If they actually follow through on making the Slate as privacy friendly as they claim in this article, and it doesn't have any major flaws, I'm gonna go ahead and say this is perhaps one of the best options for someone in need of a mini-truck/SUV hybrid.

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[–] 80 points 5 months ago (10 children)

This is heavily backed by Jeff Bezos btw, so, don’t get too excited

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  • [–] 46 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    (ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻

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  • [–] 35 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    ┬──┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ) chill out bro

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  • [–] 35 points 5 months ago* (4 children)

    Hey, I'll chuck Bezos's table over if I want!

    (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

    (I do love that new text face, though lol)

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  • [–] 21 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    ┬──┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ)

    You think tables grow on trees?

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Yeah that sucks. Its the only new vehicle I'd ever consider.

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  • [–] 25 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Even if you don’t like Jeff Bezos, the fact of this existing opens the door for smaller competitors to enter the scene.

    Canada is getting 3% more ev competition due the recent 49k chinese imports deal even if they’re banned from entering the USA, Americans will have an easier time checking out the models on their travels and then they will ask their-out of-touch politicians why they don’t also have similar options.

    The future is EV!

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  • [–] 34 points 5 months ago (14 children)

    I ordered one day 1. There are a lot of drawbacks though. I don't care for trucks. This would be my first one. I appreciate the exclusion of a modem but...not even so much as wiring for an aftermarket audio system is dumb.

    My largest concern remains the future of the company. As the article states, most consumers don't care about privacy. They expect connected everything. And I don't think a small truck is viable in the US market.

    Further, the price is still too high. You can get a Chevy Bolt for the same price, with many more comfort and convenience features. This will be an unfortunate result of the company's small size and low volume.

    Nevertheless I will vote with my wallet and hope I'm wrong.

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  • [–] 15 points 5 months ago (10 children)

    Who wants a big truck? I don't think you know what people who actually need work trucks want

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago* (2 children)

    I mean, I guess I do? I want a 2 door truck that's wide enough for a bench that will sit 3 people and a bed that's at least 6.5 foot long. So, 90's style F-150 or 1500. What they're offering is too small for me to be interested. But I'm actively hoping they make a bigger version in the future.

    Alternately, I'm kind of hoping their stuff is modular enough that I could electrify an older gasoline truck. Doubt they're actively looking to sell kits to the hobbyist market, but that would be awesome.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    I have one of the aforementioned 90's style trucks. Still had an extended cab and a proper sized bed even then (late 90's at least).

    It's also not my daily driver, but if I could get something off similar capability in a fairly simple EV I'd gladly swap it and my regular car over.

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  • [–] -3 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Everyone wants big trucks. That's why they buy them by the boatload. They're the top selling vehicles in America by a wide margin, and have been for a long time. And it's why no one even makes small ones anymore.

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    It's not purely a demand side thing. It's also a regulatory change. The CAFE standards were updated in 2010 to require a sliding scale of fuel economy standards where larger vehicles were permitted to have less efficient fuel economy ratings. Small trucks sat in an unviable zone of too small to be allowed to be fuel inefficient, and too big to actually be fuel efficient, so they were phased out right around 2010.

    Now, fully recognizing that small trucks are in demand, and that EVs don't have worry about fuel economy standards, several manufacturers have made plans to occupy that niche with EVs.

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  • [–] 0 points 5 months ago

    And how many people are buying EVs in general? It's a very small amount % wise. And with the tax credits disappearing it seems the EV market is just about being abandoned entirely. Ford made an electric version of the best-selling vehicle in America, and it was fantastic, and almost no one bought it, and they discontinued it a couple years later. Same story for Tesla's and GM's trucks. Americans don't want EVs in general, much less pickup truck EVs, and much less than that, tiny 2-door electric trucks.

    Again, I very much hope I'm wrong, but that's the impression I get from my observations of the market.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (1 child)

    Those people have no need for a truck. They are in the market for a penis replacement.

    I'm talking about people who need trucks for work. They want smaller 4x4 trucks.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    I didn't mention any specific group of people. I said "everyone".

    What type of truck they need for work is entirely dependent on what type of work they're doing. Going bigger instead of smaller is often a safe bet.

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    not even so much as wiring for an aftermarket audio system is dumb.

    Not having power windows too. I get the point of simplicity, but you gotta have at least some basic conveniences.

    And I don't think a small truck is viable in the US market.

    Isn’t the Maverick super popular?

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  • [–] 24 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Not having an AWD version is a non-starter for me up here in the frozen North.

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  • [–] 0 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    how north and how mountainous are we talking?

    I want to know how judgy I should be of you

    (lots of people claim AWD is necessary in the winter and most of them are just shitty drivers with bad tires, and I want to know if you're in that group)

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    "Hey, participate in your own judgment by some person on the internet who wants to somehow gatekeep a friggin drivetrain."

    Nah, I'm good. I've lived here for decades and can drive in whiteout and icy conditions without AWD, but choose the added benefits and control of having it these days. And the hell with dealing with those conditions with RWD ever again.

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago (12 children)

    Now if only it were body on frame too then I could finally own something like my first vehicle (a '98 S10) again.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    When I first heard about this truck I was seriously considering selling my Tacoma for one, until I found out it is unibody.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    If the bed is long enough and shaped right, is there anything else fundamentally bad about unibody architecture?

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  • [–] 12 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    Yes, repairability. If my quarter panel gets damaged on my truck, i can replace it and not total the truck.

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Not sure why the downvotes. Folks dont know how cars work or clearly havent worked on them. Body on frame is the best for repair and longevity.

    Also unibody rust=totaled.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago

    "Making it privacy-friendly"... I really really don't like the language here. There is absolutely 0 need to make anything privacy-invading, out of all products cars probably the least. So it isn't really hard to do this at all, just that companies like that free consumer data.

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  • [+] 8 points 5 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Like apple claims to protect its users privacy I guess. It ends up being a matter of trust with now a days mobile phones with wheels and motor

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  • [–] [S] 25 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

    If they really don't include a modem as they claim, then it would be truly fundamentally different, and apple's privacy claims would not be an apt comparison.

    If a user does not install the Slate app, there would be literally no way for the vehicle to collect any information whatsoever, it would be like driving an EV from the 90's, if they had better batteries back then. That would make it stand out as the only privacy respecting modern production vehicle I'm aware of, besides toys for the rich like a Morgan.

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago (11 children)

    Any chance this design is open source, so I can build my own?

    Or is this just proprietary corporate trash?

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago (10 children)

    if you really want to build your own, buy a kit car. they're cheaper.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    Any chance those kits are open source?

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    I mean it comes with a manual how to build it and the one I'm looking at is a 67 lotus. You tell me how that open sources because software is not my field

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (6 children)

    How is the manual licensed? Does it use a copy left license like GNU or Creative Commons?

    If so, it's open source. If not it's not.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (5 children)

    part of the reason i picked that one is because my local library has old car repair manuals and that's one of them. I legit don't know anything about its copyright (you can use buzzwords but that is the legal term) but like, this stuff has never been that hard to find.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago* (4 children)

    Making it easy to find is not copyleft. And copyleft is a concept that doesn't exist in the concept of copyright.

    Making something copyleft means I and you would have permission to make copies of the designs and the manual and make changes to them and sell a product based off of those designs. And that I would also require the same from my designs.

    It's a license that encourages collaboration (I take someone else's work rather than reinvent the wheel, and if I improve it I share that improved design back with the world and let them do the same) rather than competition (where the original designer would sue me for using or improving their design)

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (3 children)

    Automobiles is one of those area I feel like Chipotle copy left does not work in practice. It's a two ton death machine, so we really want contributions by Claude?

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (2 children)

    Copyleft licenses wave warranties.

    And there's loads of open source projects that don't allow AI contributions. Just because someone writes a shitty PR doesn't mean it will be merged.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    So, if this is bezos, it's just them openly admitting that they already get more than enough info from everyone, regardless of purchase, from ring cameras and flock.

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Bezos is one investor of many, unfortunately, but I don't believe it's known how much say they have in the company or not.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    If you think high profile investors like this stay as true silent partners and don't have deeper hooks into operations of a small startup like this, and don't have teams that get regular consultations on meaningful future decisions, than I'd like you to please invest in my campaign for local dogcatcher. I need 7 million and then you leave me alone to work, because I don't owe you anything.

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 5 months ago*

    I think they absolutely can have deep hooks, but how much sway those hooks have somewhat depends on how much stake they own in the company, which AFAIK is undisclosed.

    Slate Auto is ultimately a standard corporation so I trust them about as far as I can throw them, which is why I framed the point on privacy in the post body as if they follow through.

    It is entirely possible that the privacy aspect is purely a pre-release marketing thing, and at the point of release the story suddenly changes and a modem is integrated.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 13 points 5 months ago* (3 children)

    I hate the guy too. But, I'm actually looking for a small EV that is 4wd, has clearance and has enough range. At the very least, this adds more options and adds more competition

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Buying this will give Amazon more money to buy out the competition before they even make it to market.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago* (1 child)

    Yeah. I'm in Australia. They likely won't even sell it here

    Byd will probably just grab some of the ideas, and I'll buy them 😂

    I just hate that all the 4wd stuff is massive. I really want something more that's a jimny but BEV. I drive a jeep now, but I don't need to tow or compensate for anything

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (6 children)
    1. Does every EV startup in US have to make a pickup? Such a stupid country.

    2. EU just made driver facing cameras mandatory for all new cars so I guess Europe is not much smart either.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

    Just to be clear, this "truck" is absolutely tiny. It's several inches shorter than a Toyota Corolla. I think it's pretty great for a city dweller that occasionally has a need for a bit more carrying capacity.

    Edit: with the one big caveat that a lot of city dwellers don't have access to charging at home.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Do you have a source for the second claim?

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago (2 children)
  • [+] -7 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Driver facing camera systems can be consistent with privacy, as long as they don't record or transmit any data other than a single dimensional metric of how distracted or drowsy a driver is (or even discrete binary state of yes/no) and timestamps when that state was detected.

    A closed loop system that merely keeps that data for the current drive and maintains it solely in the vehicle's own systems can be consistent with privacy principles that nobody else should know anything about how a car is being used, except what can be observed from the outside.

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  • [–] 13 points 5 months ago

    Yes, it's all true.

    Too bad those systems are closed sources and we can't verify they do any of those things.

    My biggest issue with them is not even the privacy. I think at some point we sadly will have to accept that driving is not a private activity anymore. I mean you can still try driving a very old car and try to avoid traffic cameras but it will be harder and harder.

    For me the biggest issue that those systems are extremely annoying. In my experience they fail to accurately recognize the speed limits so will beep at you constantly even when you drive below the speed limit. People say they also struggle with sunglasses and many normal activities. I expect driving those new cars to be constant struggle with alerts about nothing.

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  • [–] 0 points 5 months ago

    645 words, and no mention of Jeff Bezos

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  • [+] -6 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    no stereo is not bare bones, it's malicious compliance. ugly pos anyway, same as they do most evs, on purpose to hurt sales so they can point at sales and say nobody wants evs and in this case also say people do want it to phone home and have android auto and saas subscriptions.

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  • 8 comments in c/cybersecurity@sh.itjust.works view that post
    [–] 37 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Brought to you by Jeff Bezos

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  • [–] [S] 10 points 5 months ago

    This has gotten me thinking though, one of the funniest ways for Aliens to make contact would be to submit a wave of bug reports on cybersecurity systems all over the earth under an umbrella message of "Fixed That For You" - yours sincerely, Aliens..

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  • [–] 10 points 5 months ago

    How's that XKCD go? Even talking about privacy for a truck is like a doctor saying 'don't worry, I'm wearing a condom.'

    If that's relevant, we fucked up five steps ago.

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    I have a Slate reservation, and when the tax incentive made $7,500 less expensive I was probably going to buy it. But at likely around $30k, the value just isn’t there when trucks like the Maverick exist for the same or less.

    Don’t get me wrong, I like some of the things Slate is offering (minimalism, no modem, etc), but at the end of the day all else being equal I’d rather buy a vehicle from a vehicle manufacturer.

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago* (2 children)

    Maverick? The one that had multiple recalls with issues causing fires?

    Also, the are no EV or even a PHEV version. Its not really fair to compare to begin with. Youd be saving a lot with fuel and maintence costs.

    Though, my only complaint is the 150mi range is quite anemic for that price.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

    I would still rather have the Maverick at the same price if only for the fact that there is someplace to recall them to.

    I wish nothing but the best for Slate, but if I’m entrusting them with $30k of my money and it’s my sole vehicle (which it would be), being essentially a startup doesn’t instill me with a great deal of confidence.

    Whatever you’d save in fuel and maintenance you’d spend in depreciation.

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