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[–] 112 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (20 children)

One of my greatest academic achievements was a very long, in-depth research paper that was assigned on the first day of the semester and due on the last. "Don't put it off until the end," our teacher warned us, "because you won't be able to finish this in a couple of hours. You should be doing a little bit of work on it every week." It was to be deeply-researched, extensively endnoted, and (if I recall correctly) fifty pages long, single-spaced, 10pt.

Except I had a full-time job throughout college, and that semester my schedule found me going to work immediately after that (morning) class, both days, every week. By the time I was off work, the thought of that assignment had left my undiagnosed ADHD brain entirely. The semester melted away like the cotton candy in that raccoon video.

And suddenly the last day of class was approaching. I requested the prior day off of work, figuring that I'd work the whole day on it. Only I made a mistake: I hadn't requested the day before it was due. I had requested the day it was due. I'd be working four full days of work, with classes (and at least one early final exam), and then the paper would be due, and only after that would I have the day to write it.

But you do what you have to, and when you're 19 years old, the vagaries of time and sleep seem almost meaningless to you. I was going to get off work at 6pm, which was 14½ hours before the assignment was due. My university had a 24-hour computer lab, which was good, as it was 2004 and I didn't have internet in my apartment (how did I ever live like that?).

So I went home, ate a quick dinner, and went to school, locking myself into the computer lab at 8:00pm. When I poked my head out the door at 7:30am, the sun was bright and the air slightly crisp; and I held 52 freshly-printed pages in my hand. I was done early (technically) and had beaten the page count (also technically). I felt like I had beaten the Water Temple in Ocarina of Time. I ate breakfast to supplement the copious amounts of Nutty Bars and soda I had consumed overnight, and then I turned the paper in; and as class that morning was "optional," I opted to go home, where I discovered that perhaps time was not so vague at all, nor sleep, and I went unconscious for the rest of the morning and a decent chunk of the afternoon.

A week later, I got my grades back. At that point in any semester I was always beyond caring about how well I had scored, but I looked anyway out of curiosity.

"Well done!" she had written in the notes. "I can tell you really put a lot of time into this. 95/100"

I mean, technically she was right, I had put a lot of time into it: the 11½ hours immediately leading up to my turning it in, to be precise.

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  • [–] 56 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    The semester melted away like the cotton candy in that raccoon video.

    Source:

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  • [–] 17 points 5 months ago

    This always kills me when I see this. The raccoon and opossum that basically has made a home in my garage....with my fat ass garage cat, loves to take the cat food that, said fat ass doesn't finish during the day, and put it in the water....every single morning, I'm having to clean it cause the racoon loves to eat his food soaked to mush. Still love the little shit when I occasionally catch him in the evening laying around in the garage, like he's trash panda hut.

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    Geez I felt that in my bones... I'm SO glad my days of undiagnosed ADHD and assignments are long and gone, but your story stirred up some anxiety responses, from the sediment of my mind. Yuck! And well done! 95/100 ✔️

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    Thank you for the kind words, especially from amid the anxiety sludge! Honestly, I think every graduating senior should be given a psychiatric exam, just so they know and don't have to wait until they're 35 and maxed out their deductible for the year to get tested.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Ugh I couldn't imagine how that's like, but I sympathise!Thankfully I'm from one of those "socialist" nordic countries, where healthcare is free, or rather, collectively payed for through taxes. Even my current medication is more or less free. I get 95% of my dexamphetamines subsidies through the system. Honestly I'll gladly pay ~50% in tax, when I'm covered like that!

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I lived 98% of my life in the US, but six months ago I moved to New Zealand. It's far from socialist, and I look with envy on much of what you have, but it's so much better than the life I was living before.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    I'm happy for you, though I suppose it's with mixed feelings, leaving your place of home. To be fair, it's not actually socialist here, we are very much a capitalist country, and it's not all roses ofc. But all in all, it's not all that bad, all things considered

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    Mixed feelings for sure. Sometimes it feels like a dream and sometimes it feels like a loss. Overall it's nice, though; there are still problems here, but for the most part they're different problems.

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Best story I read this week, as in, so well put together. I bet you get this a lot, but you really have a way with words!

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  • [–] 28 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Frankly, I think the quality of the story there may, in and of itself, be evidence of how they managed to get a 52 page paper done and have it be well received by the prof.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago

    Thank you! You're very kind. That's an interesting observation I hadn't considered--but now I'm kind of struck by the chicken-and-egg question of whether I passed classes I didn't put in the work for because I was a decent writer, or if I got good at writing so that I could slack off in classes.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    That means that you understood it yourself though, no? I have worked til the wee hours on many a paper at a prestigious school and it always worked out for me because I was paying attention the whole time, so it didn't matter that I only started the paper the night before. Essays fill me with dread so the deadline has to rear its ugly head before I can start. TL;DR same

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Fair point. I also took pretty good notes, which as I recall formed a pretty good outline for me.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago

    Exactly and you remember where in the readings you saw things so it's easy to flip around and pick a part you want to reference. That's not at all the same as asking a bot to do it for you.
    I have a lot of glorious moments but my highlight was when I started a 4,000 word paper the afternoon before and got glowing reviews. It's not because I was intellectually lazy, it's because I knew exactly what references I was looking for and had plotted a large part of it out in my head already. I mean, I was lazy, but I did know what was going on, and I learned.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    Ope, I had a few of those projects. Typically for me they were group projects where I was the only competent person in the group at writing in English or at doing our major. I always told people that I could do any one part of the project, got given the engineering portion, then wound up having to do the whole thing last minute. And thus a night without sleep where everyone bailed when they either decided they couldn't really help or had to fly home.

    But hey, at least my senior capstone wasn't like that, it took two of us barely sleeping for a month to get it done on time despite making decent progress all year prior…

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  • [–] 68 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    People were writing 10+ page reports before computers. Writing shit by hand.

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Hey, we got a typewriter at some point, it didn't help much with having to start the whole page over every time you made a mistake, but it did get the teachers off my back about my terrible handwriting so that was nice.

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    why didn't you just use the backspace key? /s

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    We've had White-out for almost a century now. They most certainly could've corrected those mistakes instead of starting over.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    I never liked that. It felt like only 20% of my mental bandwidth went into words, sentences and ideas. The rest went into printing characters on the paper by using the slowest method possible. No wonder why the text sucked every time. Using a computer improved text quality and output rate significantly.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    A few years ago, I found some college notes from 1906 next to a dumpster. They were hand written in beautiful cursive and bound as books, hundreds of pages for each subject. i couldn’t find a single mistake or smudge or anything. This was from a time where the main source of information were lectures where you were expected to write everything down, then use that as your textbook. It was hard to comprehend that at the time students had to make such an effort just to obtain the materials needed to complete a course. Too bad they were so mouldy would’ve loved to keep them.

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  • [–] 124 points 5 months ago (20 children)

    Just weakness. Everyone knows you write your term paper starting less than 24 hours before the deadline and crank out a fully realized thesis made out of nothing but energy drinks and Adderall

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  • [–] 51 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    Ah… I remember these days, being in a somewhat nervous caffeine induced psychosis, typing in an haughty fervor and writing 20+ pages with unmerited arrogance and barely an ounce of fear. Printing it out before it’s due and feeling like I pulled off an Ocean’s theft after managing a 93%.

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Cs get degrees baybayyyyy, anything over a 65% will do

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

    70% in non-stem majors. 60 is the norm for chemistry, gen chem was the hardest chems compared to org chem, biochem was in between, but also had a terrible teacher. and this was how COMMUNITY schools were teaching in my area, and not universities, at a univerisity it was so much easier to understand gradingwise. of course if you want to ge to more advance classes or grad school, C's arnt acceptable at all. it was better to drop or disenroll early on, or get D. withdraw, they made it extremely difficult to do it. because many programs might calculate Ws harsher than a D depending on where you want to go.

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago

    Not every one is like that! Some of us start on the very day they get the assignment, work on it for a good hour, then without a fail every week stress about it for a whole afternoon until finishing the paper on the due day.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Believe it or not, I still do my best work under the gun. In my current job, sometimes people pay me extra to expedite my turnaround, and I thrive under the pressure. Perhaps it's the promise of extra money, but I just feel so much more focused knowing my hard deadline is fast approaching.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    Yeah, I always purposefully wait to do my projects at work until the last second. If you don't have time to do anything else, you don't think about doing anything else. Plus it helps when someone forgets about a project and sends it over to me with way too little time left, but I get it done anyway since that's the amount of time I'd have allotted myself regardless. I always clock a bunch of overtime and make sure to talk it up like it was a huge undertaking when that happens, though, so they don't think they can just give me more work all the time.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (2 children)

    I always just got it done early and slacked off after the fact without the stress lol. I still half assed most of the pointless stuff and only tried hard when it was stuff I cared about or actually for my field.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago*

    i was doing that with multiple papers with 1 week(the professor allowed you to turn in previous terms paper late in the semester, this made everyone, including me just cram within it out withina few days. also because the exact same essay prompt/ subject was online it was eaiser to write the paper and not have to fully sit down and think about it. he wasnt like most other english professors, as he allowed you more time to write essay. most of them are very strict on the writing style, grammer, or "convincing arguments" of your essay. for A CC course.

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  • [–] 39 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    We used to knock out ten pages at four in the morning without punctuation.

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  • [–] [S] 19 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Editing in the common room or whatever the fuck it was called with a flash drive ready to transfer it to the college printer's computer and get a piping hot copy ten minutes before class started

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago

    I had this friend in high school where one day he pushed the envelope and the teacher showed us his 10 page essay.

    He used like size 64 font and quadruple spaced it. The teacher was showing it to the class like "there should be more than 12 words per page".

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  • [–] 27 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    I remember for my senior project in college having done so much work that documenting it at the end resulted in like 30 pages. That was without stetching it. I didn't want to spend any more time than necessary at that point. Kids these days...

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  • [–] 26 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    The hardest papers were the ones where the professor gave you content expectations and then a page limit. I def learned to be concise and how to avoid fluff

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Honestly if you're not going into academia that's a useful skill. If I'm your boss and ask you something like "if we change part 15 to be np35 instead of the current Pl-Ir we could save 40 dollars per part, what are your thoughts of the implications?" I'm not reading 30 pages of rambling. You should be able to research and give me a summary in less than a page.

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  • [–] 10 points 5 months ago*

    I had the opposite problem: I felt a steep constitutional objection to fluff, and writing with a length requirement was hell. Not because I was being lazy but because I was already kind of terrible (raised near-exclusively on the infamous 5-paragraph, 3-point plus thesis and conclusion, template) and then on top of that could not morally write garbage filler unless it was the very last minute.

    ... And that's how I ended up editing on Wikipedia for 10 years where concision is the point and the real work is overwhelmingly in the research.

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  • [–] 19 points 5 months ago* (5 children)

    I tried reading Infinite Jest for the first time.

    In a pre-LLM world, this kind of word waffling nonsense would seem impressive, but as someone who picked it up to see what it's about in a post-LLM world.... I have few good things to say about this style of pointless writing.

    It's something that I used to excel at too: a long litany of rhythmically satisfying prose that showcased your penchant for picking out the perfect words to soothe the literary soul whilst saying absolutely nothing at the same time.

    Then I learned how to write to clear English, and realised that I valued plot over filler most of all in a story.

    I'm sorry, Mr Wallace, I just can't read your book any more.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago

    I'd argue that Infinite Jest is more relevant than ever. Perhaps its boring how much his prescient world resembles our own, with its everlasting entertainment feeds, overwhelming sponsorship of every aspect of life, nuclear proliferation, quiet desperation, and quieter hope.

    The out-of-order telling definitely obscures the plot(s), but they are there. And like many of the author's choices, this structure stands in stark contrast to an LLM's output. While an LLM always outputs the most likely next token, Infinite Jest refuses to be predictable. While a slop feeder just slurps whatever shows up in the trough, a Jest reader cannot idly consume, but must actively interact to receive any fulfillment.

    Far from wankish performatism, the book deals with heavy themes including depression, drug addiction/recovery, and suicide. These were sadly demonstrated to be very personally familiar themes to the author.

    And it's an interesting, colorful world with bits that just stick with you, from "cartographic rearrangement" to the game of eschaton, to those crazy French Canadians jumping tracks at the last moment (and their leader chosen because he timed his jump so perfectly he lost his legs but lived).

    I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze, and wouldn't recommend it to someone who doesn't want to read an esoteric 1000-page tome with chapter-long endnotes-of-endnotes-of-endnotes. But those who labor to crack this pomegranate will still enjoy many a plump pip.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    I finished it in my year of 52 books. I remembering having two bookmarks running to move between the footnotes references and the main novel. You need it for the 30+ page footnotes references. I think I enjoyed it?

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  • [–] 17 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Wait until they get to the level where 10 pages is easier than 1 page.

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  • [–] 17 points 5 months ago (10 children)

    10 pages hand written in cursive in 1982.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Until my left hand become a filthy mess of pen ink or pencil carbon.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    PSA to a fellow Sinestro: the Zebra Sarasa Dry pen has gel ink that dries instantaneously and leaves no smudges on the hand. I also use a metal-tipped pencil and find it also leaves my hand clean. I tell every left-handed person about both of these. Damn right dominance.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Ugh, while I'm glad I got to see the world before computers were everywhere, I don't envy people who had to handwrite all their papers, nor teachers who had to grade those reports.

    Were typewriters cheap enough that most students had them, or did they have "typing rooms" the same way schools set up computer labs? Or was handwriting just the norm even after typewriters were ubiquitous? Maybe in HS it was common but surely college profs couldn't be fucked with handwriting for the most part?

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    Typewriters were pretty cheap but not very many people owned one. Colleges had typewriter labs sometimes, but it was more common to hand-write your papers and then have a professional typist type them up. I went to college in the '80s and we had labs with a bunch of word processors we could use, but I had borrowed my dad's portable electric typewriter and I mostly used that. During my junior year the G type slug broke off of its typebar, so for the rest of my college career I had to hand-write the Gs on all my papers.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    For middle school and high school I was in a very rural part of the southeastern USA in the late 70's and early 80's. While the high school had a typing class, it didn't have available typewriters for general use (there may have been one in the library that could be used during school hours but I am not 100% certain). As such, all book reports/research papers/etc were hand written.

    Since this was (and still is) a fairly poor part of the USA, folks were not splashing out a bunch of cash on a typewriter for the kid to use for school work. There may have been reasonably priced typewriters from Brother or similar, they were still not cheap by any stretch.

    When I got to university there were typewriters available most of the day in different buildings and some computers with networked printers in the computer labs (this was 1985 to 1990). Since this was one of the premier engineering schools in the nation, it had computer labs that were available to all students before other universities made them available beyond the EE/ICS departments.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (2 children)

    I got my degree in 2008. All my exams were handwritten (but fortunately I didn't have to write 10 pages per question, which is good as I physically can't write that much in the time allotted). I did at least get to type my undergraduate thesis.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    I got mine 10 years later and it was the same. We had to type out papers and projects, but exams were handwritten. Being an engineering major certainly lent itself to that as typing out your work in a math problem sucks, especially when it includes diagrams. But humanities exams were also predominantly pen and paper, often using standardized essay booklets that were provided by the proctor.

    I think that that's the best way to handle it. It can be properly supervised for cheating and minimizes distractions. Also, holy crap I'd hate to take a statics or dynamics or calc exam on a computer

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    I only had to handwrite for a 1st year class that was big enough to be a lecture. I think the exam probably required less than ~8 paragraphs total but that was enough. My school was pretty small so fortunately all the rest of my humanities classes were seminars we turned in reports for. I would've hated having to do those style exams for my entire degree, even without the handwriting issue.

    I don't think I've written anything longer than a couple paragraphs by hand at one time in the past 30 years. I'll still take some notes here and there and I've been known to send a postcard or two if I'm traveling, but typing is so much faster anyway.

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    Go to Wikipedia, copy that, then rewrite it underneath, make sure to delete the Wikipedia copy.

    Why not, it's all the AI does

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 child)

    Reminds me of a first year of middle school personal anecdote. At the beginning of the school year, our literature teacher asked us to do research about a subject and present the results.
    It was the beginning of internet at home, so almost everyone came back with literal web pages printed, thinking they had done well. The teacher was furious about this "demonstration of laziness" and started to go through the students one by one and handling 0/20 grades for the assignment, like a gardener carefully pulling weeds one by one, savoring each wilt. Occasionally she would praise the few students that took time to manually write down their research.
    I was in the back of the classroom, so analyzing the situation quickly and sweating, I started to furiously handwrite to a Seyès ruled paper the Wikipedia page I had printed (with the help of my father), cut the one picture and glue it to the paper. I managed to escape the culling with a good enough grade.
    Her last name was that of a fearsome wild animal. It was her final year before retirement, and as the year went on, we realized she was actually a very conscientious and caring teacher.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    I had a lecturer that was very anti-internet. But she didn't have any real sort of point, she just didn't believe things written on the internet had the same integrity as physically published articles. She was difficult to because a lot of modern research (anything published after the year 2005) has never been published in a printed format, except to the extent that someone had printed the online version. So all my references had URLs in, which was bound to set her off.

    Even if I was trying to reference some work published in the 19th century a lot of time that work had been subsequently uploaded to the internet and the best reference would be an online archive. So then I would have to go and find some book that had it in. It was a giant waste of everybody's time. Every other professor was fine with it.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    Wikipedia?! Oh, you sweet summer child.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    Don't you threaten the integrity of knowledge that is Wikipedia. It has an awful lot more to recommend to human civilisation than some random data centre AI

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    I wasn't.

    I was saying it didn't exist.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    How long ago was that??? I used Wikipedia a lot in high school. I'm nervous it'll be taken over by these goons (like they'll start editing) and become useless. One of my favorite things when I'm bored is clicking on random wiki links.

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  • [–] 13 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I did a twenty page "research" paper for philosophy the night before having read one page from the dude. And got a b+

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago

    Oh I had a 1-1 presentation with the professor for a philosophy class and he wanted us to present one point from one author, capture the point in five minutes or less, and survive ten minutes of cross examination. This guy was a real shark too, not only was he known to be very sharp and super cutting with his critiques, he was the kind of guy who would force a class of forty people to sit a presentation in his office for twenty minutes each so he could avoid correcting term papers.

    I chose Marshall McLuhan and spoke for maybe three minutes and why his assertion that "the medium is the message" is true because the invention of email made it unacceptable for a company with a branch in Toronto and one in Montreal to communicate by horseback, so the expected pace of business was irrevocably changed. Email is only "amazing" for a couple of days, then it's a fact that dictates expectations, and so, what you communicate by email is of much less consequence in the long run than the deep change in corporate culture that email causes. That was the core of McLuhan's point.

    Got an A+ for that one, and was out of his office and on my way in less than ten minutes.

    Marshall McLuhan's was the only work I read of all the assignments in that entire class.

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I once had a professor who claimed she passed a high level language course without attending a class or studying it. She was fluent in an adjacent Romance language and knew a little of some other overlapping languages. Basically walked in to the final and got a C+ on cognates alone.

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