The race may already be lost, but still.

Meme about 5-Star Product ratings. Text: This scheme doesn't help anyone: Very bad, Bad, Almost ok, ok, Good. Use this instead: Bad, Some Issues, ok, Good, Exceptionall

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[–] 248 points 1 year ago (15 children)

I blame management metrics that punish anyone for getting less than 5-star reviews

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  • [–] 118 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    In the US.

    God, I literally was told by my manager at my first job to tell customers, when they got a random survey, that anything less than a 10 is a 0.

    Japan does 5 star ratings proper.

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  • [–] 75 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    That's how you know you're being setup for failure

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  • [–] 44 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    "If you go a minute without making a mistake then you can go a lifetime without making a mistake."

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    That's how our state scores conditions for learning surveys that factor into our school district "report cards." I just flat out tell kids that I proctor for "if you ACTUALLY agree with the statement, choose strongly agree." All other answers are scored as negative.

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  • [–] 29 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Yeah this is why I almost always give 5* reviews to any sort of thing that's traced back to a worker unless I really feel like they need to be reprimanded for something, and how badly they should be reprimanded is how many stars I take off. This is only for the 1% who really need a talking to.

    When it comes to product reviews on Amazon for example, or business reviews, I feel a lot more free to give my real opinion to help the next person.

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  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Every time I have to do an after call/chat survey I try to add a comment along the lines of "Your representative was very helpful, but I had to deal with too much waiting and too many chatbots to reach them. Please hire more staff."

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    Everyone I've ever dealt with who thought the employee needed reprimanded was either

    • A huge asshole

    • completely wrong

    • didn't like a policy that the employee had no say in

    • was dealing with a reversible error that required training not reprimand

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (1 child)

    The times I've done it were for:

    • One guy who had his phone in his steering wheel and was playing some sort of online gambling the whole drive and didn't look directly at the road once
    • One guy who was driving around on a spare tire (doughnut) on the highway at speeds way above those it said on the tire.

    I mean I can look the other way on just about anything (I've given 5* to a lot of questionable driving decisions and shitty cars) but when you are putting my life at risk, that's where I draw the line.

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  • [–] 51 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Don't care how many stars it is; if it's like 4.5 stars out of 1000+ reviews, I'll take it over something that's 5 stars with 100 reviews.

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  • [–] 46 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    What it is now:

    • 5 stars = it was fine
    • 5 stars plus glowing review = it was great
    • 4 stars = it could have been better
    • 1 star = terrible
    • 1 star plus review = so terrible that I had to write something OR I'm a gigantic gaping asshole that likes to complain
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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    "One star, the restaurant was fully booked and the hostess calmly explained that there was no room to seat me and my seventeen crying infants."

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    What I love is when it's a one star with review and it's some asinine shit they failed at or something like a missing piece from a 1000 piece puzzle.

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  • [–] 33 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Every single person that I get requested to rate gets five stars plus a positive comment because fuck you gig economy.

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  • [+] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    In theory, sure. However in the real world there is no escaping neither the ratings or the gig economy. Every single delivery company here does it. When it is possible to choose the delivery I pick the postal service. They too asking for ratings, but at least they have regular employees though some delivery points that are stores and kiosks have a suspiciously high rotation of staff. Not every vendor uses the postal service and sometimes the only option is to order from them or be without.

    I don't have any grandiose ideas of it having any effect, but I will not participate in rating the performance of my fellow humans that are service workers. They do the job to do the job and the job is not to suck up to me. And everybody has the right to have a bad day or whatever without some manager making it even worse.

    Realistically it is better to support political parties that legislate wages and working conditions and such so that people working any jobs have a decent wage and are protected from abuse.

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  • [–] 32 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    For hr or Uber or similar the scale is this:

    5 stars = meh, expected experience

    4 stars or lower = your employee literally tried to kill me

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  • [–] 27 points 1 year ago

    I mean, this is a good idea, I’ll give it four stars.

    ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

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  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    This doesn’t work unless everybody agrees to use it

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Correct.

    With most things, like Ubers for example, there really is not a substantial dofference between an average job and an exceptional job. Like, sometimes someone really stands out as exceptional - but almost always, the one and only standard is "completed job without incident". By giving your Uber driver 4/5 stars because they didn't offer you bottled water or whatever, all you are doing is punishing some random person who did a perfectly fine job, possibly significantly impacting their ability to make money and pay their rent.

    What should really happen is that these companies switch to a one star system. 1 star = completed job without major incidents. 0 stars = major incident.

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  • [–] 19 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I worked for AWS for a few years and one of our performance targets was customer correspondence rating, we had a target of 4.67. That means anything below a 5 brought you under the target. You also got to have a meeting with a team lead and quality lead for anything rated 3 and below.

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  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    We do net promoter scores, out of 10. 9 and 10 are positive, 6-8 are neutral, 1-5 are negative. We get scores like "Good job, no complaints, 5 points" or "Best service ever, but my internet went down, so I knocked it down to 8 points."

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    This is literally just a 3-option ranking with extra steps.

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  • Sure.

    However, assuming two exceptional employees rated consistently 7-10, there's a measurable difference between an 8.2 and an 8.6.

    The alternative is 3 vs. 3.

    People also like to have options. Having a sad face, a neutral face and a smiley doesn't really cut it for pretty much anything.

    Having the option of 1 being "utter shit" and 4 being "bad but workable" seems like it has benefits.

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  • [–] 35 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    what about using thumbs up/down and computing a five-star rating from the average?

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    this system can skew the average towards negative

    say someone found a hair in their soup but otherwise the experience was amazing - even if they're peak karen they'd still probably give something like 3 stars, but if faced with a binary choice they'd probably pick the negative option

    unless you mean up/down vote per each quality like atmosphere, food, hygine, service etc then that'd preserve the nuance imo

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    alternatively it skews the average towards positive: shit i found a hair in my soup! that indicates bad hygiene it the service was so good and i don’t want the wait staff to suffer! i’d probably go 3 stars but this is a thumbs down

    it all comes out in the wash: 1 hair in 1 soup, doesn’t matter… many hairs in many soups, place deserves a 0 not a 3

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  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Now i don't know if i should upvote fpor thinking outside the box or downvote for the faults in it. Maybe if we had 3 options? But then, what if the idea only has one fault and more positives? Maybe 5 options...?

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    compromise: you need to write a 1000 word review at at least a 12th grade level and we use automated sentiment analysis to set the score.

    still only as thumbs up or down though.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    You just described the entirety of my career on ePinions back in the day. I made bank off of that stupid website even though commenters with short attention spans constantly complained I was too verbose. Many dumb early 2000s computer parts were paid for via that avenue.

    I made the top 100 at one point. I still have the hat they sent me someplace.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Good luck convincing HR, or any of the assholes in corporate.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I prefer

    • bad
    • issues
    • good
    • great
    • exceptional
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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Except it isn't even an objective scale other folks are rating something a 5 for not being complete POS and being 5 dollars treating it as an objective scale and using a different one from planet Earth is less than useful.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Yeah which is why I pretty much ignore stars unless someone has a rubric in their profile, or an actual review attached.

    Solely numeric reviews are basically no better than up and down votes. Good for automation or algorithms, but largely useless to humans.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago

    It always seems like, for most people, the middle three stars might as well not exist. Was it acceptable? Five stars. Do I want to complain? One star. There is no in-between.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    For real, the fact that the former is how people have started using the five start system is crazy. Uber driver has less than a 4.8 rating? Cancel that ride, he must be a monster.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    The Internet is to blame for a lot of it. We have all these amalgumated ratings visible, and people want their review to impact that total score. The most impact they can have is putting a review at either extreme.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago

    Big corp has 10 ratings, and anything under 9 is deemed failure.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I think old and current newgrounds rating give a pretty clear representation of what each star mean.

    It's old tho.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago

    No I had emotional bad time and so that means 1 star always 😡

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago

    We tried this though. "C" stopped being an average grade and therefore "okay", a long time ago.

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  • The lower scheme is how I rate media, for service it's unfortunately the upper one because I don't want to fuck anybody over who's just doing their job.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago

    A few times in my life I encountered a system where 1 is labled "Satisfactory" or something similar and 5 is "Perfect" or similar.

    In those cases I either refuse to rate or rate a 1 no matter how it went.

    I think the system should always be so that 1 is absolute dog shit, 3 is no complaints, 5 is exceptional

    I hate that 5 is anywhere from "just okay" to "amazingly exceptional" and you just can't know which it is

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    I have a very similar system only from a subjective personal angle:

    1. I hated it
    2. I didn't like it
    3. It was fine
    4. I really liked it
    5. I loved it

    So most get 3, some get 2 or 4, only the few special ones get 1 or 5.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    If you're rating people, then it's better that you just don't rate if they did a good job. Because corporations only see 4 and 5 as good, everything else is bad. So you rating someone's good performance as 3 just hurts them for doing a good job.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Some corporations don't even see 4 as acceptable, let alone good. If I get a 4 star rating instead of a 5 at work, it's essentially the same as the person not giving me a rating. 1-3 are bad, 4 is neutral, only 5 is good.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago*

    This is working as intended, though. In most cases, nobody cares how stoked you are about the product, people mostly care which flaws the product has. With a target average of, say, 4.5, the 5-star system gives you options to give +0.5 stars all the way down to -3.5, giving negative reviews significantly more weight.

    relevant xkcd

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    Absolutely right! To somehow make sense of the current system, I tried to do statistics of reviews and see how a product or a business fairs in comparison to equivalent products or nearby businesses. The problem is that now there are so many fake reviews in addition to unhelpful human review.

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  • Remember boys and girls, a 4 out of 5 star review on any platform that doesn't allow a zero star, is only a 75% grade. Not an 80% like these hucksters imply. Thats a solid C, not a B. Let's not give in to this corporate delusion anymore

    3-5 = 50% =/= 60%

    2-5 =25% =/= 40%

    It's a false show of satisfaction in the very least. A rotting manifestation of the soulless corporation not allowing any amount of transparency stop them from pulling the curtain closed tighter, on the, "oh fuck," side.

    I think they are actually aware the curtains are silk and quite see through. I think we can all agree we've crossed the event horizon. Everything is going to get pulled in soon.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    It’s not the rating that’s flawed. It’s that reviews are bought now. There’s minimal real reviews.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Why are 0 stars not included?

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago*

    I think there should be 3 options: bad, OK, exceptional.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    The only two ratings that matter are 5 and 1.

    5 = Met expectations

    1 = Bad

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    Ah, but consider

    5 = Exceptional

    4 = Met expectations

    1 = Bad

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    4 does not meet corporate expectations and some minimum wage person who dealt with you is going to get shouted at.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Actually to be clear normally it's the average weight of reviews that is relevant nobody has time to actually speak to every review and most people don't actually shout at people

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    If your target is 4.7, every asshole who gives you 4 stars because "there's always room for improvement" or "5 means excellent and I wasn't that excited about it" has to be balanced by at least three more who give it 5 because they recognise that the wage slave has no power to make it better than they did and it's unreasonable to expect the wage slave to inject joy into their day.

    most people don’t actually shout at people

    Depends on the company. Some companies give people a ten cents raise, an hour's training and lots of stress and targets for being a supervisor. I don't know whether shouting at the other wage slaves is the intended behaviour, but it's frequently the outcome.

    It's great that you don't have experience working for places where the fear is used for control, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen a lot.

    You may say "if you don't like it, feel free to get a different job", but that's exactly what management say, and there are plenty of people on whom that fear works.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    Give 5 stars to this comment or I report You for any other score as harassment!

    Also I add extra gifts for any 5 star ratings!

    Corrupted, it is all corrupted.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    Hm. Probably a decent idea. I’m sure people view ratings very differently amongst themselves.

    I almost never give 3 stars. If it’s 3, it should probably be a 2 or 1.

    5-excellent, no problems.

    4-some very minor concerns, but otherwise the product does what it’s supposed to.

    3-?

    2-Issues interfering with the expected/full use of the product. Failure of product right out of warranty. Likely seeking tech help or a refund.

    1-DOA/not as described/died soon/immediate RMA

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  • This is how it works in Japan. An average of 4 stars on Google Map (for food places, at least) is considered pretty good. There's also another Japanese site dedicated for restaurants (Tabelog), where restaurants with more than 3.5 stars only make up 3%. Only 0.07% restaurants have more than 4 stars.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    the top scheme has 5/5 and the bottom one 4/5, so now we know which is better

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Honestly I wish rating systems just gave me a vertical line to place somewhere on a bell curve. Make it obvious I'm comparing against the average.

    But as it is, because drivers etc. get punished for anything less than a 5, it's 5 stars

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