Kenney is awesome.
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As a wannabe game dev in Godot: it is absolutely insane what Kenney is putting out there for free. They are legends.
from closed source to open source

From closed source to vibe source (it's open if Tim feels else his lawyers will see you in court)
He is going "good enough" at giving the source only when it attracts (is actually needed) big projects, but not letting go of the downstream or license... What a hero indeed. Just extrapolate that "white lie paint" on all of his statements, then do this for all "leaders" but especially the technology related ones
Good grief is Sweeney an insufferable cunt.
Imagine responding to one of the most wholesome people in the entire video game industry with “this is bullshit”
Real “Hans, do you think we’re the baddies?” moment
Oh my god. I didn't even realize that was THE Kenney
I'm out of the loop. Who is Kenney?
He makes a lot of free video game assets. 3D model kits, etc. Really popular among the Godot crowd, I believe.
Tim Sweeney is just mad cause he's discount John Carmack and weeaboo Gabe Newell.
when the fuck has Tim Sweeney made anything open source in his entire life?
I like how he suggests C++ is inherently superior to C, or that 3D is inherently superior to 2D, in the same way open source is superior to closed source.
Despite >=90% of his companies' codebases being strictly proprietary, and guarded so heavily you'll drown in fines if you leak as much as 3 lines.
Well of course he likes open source, I'm sure a ton of it has ended up in their proprietary source.
Not to mention vibe coding wouldn't be a thing at all without decades of open source for the LLMs to draw knowledge from.
I think in context, the C++ things makes sense: most games today are written in it.
But I thought exactly the same about the 3D thing. Does he know that 2D games still exist?
And C is also still used because a lot of low level infra still only supports that. Like, the drivers for his precious GPUs that run coding LLM still use some level of C code. So does some compilers. Those use cases are not replaced by C++. Because C++ is not a C replacement. Dumb ass argument.
Isn't C++ built on top of C and able to do everything C can and then some? It's been a while since I've coded in it but I remember that being a kind of neat feature in C++. (I'm not searching it to confirm - just chatting about it)
All C code can be compiled with the C++ compiler, though there's some nuance (if you don't mark the C code as C, it behaves slightly differently which could mean it doesn't work).
C++ adds a bunch of language features (object-oriented programming and templates are two massive ones). This can make it easier to describe a concept in C++ than in C. But it also enables a lot of unneeded complexity (if C++ wasn't the best fit, or if the programmers aren't excellent) and the compiler is slower because of all the extra stuff. And the resulting binaries are much bigger. And it's harder to port the C++ compiler to other platforms. There's still plenty of situations where it makes more sense to use C over C++.
He proceeded to list changes which gave good, astonishing results, where no art was stolen and no backlash happened.
Then he compared those changes to AI vibe coding? What results can he bring to the table for comparison?
It's been years now, so let's do a game and compare what years of 3d instead or 2d gave us, or the same with C++ instead of C.
It is a fallacious argument. Both 2D games and C are still used and have actually continued to evolve and progress in new creative directions. As for the third argument, it is pure hypocrisy. Tim doesnt contribute shit to the FOSS movement and actually has spoken against its core values from time to time.
It's hard for me to get past the fact that a person has willfully deferred their creativity and skill to an AI chatbot.
At that point, to me, you become a no talent ass clown.
At least of the folks I know that have gone all-in on GenAI, almost all of them never displayed much creativity in the first place.
One that I at least once had some respect for had walked away from doing any creative work 20 years ago. I frankly had sorted out about a decade ago that he was more "right place right time" than actually knowing his stuff. But he had a fairly common narrative I've heard a few times now: "I walked away from coding years ago, but I'm back in thanks to AI!". There's always good reasons they walked away in the first place that are generally not fixed by embracing AI.
Broadly the GenAI steps on creativitiy and skill by not producing precisely what the content creator wanted, so it favors people who don't really have an opinion on the specifics, and without opnion it's generally pretty flawed premise.
not producing precisely what the content creator wanted, so it favors people who don’t really have an opinion on the specifics
That's an interesting point that I haven't run into elsewhere!
This is absolutely the case with GenAI art. I get a lot of generated customer art now and I don’t even bother pointing out their obvious mistakes anymore because they never cared to begin with. If they want to hand me slop to print, I’ll give them just what they ordered.
A person?
Anyway, here's a pro tip for your issue: don't mind them. Get past it by just knowing they will eventually fall off.
Chances are they never had any creativity to begin with.
Also anybody trying to convince you that games made with AI are a good thing, should be evaluated with the same level of seriousness as people who tell you that fast food is healthy.
I have downed my opinion on Tim Sweeney. Down yours too !
Reminder that Unreal Engine is source available not open source.
Also a reminder that Valve doesn't license their engine out to pretty much anyone!
Like GPL, you have to be a customer to be entitled to the source code and modifications are under a share-alike license.
You could sell the unmodified Unreal Engine if you wanted to but your customers would still be subject to the epic user license.
tech tree following optimist
Permission to ew?
That's totally an indignant crash out... Fucking asshole in chief sitting there forcing AI down the throats of devs like grain down a goose chasing those phat phuckin slop-grois profits. I'm far from anti-AI, but this fit in or fuck off monoculture shit is toxic and unacceptable.
Kenney is based.
"Up yours?" Why go through all the trouble creating the impression that you're interested in good-faith arguments if you're ending your message with that? What a jerk.
That's precisely what stood out to me, as well. Not sure if the double entendre was intended, but the message is clear.
Up yours, too, Tim.
Yeah, I obviously don't know that either, but it would be one hell of a coincidence if this wasn't intended.
Tim cries himself to sleep every night because he knows deep down he's just a cheap knockoff John Carmack.
Hey, you dont talk shit to Kenney! Kenney is a saint in the GameDev world and many of my learning projects would have no good assets if it weren't for him and others like him. Fuck off, Sweeney.
God, this dude is embarrassing. A genuinely decent-seeming approach on the one hand that on the other is completely fucked by him making damn sure you know that he’s definitely got the bad intentions.
"open source" is kinda a lie
Ahh yes of course, as we know cpp is an upgrade and so is 3d. Thats why indie games are doing so well and all the people cofing in cpp like it so much. Anything related to coding was already liie 90% bs and now that 90% is also adapting the newest bs trend while the 10% actually trying to do stuff right is getting fucked.
c to c++ isn't really moving forward, it's lateral, and i don't mean that as a slight against c++ (for once, lol). same with 2d to 3d. turns out tim sweeny just says shit thinking we're stupid, imagine that.
if he really knew anything, he would have said "c to rust," which would have also been nonsense but it would have gotten a funnier reaction at least.
2d->3d -- bigger number
c -> c++ -- two extra plusses (and plus already means extra!)
games -> epic games -- it's got "epic" in the name
You don't have to be a genus to see these are all better!
Thinking C++ is advanced C is like thinking C# is advanced Java. Even if they were really similar at a point, they've moved on and diverged into their own thing. Things don't necessarily get better; more often than not they just change.
C# is a bad example. I'm happy it became its own thing over time and has since evolved in a different direction. But it was most definitely and unabashedly Microsoft's Java clone at the start.
It was definitely a reply to Java but I’d argue it was very much Delphi/ObjectPascal with C syntax. Which makes sense with the language creator.
Yeah, you just said the same the same thing I said with different words.
Java was also based heavily on Pascal at first.
A Java Application Servers Report (2010) opens with a brief history of Java that says:
It all started back in 1991 at Sun Microsystems Corporation, […] Patrick Naugthon, […] proposed a project to his friend and CEO Scott McNealy for the development of a small, simple, portable computer environment that could control all types of electronic components.
The language must use the principle of a virtual machine […] It must also be based on the current object-oriented language, C++, […] The project went ahead under the name "green" and the language was based on an old model of USCD Pascal, which makes it possible to generate interpretive code.
The Java development team has white papers dissecting Delphi Object Pascal for the discussion and development of Java features. This one is funny in that it discusses and discards a feature of Microsoft's J++, on which Hejlsberg worked too.
Idk if Sweeney is trying to pull one over on people he thinks are dumb. I'd believe that he thinks those are meaningful changes because he's just a deluded twat.
It's not an exoneration. I'm just not angry at him, only derisive.
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