Nothing, and I mean nothing, can convince me to have a child.
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This isn't how you get me to have a kid. This is how you get me to dodge taxes.
Off to gulag, then.
Yeah, I'll just start claiming nonexistent dependants. Or I'll start claiming my pets as my children on all legal documents.
Probably isn't that hard to get forgeries of all sorts of documentation like birth certificates, etc.
You probably don't even have to try very hard. My cat, which I had when I was a kid and died of old age decades ago, regularly gets preapproved credit card offers sent to my father's house. Still.
Yes, literally a cat. Like, furry, pointy ears, tail, and meow?
I have to think it would be fairly trivial if I put my mind to it and had larceny in my heart to eventually build up enough documentation to get at least some state entities to believe my dead cat is actually a living human, and then do any old thing with that identity.
I may be misremembering... because we're in the process of "correcting" our history but:
Wasn't "no taxation without representation" kinda a foundation on which this nation was formed? Just sayin'
Unless you live in a US territory or DC, you have representation.
Depending on where you live, "representation" means less than the paper it's written on.
Do you oppose AI-powered surveillance in your local city? Golly, that's swell and all, but they already made up their mind months ago! Everything else is just a formality, and they're more than happy to make it as difficult as possible for you to be heard during public meetings.
This genuinely does parallel early american colonial plights surprisingly well. Also: I'm not sure if you picked that example intentionally - but I have to say it's pretty topical ;) 📎
Argue against representative democracies, then. Claiming it doesn't exist is just wrong, though.
Your comments have a certain vibe about them, don't they?
They hold elections in Russia.
Based on your logic - I imagine they have a great deal of choice then, as well.
Breathe easy! I don't expect a response:
Government is flawed in all forms and corruption can fundamentally prevent any flavor of it from working as intended.
There are infinite circular arguments that can spin up from nitpicking any obvious issues... available to anyone seeking the low hanging fruit. Your comments here do a fine job of providing examples.
"Vibes" are not evidence, and "Bad thing exists that claims to do good thing, so good thing must actually be bad!" is not a reasonable argument. I never claimed any democracy is perfect, or even suggested as much.
If you hate being "nitpicked" over your unfounded arguments, maybe don't make them, then.
... and if you have something meaningful to add to a conversation or post: I'd suggest something more substantial than "Nuh, uh - prove me wrong" or some other equally low effort form of trolling. It's practically textbook. At least attempt to mask it.
I digress.
Topically - I enjoy discussion. With that said: only one of us attempted to polarize an observation into a black and white topic. Curious. Vibes seem to check out.
"Starts off claiming [thing] doesn't exist. Accuses others of 'polarizing' discussion and calls them trolls." Sure thing, bub.
Everything down to that response is reductive, misinformed, and right out of the classic playbook.
On the off chance you are actually that unaware of your response patterns:
My most sincere apologies - I mistakenly thought you were at least being paid to be that obtuse. It would appear you are just a natural.
The idea that anyone that would dare disagree with you must be getting paid for it is staggeringly egocentric. Keep up with the name calling, though. It does a great job showing your comments for what they are.
You'd have to have actually posted something meaningful that was discussion worthy for that to happen. I applaud the wounded behavior.... also a fallback mechanism in the aforementioned guide.
You could just be a fallacy factory without realizing it. A natural. Who's to say:
You injected yourself in these threads. You even spun up the imaginary conflict in which you were going to argue about. You picked the topic you weren't equipped to discuss. It isn't my, or anyone else's, duty to caudle you when that blows up in your face. Act like a twat - be treated as such.
Typically I find amusement in dealing with people like you but - you may as well have been posting from a response tree.
Far from wounded, bud. Just pointing out the hollowness of comments full of empty platitudes and insults.
"If you have an issue with the tea taxes please direct your concerns to your representative in the house of lords"
Did colonists get to vote on their representative every 2 years? No? Ok, not the same then.
It should be noted that the colonies did have their fair share of English apologists. Thank you for offering up an example that can be used in the present day.
While "ack-shu-ally" history does not repeat itself - it does tend to rhyme.
Families and having dependents already gives you tax breaks, ergo not having kids already is taxing childlessness.
Counterpoint to JD:
I am autistic.
Surely you don't want me generating more autists, right?
Don't worry you'll be "relocated" soon.
Just don't eat tylenol, apparently.
Right right, my stupid autism brain is still stuck in 'reality' where there is pretty strong genetic inheritance, a heritability component to autism.
Ok, so new instructions are... apparently... generate a child by some arcane means, natural or unnatural, BUT, under no circumstances allow the target of my impregnation powers to use any Tylenol for 9 months.
I phrase this as cringily as possible to convey the concept that this is an incel tax.
It is a tax on incels.
....The only way this could even theoretically work is if it was also paired with a uh, Nazi style Aryan broodmother / assigned wife type program.
So, I guess, get ready for that soon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebensborn
Somewhat of a sticking point:
The Nazis aborted pregnancies from the racially impure and those suspected to be born with a disability.
So... not quite sure how the theocrats will feel about that.
I can assure you this is directed at white able bodied "normies"
I'm a minority with a professional degree in a profession that has more job openings than candidates, especially in rural areas like JD had grown up in. I know in my heart he would deport me without question, regardless of if I were American born, to the homeland of my ancestors. I'd imagine he would find my humanist values quite disturbing.
They want an Aryan nation as Hitler envisioned it. They're convinced it will be utopian. If not, it'll at least allow them to deify themselves as the white people they've sold the "master race" lie to are loyal to them to the point of self immolation.
Yep.
This is for white incels.
All other hues and tones of incel can gtfo or die trying, or be made into literal slaves, one way or another.
Yeah.
Yep, that's basically their plan.
Totally horrifying.
Would be neat if people uh... did something.
To resist that.
tell me when someone important to the fascist movement comes within 300 miles and we can start (don't actually tell me that i fight with music not actual fighting) i'm not pulling an astronaut style road trip
tell me when someone important to the fascist movement comes within 300 miles and we can start (don't actually tell me that i fight with music not actual fighting)
Ok. So let's talk about the two scenarios here if you can't afford kids.
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You're taxed for childlessness, likely at an amount above the cost of a child or two, to "encourage" you to have children. You are now unable to afford that tax and thus, risk jail.
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You have a child when you can't afford it to avoid the tax, and now have to bring up a child you cannot afford to raise in a government that actively doesn't want to help you in any way.
In short. You're fucked either way.
Ahh. Lebensborn. I should have made a bingo card with all the keywords of Nazi Germany. The Trump administration has it all. Censorship, GeStaPo, apartheit against minorities, Reichsparteitag, ignoring the law, using emergency laws to ursurp the rule, concentration camps...
Stop paying taxes altogether, you say?
When the communists got the same idea in Romania, it failed spectacularly, filling orphanages with abused orphans
This sort of America-centric analysis neglects the fact that birth rates have also dropped to well below replacement in other countries with governments and cultures very different from those in the USA, and that neither expanding the welfare state nor attempting to restore traditional values has reversed this trend in the countries that tried that. Thus a discussion of either potential causes or potential solutions which focuses specifically on the USA is fundamentally incomplete.
potential solutions
Birth rates below replacement is the solution imo. It may not be wat the rich want, but I think a population of 8 billion is not sustainable.
Global population is still growing, I think I read it's predicted to keep increasing into late mid century to around 11 billion before it plateaus and starts slowly falling.
The numbers get very optimistic from there will predictions of rebounds and other nonsense that is unlikely but the people claiming it will be long dead.
People who were raised as a single child are far more likely to only have one child so my bet is the population dwindles more quickly than these models indicate.
I agree that the answer to humanity's most pressing issues is lowering our population, but don't think it's a non-issue.
The old keep aging out of the workforce, there's not enough young to keep a viable tax base, utter collapse. Here's where someone says tax the snot out of the rich. I'm down with that! But in a shrinking population, they won't be rich long. Directly or indirectly, all of their money comes from us.
Right, so we’re all going to have to adopt some form of austerity, however, most of us are already down there. So I mean the sooner we scrap those yachts to build schools and homes the better
You say austerity, I say mass starvation. Depopulation is going to be an order of magnitude worse than, "Do with a little less." And global warming may well accelerate all of that.
This comment presupposes that “below replacement rate” is a problem in need of a solution.
Yes, in a few thousand years it might be a problem. However, population growth is a problem for the next few decades at least.
Can’t wait for my government assigned trad wife
Taking a page from Putin's playbook. Anything but to alleviate the cost of living crisis, which is the main reason for people not having children. It is also a thinly veiled attempt to reassert dominance on women.
You know who this punishes more than just childless heterosexuals?
That's right. Couch fuckers. Unless his Chesterfield gets pregnant with an ottoman... 🤔
They need everyone to pop out a ton of babies so we can have child labor replace the migrant farm workers they deported.
I've always thought it's insane we pay people to have children, but sure let's take that even further and tax those who don't.
It makes political sense for them to demonise certain groups. The childfree movement has been quite vocal (or at least well publicised) of late, and it's super-easy to cherry pick some of the more extreme viewpoints from that 'community' and weaponise it against 'normal' people, conflating those opinions with the so-called left (as if deciding wether or not you have kids defines who you are politically). It's easy fodder for the media and, as always, successfully distracts much of the population from the fact that they're being bled dry by billionaires.
The article is worth a read and is not about jd Vance. That's just a anecdote from the article. They touch on the different approaches and motivations behind the pronatalism movement. The article ends on a non-apocalyptic and non-proscriptive note.
Fun fact: humans are capable of parthenogenesis. No cases have been known to survive to birth, but they can induce miscarriages like sexual fertilization does. Since most early miscarriages happen before you are aware and would not be distinguishable from normal periods, there's no way to tell if you are experiencing one of these events at any given time. Therefore, I will be filing my taxes to reflect the 12 dead children I lost over the year. Does it matter that I have no fallopian tubes, and therefore would never have an egg implant into my uterus in the first? Not if every conception is sacred!
Did JD Vance have kids by fucking his couch before his wife sat on it?
Look- just because he went through all that work and finally had an ottoman doesn't mean he can push those unrealistic expectations on the rest of us.
Really good article, imo. A quote I liked:
"When people see phenomena unfolding in plain view being denied…their reaction is not to turn away from the phenomena," as Anastasia Berg, author of What Are Children For?, noted in April. "Rather, it is to turn away from the deniers and toward those whose starting point is acknowledgment, regardless of their motivations or political ends. What this might look like in the case of denialism about birth rates is not hard to imagine."
Same in Texas, wanting to reward married heteros with children. I respond by not buying anything extra, depriving the economy of my single person dollars.
And if you are infertile through no fault of your own? Surely they would be thoughtful enough to recognize that taxing you would make no sense, correct?
You are already taxed on not having children because you cannot write them off if you don't have them.
Another community for me to block!


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