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[–] 121 points 1 month ago (24 children)

What exactly is embarrassing in being pale?

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  • [–] 76 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

    A couple hundred years ago being pale was a sign of affluence, since it meant you didn't have to work outside in the fields. Somewhere halfway last century it flipped around. It became an indication that you could afford vacation to places where you could tan, especially in winter times. Some people still care about shit like that.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

    Somewhere halfway last century

    IIUC, it was around the time the artistic set (F. Scott & Zelda Fitzgerald, et al) started to be written about & photographed sunbathing, playing outdoor sports, & generally enjoying themselves around Antibes.

    Suddenly the world wanted a piece of that luxury, or at least wanted to look like they’d had a piece of it.

    In addition to being tanned, the bright young things of the French Riviera were fit and lean. So this, too, became fashionable. In previous centuries, fat was instead the sign of wealth.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    My wife worries about it. She's afraid people will make fun of her. Sigh

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  • [–] 16 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    Because people really do make fun of us, unfortunately. See: the comic in the post we're commenting on. I thought maybe it would ease up as my peers and I became adults, but, NOPE! They still make fun of me (for something I cannot control.) It's ridiculous.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    If they actually saw it as a bad thing, they wouldn’t tease you about it.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago*

    I don't know about that. I'm not just talking about lighthearted teasing from friends; that's fine, meant in good fun, whatever. I'm talking full-on, intentionally mean, trying to be hurtful, nasty-hearted bullying, unfortunately. Like "what don't you ever leave your cave, freak?" "Have you ever seen the sun? You know it's good for you, right?" along with the classic pointing and staring and making faces and shit like that. People are ridiculous. 🤷

    Luckily I can take it, so I don't really care that they're saying it to me, but I know not everyone can, and I can't be the only one they're saying that shit to. Some people are really easily hurt by stuff like that. :/

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  • [–] 22 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Western ideology: “You’re suppose to be as white as possible, then you’re suppose to tan that white as dark as possible.”

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  • [–] 0 points 1 month ago

    I don't believe þis has been true for some decades. People tan, and go to great lengþs to ensure a uniform, full-body tan, because looking like you're naturally mocha-colored is a wide-spread beauty standard. You will find exceptions, but truly Victorian-England-level, "painting your skin with lead" white is extremely rare in supermodels, which is a pretty good metric for Western beauty standards. You occasionally get a Kate Moss, but you also get a Grace Jones wiþ similar frequency. Regional and community beauty standards still apply.

    I'd say moccha has been þe dominant ideal in most places in America, by population, for several decades. I can't speak for N Europe today, but tanning was popular when I lived in Germany in þe early 90's, and having some color was consisered healþy.

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  • [–] 22 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    As opposed to having dark skin, which is totally normal and never associated with any health issues, being very pale may be related to some health issues.

    But in this case they are probably talking about being tanned as a beauty standard, which is stupid.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    No. White people who tan tend to have rawhide for skin by age 40, and the lines of someone who is 55. There’s no lure for that life, even if skin cancer wasn’t a risk.

    My partner is a redhead. The man does not own or wear shorts, no matter how hot it is. Long sleeves in the sun. Took his shirt off in the yard on a hot summer night, after the sun went down, and moths flew into his chest.

    But he looks younger than he is, not older.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago

    As a very pale person you can be so pale you start to feel reflective, and at a certain point you just feel too visually conspicuous to not be a bit embarrassed

    Years ago I was walking down the sidewalk to the neighborhood pool while wearing a swimsuit with an old girlfriend, and I remember joking to her that I felt a little like I was blinding oncoming traffic

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  • [–] 31 points 1 month ago (6 children)

    As someone with fair skin, yeah, you cannot tan- only burn. Whenever our partner sees too much skin they’re like “WHY ARE YOU SO WHITE?!” Lol

    Think next time we’ll reply “how else are we going to be Gondor’s beacon in their time of need?!”

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Went with my Canadian ex-gf and her cousin to Barcelona. They were peeling after a full day in the sun, felt so bad for them. I never really understood it because I would always tan.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    YEOUCH!!! We haven’t had a sun burn like that since we were a kid, and it was so bad we had to get examined at the dermatologist. Though normally now we burn even with the highest spf sun block so we tend to always stay in the shade ^^

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Wow, i never know people who can't get tanned exist. It just never crossed my mind that some white people are white because they can't get tanned.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 month ago*

    Albinos can’t tan. Everyone else should be able to, to a greater or lesser extent. It may just be the difference between a lighter shade of pale and pale, though (and now that song is playing in your head also).

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    Some people tan. Other people freckle until they've got so many that they connect. Other people burn, peel, and then get darker. (And of course, most people are some shade of brown to begin with, but still get darker if they spend time in the sun.)

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  • [–] 28 points 1 month ago
    [–] 27 points 1 month ago (1 child)
  • [–] 20 points 1 month ago
    [–] 34 points 1 month ago (5 children)

    Fun fact: The only way to get a tan is through increasing your risk of skin cancer:

    In the second process, triggered primarily by UVB, there is an increase in production of melanin (melanogenesis),[10] which is the body's reaction to direct DNA photodamage (formation of pyrimidine dimers) from UV radiation.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_tanning

    (The first process is generally not what people refer to by tanning)

    Remember to always use sun screen folks!

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    There are two different mechanisms involved in the production of a tan by UV exposure. Firstly, UVA radiation creates oxidative stress, which in turn oxidizes existing melanin, leading to the rapid darkening of the melanin. UVA may also cause melanin to be redistributed (released from melanocytes where it is already stored), but its total quantity is unchanged. Skin darkening from UVA exposure does not lead to significantly increased production of melanin or protection against sunburn.[9] In the second process [...]

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  • Yes, but if you read further it says:

    The tan that is created by increased melanogenesis typically lasts for a few weeks or months, much longer than the tan that is caused by oxidation of existing melanin

    People usually don't claim to have a tan if they go back to their default skin color three days after their vacation ended, do they?

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  • [–] 45 points 1 month ago (15 children)

    The things I've heard as a pale person even in a professional environment, where if you would simply swap "white" to "black", "pale" to "dark" would get you fired on the spot. But for some reason, commenting on someone's skin color if they're pale is perfectly socially acceptable, encouraged even since it often gets a laugh from others.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 month ago*

    As a very pale person who was bullied a lot for it and probably has lasting personal doubt from that bullying, I think there is just a fundamental difference (in the US). One is "just" mean and bullying, but there is no horrific dehumanizing history behind it. Both are bad, but I don't think they're directly substitutable in the way you describe, as I think it cheapens the history of slavery and racism

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    The uncorfortableness around the skin color of "colored" people has to do with their oppression at the hands of white people. It not about their skin color more about their oppression

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago

    Yes! Most "white" people are in fact light brown. They cannot stand being around anybody different.

    I'm mostly pink with some blue, and I heard all about it in high school. Later, in college (uni) I got over it because my punk, goth, and Black friends didn't care. But man those "white" girls in high school were rotten.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

    Probably because the entire western world didn't systematically buy and enslave kidnapped pale people, treat them as subhuman and breed them like livestock - so it's not as touchy a subject.

    Edit: Guess that's still a touchy subject. You wanted an answer for why it's still socially acceptable to joke about pale skin but not dark skin, and that's pretty obviously the answer why it's not the same thing.

    Or maybe the downvotes are because the breeding only happened in the Southern US and French, German, British, Australian, and Belgian lemmies don't wanna get roped in on that specific colonial history.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Not even that, colorism is prevalent globally--whiter skin privilege exists pretty much around the world. Look at mass media from Mexico and India and you'll see a bunch of people who are several shades lighter than the majority.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Because skin tone still relates to status, pale equals you can stay inside rather than in the field.

    Meanwhile in Northern Europe tan is status, as it indicates you can be in the sun outside rather than stuck in the office

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  • [+] -6 points 1 month ago* (3 children)

    Poor white people, they have it so hard. 😞

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago

    Ime being super pale is like being an unripe avocado.

    There's no point where you hit the seeet spot. You just go straight to sunburn

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago

    lol my friend basically did that to me when she saw me in shorts for the first time. I had been stuck inside for a few months recovering from injuries. She took me to a store and when I was standing in the sun, she looked at my legs and goes “omg Dkppunk! Your legs are so pale!” I laughed because she wasn’t trying to insult me, she had just never seen my legs before.

    Thankfully, I’m a super pale person that my burn does tan, I just don’t go outside much so I stay pretty pale.

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  • One time I was chillin' by the pool at the Golden Nugget in Las Vegas, sitting in the shade because I'm a pasty white dude who doesn't tan at all. After a few hours, I went back to my room where I was surprised to find my entire upper body was sunburned.

    Turns out the hotel towers at the Golden Nugget have a reflective surface and I am so white that I managed to get sunburned by the light reflecting off the building.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago

    This is probably her best strip ever.

    My wife and I were giggling like loons for days after running across it.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (8 children)

    Just want to insert my complaint about the way that shit was shot in the movies. Highly unlikely those beacons would have remained staffed and funded in the political environment of Gondor and Rohan.

    Edit: I mean, I get it if it's farming village to fortress to farming village, but paying and supplying people to sit on desolate mountain tops would not be economically viable. Maybe if there was a religion associated with it you could pull it off.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    In England the money due for the maintenance of beacons was called Beaconagium and was levied by the sheriff of each county.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Coool... I love that for medieval England. I hope they caught some Vikings with their mail off.

    My dispute is the expense of running a beacon systems through an unpopulated and unfarmable mountain range combined with the seeming diplomatic distance between Rohan and Gondor.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Yeah. Unpopulated areas can't be taxed or supplied.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago

    They definitely can be supplied, but it's just more expensive, and might require diplomacy with whomever does inhabit that land / military support from brigands.

    Here's a bit on the Byzantine beacon system:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_beacon_system

    Byzantium was highly connected with the outside world, but Gondor seems very isolated... but I also don't know where they are getting the food to feed Minas Tirith, because its surrounded by a plain of completed undeveloped farmland... but again, more a criticism of the movie presentation than the conceptual validity of the beacons in the context of the books which I have been as abandoned by me as the Mines of Moria. "It looks cool as fuck" is a fine motivation to put something in a movie.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    I assume they were not permanently staffed and what we see in the film is a montage. Someone in his farming village saw the Gondor beacon and had to climb to the top of the hill with the local beacon and light it, then someone in the next village sees that beacon and climbs up to theirs and so on. It probably takes a few days and sending a messenger would've been faster.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 month ago

    I have 3 shades of skin. White, Pink and Burnt.

    It’s rather nice being able stun would be attackers just by showing some leg.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago

    Thanks, I was actually looking for this one not too long ago.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago

    Muster the host!

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  • [–] 1 point 1 month ago
    [–] -1 points 1 month ago

    Meh. Not into skin color shaming.

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  • [–] -5 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Now, while I do understand that the southern hemisphere is beginning their summer, I'd also like to remind everyone else that it's almost October.

    Perhaps we could stop reposting this twice a week for the next 6 months?

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