Why or why not?

top 98 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 23 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I'd be a bit of a hypocrite if I had a problem with that

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    ha, fair enough - though it's precisely because I'm trans that I would be hesitant to date a trans person, but honestly it would depend on the person and where they are in transition, among other things. I guess in my mind if I loved them, that would transcend that they are trans (just like if they were in an accident and became paraplegic, my love and loyalty to my partner would mean I would still love them and stay with them even with that disability).

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • Fair enough. I might be a little hesitant to date someone really early in their transition, just because I would need to seriously consider whether I was able to take on the somewhat implied responsibility that comes with that to guide them through such a scary and vulnerable period.

    Beyond that I'm functionally t4t, it's just really nice to date someone who gets you, and all the baggage that entails, and with whom you already have such a strong shared connection.

  • source
  • parent
  • [+] 23 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 45 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    Yes. Because i find them attractive.

  • source
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] [S] -3 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    this is the right answer, here is your prize: πŸŽ‚

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Having been in this position, sure, but I've also had to end relationships because the person transitioned in a direction I wasn't attracted to. Communicating honestly and openly is the key, as it is for pretty much everything about interpersonal relationships.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Side note: The atmosphere on Lemmy is very pro-queer. Mastodon seems to be pretty queer too, but the number of users is a lot bigger, so you might see more diversity in answers. If you asked the same question on Reddit or X, you would absolutely find lots of unsavory comments.

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago

    No, because I'm already happily married.

    If I weren't, well, the "equipment" is part of what I'm attracted to. So whether I would want to continue something long term depends on what they're working with.

  • source
  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    If I found someone attractive, yes of course. I don’t care if you’re straight, gay, bi, trans, whatever - I’m not attracted to sex or the bits between your legs, I’m attracted to person and personality. As long as you’re confident and comfortable being you, I’ll swing anyway you want.

    But due to the world we live in, lot of the time the struggle of being them so very much in their identity that they can’t talk about much else and I don’t find that very attractive, in fact quite the opposite.

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I would say only a minority of us are like that, and usually it's more intense early in transition.

    tbh a lot (if not most) trans people just adapt to living as their gender and are fairly "normal" at that point.

    When they can, most seem to leave the community, stop identifying as trans, and just integrate fully into cis society. This is part of why it's hard to find trans elders online, "trans community" both in person and online seems to be mostly for people who are visibly non-conforming or who are early in transition.

    So the visibly trans people are usually early transitioners, people who struggle with passing (whether intentional or not), and the loud, proud activist types. This can skew the perception of what trans people are like generally.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Yes, I think you're correct. The noise/signal ratio tends to be bad in online communities and especially in social media (as with any other topic). I've met some lovely (and attractive!) trans people in work life. Never dated one though, as I've been "off the market" for years now, but I don't find the idea any stranger than dating anyone else. If there's a mutual connection, then that's all I need. The rest will sort itself out and this, as you rightfully point out, has become stronger and clearer the older I've become.

  • source
  • parent
  • [+] 54 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] [S] 13 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    true, it's hard to fit all the context I wanted to add within a title ...

    my question is really meant to ask how people would react to learning someone they are attracted to and would otherwise date is trans

    If I just asked "would you date a trans person" I would expect the reader to think of an ugly trans person because that's the stereotype, and then the answer is usually no, but that doesn't get at what I'm wondering about.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    Being already married and stuff aside, as a straight cisgender male I would honestly have a hard time with it. Like, my parents' neighbor is a trans woman and I'd be lying if I denied noticing her (covered) boobs when she was hanging out in the back yard. But if I'm going to have a romantic relationship with someone, there are physical traits that attract me and others that don't... And I would need to be attracted to my partner, both with what's typically visible in public and what isn't.

    It's nothing personal, and I truly hope their new body (whatever that may be) works for them and they find the love they want. It's just not what I'm after.

    To use the cliche as a tl;dr, it's not you, it's me.

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Would you feel differently about a post-op trans woman? I assume the hang-up is the penis on a woman?

    Do you think a penis would be a deal-breaker even if it were feminine: soft, flaccid, more like an oversized clit than a penis? Would it change anything to know lots of trans women's penises don't ejaculate, but instead produce wetness like a cis woman would when aroused?

    I don't doubt the gential preference, I just sometimes think straight men think of the female penis as being like a man's penis, and that's not usually the case.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    To be honest, I'm not entirely sure. In theory, sure: the initial question assumed initial (presumably clothed) attraction. You've got the body parts I enjoy between the sheets. Let's give it a try!

    But also, I'm a dumb human with dumb human hangups that shouldn't matter, but do. Maybe this person is everything I wanted and I could never turn that down; maybe there's a mental block I just can't get around despite my best efforts

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago

    Personally yes. Because I can find attractive all types of primary and secondary sexual features. So there's no problem if there are some mixed features.

    But I would understand if someone who doesn't find penises/vaginas attractive wouldn't want to date other someone who has a penis/vagina.

  • source
  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I somehow added an i there and was a little too excited to comment 'Yes, who doesn't love trains!?!?'

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    No, because I'm taken but it wouldn't change the fact that I find them attractive. I'd date someone no matter their gender or genitals though, if thats what your asking

  • source
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] [S] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    that's not exactly what I'm asking - but it's informative that gentials come up (makes sense in the context of dating)

    I tend to think of being trans as more than just gential situation in terms of dating - if the person is not passing for example, you might get stared at as a couple in public, the stigma that is directed at them might also impact you. Their life experiences- the harassment, the unemployment, etc. might impact you. For me, these even might be more important factors than their genitals.

    (I tend to be able to see a female penis as female, it's usually soft and flaccid, like an oversized clit - it's not as "male" as people tend to think, which can be a disappointment for a certain subset of people who want the female penis to perform and fill the role a male penis usually does.)

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I only mentioned genitals because it seems to matter to most people. I really don't care tbh, I could date someone with zero sex involved if I wanted. As for social stigma, that shit can suck but it wouldn't stop me from dating them.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    The only issue I might have is that some of the bigotry might start coming after me for associating. I’d like to think I’m the sort of person that would stand strong against that shit but I recognize that’s easier said than done from a position as relatively comfortable as the one I’m in.

    Who am I kidding, though? I’d never think through the question as long as I did being asked it as a hypothetical. I’d date her and then maybe regret it later for the tangential reason.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago

    you are the first person to mention this! I'm shocked all the focus is on gentials when I would think the stigma and being a political scapegoat would be bigger concerns!

    Follow-up question: what if she were cis passing and you didn't experience stigma being in public together?

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    I would say I am hetero.
    If they reflect the sex they are claiming to be? Sure. I am not planning on making kids. So no way of getting pregnant either.
    Rather would adopt anyway.

    Edit: This assumes I like their personality in the first place.
    And it would maybe only in tge first couple weeks be novel and unusual/weird to me. Then it's just business as usual.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 year ago

    This makes sense - by "reflect the sex they are claiming to be" do you just mean they are suitably feminine and appear to be a woman?

    This is a fairly reasonable take, or at least I completely understand why someone who is a straight man would not want to date someone who appears male, for example.

    I guess one question I have is whether a female penis would be a problem for you as a straight man? Separately is having a vagina an important requirement for you to date a trans woman (you might be happy with a female penis, but still want penetration with a vagina, which is why I see these as two separate questions).

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 27 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    I would not. I'm all for treating people as they want to be treated, but as far as my own attraction goes, I don't think I'd be able to completely think of them as being of the opposite sex.

  • source
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] [S] 7 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    this assumes you are able to tell, do you think you can always tell?

    or is the point that once you know they are trans, the knowledge prevents you from seeing them as their gender?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    If I couldn't tell, and they didn't tell me, then i guess I'd just be happy in my ignorance. I can't say that I can always tell, because... well I wouldn't necessarily know about the times I couldn't tell. But yes, if I knew then it would break the attraction for me.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] [S] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    that makes sense!

    What do you think it is about learning someone is trans that breaks the attraction for you?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Good question. I think what it comes down to is that the idea of someone being trans is just kind of foreign to me. I never met someone in person who was trans until I was close to 40, as far as I know. So for most of my life I categorized people, at least as far as attractiveness and dating goes, without distinguishing between sex at birth and gender identity.
    So while I treat (or hope that I treat) trans people as appropriate for their chosen gender, it doesn't come completely naturally to me. It's hard for me not to think of a trans woman as "a man who wants to be treated as a woman", even though I know that's not what they want. And while in day to day interactions I can just ignore that difficulty and treat a trans woman as a woman, when it comes to romantic interest it is not so easily ignored.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Same. Similar, anyway. I've only knowingly met one trans woman who completely passed, who - if they were a Cis woman - not only would I have been with, but would've been completely out of my league.

    But knowing they were Trans... yeah, I have hangups, in the same way I'd have hangups about the idea of being intimate with another man. I'm not completely against the idea, but I've got ingrained social prejudices it would take a fair bit of work to overcome.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    I know a couple of people who transitioned and if I didn't know I couldn't tell.

    I think I would be open to date if I found out organically that they are trans.
    If instead it is the topic of conversation every other day, I'd pass.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I've never been in that situation but I wouldn't rule it out on principle.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] -1 points 1 year ago

    that seems reasonable

    I'm sure most of us would have internal barriers in place that would make it challenging to date someone who is different that way - no different in some ways than struggling to date someone in a wheelchair or who lives with a major disability.

    But I think it makes sense to not pre-emptively judge a situation, to be open to possibility.

    Are there boundaries or limitations you think would make it challenging for you to date a trans person?

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Trans women are women, and women are gorgeous. So heck yes for transfemmes.

    Cute enbies are cute enbies, you can bet I'm down <3

    If a person I was dating transitioned to being a man, I would probably have to end it unless they were a femboy? (Currently seeing a transmasc femboy - he's cute as hell <3)

    Reason? I'm not attracted to a person's genitals or the gender they were assigned at birth, I'm attracted to the person! If they have a penis/neopenis or vagina/neovagina or both or neither - who gives a damn. If a doctor declared they were "male" 20 years ago who gives the slightest fuck.

  • source
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    If I were single and they* were secure, then sure. I really feel for a lot of trans people because I know the transition can cause a lot of insecurity. And that's absolutely valid and I don't want to be unfeeling about it, but at the same time I know myself and I don't want a partner who is insecure and potentially overly emotionally needy, because I'm not good at providing that kind of support. So I'd be fine dating a trans person who is confident and secure, no matter where in the transition the person is.

    * I say 'they' because I'm fine dating either men or women, not because I want to invalidate anyone's gender :)

  • source
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Personally yes, absolutely. I guess benefits of being Bi/Pan?

    But I can see how some wouldn't. Preference and compatibility matters in a relationship.

  • source
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    If I was to go on a date and found them attractive, I would not disqualify them for being trans.

    Im a 50 year old wht sis male (I hope that's right). Tbh, not sure that this would have been my answer 25 years ago.

  • source
  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    People are misinterpreting what straight means in this thread. You can date a trans person and be straight. Have a genital preference is different than your sexual orientation. It's perfectly fine if you wouldn't date a trans person because they don't match your genital preference, sex related things can be a deal breaker. But you're not gay for dating a trans person of the opposite sex.

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 8 points 1 year ago

    +1, dating a trans woman as a man doesn't make you gay

    tangent on attraction to trans people being gayI understand why people get this confused though, a lot of times "trans woman" is a gloss for "man who lives socially as a woman" - the assumption people have is that trans women are "biologically male" - this is like an essential aspect of being a trans women, it's what differentiates them from cis women: being male. And so I understand the polite response is to treat a trans woman as a woman, but when it comes to someone's sexuality, that is likely to expose the deeper perspective that trans women are really male (and thus attraction to them is attraction to a male, and thus gay). All I can say is that trans women are women biologically, too - sex hormones like estrogen mediate a lot of the differences between male and female bodies. A trans woman on estrogen is more like a cis woman than a cis man "biologically" - the way they smell, the way they metabolize drugs, etc. And even this binary notion of sex is a bit of a lie, even cis people often have more mixed sexual traits than they realize. Anyway, this is complicated. "Straight" and "gay" might themselves not make sense in a world where we acknowledge the natural diversity in human sexual differentiation.

    I think sometimes the "genital preference" has often become an acceptable form of "transphobia" (I don't mean that word in the "I'm going to murder a trans person" kind of way, but more like a "bias and stigma against trans people" kind of way).

    I think this is a fundamental confusion about female penises, tbh - the assumption is that they are much like male penises, which is a reasonable assumption given how little exposure people have to the female penis. Even in trans porn you generally see trans women's penises being used like men's penises - how are we supposed to show this is unrealistic and not characteristic of most trans women?

    On the other hand, I do believe genital preference really should be respected regardless of whether it gets mixed up with transphobia, and someone who understands and sees a woman's penis as a female might still prefer to have penetration with a vagina, for example. Anal sex can be involved and be painful, etc. so I completely understand if that doesn't end up suitably replacing vaginal sex (and to be honest, I feel this way myself as a trans woman - I was deeply unsatisfied with having a female penis, and I feel if I have a right to my bottom dysphoria and sexual preferences, who am I to deny some legitimate preferences of sexual partners who also want a particular kind of penetration?)

    That said, I do think often ignorance and transphobia hide behind "genital preference" and this muddies the waters. My reaction to this is a bit of indifference - I'm not interested in coercing anyone into having sex with trans people, I just want to have an opportunity to expose more people to the truth and invite people to think more deeply about their beliefs. I don't need to change them, even, it's just nice to have some dialogue.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    s perfectly fine if you wouldn't date a trans person because they don't match your genital preference, sex related things can be a deal breaker. But you're not gay for dating a trans person of the opposite sex.

    Ok, then the equal is true β€” I'm not transphobic for deciding I don't want to date a trans person. Regardless of sexual part compatibility.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    If there's an expectation of sex we'd have to figure out if we're compatible that way.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago

    This is such a mature response, it remains open to possibility while being realistic about the existence of certain boundaries or needs.

    To be honest figuring out if you are sexually compatabile is an important aspect of any relationship, and trans people even more than others might need accommodation and have a need to figure out compatibility.

    How do you think you would you figure out compatibility?

  • source
  • parent
  • [+] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] [S] 1 point 1 year ago

    depends on how you're looking at them, tbh

    it makes sense as a straight guy to be attracted to trans women, I don't consider it gay to be attracted to women (though I understand the confusion about this, I assume you're not into trans women who haven't transitioned, presumably you are attracted to women who are feminine and look like women...)

    but to be attracted to a trans man definitely raises questions about how you see them. Are you attracted to a trans man like Buck Angel for example, or is it mostly early transition trans men who are androgynous and still might be mistaken for women?

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Probably not, because ultimately, I want to play with genitals that are different from mine.

    I don't expect everyone to agree, and it's perfectly okay for someone to have an alternative preference, and they are welcome to indulge it, but that's just mine.

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Why are you assuming their genitals would be the same as yours?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] [S] 10 points 1 year ago

    probably because only a minority are post-op

    fuzzy unreliable memory of potentially unreliable numbers, but I had read over half of trans women want a vagina, but only around 12% actually have one - those numbers are probably wrong, but the overall point stands that by the numbers most trans women are likely to have a female penis.

    The assumption that having a penis is essential to being a trans woman is clearly wrong, though. Most of us want a vagina, and it would be nice if access to healthcare was a priority

    currently the goal seems to be to make it as hard as possible for trans people to live as their gender, which is weirdly anti-assimilationist, you would think giving a trans woman a vagina would be entirely compatible with the conservative anxieties about trans people - the better access and care we receive, the fewer visibly trans people exist ... it is by denying us the means of assimilation to cis norms that we become social "problems", which benefits no one.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    I said Probably. If we can interlock, I'm good to go!

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago

    Well, I guess anal penetration is an option with pre-op women, assuming she is comfortable and knows how to facilitate that without pain or injury (I never fully figured it out myself, part of why having a vagina was important to me).

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    If I wasn't already in a committed relationship, yes. I'm pan.

  • source
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Generally I'm attracted to all gender expressions and sexual characteristics, just to varying degrees. Whether or not someone is trans makes no difference to me if I'm attracted to them.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    oh interesting - I stopped using "pan" as an identity label when it started to be used to mean equal attraction to genders and words like polysexual and omnisexual came out. (Polysexual: attraction to 2 or more genders, but not necessarily attracted to all genders; omnisexual: attracted to all genders, but to varying degrees.)

    To be honest I got tired of labels that had such different meanings among different groups, and I didn't like the idea of ceding "bisexual" to the transphobes, so I just identify as "bi" now because most people understand roughly what I mean by it. Realistically I'm probably polysexual, but I don't like using a label nobody is aware of, and it's not important to me to make these kinds of distinctions.

    I do think being trans could influence my attraction to someone, ironically in either direction. Being trans myself, I don't like being around other trans people because of the "second hand dysphoria" I can feel. On the other hand, the right kind of trans body can be very attractive to me - so I guess it's not straightforwardly about being trans, but generally I am less attracted to trans people because generally they remind me of how ugly and "gender fucked" I am. πŸ˜… That's a me problem, I get it.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Yep, gender is a fuck! It's messy and complicated. I have individual preferences, but no hard lines, and I don't intend on letting that define me. I even started adding "they/them" pronouns to my acceptable pronoun list even though I consider myself cis just because pronouns aren't gender, and many people don't approve of they/them pronouns. Gender is messy, and so is attraction. It's also something that changes for many people, and that's okay too!

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Yes. Penis or vagina matters little to me.

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] [S] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    interesting but not surprising to see the focus on gentials - after all the biggest problem (and for some, the biggest perk) has to do with the genital mismatch

    It's hard because not all trans people fit a single "type" - some of us get support as children and avoid going through the wrong puberty and live pretty much as cis people (though that doesn't guarantee access to SRS).

    I can't remember exactly so take this with a grain of salt, but over half of trans people want SRS but only around 12% actually have had SRS. So statistically it's probably true a given trans person is pre-op.

    Anyway, for me dating a trans person comes with a lot more than just gential configuration, it involves their daily experiences of dysphoria, discrimination, the sensitivities about how they want to be touched or not touched, how their voice sounds, their mix of socialized gendered traits, etc.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Absolutely, there’s a lot more to it than just the genitals, but to be fair, everyone has a large number of differences from the mean- I’ve met bio women with very deep voices, with unflattering figures, who’ve experienced misogyny, etc.

    Apart from the genitals, everything a trans person had that might differentiate them from a cis person can still be present in a cis person.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago

    I tend to agree, many facets of trans experience are found in cis people. It is not acknowledged how much gender diversity exists in cis populations. Many victims of trans moral panic are cis, often cis women of color are the ones targeted in bathrooms for being mistaken as trans.

    I guess with trans people there are some aspects like transition experience that won't exist in cis populations- but I love your point, thank you for that. πŸ’ž

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    No because I'm married and my wife wouldn't like that.

    More seriously, It's not a hard no, but I lean towards probably not, it would probably depend the specifics of their identity and the state of any medical transition.

    In general, I'd tend to call myself a straight cis man. If I think long and hard about it, I could make an argument that I'm perhaps something along the lines of a non-binary person with a penis, who just happens to present in a traditionally "masculine" fashion in basically every way, and who is attracted to people with vaginas who present in at least a somewhat feminine way.

    That's a fucking mouthful though, and I'm just not gonna get into the weeds about that in casual conversation.

    The fact that I'm a man isn't really something that's particularly important to me, I just kind of think of myself as a person. If somehow someone misgendered me it wouldn't bother me in the slightest (though it may get a chuckle because I'm a bald, hairy dude with a big busty beard and fairly deep voice, not exactly the picture of femininity)

    And while I quite enjoy having a penis, I don't feel as though I'd be particularly bothered by having a vagina instead (although you can miss me with that period nonsense, but I think most vagina-havers would agree on that point) and I'd otherwise live my life the same way.

    And how "feminine" a theoretical partner would need to be actually gets a lot of leeway. I can find people pretty far into the tomboy/androgynous/butch/etc end of the spectrum attractive, maybe even preferably to the extreme "girly" end of the spectrum. There's a line there where they'd be too "masculine" for my tastes, but it's a fuzzy one.

    And for me, a certain amount of physical attraction in a partner is important. It's a pretty wide spectrum that I'm able to find attractive, but there are limits, and I have preferences and dislikes to varying degrees.

    And one of those strongest preferences is that my partner have a vagina. I am just not attracted to people with a penis.

    If we want to count it under the trans umbrella, I don't think that me dating a non-binary person with a vagina would be out of the question.

    Maybe even a FTM femboy type who hasn't had or want bottom surgery.

    MTF, which I think is more in the spirit of this question, is a bit murkier though. If they don't intend to get bottom surgery I think that's a pretty hard no. And even if they have or intend to I can't say that I've ever seen, let alone touched, a surgically-created vagina, so I don't know if they'd do it for me the same way as a natural one.

    The best comparison I do have is that I generally consider myself to be a boob-guy, and while it's not an outright disqualifier, fake boobs don't usually do it for me in quite the same way as real ones, but some are better than others, and while I tend to like big boobs, I have nothing against small ones, and a mastectomy isn't a deal-breaker for me either.

    So I suspect that with bottom surgery, it's a firm "maybe"

    As for a trans partner who has not yet but intends to get that surgery, I guess it kind of depends on the timeline. I don't really want to have sex with someone with a penis and a sexless relationship for me would have a limited lifespan.

    All of that said, regardless of whether I'd date them or not doesn't change how I'd view their identity. There's plenty of women out there I wouldn't date for any number of reasons, but that doesn't mean I see them as any less of a woman.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    Yeah I feel this. Not in any of the specifics, pretty much all of those I'm completely opposite to you in, but just in the overall sense of "yeah this shit's complicated, I mostly like having sex with (in my case penises).

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Me finding them attractive is already a good indication they're trans, so...

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    well, i'm trans, and my partner's trans, and so are the majority of my exes, so, i'm gonna go with yes.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] [S] 1 point 1 year ago

    haha, is that a coincidence or do you have a preference for dating trans people? I do think when I was in denial I was more attracted to trans people as a result. When I transitioned that changed, it was probably repression that led to some kind of sexual sublimation that was responsible for the kind of "trans fetish" I was experiencing.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    If I found out someone was cis whom I'd otherwise consider dating, it would probably be difficult to maintain interest.

  • source
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    ah, interesting - what makes cis people less interesting to you?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    To answer it seriously, for me, it's not specifically cis, but more broadly, queer. I need someone who has faced the assumptions that society forces on them and knows how to exist in the world anyway, having faced those assumptions, questioned them and found their own relationship with themselves.

    tl;dr I need people who have had to question who they are and find themselves, rather than someone who has never had to answer those questions.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    I mostly meant it as a joke. I don't date or have sex, so its not something I'd seriously consider.

    But I also suspect I'd have a hard time jiving with someone who strongly identifies with their AGAB. Personally, I sorta feel like gender is BS and cis people caring about it is weird. If they only tepidly identify with it, that's fine. In a non-transphobic world, I'd hold trans people to the same standard, but since transphobia is prevalent, trans pride ought to exist as a counter force and trans people at least inherently challenge some of the worst aspects of gender as conceptualized by transphobes.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    hm, I think most cis people don't think much about their gender ... I guess there is a certain segment of for example "girly girls" who are very into their gender ... I guess that can get annoying in a way (mostly the strong reification of a binary way of looking at a more complex natural phenomenon)

    that said, I do like being a woman, and I have attachments to feminity I would be upset to lose in a normatively gender abolitionist world ... I tend to think gender is not just BS even if there are arbitrary elements, and I increasingly believe my gender identity ties into my biology in ways that make my gender not a choice but an immutable part of who I am

    regardless, I would think a major reason to not date cis people is that they don't understand our experiences - it's interesting that didn't come up for you, but maybe that's because you don't date or have sex πŸ˜„

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • I think most cis people don’t think much about their gender

    Of the 5 guys I'm closest to, I think three do seem to clearly value their masculinity. They express it in different ways and I don't think they conceptualize it the same way trans people do and some of them probably don't realize they do care about it.

    I tend to think gender is not just BS even if there are arbitrary elements, and I increasingly believe my gender identity ties into my biology in ways that make my gender not a choice but an immutable part of who I am

    I don't disagree. My choice of "feel like" was intend to differentiate it from my beliefs and to avoid implying I was saying other ought to feel/think the same. I largely believe my negative feelings towards gender are likely a result of the gendered expectations pushed onto me because of my AGAB. At the very least, I do believe we need to abolish the prescriptive nature of gender.

    regardless, I would think a major reason to not date cis people is that they don’t understand our experiences - it’s interesting that didn’t come up for you, but maybe that’s because you don’t date or have sex

    That's pretty much what I meant by saying I wouldn't jive with them. I don't think they need to be trans to understand though, but I don't feel like those who strongly feel their AGAB could relate.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago*

    Yeah. Half the people I’ve dated are trans.

  • source
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Sure.

    I find like 99% of people unattractive, though, cis and trans alike.

  • source
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Likely not. I'm a cis straight man who tends to be into women who aren't into men, so while particularly feminine women aren’t my thing, the parts matter to me in terms of dating/having sex. Fully post-op and passing would certainly consider, but I know that's not always the goal for trans folks.

  • source
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Been there, done that. It was great, but didn't last for other reasons. I'm now cis married with kids and don't regret a thing.

  • source
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    That's such a weird order of operations. Like, your medical conditions are simultaneously such a big part of your life, and yet also so deeply personal that it feels like they should not be part of the initial conversation, which is supposed to be shallow and light, not immediately heavy duty.

    I think perhaps there are other more important considerations than mere trans-ness, like "do they have the same overall life goals that I have" and "are they taking care of their mind and body and fitness". But transness may inform those aspects. If a significant focus of their life is on their own gender, I might struggle with that. If they're already at a point where they have dealt with it and moved on to other things, then it might work. If they have comorbid issues beyond transness, like depression and anxiety, that can be a deal breaker unless they are managing themselves and putting in the work.

  • source
  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Yes and why not?

  • source
  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    Can we just not do threads like this? It literally just a thread for cis people to confidently declare how much they find trans people yucky and how they are completely justified in finding us repulsive. Nothing good comes from these discussions.

    People say they have a genital preference, yet trans people have a range of different genitalia, pre-op, intersex, or post operative. People say they want kids, yet some trans people can still have kids pregnancy, banked eggs or sperm, adoption, surrogacy, etc.

    For every "requirement" cis people have for trans people there is a trans person that exists that meets those requirements and then cis people move the goalposts to justify their bigotry.

    Cis people don't respond.

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] [S] 10 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    yep you are exactly right, though I don't know how you expect cis people to know this without interacting with trans people who are able to complicate their view ...

    it sounds like you justified the thread for me - the good that comes from a thread like this is the possibility of cis people learning more about the diversity of human biology. I don't expect anyone to change their views overnight, but refusing to talk to cis people about their views just because they are problematic doesn't seem right to me πŸ€”

    still, you're not entirely wrong that the discussions can just become a way for transphobia to be aired publicly, so I understand why other trans folks might not want to be exposed to this

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] -2 points 1 year ago

    Nah fuck that, cis people don't get debated in this way publicly at all. Cis people can go learn elsewhere in a more moderated setting, meanwhile this thread is full of bigotry that the rest of us are subjected to.

  • source
  • parent
  • load more comments
    view more: next β€Ί