I don't know how to link directly to the Instagram message from this frontend https://flufi.me/profile/tommorello

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[–] [S] 232 points 9 months ago (18 children)
  • [–] 267 points 9 months ago (15 children)

    Just in case anyone is not aware: This slogan is referring to collective punishment, which is a war crime. She is advocating for war crimes, shamelessly, in front of the populace.

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  • [–] 78 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    Someone shoot that bitch. And tRump and the rest of the cunts around him.

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  • [–] 69 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Don't ask for her to be shot. That's unclassy and rude. Politely ask someone to Kirk her.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    And her husband (if there is someone that can stand her) can then start fucking someone else from the administration. So it is complete Kirking. Maybe Vance would be up for it? He seems to not care, as long as it's white.

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  • [–] 17 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    War crimes only apply to war. For example, the use of chemical weapons is a war crime, but their use against your own population is apparently fine and dandy.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    True, but I think that the point stands. Advocating for something that is a war crime, even while not at war, should be treated very seriously.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Many things which would be war crimes if carried out by soldiers are legal if done by law enforcement against the people they're supposed to defend

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    Yeah, looks like I didn’t fully finish the thought in my head 😅 The seriousness of this situation cannot be overstated. It goes without saying that since taking office, the regime started their campaign of terror without hesitation, and have stepped it up by the day.

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    I want to clarify something that others aren't. Yes, things that would be war crimes aren't if not used in war, but this doesn't give a reason. A lot of them are to prevent mistakes in war, not because it's evil. For example, you aren't allowes to use chemicals that are often used on civilians, but it isn't because they're particularly harmful. It's because you don't know what they are until latter, so if you see it you may respond with your own chemical weapons, which may be harmful. This is just one example, but a lot of the time "war crimes" are there to prevent escalation, not because of how harmful they are. (Obviously some are because of the harm though.)

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    I tried to find a definition that would explain that and failed. Can you provide some source for that claim? What you refer to does seem to be a violation of warfare laws but not war crime, which is a violation of humanitarian law

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  • [+] 149 points 9 months ago (9 children)
  • [–] 45 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    I don't understand why people would even be debating that.

    if you write something out and display it, it is no different than saying it out loud. that's not debatable, that's just the way it is.

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  • [+] 22 points 9 months ago* (1 child)
  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    this is my take when you see the most asinine shit imaginable on the fediverse where it's mostly real flesh and blood humans. people bring their biases from getting gassed in comments sections from other places in the form of influence campaigns and then say that shit with their whole chest. i don't think this can really be fixed here on lemmy because of a variety of factors, i think the best that can be done is ensure that positive, anti-imperial, propaganda has presence that people can identify with and then get verbal confirmation of at group meetings for mutual aid or whatever

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  • [–] [S] 15 points 9 months ago

    If it helps, in another post about if Renee Good's driving was a part of why she was executed, Lemmy commenters were complaining about if using Google to search online was acceptable.

    It's kinda depressing honestly.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago

    Attacking how communication is done instead of what's being communicated is a form of subversion the CIA uses to mess with foreign actors. The left and its tolerance towards others (e. g. misgendering by accident) is very susceptible to such attacks and they've let themselves be decimated on the public stage because of it.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    That's a false dichotomy: it's possible to argue about menial things AND conduct meaningful actions at the same time.

    Also, the majority of Lemmy users are outside the US and have very little control over anything that has to do with US politics outside of urging Americans to get their shit together.

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago

    Its never okay to spread objectively false information. If they were directly quoting Nazis, I would be on the first plane out of here, leaving behind my family and all my property. When I first read this, my heart jumped, because I thought that's what I now I had to do.

    But then I see that it isn't true. Yes, this is alarming and horrible, but do you really think it wouldn't be any more alarming if they were directly quoting Nazi slogans?

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  • [–] -5 points 9 months ago

    It's fucked up. No one is disagreeing with that. However, making shit up makes your argument weaker. The enemy will only have to point out that you're making it up to get people to ignore you then. This post is specifically about the made up thing. If it was about the podium then there wouldn't be an issue.

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  • [–] 71 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    So many people in this post complaining that its misinformation because its not actually a quote because it wasnt spoken aloud or it doesnt actually come from the nazis. However. The Trump admin DID display this information WITH the intent to threaten the lives of all dissidents and almost certainly with the belief themselves that it comes from nazis, as they wholeheartedly stand on the side of nazis. This isnt misinformation, no matter how picky you want to be, and it is VERY relevant and important to share.

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  • [–] 71 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Do none of you know what this is referring to? Okay, class time. Gather round, because I'm going to give you all a quick history lesson.

    Oh, and you should check this out on the side. It will help with the learning.

    I don't know about whether there's a connection between that slogan and the nazis, but the incident the slogan is allegedly coined from is definitely real.

    The SS officer who was killed is Reinhard Heydrich, a SS officer who was high enough to be part of Hitler's inner circle. Heydrich is understood to be one of the principal architects of the Holocaust.

    The village who had its male population (except for the children) wiped out as revenge for Heydrich's death is Lidice, in the modern Czech Republic.

    By the way, you all should watch the movie Anthropoid. It goes over a dramatized version of the events.

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  • [–] 25 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Y'all remember when Trump supporters danced to Rage Against the Machine? https://youtu.be/ddrFt1BHkUQ

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  • [–] 23 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Of course they did, they're all dumb

    Most Americans are seriously dumb. The illiteracy level is insane for a western developed country, especially the riches country in the world. It could ensure all its citizens are well educated but we'll educated citizens won't vote for fascists, they won't listen to the transparent bullshit lies of fox news and co, they won't vote Republican because fuuuuck that shit.

    Republicans have worked pretty much since WWII, especially starting with Reagan, to ensure the US citizens are as dumb as possible, it keeps them in power.

    So Magas dancing to killing in the name of is pretty normal for them, as they have no idea what they're doing, no idea what the song is about, no idea what RATM is about.

    I'd feel sad for them if they weren't so dangerous to themselves, to everyone in the US, and everyone in the world. I honestly have no idea how to solve this part, after trump and Maga is gone. How do you deprogram millions of brainwashed idiots that barely finished highschool?

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Easier than you think. Just thrive. Be an example.

    Oh. There's a difficult bit as well... You have to get rid of any sociopaths that start talking to them or it'll all happen again.

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  • [–] 68 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Sigh. I miss when Rage Against The Machine wasn't political.

    What are you going to tell me next, that Tom Morello has a degree in political science? He should just stick to playing the guitar.

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  • [–] 29 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    The Trump administration is quoting Nazis, why am I not surprised?

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  • [–] 12 points 9 months ago

    It's not and it's a matter of time before either the second civil war or third world war happens.

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  • [–] 40 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Yeah, this is the breaking point 🙄

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago

    It’s wild what they’ll put up with until you realize that they’re simply trying to pretend like it’s only the start so they don’t need to actually do anything about it yet.

    They could be personally being stabbed and they’ll still say “ohhhh boy when it gets REAL bad I’m gunna be so cool and badass about this”.

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  • [–] 110 points 9 months ago (14 children)

    Be careful of false news that suits your narrative, it weakens our position.

    That phrase has no known Nazi origin that I could find. As loath as I am to link to Reddit, there is a good write up here:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/1qbjtkr/is_the_phrase_one_of_ours_all_of_yours_an_old/

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  • [–] 93 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    I'm inclined to give AskHistorians a pass. There is no community on Reddit that tries as hard as they do to moderate their way around the limitations of the platform and its management.

    The verified posters tend to be millennial academics with masters or PhD's in history or closely related fields, and they take the name of the community seriously. You are there to ask a historian a question, and if none answers, then so be it.

    And I agree, pushing past the obvious dog whistle to go somewhere the data doesn't lead is a way to weaken what should be a self-evidently powerful argument that the Trumpers are embracing ever-more-openly fascist positions on, well, everything.

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  • [–] -4 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    The verified posters tend to be millennial academics with masters or PhD's in history or closely related fields, and they take the name of the community seriously

    Verified by whom?

    Reddit as a whole is a consent manufacturing machine. These "verified" crap shoots, where every one of the "discussions" align with the confirmation bias of the people manufactured by people who want to curate the narrative doesn't have any credibility beyond people who are gullible or benefit from these narratives.

    But you do you.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    Literally have watched the typically accepted propaganda get removed quickly on that sub. Also had several conversations with mods when I was on there. Levelheaded and quite serious about their work. Literally the only sub that seemed to maintain ethics and consistency.

    That being said, I’ve not been on there in a couple of years.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Verified by providing well sourced and reasoned answers. There are PhD contributors but mostly it's down to providing consistently providing context to an answer and not going off on some fringe tangent. It's easily the most heavily moderated subreddit.

    "Why on reddit" comes up often and the answer has consistently (historically anyway) been that there isn't really a better long-form public outreach platform at the moment. Blogs are close don't have the same opportunity for followup questions and definitely don't have the same "drive-by" effect of just seeing it on the front page.

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  • [–] 41 points 9 months ago

    If you ever want to check, just dona search and set the range of dates to end before the current outrage.

    Before January, I couldn't find a single use of that phrase on the internet.

    But it's not some dog whistle, it's blatantly obvious what they're saying. Don't let them get it twisted up so that the only bad things are verbatim what nazis said.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Yeah, except that article is incorrect. The whole thing is made up. That isn't a Nazi slogan and never was.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago

    I don’t know how to link directly to the Instagram message from this frontend

    The field URL in the form to create posts.
    screenshot of form Create Post marking the field label URL

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    All of yours first, then.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    Pleas guys, learn from the Brigate Rosse. Put him in a f*cking trunk (use a chrysler pt cruiser for the occasion please) and goodnight.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago*

    The women were sent to concentration camps and most of the kids were gassed. This is literally what they mean when they say “make America great again”

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  • [–] 43 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (19 children)

    Congrats, Amerikkka! You finally managed to achieve socialism! The National kind of Socialism!

    EDIT: Apparently, the joke is not evident enough so I have to explain it so I'm not called a right-winger:

    There is a double reference in the comment:

    I wrote "Amerikkka" with 3 K for the KKK. (First part of the joke) to call them KKK members.

    Then I used National Socialism (notice the capitalized words) instead of just socialism or national socialism (without capitalized words) to reference the name nazis gave themselves, to calll them nazis.

    I hope this clears it up. As people are talking about "nuance" that I seem to be lacking.

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  • [+] 6 points 9 months ago (18 children)
  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (17 children)

    Look for National Socialism. See if it checks.

    Edit: Funny the amount of downvoters. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

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  • [+] 0 points 9 months ago (16 children)
  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (15 children)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

    Smh. And I quote:

    Nazism (/ˈnɑːtsiɪzəm, ˈnæt-/ ⓘNA(H)T-see-iz-əm), formally named National Socialism (NS, German: Nationalsozialismus, German: [natsi̯oˈnaːlzotsi̯aˌlɪsmʊs] ⓘ),

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago* (12 children)

    So you don't actually know what socialism is. If you did, you'd be the last one saying the Nazis were using the name correctly.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism

    Smh. And I quote:

    Socialism is an economic and political philosophy encompassing diverse economic and social systems characterised by social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership. It describes the economic, political, and social theories and movements associated with the implementation of such systems. Social ownership can take various forms, including public, community, collective, cooperative, or employee. As one of the main ideologies on the political spectrum, socialism is the standard left-wing ideology in most countries. Types of socialism vary based on the role of markets and planning in resource allocation, and the structure of management in organizations.

    To misuse names as labels contradictory to substance is a hallmark of propaganda. I don't fall for it. Just because Nazis want people to think they're just crunchy on the outside while remaining warm and caring on the inside and pick a name they think will do that for outsiders doesn't actually mean shit.

    Nuance is important. Learn to look past the name.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (10 children)

    Nuance is important. Learn to look past the name.

    Says the one who was unable to get a joke comment in which I'm calling them "national socialist" and not just socialists to call them nazis (since the nazis called themselves national socialists and not simply socialists).

    You talk about nuance and can't see that I'm specifically calling them national socialists and not just socialsts.

    Ffs, have you escaped from .ml? You look ridiculous in your defense of socialism when all I did was a joke about nazism.

    Edit: You shouldn't talk about nuance when you didn't get the "nuance" on the first place. Notice the capitalized letters in the first comment and not just the name. Nuance is important, so by calling it National Socialism (mind the caps) and not national socialism (mind the caps again) I'm using not the general definition of the socialism but the name nazis gave to their movement (which was, as every name, capitalized). You didn't get the joke. And that's fine. But it's not on me.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (9 children)

    You sounded like a rightwinger who unironically confuses nazis with actual socialists, and it didn't help that you started off defending what you said for two more comments rather than admitting you were joking and accepting that of course they're different.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (8 children)

    You sounded like a rightwinger who unironically confuses nazis with actual socialists,

    My original comment:

    Congrats, Amerikkka! You finally managed to achieve socialism! The National kind of Socialism!

    Notice the three K in america referencing the KKK? And how I specifically capitalized National and Socialism so it's not just "socialism" but the name the nazis decided to give to their movement by capitalizing both words?

    Really? A right winger when I'm both calling Amerikkka nazis and reminding them of the KKK? Mate, you didn't get the joke and are blaming me for it.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago* (7 children)

    I don't think you read what Poe's law says.

    You sounded like a right winger in the sense that you said the same things right wingers said, not in the sense that I believe you are one.

    And you talk to me about nuance?

    No, I don't believe I did.

    you didn’t get the joke and are blaming me for it.

    I think that in these terrible times, if your edgy humour that uses the same logic as right wing talking points from 2024 doesn't land, ranting at people for two comments that they don't understand that nazi means socialist without making it clear that you know that that was intentionally misleading, instead of making it clearer that it was a joke doesn't make you come across as a fun person, and is why people started explaining the difference to you.

    For at least five hours after your first post (which I see you have now edited), you just disagreed angrily with people pointing out that nazis and socialists are different. Why would anyone believe this was an attempt at humour?

    If you actually want to make people laugh, you need to lighten up a bit and be less defensive if it doesn't land. It's not my fault that your humour wasn't funny enough for people to get it, so maybe blame the audience less and make it clearer that you're attempting to satirise stupid magas rather than being one.

    There is no "of course that's wrong and stupid, no one in their right mind would believe such a thing, so it's obviously a joke" with maga folk. Hence Poe's law.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (6 children)

    I don't think you read what Poe's law says.

    You sounded like a right winger in the sense that you said the same things right wingers said, not in the sense that I believe you are one.

    I know what Poe's law is. I never heard a right-winger call themselves National Socialists. And if you've read any of my previous comments anywhere on lemmy, you'd see I'm far from a right winger.

    No, I don't believe I did.

    You are right, i confused you with the previous poster, I edited that part removing it.

    I think that in these terrible times, if your edgy humour that uses the same logic as right wing talking points from 2024 doesn't land, ranting at people for two comments that they don't understand that nazi means socialist without making it clear that you know that that was intentionally misleading, instead of making it clearer that it was a joke doesn't make you come across as a fun person, and is why people started explaining the difference to you.

    Ranting at people who don't know history and how the nazis called themselves National Socialists (I specificall, used those words and not just socialists)? Dude, if people are dumb is not my fault. Telling me to read a fucking dictionary when they haven't opened a history book? Really?

    I'm sorry if you never opened a history book? Is that what I should say?

    For at least five hours after your first post (which I see you have now edited), you just disagreed angrily with people pointing out that nazis and socialists are different. Why would anyone believe this was an attempt at humour?

    I'm really flabbergastered that you are blaming me for people not having opened a history book (else they would know about National Socialism and not just socialism) in their lives. But I guess that's what I get for assuming people have read. I'm not gonna apologize for defending what was a nuanced joke that ignorants didn't get. That's not my fault.

    If you actually want to make people laugh, you need to lighten up a bit and be less defensive if it doesn't land. It's not my fault that your humour wasn't funny enough for people to get it, so maybe blame the audience less and make it clearer that you're attempting to satirise stupid magas rather than being one.

    My first reply is "look for national socialism". Not for socialism, but national socialism. First result on search engines for "national socialism" is fucking nazism. If someone is still thinking I'm attacking socialism, they are... dense. To say the least. And it's not on me.

    That, or they are trying to not look dumb but putting it on me, which I don't accept either.

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    I think that literally everyone who you ranted at are aware what nazi stood for, and that it is youth who lack awareness for not knowing that "nazi=socialist" was a right wing talking point, with exactly the reasoning you so angrily and repeatedly gave.

    If you knew what poe's law was, why did you get so cross and defensive when I said you sounded like a right winger. If you knew that nazis aren't socialist, why did you get so cross and defensive mansplaining that socialist is in the title? If you were making a lighthearted joke, why are you so cross and defensive when people didn't see the humour? At every stage you're cross and defensive.

    You claim to be joking, and claiming had people are dumb and poorly read for explaining that nazis aren't socialist, but the more you rant about not having read a history book, the more you seem to have missed the point that nazis really aren't socialist, when you repeatedly and angrily say "It's IN the nAme, StUpiD"

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

    Tell me exactly where I mentioned socialism without the word "national" before it. I'll wait.

    Again, it's not my fault if people are dumb and can't understand that National Socialism (capitalized again) is not the same as socialism.

    Oh, and by the way, "it's in the name"? Well, duh? It IS in the name? That's why I kept saying NATIONAL SOCIALISM and not just socialism? Mate, really, it's kind of stupid to explain it, but have you ever heard of jokes? Puns, and the likes? How they play with language? How the nuance in them (that I seem to lack) is where they become funny?

    Just admit that you didn't get the joke. It's fine, I wasn't expecting you to. But seriously? I should accept to be told to read a dictionary? Just... wow.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Pretending other people are dumb when your "joke" landed badly because it matches Republican taking points circa 2024 isn't convincing me that you have a sense of humour. You sound like you genuinely believe you're the only one in the world who ever noticed that the nazis misdescribed themselves as socialist.

    If you didn't spend part of 2024 explaining to maga followers that nazis weren't socialist, you can be forgiven for not realising in advance that those of us who did found your "joke" neither original nor funny. You claim to understand Poe's law but are falling miserably to recognise its relevance to you.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (1 child)

    You sound like you genuinely believe you're the only one in the world who ever noticed that the nazis misdescribed themselves as socialist.

    Actually, they describe themselves as NATIONAL socialists. Which is, as I keep pointing, what I wrote. You still keep pushing this and I really don't understand it. You just want to be right about something dumb, which is that I said socialism is nazism. But you keep "forgetting" (so it fits your narrative) the word NATIONAL.

    Just say it, you didn't get the joke.

    Instead, you keep beating a dead horse.

    If you didn't spend part of 2024 explaining to maga followers that nazis weren't socialist, you can be forgiven for not realising in advance that those of us who did found your "joke" neither original nor funny. You claim to understand Poe's law but are falling miserably to recognise its relevance to you.

    For the uptenth time: the joke was calling them National Socialists because anyone who has ever read a history book knows that, specifically, National Socialism (and not just socialism, without the "national") is what nazism called itself.

    You just didn't get the joke, and at this point, I'm starting to think you are just a tankie offended because someone dared to use the word "socialism" in a way you don't like.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    It doesn't really matter what I say, you don't read it for meaning, you just shout some more of the same; attempting to communicate with you is like raking water uphill.

    What does Poe's law say? How would you put it into your own words?

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago

    How the fuck do you not see that you are the problem here? This was a very obvious joke about how Nazis named themselves National Socialists. How have you turned this into an argument? What the actual fuck is wrong with people on this website.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    How the fuck do you not see that you are the problem here? This was a very obvious joke about how Nazis named themselves National Socialists. How have you turned this into an argument? What the actual fuck is wrong with people on this website.

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    I can call a party "the cumfarts and beer union" and have nothing to do with either, proofs in the pudding, so to speak.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago

    Don't call me overdramatic. Holocaust 2.0 is coming.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    We found no evidence confirming the phrase appearing on a lectern originated verbatim in Nazi Germany, as social media posts suggested.

    However, we found no evidence confirming that the phrase originated verbatim in Nazi Germany, as social media posts suggested. The origin of the phrase was unclear, but it did not appear to have been used by the Trump administration or other presidential administrations before appearing on the lectern. Online searches for the origin of the phrase returned only results for more social media posts claiming it had roots in the Nazi regime, without providing further evidence. Searches of newspaper archives also found no instances of the Trump administration or other governments using the specific phrase.

    Mindlessly spreading without fact-checking, bad look.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    The phrase "One of ours, all of yours" was displayed on a podium during a Department of Homeland Security (DHS) briefing attended by Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem. While images of the podium with the slogan circulated widely on social media, Kristi Noem herself did not say the phrase aloud 12.

    The slogan has been linked to Nazi Germany, specifically as a reprisal for the killing of an SS officer 45. Musician Tom Morello alleged that the "Trump admin quoted (verbatim) the slogan" 25. However, other reports indicate that Noem defended ICE agents, stating they acted in self-defense and that "criminal, illegal aliens" would be arrested while American citizens would be protected 1. Some sources suggest that the phrase has not been found in historical texts related to 20th-century history 3.

    References

    1. Did Kristi Noem really say One of Ours All of Yours? History of ...www.primetimer.com

      42%

    2. Fact Check: Did Kristi Noem use problematic slogan ‘One of ours, all of ...news.meaww.com

      29%

    3. Kristi Noem One of Ours, All of Yours Podium Message Explainedwww.distractify.com

      13%

    4. ‘One of ours, all of yours’ – Into the Woodsacornabbey.com

      11%

    5. Tom Morello Condemns DHS Podium Sloganbluntmag.com.au

      5%

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    We need socialism

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

    I can’t find any evidence of this being an actual Nazi slogan. Searching for the phrase and filtering by results before this week turns up pretty much nothing.

    (Advocating for collective punishment is obviously unacceptable either way)

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