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[–] 57 points 9 months ago (1 child)

A closeted gay acquaintance that I knew from shared extracurricular activities, is now a judge who ran as a Republican because that's the only party people will vote for in the redneck town we grew up in.

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  • [+] 54 points 9 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 20 points 9 months ago

    I was a physics student for some time (got to quantum and realized it was not for me lol) and one of the smartest, most hardworking students I ever met was a 27 year old who had been in and out of rehab since he was 18. He is working on his masters now.

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  • [–] 46 points 9 months ago (59 children)

    One of my friends in school was super popular. She was in cosmetology, was always immaculately dressed and had a stabe boyfriend for years in school and after we graduated. Her family life was rock solid but in 1988 she went off the rails and into a super depressive mode, stopped talking to everyone and killed herself. NO one, to this day, saw it coming. It came out of the blue within 4 months. She was carrying something emotionally bad that ate her, or some sort of wild metabolic disorder sent her into a spiral.. no one knows.

    Hell of a path NO one saw coming.

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  • [–] 43 points 9 months ago (58 children)

    I dated a girl like that in college. She never went deep off the rails, but when I met her she was reckoning with the fact that she had basically been forced into the perfect pretty cheerleader life by her backwards Louisiana family, even having them go so far as to put her in a mental institution for a short time and hide it from everyone in their lives to keep being able to pretend she was "perfect." It dragged on her mentally, and she years later would tell me the reason she disappeared and stopped talking to me after six months was I was the first man who had ever been interested in who she was and what her thoughts were and she literally didn't know how to handle it. She tried to play the perfect pretty girl for a while longer, even marrying a guy who treated her the same way her dad did, as though she only existed to be a trophy wife, before getting divorced and starting to break free from those shackles.

    Anyway, just saying, sometimes those super popular, happy seeming immaculate people have something sinister hiding under the surface: like a family forcing them to be that way.

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  • [+] -13 points 9 months ago (57 children)

    She married the wrong guy.

    But most feminists would skewer me for saying that, because it's her choice and "nice guy" actually means "predator" apparently. And then they complain about how men are so abusive and wonder why they can't find a man who treats them well.

    And nobody is allowed to tell them that "Not all men are like that" or that "Your perception is indicative of the kind of men you've chosen to give your attention to."

    And all the guys who spent their lives respecting women are instead quietly pursuing their own hobbies because they've realized there's no room for them in the dating pool, and never approaching women because apparently they would rather be mauled by a bear...

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  • [–] 15 points 9 months ago (54 children)

    Y i k e s.

    I guess fuck all the intergenerational trauma she experienced, it's all her fault for not being smarter about men! I guess you missed the part where she got divorced and began to break free of her traumatic upbringing which absolutely included changing the type of men she was allowing into her life.

    Get a grip, you sound like a "nice guy" yourself.

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  • [–] -5 points 9 months ago* (53 children)

    She dumped you because she didn't know how to respond to a guy legitimately caring about her, and then she married an abuser to relive her trauma.

    I never said her intergenerational trauma doesn't matter, but whenever my intergenerational trauma has caused me to make bad decisions, I've never received any sympathy. People just say I'm responsible for my own decisions and can't blame my present conditions on the circumstances of my past.

    I've seen it happen all the time where women stay with their abusers, and take their anger out on anyone who tells them they deserve better. And yet they blame men as a generalized, abstract category for all the ways they've been mistreated by particular men, sparing no reflection for the selection bias at play.

    Saying "women choosing to date abusive men is a problematic choice" isn't misogyny. Pretending they have no agency in who they decide to date is.

    Don't be a cuck.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (52 children)

    but whenever my intergenerational trauma has caused me to make bad decisions, I’ve never received any sympathy.

    Cry me a river. Being treated badly isn't a good or valid reason to treat others badly.

    And yet they blame men as a generalized, abstract category for all the ways they’ve been mistreated by particular men, sparing no reflection for the selection bias at play.

    And you're definitely not doing the same thing to women (blaming them as a generalized, abstract category) when you speak like this, got it, sure, sure.

    Don’t be a cuck.

    Man, this couldn't get any more sad and funny at the same time. Whew, thanks for the laugh.

    But seriously, you really need to learn to let go of that pain and try to not blame the opposite gender at large for what you see as perceived failures on their part. If you have only ever experienced women saying your intergenerational trauma is your own problem... you might be just as guilty of the "sin" of choosing to pursue the wrong type of person as you claim women are.

    I personally have had loads of supportive and loving women in my life, so it's hard for me to wrap my mind around this mindset. Maybe I'm just lucky, or maybe it has something to do with me not making generalized statements about women in general instead of accepting them all as unique, flawed individuals just as much as anyone else, including myself.

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  • [–] -4 points 9 months ago (49 children)

    Cry me a river. Being treated badly isn't a good or valid reason to treat others badly.

    You could say the same to women who use their trauma as an excuse to berate men.

    And you're definitely not doing the same thing to women (blaming them as a generalized, abstract category) when you speak like this, got it, sure, sure.

    Maybe there are some who don't act like that, but at least online they seem ubiquitous. Hence the famous "man or bear" question, and basically every thread that's ever existed in a feminist space online. I'm simply reporting the evidence of my eyes and ears.

    At the very least, if women give themselves a free pass to make sweeping generalizations about men, then I don't want to hear any grandstanding about how I'm supposedly generalizing about them when I say it's a common occurrence.

    But seriously, you really need to learn to let go of that pain and try to not blame the opposite gender at large for what you see as perceived failures on their part.

    If a woman chooses to date abusive men, that's a failure on her part. Acknowledging that they have a responsibility in that decision isn't "blaming the opposite gender at large," and the fact that it's so taboo to even point this out is problematic.

    If you have only ever experienced women saying your intergenerational trauma is your own problem... you might be just as guilty of the "sin" of choosing to pursue the wrong type of person as you claim women are.

    I don't pursue anyone anymore, because women have made it clear that they don't want to be pursued. The only guys left pursuing women are the ones who don't respect boundaries, and what that means for natural selection is fairly easy to guess. Assholes will reproduce, and "losers" like me will perish. You'll get the day you asked for when all the "nice guys" are gone.

    Even if I did choose to only pursue women who don't blame me for the sins of all men everywhere, her friends and the rest of society would just say I chose her because I picked her out as "an easy target" who "doesn't stand up for herself," because they'll always assume my intentions are predatory and never simply "wow, she's an introvert just like me. She likes books, I like books. She doesn't like parties, I don't like parties. We could really work together!"

    I personally have had loads of supportive and loving women in my life, so it's hard for me to wrap my mind around this mindset.

    Well, look at you! You must be well-adjusted, maybe conventionally attractive, certainly in possession of social skills. You might have a good sense of humor, a charming personality. In any case, you're probably generally likeable. You probably had plenty of women in your life growing up, and some positive male role models as well. Likely plenty of opportunities to interact with your peers and develop socially in an organic way.

    What about someone who was homeschooled and isolated growing up, kept in a conservative bubble and fed lies about "evil liberals," sheltered, brainwashed, and gaslit about what's true or false? No opportunities to interact with peers, to develop social skills in an organic way the way most people do during the formative years of their development.

    What if the only women in one's life was one's own mother, and the occasional visit from an aunt or two, all conservative? What if the only male role models were narcissists with exploding tempers, and an older brother with abusive tendencies?

    What about when that person finally enters the world and attempts to socialize, with no basic social skills to go off of, and is immediately singled out, ostracized, bullied, and universally disliked?

    And then that person goes on to become an adult. Do you think they'll just magically develop social skills and become well-adjusted, simply because they're legally an adult now and are expected to have a minimum level of "maturity," or what the general consensus dubs "maturity"?

    Go on, and blame me for having no friends. Go ahead and blame more for having no healthy relationships, no supportive women in my life, no positive role models to look up to and emulate.

    Go ahead and fucking blame me, I don't care. It's just fucking typical. I've been putting up with that my whole life. It comes as no surprise.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago (27 children)

    Sounds like you've gone down tbe blackpill/incel rabbit hole, hopefully these videos might help. You should also at least read books such as cPTSD by Pete Walker if you're not looking for therapy, which is for everyone.

    Dating Advice that applies to everyone

    Debunking the toxic manosphere

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (26 children)

    I'm not in the fucking manosphere, I hate that machismo bullshit. And if being unable to get laid makes me worthless or lesser in your view, then you're promoting toxic masculinity more than you realize.

    Any time I express a shred of self-respect, people call me names like "incel," "redpilled," or whatever. Sorry, if you want me to be perpetually self-debasing to earn your approval then you can fuck off and I'll continue to be a friendless recluse. I don't care, I'm already used to it.

    If telling my story and talking about the challenges I've faced means I'm "redpilled," then everyone can fuck off. You can't expect sympathy from me if I've never gotten sympathy from anyone else.

    I'm tired of being gaslit that my problems don't exist and that I've supposedly been brainwashed into believing in my own problems by a bunch of douchebag influencers who I don't even listen to, who I despise as people and fundamentally disagree with philosophically. They're the abusive assholes that I'm talking about.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    No, you're just angrily venting indistinguishable to someone who is, making up my position, and getting angry at what you made up. If that's how you act when someone offers any sort of help than go ahead and ignore it.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago

    I'm tired of being gaslit that my problems don't exist and that I've supposedly been brainwashed into believing in my own problems by a bunch of douchebag influencers who I don't even listen to, who I despise as people and fundamentally disagree with philosophically.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (23 children)

    You're not helping your case by telling people who actually get laid regularly "don't be a cuck," though. If you don't want people to throw you in that handbasket, then maybe stop giving them reason to do so through the way you speak and present yourself? Then turning around and blaming them for it?

    I mean, I definitely don't feel like a cuck because a woman with serious issues that stemmed from trauma stopped talking to me (and later admitted to stalking me afterwards, wondering what I was up to), when I was dating someone new who was a better fit for me within six months (a beautiful punky redhead with a killer rack). Nevermind that this was also all 22 years ago for me. Nevermind that I've also never wanted to get married or have kids. She's doing well now, has kids, is married to someone kind and loving, and I'm happy for her for that. I'm happy she worked through her trauma and didn't keep going down the same path of submitting to abuse.

    You're giving people lots of people good reasons to make such assumptions and then you blame them for not knowing your personal history after some throwaway internet posts where you make some seriously misogynistic statements and aren't initially giving your background. You don't have to be steeped in machismo to be a misogynist, in fact it can be argued that the 4chan incel crowd feel the same, which is where all the talk about "Chads and Staceys" comes from, where they, like you feel not attractive, feel like they have bad social skills, and get angry at the world for not holding their hand like a baby through it instead of making an effort to do better themselves, even if it takes a long time, a lot of effort, a lot of pain, and a lot of rejection.

    But as I said elsewhere, you obviously need help. We all need help. But you won't be able to move forward until you accept help and accept your own part in how all this works instead of all the blame being on external factors and external actors. We absolutely play a part in how others perceive us and judge us, and we can't always blame others for those rationally made judgments if we're giving them good reasons to hold those judgments.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (22 children)

    Whatever. I don't have a case. Certainly not one that would benefit from any amount of help. I'm clearly past the threshold of being helpable, so what's it matter? You're just witnessing the off-venting of years of pent up cynicism. Don't expect it to be prosocial or beneficial.

    And I don't know, maybe if society didn't ostracize people for being unable to get laid then you wouldn't end up with a large group of maladjusted angry miscreants forming an online community centered on their shared aspects of identity?

    Maybe if "involuntary celibate" wasn't an insult, then guys who don't get laid would be able to get over it and adjust as regular members of society. But if they're ostracized for it, and treated as if their worthiness as a person is somehow lesser because they don't get laid, then maybe it's not entirely their fault that they're bitter and frustrated at the world?

    If "vagina" is treated as social currency, then what the fuck do you expect to happen?

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (21 children)

    If “vagina” is treated as social currency, then what the fuck do you expect to happen?

    The thing is here, you're the only one seemingly holding it up as social currency. I think you really need to think about that. Because I have close friends who are asexual, they're not and never have been driven by sex, and they're some of the funniest, most thoughtful, most artistic, most pro-social people I have in my life. Genuinely one of my best friends has had one girlfriend in his life and has been celibate by choice since, and he is one of the most prolific artists I know and I wish he could get a foot in the door with his comedy writing, because I think his stuff should be on television or other media. I listen to the albums he has released regularly. He has a vibrant social life and many friends and literally no one cares that he has no interest in sex.

    If you think "people who get laid" hold it up as a social currency, you're the one who actually holds it as a currency.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (20 children)

    I don't hold it up as social currency, but just cause you can name some exceptions doesn't mean the trend isn't a big one. If it wasn't treated as social currency, then why would "incel" even be an insult? "He fucks" is often left as a compliment on posts where someone says something cool. "You can't even get your dick wet" is often said to people as a way to degrade them.

    Maybe your social circle is healthier than the ones I grew up in and was exposed to in my early adulthood. Good for you and all your friends, I guess. When people found out I was a virgin when I was 18 (it was by choice at the time as I was abstinent until 19), they treated me like I was less than human.

    And you think that doesn't leave a long-term psychological impact that lasted deep into my twenties? "Oh no, gotta get laid so people will respect me." Don't act like it's something I made up in my fucking head.

    Asexual people often complain about society viewing them as lesser, different, or incomprehensible due to their disinterest in sex. Why would that be the case if society didn't treat it like social currency?

    Psychological studies have been done and shown that women tend to ascribe more subjective attractiveness to men who get laid. So it's not even just men doing it to each other.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (19 children)

    Incel is an insult because people like you make it your whole personality and are bitter sad sacks who make it the worlds problem instead of choosing to look inward. People give up and insult incels not because they can't get laid, but because they make their whole lives about it instead of finding anything constructive to do with their time like my asexual friends do. If you think people actually make fun of incels because they don't get laid and not that they fail to see how their shitty fucking attitudes is why they don't get laid while latching on to anything to try to justify it except their own shit behavior and beliefs, you're missing the forest for the trees.

    Also, I didn't get laid until I was 20. You are literally reaching for any, and I mean any, reason for this to not be your fault and to justify being bitter and angry and unlikeable.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (18 children)

    I don't make it my fucking personality. I've been made fun of throughout my adulthood for not getting consistently laid. Don't gaslight me that it's all in my head and that I'm just making it up.

    I'm consistently rejected by society. Not even in terms of sex. That's another problem, whenever I talk about being rejected by society people think I'm talking exclusively about sex. That's indicative of their perception of the term "society."

    I don't call myself an incel. But when other people call me that, it's based in cruelty, vindictiveness, and a feeling of superiority. They enjoy having someone to talk down to because they're getting laid and someone else isn't. Stop acting like they're actually morally superior because they're well-adjusted, and that I deserve the hate because I'm bitter after a lifetime of ostracization.

    People don't fucking like me, and it's as simple as that. It doesn't matter what I do, because people have disliked me my entire life. I haven't always been bitter, but there's a reason I am now. And it's not as simplistic as "because I don't get laid." I don't fucking care if I get laid or not. But if I get treated as subhuman for not getting laid, that I have a problem with. Yet what I raise a concern about it, people say I'm acting "entitled to sex," missing the point entirely and reducing it to a strawman.

    It doesn't matter what I fucking do, people have never liked me and they never will. It only makes sense that I'm bitter. Stop acting like my bitterness came first. You don't even fucking know me. If I were to suddenly decide to be cheery, people still wouldn't like me. They wouldn't trust me either, because it would be obviously contrived.

    Stop pretending I can simply choose not to be bitter.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (17 children)

    I'm not the one who is pretending. You do you, obviously no one will be able to break through that wall of self importance.

    EDIT:

    I don’t make it my fucking personality.

    *Gestures broadly at this entire thread.

    Sure looks like it from here.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (16 children)

    Apparently giving a shit about my own problems is "self-importance." Let's see how that scales to the general populace...

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (15 children)

    Once again, you whining that people don't like you isn't the same as caring about your civil rights dumbfuck. I gave you a lot of outs in this conversation, but your whiny bitch ass just wants to keep digging a deeper hole to prove how unlikable you are. Well, guess what, you succeeded, I officially don't like you and think you suck. Not because you're a bad person, but because you have zero self reflection and whine about lame shit when people tried to help you understand and do better.

    Be happy, you got what you really wanted, people don't like you. Good job, it's a self fulfilling prophecy you fucking idiot. If the only thing you put out into the world is "no one likes me and everyone judges me" eventually, that's all you'll get from the world. You get out what you put in, and you're obviously all too happy to put in "I want people to fucking hate me so I can be sad and bitter about it."

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (14 children)

    At least you finally understand. It took you long enough to get it through your head. Now go look yourself in a mirror and see the monster lurking within, waiting for you to let your guard down long enough that it can break free.

    Of course it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. That's how trauma works. A pattern was ingrained in my deep subconscious at an early age, and I've been reliving it on repeat ever since. Even if someone gives me a chance, I drive them away because it's easier than building something on potential only to inevitably see it come crashing down. I don't need the anxiety of constantly dreading when that might come. I don't even try to build relationships anymore, because according to my cognitive conditioning it can only end in pain and disaster.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (13 children)

    I drive them away because it’s easier than building something on potential only to inevitably see it come crashing down.

    So you finally admit that you're the problem here. Glad you recognized it. Now shut the fuck up.

    You aren't your cognitive conditioning, you can make a choice to be different. You don't want to make that choice, ergo, you can fuck off. That's me setting a boundary with someone who obviously isn't worth the effort.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (12 children)

    Nope, this conversation started with you saying your ex isn't to blame for her trauma, and now you're blaming me for my trauma.

    She left you because she couldn't handle being treated with respect. And you say that's okay, but I'm wrong for avoiding relationships for similar reasons? (In addition to growing accustomed to rejection, ostracization, ridicule, and derision)

    Still the same double standard I've been pointing out all along... maybe if I chop my dick off and wear a dress then someone will finally give a shit, or at least I'll be allowed to talk about my problems even if no one cares...

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (11 children)

    My ex grew and changed. You haven't. That's the part you've conveniently ignored this whole time. I literally explained that in an earlier post, but you're more than happy to ignore information that conflicts with your fake ass worldview. I'm not some shmuck who thinks she is irredeemable because she didn't choose me, and instead eventually found someone else who really treated her right, after struggling with her trauma for a while. If she had kept doing dumb shit and getting with abusive men her whole life maybe your argument would have a leg to stand on, but right now your argument is a fucking quadriplegic.

    As I said before, she eventually got divorced and broke free from her traumatic past and is now happily married to a good man and has kids. But sure, the fact that she grew and changed means nothing and means she's to blame! No, losers like you you refuse to grow are the only people to blame.

    It's not a double standard if it's bullshit you made up in your own head that doesn't match the facts of the situation.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (10 children)

    I've already told you, I've put effort into growth. It only got me shat on. I haven't always been this resigned to defeat.

    Some people overcome trauma, some people don't. Just because some people escape poverty doesn't mean the ones who can't are to blame for their own condition.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (9 children)

    All I hear is the equivalent of a Republican saying "well Democrats said I'm a racist so I guess that means I should be mega racist Nazi."

    Seriously if that's your takeaway, that your self improvement was for nothing because you didn't get what you wanted out of it instead of self improvement being for its own sake, then you're doing the same thing. You're choosing to be worse because you're too weak to stand up and be better. Sorry not sorry.

    Just like Nazis, if people being not nice to you and saying you're being racist means you should go as deeply Nazi as possible: something is seriously wrong with you that not even trauma can explain or justify.

    Being a bad bitter person blaming everyone else isn't ever justified. Hopefully you learn that some day. If not oh well one less loser in the world.

    Saying "people were mean to me so I need to double down and be worse about the things they said were bad about me" isn't the flex you think it is

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (8 children)

    I've always wanted to open my wrists in a public place, to traumatize everyone around me. They'll probably celebrate my death, so I won't give them the satisfaction of doing it quietly in a dark corner. I'm not mean enough to be violent towards others, though. But no one's ever grateful for all the times I've exercised self-restraint. Oh well.

    The world is going to shit, anyway. It's a shame about all the loss of biodiversity. Nature was always my refuge, but humanity destroys all things good. I won't care when they destroy themselves. It's only a matter of time...

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (7 children)

    Man you really just want to prove how genuinely unhinged you are and how little you've done to grow, huh?

    No one who has actually had serious self-growth would ever in a fucking million years want to force other people to want to watch them commit suicide to punish them.

    Seriously, my ex did that shit to me. Why? Because we were in an argument about how I had cancer and was working full-time, did all the cooking, cleaning, shopping, and life planning and she sat on her butt at home. So she decided to tell me I never really loved her and tried to force me watch her kill herself because I had the fucking audacity to ask for help after I had been struggling with cancer for a year already. It has left me all fucked up, but the only people I blame for that is her and me specifically. Her for being so petty as to try to force me to watch her kill herself (by trying to swallow all my cancer meds no less) after over a decade of basically being her caretaker, and myself for not having the balls to make a boundary earlier before she tried to do this fucked up thing to me. Anyway, good job, you successfully triggered me over some fucked up shit I've been through.

    No one who has ever done the work and experienced real growth would ever do that to another person, especially not just random people as you seem to be implying you would do it to. You are deeply fucked up, and you have made no growth as much as you lie to yourself that you have. If you ever had any real serious personal growth, you wouldn't ever be saying shit like that you fucking sociopath. Like that's the whole thing, you've said an unimaginable amount of selfish fucked up things here today, shifted goalposts from "there's a double standard" to "well she grew past her trauma but not everyone grows past their trauma like me for example", and have generally been one of the biggest fucking whiners I have ever encountered, but even when you admitted that you purposefully push people away because it's easier to be an angry angsty asshole who feels sorry for themselves than it is to actually be a decent human being, you still haven't put two and two together that you haven't actually grown at all and you're the actual fucking problem here and maybe, just maybe, that you are the reason people don't like you, not the cruel cruel world.

    I mean, even if humans didn't destroy themselves, it's not like the heat death of the universe isn't inescapable. Yawn, what a load of existential crisis bollocks. You're pathetic.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (6 children)

    Demean me harder. Maybe it'll finally give me the resolve to do it.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (5 children)

    Like I said, it's clear you get off on trying to be so terrible that people hate you. Don't worry, if and when you do that, all those people you force to see it will have very, very justifiable reasons to fucking hate you and be glad you're dead. Mostly because you had so little empathy as to think they deserved to suffer simply because you suffered people being big meanies to you. Once again, wanting to make others suffer because you have suffered speaks to something being deeply wrong with you, instead of you not wanting others to suffer as you have. As I said before, your attitude and beliefs make this a self-fulfilling prophecy. Your unwillingness to learn and try to change is your choice alone. You have zero desire to do better or grow, as much as you like to pretend you do.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    When you decided to switch to personal insults, I stopped caring about your feelings.

    instead of you not wanting others to suffer as you have

    I used to want to change the world so that others wouldn't suffer like I have, but when people decided to view that as a weakness and exploit the vulnerability by heaping piles of extra suffering on top of me, it beat me down and after a while of that it kind of turned my plot arc into that supervillain origin story with an underwhelming conclusion due to my lack of superpowers.

    The world has never taken responsibility for its role in making me what I am. I had potential, but they'd rather see me fail and suffer than live in a world where I had the satisfaction of making the world a better place. They wouldn't tolerate me being compassionate. They chose suffering, and then they complain when the suffering envelops them too. They thought I would be the only one who suffered, a convenient and well-behaved scapegoat. Well, I'm not so docile, and I don't have sympathy for a world that had no sympathy for me.

    You have zero desire to do better or grow, as much as you like to pretend you do.

    You've clearly misinterpreted what I said. I said I put effort into growth for years in the past, but when it proved to be futile I gave up on it. That implies that I don't care anymore, so it's still logically consistent. Is trying the same thing over and over and expected a different conclusion not the definition of insanity?

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (3 children)

    I'm sorry but you clearly didn't care about me or anyone else's feelings in this conversation long before I resorted to rightfully insulting you.

    The world has never taken responsibility for its role in making me what I am. I had potential, but they’d rather see me fail and suffer than live in a world where I had the satisfaction of making the world a better place. They wouldn’t tolerate me being compassionate. They chose suffering, and then they complain when the suffering envelops them too. They thought I would be the only one who suffered, a convenient and well-behaved scapegoat. Well, I’m not so docile, and I don’t have sympathy for a world that had no sympathy for me.

    If you really believe this about the world, let me repeat myself as I have over and over again and you clearly still don't get it: if you really believe this, you never actually experienced any real growth at all nor do you have real empathy for others. You can lie to yourself and say you "gave up" on it all you want, but the reality is anyone who actually had experienced real growth would have never, ever come to these conclusions to begin with, ergo, you have not actually grown or used any of the skills you claim to have. You never did. It's a convenient lie you tell yourself to justify being a shiftless piece of shit who loves being hated because it fulfills your victimhood complex.

    You’ve clearly misinterpreted what I said.

    No, no, you've just not been aware of how much of yourself you've really revealed with all you've said here today, and it isn't anywhere near a misinterpretation, it's a lunatic who will never have enough self reflection to really see themselves and understand their own failings instead of blaming the entire world for every single little slight they have ever experienced. Like I said, you're a fucking loser like Donald Trump, a fucking whinger and whiner who takes no responsibility for themselves, their actions, or what they've said. You've made that exceedingly clear, even if you're too oblivious to realize how you've done so. You are what you hate so much about the world, wrapped up in a neat little bow. No wonder you want others to hate you so badly, because deep down you must hate yourself something awful because somewhere inside you recognize this in yourself and hate yourself for it. Yet, like Trump, you want to make others suffer for your own personal failings more than you want to do better an atone for any of it. And that is what makes you worthy of derisive words.

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I'm gonna paint you a picture with words, because I don't have skills with pixels.

    Imagine there's a bucket. Maybe it's been sitting in a forgotten corner for a long time, filled with cobwebs and debris from disuse.

    The bucket decides it wants to improve itself, so it cleans itself up and sets itself out somewhere someone might make good use of it.

    People see the bucket, but it doesn't look new, it doesn't look clean, so they don't want to use it for nice things like carrying water. But the bucket waits patiently, hoping someone will put it to good use.

    Well it sits out for a while, and people regularly walk past, and those people are carrying cups overflowing with hate.

    The people pour their cups of hate into the bucket. The bucket lets them do this because, after all, it wants to be put to good use, and giving people a place to pour out their hate seems like it might be helpful.

    So people continue pouring their hate into this bucket, until the bucket starts overflowing. Then people get angry at the bucket because it's overflowing with hate. They say "that's an evil bucket, it's filled with hate!" Forgetting that they themselves were the ones who poured the hate into the bucket in the first place.

    What did the people expect? They filled the bucket with hate and now they wonder why it isn't overflowing with honey?

    Sooner or later, someone knocks the bucket over, and all the hate pours out. Then everyone blames the bucket. "It shouldn't have been filled with hate! Now the hate is spilled everywhere!" Well, it was their hate in the first place, and the bucket gave them a place to pour it so it wouldn't be spilling on themselves while they were walking.

    But the people move on, and forget about the bucket. Eventually someone sees the bucket and says "That's a useless bucket. It's on its side! It can't hold anything like that!"

    So the person sets the bucket upright and says "There, now the bucket can be useful." Then the person moves on.

    The people walking by see an empty bucket, and find that it's a very convenient place to pour out their hate...

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 child)

    This is by far the dumbest fucking analogy I have ever had the misfortune to read.

    You will, never, ever, understand what I am saying because you obviously do not even want to try. You are not a bucket, you are a human fucking being, and it's a choice to hate others because you have had misfortune.

    As I said in a previous post, I blame no one for the pain and agony my ex put me through except myself and her, and I would not want to make anyone else suffer such things ever because it doesn't matter how hurt I am because of it, I know being a decent person that making others suffer will not fix what has been done to me. The only thing that can fix it is me trying to be better. You want to cook up every excuse in the book for why it's not on you to ever be kind to others or consider others feelings like you want people to consider yours.

    Like, think about that for a minute, you want others to consider your feelings, but you consistently have made clear you're actually content to not think about theirs, going back to the very beginning of this thread where you callously said that my ex "married the wrong man" and waxed poetic about how you think women are coddled for such choices. Why should anyone give a fuck about your feelings when you consistently have made clear this whole thread you have no consideration for anyone else's? That despite all you've been through, you haven't learned "gosh I never want to make anyone feel the way I have felt, it's so awful!" you instead learned "FUCKING EVERYONE DESERVES TO FEEL EVEN WORSE THAN I HAVE FELT BECAUSE I AM THE SPECIALIST LITTLE SNOWFLAKE BITCH ALIVE! BLEARGH!"

    It really says a lot about how fucked in the head you are, how you don't actually understand how empathy works, how you never actually worked on yourself like you keep claiming you did (I promise you, people who have worked on themselves don't think like you do), and are possibly one the most selfish and petulant people I have had the displeasure to interact with on this site. You have no intentions of actually hearing what anyone else has said, continuing to repeat your "woe is me" horseshit that everyone is tired of hearing because to everyone else it is painfully clearly and obviously nothing but selfish horseshit.

    You will never have the amount of self reflection needed to understand what I and others have bothered trying to posit to you today, and yet you persist in trying to convince us that no you're just a sad sad widdle boy who needs to be fucking coddled like you apparently think everyone else is. Bitch, you have no idea what that woman I was speaking of in the beginning of this thread had gone through when you decided to slander her for no fucking good reason and whine about how bad you had it in comparison. You are the one who came in and slandered a person who I have compassion for because you're a whiny little fucking bitch who can't handle seeing people who are emotionally mature without deciding you need to shit all over it.

    I'm done trying to explain it to you. You have no intention to hear it, you have every intention to repeat your selfish bullshit in desperate attempts to manipulate people into feeling sorry for you. Fucking suck it, loser. Eat shit. Nobody with a compassionate and empathetic bone in their body has time to waste on people like you and I regret spending the latter half of my day wasting my time trying to get you to see your own fucked up priorities, because you clearly want to be a victim so god damned badly you'll Donald Trump it to the end of your life.

    I mean seriously dude in your second message to me you said "Don't be a cuck." Like what kind of clueless and fucking dickless wonder who admits he never gets laid says that to a fat fucking loser like me who has had endless pussy simply because he's a nice person? I'm being a cuck because I fucked a bunch of women and some of them moved on in their lives? And you're not an incel? Fuck me, you're an incel, a moron and a liar because if you had cared about anyone's feelings at any point that wouldn't have been one of the first things you said to me. Yet despite that, for a while, I tried to give your stupid worthless victimhood desiring ass the benefit of the doubt. You took my kindness even after you had already attempted to insult me and went "WAHH NOT GOOD ENOUGH BECAUSE I'M A LITTLE BITCH!" Well, fine, go be a little bitch, then.

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago*

    Like, think about that for a minute, you want others to consider your feelings, but you consistently have made clear you're actually content to not think about theirs

    You continue to reverse the order of operations. I stopped caring about people's feelings after years of consistent reaffirmation that nobody cares about mine. Why should I? By your logic, you don't have to care about my feelings because I don't care about yours. Apply your logic consistently and this whole thing will make more sense to you.

    Or continue making special exceptions for yourself to justify why it's okay to degrade me, but wrong if I question someone else's choices, because I'm an easy target and it's so easy to gang up on someone that already no one likes.

    You've consistently operated on the assumption that I can simply choose to be likeable, but I assure you that no matter what I do, I will never be likeable because I don't know how to be "normal," and the harder I try the more people call me "cringe" or a "try-hard." You can go back as far as you please, to my earliest memories and beyond, and I was already being ostracized, bullied, and isolated.

    Call me a fucking whiny bitch. I don't care. And when I don't care the next time someone else complains about their problems you'll probably call me callous. Because to you, their problems matter, and mine don't. It's a pattern I'm familiar with. This isn't fucking new to me. You're not unique, and your vitriol isn't some breakthrough revelation that's somehow never occurred to me.

    You don't know fucking shit about me or my life. Don't give yourself a stroke on your way out the door.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (20 children)

    Seriously man, and I say this with no ill-intent or judgment, you need a therapist. This is way too much for me, an internet stranger, to unpack. I go to therapy for chronic depression that I had long before I was diagnosed with cancer when the depression got worse. I often feel like the universe taunts me by giving me everything I've ever dreamed of and then slapping it out of my hands and pointing and laughing. I'm not blaming you for anything, but we all have time to grow and the ability to grow and change and not be the person we were raised to be with the limitations placed on us. I was sent to an extremely small private Baptist school where the only "friends" I had were the same 18 kids from kindergarten to middle school, and I was mostly bullied and ostracized by them. My mother was overbearingly Christian and lacked education herself and had trauma from losing her first children to being kidnapped by her ex-husband which led her to being overly controlling because she would panic about losing us the same way. My extended family was similar to yours, it sounds like as well. I am by no means conventionally attractive and have been overweight the majority of my life.

    Our experiences and trauma don't define us. The pain and problems we suffered aren't what make us who we are unless we allow them to. That bitterness you hold for it all, that deep contempt for a world where you assume everyone is going to reject you or judge you before even giving them the chance to do so is a choice, even if it doesn't feel like one. I just try to let such judgments roll off my back, because they will always be there, there will always be someone else judging us or rejecting us. I learned that in high school when I found out there was some kid who hated me and thought I got all the attention from women because of one of my few friends who even had a boyfriend who wasn't me. It made no sense because she was just my friend and was dating someone else, and it just made me laugh, because it was so patently absurd.

    The only blame I can lay at your feet is your unwillingness to be open to the opportunity for things to be different instead of crawling inside a shell of self-protection by rejecting others before they can reject you, and even then I can understand why your trauma makes that hard. It's been hard for me in similar ways, but I promise you life is easier if you don't do that. I promise that you don't have to reject everyone to protect yourself, and that you're doing yourself more harm and disservice by doing so than you would by being open to the opportunity for something good to happen for once.

    What probably makes me the saddest is how much how you speak reminds me of my longest-lived relationship, and the one that troubles me the most about it ending, where she felt like no one would ever love her and people would always judge her for her mental health problems and she had endless panic about being abandoned. I spent so much time and energy trying to prove to her she was worth loving, and that she shouldn't let people's judgments impact her, and that I wasn't going to abandon her. You deserve someone who gives you that kind of effort and time as well, but if you don't allow someone giving you that kind of time and effort to allow yourself to grow and accept that things could be better, try to change your outlook, you will end up still bitter and blaming the world just like she does, which is what ultimately ended our relationship. I worry for her a lot still.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (19 children)

    I've been in therapy. I understand the tools and techniques. I've done CBT, DBT, ACT, and others. I've been in residential programs, inpatient, intensive outpatient, regular outpatient, you name it. It can give me a place to vent, get me geared up with tools and excited to start again, a new start, a fresh day, whatever.

    But when I go back into society with all my tools from therapy, I still get the same response as always. People don't like me, they never have and they never will. And I got tired of being gaslit by my therapists that my problems were all in my head and I just need to reframe them.

    I've had a decade of adulthood to "grow," and I focused intensely on self-help, personal growth, all that stuff. I followed every avenue I could find. And at the end of it all, people only thought it made me self-absorbed. Any social skill I've tried to learn and practice, people sense the unnaturalness and think I'm being a manipulator with some sort of dark psychology techniques. No, it read about "mirroring" and stuff like that in books on interpersonal communication and conflict resolution. Not some narcissist's field manual.

    So I have two choices: be awkward and cringe, but genuinely awkward and cringe; or try to be normal, but in a contrived and inauthentic way. I cannot be genuinely normal. That option is not available to me.

    Sorry about the traumas you've faced, and I'm glad you could come out on top of it. But you need to recognize that you're the exception rather than the rule. You can't expect everyone to turn out well just because you did.

    I spent most of my early twenties as a recluse. I spent my mid-twenties trying to overcome my social anxiety, social ineptitude, and generally trying to integrate into society. I was constantly buffeted by judgement and ill-will, but for years I didn't let it keep me down. I kept trying. I was persistent.

    By my mid-to-late twenties, it began to seem insurmountable, my frustrations grew, challenges escalated, and I started cracking. I think there were also some external factors like being doxxed/cybergangstalked, threatened, harassed, gaslit, and all kinds of nastiness. I couldn't prove anything so my doctors called it psychosis.

    Anyway, my anxiety reached a crescendo and I began regularly fighting panic attacks. A couple breakdowns later I had my first trip to the mental hospital, which was only more traumatizing. I've been in others since which were more professional, but I'm fairly certain that first one was torturing me (both physically and psychologically) under cover of "treatment."

    It was the beginning of a long, slow spiral. I fought to stay afloat all along the way, but things only got worse the more I fought it, like quick sand. It was a long tumble, with plenty of bumps all along the way. I even got arrested at one point for "disorderly conduct" while having an acute psychological episode.

    Anyway, several trips to the psych ward later, multiple times in residential therapy, I've given up on thrashing. I don't go in public anymore. I don't even go to the fucking grocery store, say what you will but I get them delivered.

    I'll probably never be able to get hired again, even without the apocalyptic nosedive the job market is taking. Even if I could convince someone to hire me, I probably wouldn't be able to hold a job for very long.

    I've spiralled too far to try to make a recovery, especially when for every five steps I try to climb, I end up falling thirty. Don't try to give me hope, I don't need that poison.

    Yeah, the person you describe in your last paragraph sounds like me. But it's a lot less endearing to be a man and need constant reassurance. Women like that have a chance. I don't.

    you will end up still bitter and blaming the world just like she does

    I already am, dude.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (18 children)

    I already am, dude.

    I can tell. I tried to be supportive and understanding here instead of just ragging on you, which I definitely could have. You have rejected it out of hand with excuses of why it just makes sense for you to be bitter and hateful. I don't know what else to tell you. That's on you.

    Also, I definitely don't think I'm the exception rather than the rule considering how many men I know who have had similar traumas and are also well adjusted adults who don't blame the whole world for their problems.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (17 children)

    If people can't blame the world for their problems, then why the fuck should any of us care about systemic oppression? It's the same logic. Blame the people who suffer for their own conditions.

    If my problems don't matter, then no one's do. Or am I some special exception where everyone else's problems matter except mine?

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (16 children)

    It's absolutely not the same logic. You not being able to get loving people in your life as an individual because of a bad attitude and outlook is not in any way the same as systemic oppression. You are not being systemically oppressed because your shitty outlook and attitude makes you not likeable. You not having people who like you in your life is not anything like people being kidnapped in the streets for being the wrong race or having the wrong politics, being denied legal counsel, food, water, or reasonable living facilities and then being disappeared to a country they've never been to. The comparison is honestly laughable.

    You're desperately looking for any way to justify being an angry bitter sad sack. I don't know what to tell you.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Mate, I may or may not be qualified to diagnose anyone and don't know this person intimately, but they're giving off serious cluster B vibes. You can't argue logic with a cluster B personality that doesn't want to hear it. There's the world we live in and there's the world they fabricate, and the harder you push them toward reality, the deeper they delve into their denial of it.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (14 children)

    Am I unlikeable because I'm bitter or am I bitter because I'm unlikeable?

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (13 children)

    It's the first one, I promise. The second one is just the excuse you give yourself. It's a choice you're making to be bitter and unlikable, as much as you want to pretend it's not.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (12 children)

    Okay, then I'll go back in time and tell my five-year-old self that it's actually my fault that I'm being picked on, that I'm just genuinely unlikeable and need to stop being bitter.

    Maybe then I'll earn my dad's approval, and everyone who's taken advantage of me, bullied me, or treated me like a pushover ever since will magically respect me.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (11 children)

    You're an adult, and you don't change it by telling your child self that, you change it by having some fucking self respect and not blaming every person who has mistreated you for why you should never trust or be kind to anyone else ever. Your own inability to accept your own lack of boundaries when it comes to being taken advantage of or treated like a pushover is evidence of that. I've been hurt too, but I also see when I made mistakes, didn't set clear boundaries, and how that impacted the situations a great deal. I have also seen when my own bad attitude has led people to dislike me, and so I dropped the bad attitude, because it hurt me more than helped me, and honestly, I'm much happier for it. You really ought to try it sometime.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (10 children)

    So if I have weak boundaries and let people take advantage of me, then it's my fault and I can't blame others?

    But when a woman has weak boundaries and gets taken advantage of, it's not her fault and she can blame men as a whole and take it out on men who had nothing to do with it?

    Do you not see the double-standard here? Doesn't that reinforce gender stereotypes where "Men just need to take it on the chin, be a man, be tough. You're responsible for your own destiny. Not women though, they're subject to conditions and don't have any agency or control over their lives."?

    Whenever I point this out, people get upset. As if I'm the one advocating for the stereotype. I'm not. I'm pointing out how it endures in the common mentality that we're discussing here.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (9 children)

    That's odd because out here in the real world people absolutely let women know that it's their own lack of boundaries that led to being taken advantage of, and nobody gets upset because no one is being a petulant ill tempered dick about it when they do so. You are literally living in a fantasy land you've built for yourself so you don't have to face your own shitty attitude being part of this.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (8 children)

    You are literally living in a fantasy land you've built for yourself

    How exactly do you expect me to be in touch with consensus reality when I've been excluded from it and isolated for most of my life?

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (7 children)

    I don't know man, I was excluded from it for a long time and I made myself a better person and then had a happier life. You seem pretty dedicated to being an angry bitter asshole who blames everything on everyone but yourself, so like I said, you do you. Go ahead and be a fucking asshole who no one likes. I did my bit, walk away and stop being an annoying loser, please and thank you.

    You got what you wanted, I'm sick of your loser shit, so piss off please. I don't need to hear it anymore, because you'll just use this as justification for why you're a fucking angry shitty loser instead of having an ounce of self reflection over anything you've said here in this giant fuck off thread of you being a whiny little bitch. Good, I hope you feel justified and I hope you stay the sad sack loser you are, because if you're really this much of a twerp who can't listen to positive re-enforcement you probably deserve it.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (6 children)

    Wow, and to think I almost thought you were a decent person. Okay, whatever. Think I don't have thick skin from a lifetime of being treated like that? I've learned to laugh when I'm insulted, because otherwise I'd never laugh.

    If you're that upset about it, you don't have to respond. Geeze, and you say I blame others for my bitterness. Whatever, dude.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (5 children)

    Geeze, and you say I blame others for my bitterness.

    Called it.

    I don’t need to hear it anymore, because you’ll just use this as justification for why you’re a fucking angry shitty loser instead of having an ounce of self reflection over anything you’ve said here in this giant fuck off thread of you being a whiny little bitch.

    Also, if you actually had a thick skin, you wouldn't be a such a fucking whiner about all the times you've been mistreated. You're like that dipshit Donald Trump. Says he's a big strong man but can't shut the fuck up about all the perceived slights he's ever received. Strong people with thick skin don't spend several hours writing full on screeds about how awful their life is because everyone else is a big meanie. They especially don't compare people not liking them because they're a bitter assholes to people's human rights being violated. Seriously, grow the fuck up. Although I know you won't because then you won't have the satisfaction of being able to say it's everyone else's fault.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    Don't compare me to that fascist.

    Never once did I claim to be "strong." Humans are remarkably fragile beings. Anybody who considers themself "strong" is deluding themselves.

    I said I have thick skin, there's a difference. If I didn't, I'd be butthurt about the things you're saying, which are clearly intended to be hurtful.

    Also, having thick skin doesn't imply acceptance of abuse. Didn't you learn that in therapy?

    I can have thick skin and still complain about the problems I've faced. And if it doesn't matter that the world has been unfair to me, then I will no longer care about being fair to the world. Simple as.

    Sounds like the making of a supervillain background story. Don't worry, I don't think I have any superpowers.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago* (3 children)

    Don’t worry, I don’t think I have any superpowers.

    I don't know, you're the biggest fucking clown I've ever encountered, so that seems like a superpower.

    You get to be compared to him, because I spent an afternoon trying to be nice and having you bitch and moan and make excuses for yourself at me. Just like he does. Get over it.

    Also, it's weird how much you obviously get off on this. It's clear you want people to not like you so you can be bitter about it, otherwise why would you try so fucking hard to make it happen?

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Fuck you. I haven't really been upset about anything you said until this point, but fuck you for that one.

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  • [–] 44 points 9 months ago*

    A friend I met as an adult. He had a pretty rough life growing up, his family was homeless and roamed around a lot, he was supposed to be 'homeschooled' but was really taking care of his parents during that time, so he never really had an education, obviously never went to college, etc.

    He fell into learning programming as a teenager and started working when he was 16 as a web programmer. Now in his 30's, he makes more money than anyone I've personally known and I'm so freaking happy for him. A lot of bullshit people like to brag that they're 'self made' when they own companies, or are CEO's, etc. And this guy is like the most humble, kind and well adjusted person I've ever known, and he did it all himself. Super greatful to be his friend and have him in my life.

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  • [–] 37 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    A guy I grew up with playing music and working odd jobs for his dad is now a hardcore right wing influencer.

    His family was very progressive (still are as far as I know) and we lived in a staunchly blue part of the country. Hell, we wrote songs that were hyper critical of the govt and authoritarian systems.

    Now he’s screeching to a million plus followers and participating in counter protests as a pro-maga mouthpiece.

    I am sure it has to be for money. He was always an egomaniac. Between that and the dopamine hit of a good grift, it has to be. I just can’t resolve in my own heart that he’s truly gone to the dark side.

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  • [–] 35 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Not to judge your friend, but an egomaniacal dopamine addicted grifter IS the dark side

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  • [–] 30 points 9 months ago

    A guy with good grades was accepted into a prestigious architectural school.

    He works for a local brewery now.

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  • [–] 22 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

    The one who became sergeant of a French special forces unit really surprised me. I thought he was gonna become a brilliant mathematician.

    Edit because this is bringing back memories and I'm bored af: I have 2 best friends. Him, and another guy. They are diametrically opposed and never could really get along for more than a couple of hours. The other guy became a successful businessman (the 'has 3 new sports cars in the garage' kind), which I always knew was coming, but I know how he got his seed money, and how that's the real reason why he can't live in our birth country anymore. He was the street smart one. I met him at a martial arts tournament (kicked my ass btw). The other best friend, the subject of this comment, was always pretty much Sheldon Cooper. Archetypical book smart. We were in the same elementary school, high school, and college. Smartest guy I have ever known, but super awkward, which never bothered me the slightest.

    And so we were in college together, and after another night of him drinking way too much, to the point of resulting in a head wound that I treated in my room with my mother who's a nurse on the phone, he decided he absolutely needs strong structure, dropped out, enlisted 2 days later. A year later he was in the special forces. 2 years after that he was sergeant. 3 years later another grade bump, and now he teaches strategy at the top military academy we have. Turns out he wasn't just a brilliant nerd, he's the kind that's brilliant at anything he sets his mind on. I don't call "best friend" just anybody :)

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 child)

    He wasn't a friend, but he was an acquaintance. There was this guy named Robbie, who was dating the principal's daughter, and everything seemed bright and shiny for them.

    They were like our small school's power couple, Robbie and Shannon.

    After high school, Shannon came up pregnant, and everyone was excited and startled because they hadn't gotten married yet, and then it came out that the kid wasn't Robbie's.

    Robbie took a nap on a train track.

    The weird thing is, he survived being run over by a train. It was a huge event in our suburb.

    But then he went deep into drugs and just fell apart. I don't think he made it to 27.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago

    Fuck it, I'm gonna skirt the rules a little and say me: I'm alive past 25 years old.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago

    The girl who got into every prestigious university for hard sciences is now working in the performing arts. I assume she was studying to placate her parents and then chose her own path as soon as she could escape.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago

    Not high school, but close. We hung out in the same group of friends freshman year at the local technical college. He was a very free spirited guy, with all sorts of wild tattoos and piercings, like a few others in the group. He even got some sort of genital piercing that I declined to see when he was showing it off after he got it. He was also fairly antiestablishment, an atheist who I think leaned politicaly towards anarchism.

    Unlike the rest of the group though, he was way into drugs. There were a few who dabbled in marijuana and probably one dedicated stoner, but nothing like this. This guy was snorting lines of cocaine off the bathroom sink between classes, and always finding new pills try. Aside from that he was a very personable guy who had interesting perspectives to include in our conversations about anything and everything. Even when he wasn't all there, at worst he was still decent company, so everyone just let it go. We'd all expressed our concerns at one point, and there wasn't any point in continuing to bring it up. We were a very diverse group and most of us had some things we tolerated but didn't agree with in each other.

    For Christmas that year I bought a cheap little gift for each person in the group. Most were silly, but I got him a pill organizer. He excitedly began to brainstorm organizational ideas on how to use it, going on about uppers and downers and more terminology I can't recall. I told him something along the lines of knowing he wasn't going to stop experimenting, but I hoped it would help him stay safe. He hugged me and said it was one of the most thoughtful gifts he'd ever gotten.

    At the end of the school year we largely all ended up going different ways and I lost track of him. Many years later, I heard from a friend I had kept in touch with that they had run into him. I'd feared he'd end up in jail or dead, but he was doing well, if in an unexpected way. Still had kept the crazy piercings, but was otherwise a button down, white collar guy. He had a wife and kids, lived in a suburban home, and worked as a manager at some office business. He was even a deacon at his church. He was healthy, happy, and proud to be many years clean of drugs. I'm glad he kept enough of the rebel spirit to keep the piercings, and I'm more glad he was off the drugs.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago*

    Not necessarily a friend but someone I often spoke to back then. We met once again some years ago (just around when Covid hit).

    He mentioned, he’s trying to get his life back on the rails; he got send to jail twice and then he went to the gym and got much more healthier (lost a lot of weight). I was surprised that he got send to jail, let alone twice.

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  • [–] 15 points 9 months ago

    I'm from a small town that has 3 factories in it. They employ a good portion of the area.

    A friend of mine who was pretty socially awkward but really smart worked in one of the factories in the summers while he was going to college for accounting. He got his degree and...moved back home. He still works at the factory full time on the floor. We graduated high school in 2002.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago* (4 children)

    A quiet nerdy guy I went to school with died at 19 in a freak magazine explosion aboard a ship he was serving on. Wouldn't have expected him to be in the navy, much less have such a random, rare, or young end.

    I'm 52 and shocked by the number of high school classmates I've lost. A girl I dated a few different times in our lives died. She lived hard for parts of her life and I guess it wouldn't shock me if she fell back into drugs and accidentally OD'd, but I always wanted better for her. Maybe it wasn't drugs. Doesn't matter I guess. We weren't right for each other but I kept trying to save her whether as a friend or something more. Guess I didn't.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I'm 52 and shocked by the number of high school classmates I've lost.

    Oh man.. I hear that one. I graduated in '82 and on the 40th reunion, I was shocked at the number of my classmates that had died who were fine on our 30th reunion. The 45-65 years seem to be when a lot of the "premature deaths" people fall.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    I'm twenty years your junior. My cohort has seen/continues to see a lot of opioid deaths.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    I do not doubt it.

    When I was a kid - now we're going back to the mid-70's after the Vietnam War ended - there were public service ads on TV to avoid opiates all thr time, though I think it was mostly heroin or morphine.

    Gotta thank the billionaire Sackler family for the mid-90's wave of Oxy addictions that seems to have kicked off the current wave.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    I'm in my mid-40s. I moved for my final year of highschool, so it's a bit weird. When Facebook came out, I did reconnect with some, but I quit it around 8 years ago now and lost contact mostly. When I look up my first (rural) school classmates by name now and again, I get so many obituaries. Some freak accidents, many cae accidents, some military, and others still drugs and violence (not much else in tiny truck stop towns). My graduating class was like 180is people and easily a tenth of them are gone (it feels more like 1/5 even).

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  • [–] 14 points 9 months ago

    My punk show / skater buddy went hard into religion, which led to apparent right-wing politics.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    The top performer is still in his hometown working a minimum wage job :-/ The guy was crazy intelligent.. I have no idea what happened...

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago

    The biggest shock was a guy I met in first grade and was friends with all throughout school. We went our separate ways for college but saw each other on breaks. He went on to grad school, then med school and residency after that and I didn't see him much. I was supposed to see him and a bunch of other friends at wedding but he didn't make it. We callled him and gave him shit about it and he kinda played it off.

    One day a year or so later my mom asked if he was done with residency and was a full doctor yet. I wasn't sure so I looked on Facebook and his was about as barren as mine the last 10 years. Did a search, and nope not a doctor, got caught trying to pick up a 15 year old.

    I never expected anyone I grew up with to ever be on the wrong side of the law for anything more than a misdemeanor.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago

    not a friend, but the biggest asshole drug dealer at my school and his trailer park family ended up being Mayor of Toronto and Premiere of Ontario.

    I just assumed they would be incarcerated by 21.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago*

    Both my best friends from highschool died.

    One during a winter storm her freshman year of uni, car accident.

    The other I lost contact with until I heard she died of an OD.

    Nearly all of my friend group got hooked on drugs (except the one who made it to uni) and I guess some got clean but I never hung out with them again. My friend dying in the snow storm really fucked me up. we were inseparable in school. I think she'd let me laugh though, took her five tries to get her license, maybe should have taken 6 :(

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

    pretty much all of my high school friends went off the deep end, except for myself.

    my best friend went to jail for heroin positition and beating his girlfriend.
    most of my other friends dropped out of college and burned out on drugs to the point they looked/sounded like homeless mushmouths, or if they were women, they got married at like 20 and popped out kids and never had jobs.

    one of my girlfriends became a nun another one became a stripper
    another became a nun then left the covenant became a trad wife
    another one became a poor broke hippie and married the guy she dated after me who was poor broke musician, and they both became addicts.

    a lot of other people i was not friends with, even if they did graduate college and get jobs, lived at home, married very young, and basically inherited their parents homes and never left the area. they never lived on their own or had lives outside of the town. that includes some of my relatives, they all ended up working for their parents even if they graduated college.

    I grew up in a shitty town that was in the lower quartile of economy/education. i was maybe like 10% of people who grew up there who 'made it out'. and when people learn what town i grew up in they tend to give me the cold shoulder because it's not a 'good place' and 'good people' don't come from there... which is pretty much true. it sucks to that i will never live down the fact my parents were broke and that town was the best place they could afford to live.

    on the flip side, anytime i met anyone from my past... they think I'm major pretentious asshole now because I went to an ivy league school, got a good job, lived on my own my entire life, got a graduate degree, lived abroad, and now live in one of the most expensive zip codes in the country. and they start telling how 'disappointed' they are I'm not famous or super rich some bullshit. because they are miserable twats who hate their lives and made bad choices. I didn't. i have never been back to that down since my parents sold the house when i was 21.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago

    The sweet, shy, quiet band girl ODd on heroin sophomore year.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    I am Italian, and in high school I had a friend who was REALLY into Indiana Jones movies and games. He kept saying he was going to be an archaeologist and we all scoffed at him.

    Fast forward 20 years later, and he is not only an archaeologist but one of the best Latin epigraphists.

    Some years ago, I was visiting an ancient Roman villa close to Naples and sent him the photo of a random marble epigraph, and he told me that that guy named there was the son-in-law of another epigraph he sent me promptly a picture of, but also that since I was so much into Stoicism, I would be interested in the bust that is 180 degrees behind me, picturing the neighbor of Seneca in Baia or something like that.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    Smartest kid in our high school, easily got valedictorian in a very competitive school. Got a full ride to Harvard. Got his Masters. Became a research scientist. Was on track to get his PhD. Suddenly quit it all and became an elementary school music teacher. From what I can tell, he seems happy, but that burnout must have been crazy.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    I had a really close group of friends in high school and by the time we had all graduated college all of us were going in directions we never predicted.

    One buddie became a doctor.

    One really loved being a professional chef.

    I joined the Army after Undergrad and eventually went into IT.

    The fourth member became a jeweler.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    A sweet younger friend who was about 12 when I was in high school ended up doing meth, possibly selling meth, and in prison for shooting her bf to death (over meth.)

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    One of my friends from our Boy Scout troop got into meth and went to prison for home invasion.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I'm the biggest one in my friend group to go a different direction.

    But there's one guy who I was decent friends with. He'd been the most vocal atheist at our catholic school, went off to a prestigious college in California that happened to be Christian. The few times I saw him after that he'd been getting over his proto-incel mindset he'd had since high school, was increasingly progressive and feminist and starting to get women's attention. Then he disappeared, last I heard he'd started a philosophy degree and converted to a form of conservative Christianity, but that's just a rumor.

    There's also the friend who's manic-depressive and had been increasingly into drugs through high school and as he was failing out of college due to mental illness. He was a progressive communist and atheist since we were like 12. Hell he was the person to break me out of the Catholic anti choice stance when we were teenagers. Well he had a bad trip in our early 20s, and he found a very different Jesus than the other friend. He's done with psychedelics and never touched the hard stuff. He kept his political beliefs though, just found Jesus with them. Wound up finding a career that makes him happy in landscaping, and he's engaged now to a woman who seems really good for him. It's been too long since we've seen each other, he's a good man even if he did wind up the sort of guy that's really into sports.

    My other two friends from high school more shocked me by how they stayed the same. I love them both, they're good men, but also little growth in their 20s.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    he’s a good man even if he did wind up the sort of guy that’s really into sports.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    Haven't really kept up with them. Not big on facebook and don't live nearby and life is to busy in general. Know at least one college guy became a nutter and another sorta a bussiness asshole.

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