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[–] 31 points 2 months ago* (6 children)

Debating with people in general is something I’ve found to be stupid and pointless as I’ve gotten older, even if they’re not trolls. I don’t even like watching videos of others debating. People come out the other end more entrenched than they were before. As for trolls, I don’t engage at all. My echo chamber is devoid of righties and nothing of value was lost.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    meanwhile the righties have also built their echo chamber devoid of uncomfortable discussions also. and the polarization continues to get deeper, dehumanization of 'the others' and wars become a common idea.

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  • [–] 10 points 2 months ago

    Those groups are filled with anti-trans, pro-corporate nonsense. I don’t even know what the point is, other than to make themselves feel bigger when the reality is that they’re just scared. It’s an echo chamber permeated with billionaire-funded viewpoints. No original thought, while also needing someone to punch down at every time.

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  • [–] 8 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    People never engage in honest discussions, man. They just vomit word salad and claim you're stupid if you can't find the argument in the haystack.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 months ago

    Reddit was horrible for that. I think there's less trolling here, but still the occasional mental issue.

    Some people are just passionate. Some people will write a manifesto in response to one line of text and dictate what you meant by it.

    🎵 Gotta know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em 🎶

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  • [–] 20 points 2 months ago

    I prefer a more direct approach...

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  • [–] 40 points 2 months ago (37 children)

    Over the years I've realized the futility of engaging with idiocy online. It's either trolls, bots, or morons, and I'm not convinced any interaction is worth it to me, all it does is piss me off, and I'm just enabling their stupid bullshit.

    So yeah, there's a one strike and you're out policy now. Does that increase my echo chamber, sure, but I'd rather interact with like minded people than piss away my own happiness by feeding bots, idiots, and trolls.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Everyone will piss you off once eventually

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  • [+] -8 points 2 months ago (30 children)

    See this type of thing cost the left the election in 2024. It's time to have better arguments to sway people's minds, they still will vote afterall

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  • [–] 23 points 2 months ago

    I tried for years man, but there's so much bad faith, and I'm just one guy who just wants some peace now. I've been so fuckin angry my whole life, I just can't anymore, the futility is draining

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  • [–] 9 points 2 months ago (15 children)

    I really don’t come to social media to change the world or people’s minds. I don’t know where this mentality of “you must change people’s minds” comes from. When was the last time some rando changed yours?

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago

    For me it's more about sharing the many information, including the best insults to spread around about the ruling class, and networking, than changing peoples' minds.

    If someone is being rude and I don't think they are in good faith, or a serious person, I just ignore them. I don't block or hit the ignore button, I just stop replying, usually don't even read them.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago (10 children)

    I get enlightened on Lemmy almost everyday as long as people have discussion with me. But that's the thing people resort to band whenever you question their opinion. If you look at United States, Trump built a coalition of former Democrats to be on his cabinet. That's one example of people changing their minds, why can't we on the left do that? How the hell did he get RFK Jr on his cabinet?😂😂

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    I’ll grant you that the links to content are informative but usually the comments are full of people missing the point, taking your comment out of context, etc. like this person that’s trying to act like I’m racist because I said it’s difficult to find vegan food in Mexico.

    I’d say 90% of comments are just a waste of time. I would never come here expecting positive engagement with others.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    This is sad to hear, I remember the Golden age of Reddit was so open and you could have a discussion with everybody. I was hoping that Lemmy was stuck in that era, but it seems that down vaults aren't enough for this website. They must resort to banning people with different opinions

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago

    Reddit hid downvoted comments, so if you said something truly contrary, you'd end up just getting buried.

    You can indeed have discussions here, but as soon as they start going off the rails, the chances of getting blocked are pretty high.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    We should be welcoming defectors from the right but the oligarchy has everything so influence operatized that we are led to loudly reject them so we remain unable to win.

    ie MTG. That said, everyone that's been against the bad guys from the start should get at least one I told you so on a turncoat. But they should be welcomed and encouraged to defect even if you don't trust their motives as being anything beyond self interest.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago* (3 children)

    I can accept that MTG is no longer a trumper, I can't accept most of her anything else. She is racist and destructive and trying to set up her next bid for election. I'm guessing the next VP?

    “This hateful, racists [sic], and demeaning rhetoric should not be tolerated. Ever. But they allow it and keep her in the inner circle,” Greene wrote Sunday in a social media post on X.

    Note: I included her anti-racism because it seems like she's not used to it.

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  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Idk what she has been up to lately, but here changes in stances, repudiating Israel, calling gaza a genocide, supporting universal healthcare, what else, opposing the Iran war, and what else, opposing geo engineering, (yes her base is opposed to it primarily because chemtrails but they are also against spraying sulphur dioxide in the upper atmosphere to blot out the sun.

    What else, there were others too. She's further left than almost the entire democratic party at this point.

    I don't think there is a single white democrat further left of her just given those positions. Bernie doesn't count at this point. Name one, Ron Wyden? Supports sending weapons, incluing assault rifles to Israeli settlers in the west bank, just last summer.

    Idk, seems to me like Israel and their super fans are manipulating us, again.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (1 child)

    RFK Jr. had like three percent in polls as an independent candidate, so he went to Democrats with an offer to withdraw and endorse them in exchange for a healthcare position. Sure enough, nobody there even listened to that constantly choking nut. So he went with the same offer to Trump, who decided “yeah, sure, who cares”. The gag, of course, is that there's no guarantee that the three percent voted for Trump — they might've split evenly or all chosen Democrats.

    However, I'm not sure what about that roadkill-eating conspiracy-theorist brainworm is Democrat.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago*

    What Republicans did that camel even try to bring in? Oh yes the hated Cheney's. That was so brilliant, bring the warmonger and evil cheney family to the Democrat ticket. Such brilliant very smart move 🤣🤣

    Do you see how stupid Kamala is? She is thinking of running again? The Democrats will probably make sure she does because they are controlled opposition

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Before you get too invested, check this bloke's comment history. They're a troll, and a poor one at that.

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  • [–] 13 points 2 months ago*

    The thing that cost the the election was that overwhelmingly popular left policy was entirely unrepresented; the left screamed "Genocide, funding ICE, and doing fuckall to help people will decrease votes", liberals said "What the fuck are you gonna do, not vote? We need to appeal to Moderate Republicans(tm) by talking about stopping migrant caravans, including republicans in your cabinet, banning trans people from sports, and The Most Lethal Military Ever!!".

    And once again, basically no republicans voted democrat, while massively unpopular republican policies decreased turnout.

    It would be trivial to sway people with "Do you want free healthcare? Do you want to NOT resume a genocide? Do you want to keep federally legal pot? Do you want Trump to stay in prison?"

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    "the" election - as if there was only a single one? Lemmy.World where your account is housed is not located in the USA (while I do not know about programming.dev).

    Your argument would carry much more weight if you displayed the slightest sensitivity towards acknowledging that places outside of the USA so much as exist, and occasionally have elections.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (6 children)

    Ah yes I forgot about the global election that's happening in 2024

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  • [–] -4 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    My friend, USA is the only place that truly matters. We are the greatest empire that have ever and will ever exist on this planet. Only with the grace of the USA, does any other country continue to exist. We have won so many world wars. We have proven to be the best and every other country just follows in our wake. So when elections happen in the USA, that's the elections everybody talks about throughout the whole world. When our trillionaires make decisions, the rest of the world listens. That's true power, that's something no other country will ever be able to experience.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    Yet you left Reddit to come here.

    Do you think Lemmy was made in America?

    Please don't answer, it was just offered to spark your thinking.

    Even though there is a point behind what you said there, behind THAT is an even bigger point: that pride comes before a fall.

    Don't worry, you will come to understand... eventually, one way or another.

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  • [–] -2 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Well reddit is too corporate now, I like this place. Without the USA lemmy wouldn't excist. Without the USA this whole computer thing wouldn't excist. You should be thankful that all this exists and was given to you for free. #thankanAmerican should be a thing really

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    I never said that people shouldn't be grateful for good things. I only said that the USA is not the literal exclusive nation in the entire world that had elections in 2024.

    And you said that you like this place, so I am offering a correction here if you choose to accept it: we can leave Reddit behind, all of it.

    I don't like what Reddit turned me into. Argumentative, combative even, ready to unleash upon anyone who dared respond with the slightest criticism. Did you know that Reddit designed their systems to promote such rage-baiting? You, like literally all of us here, feel into their trap. But you can breathe the free air now.

    If you want.

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  • [–] 70 points 2 months ago (23 children)

    Blocking doesn't stop them from propagandizing others.

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  • [–] 90 points 2 months ago (10 children)

    True but sometimes you have to pick your battles for your own mental health.

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  • [–] 26 points 2 months ago (9 children)

    Very true, but be careful not to end up in an echo chamber

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  • [–] 22 points 2 months ago (6 children)

    Echo Chambers are great. You just think they're horrible because you're in an echo chamber that says they're horrible.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago* (3 children)

    You wouldn't say that if you actually knew that most echo chambers are like the Incels, the neonazis or the pro-MAGA.

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  • [–] 21 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    But interacting with them will be interpreted as "engagement" and lead the algorithms to push them into more feeds and rank them higher.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Well not on lemmy I don't think they use algorathms to rank content and are open about how they rank comments and such. Not entirely sure though I am not a computer guy.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

    Sorting by ‘active’ takes into account the time of the last comment, and/or the number of comments. And it's the default sorting option in the default UI and apps that I've seen.

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  • [+] 5 points 2 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    To be clear, I'm writing from a Lemmy/Reddit/Slashdot perspective. Maybe on Mastodon/Twitter (or, dog forbid, Facebook) it's different, but I wouldn't know because I've never used that shit.

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  • [–] 13 points 2 months ago* (9 children)

    Hence:

    X officially changes block function

    https://www.wcnc.com/article/news/nation-world/x-block-changes-twitter/507-931ed7fc-cacd-4550-b850-b5d235533227

    Here’s a fun new one, no longer able to block accounts on pages. Thanks, Meta

    https://www.reddit.com/r/facebook/comments/1ps4r5d/heres_a_fun_new_one_no_longer_able_to_block/

    Under the new system it actually lets the blocked person know they are blocked, which is horrible design because they now know that they need to use an alt to send you mean messages. Under the old system they don't actually know if their messages are getting through, so it is better in that regard.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/self/comments/1st24au/reddits_new_block_feature_is_bizarrely_antisocial/

    Blocking someone reduces ragebait engagement, and they can't have that, I guess...

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  • [–] [S] 7 points 2 months ago

    yeah, and actually all those platforms have been shown on different opportunities to have a bot problem and it's still unaddressed because it's basically a conflict of interests to them (numbers go up : stakeholders go happy.) That's basically how I've been drown to Lemmy (and before, other 'niche' forums, irc channels, etc.)

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    You can always "block" (i.e. not use) forums and platforms that don't work the way you like.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    The fact that these platforms are trying to remove the block button is, to my mind, the strongest argument in favor of using it. These platforms are often mentally corrosive and will do everything in their power to ensure that you stay addicted, outraged, and idle. If you're busy debating reactionary idiots, who these days might not even be real people, then that is sapping your mental energy away from more productive efforts in your party/union.

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  • [–] -3 points 2 months ago

    Maybe you are just afraid to have your preconceptions challenged and are here for a quick ego fix. Which is cool and all, we all doomscroll, we need that dopamine, but I don't believe that is the purpose of a forum like this. Tik Tok might be a better match.

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  • [–] -2 points 2 months ago

    The first, most central and foundational principle of international diplomacy and conflict resolution is that you must always afford both sides a voice. If you don't, there can be no communication, no progress, no way forward but conflict.

    Take a moment and try to feel what you feel when someone ignores you, as if you were thin air. Does that emotion lead somewhere good?

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  • [–] 13 points 2 months ago (6 children)

    Meh. I've learned some interesting things from some people I found a bit annoying.

    It's how I've come from card-carrying Republican to more or less fitting the label "progressive."

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  • [–] 9 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    I think this is for people who are less "annoying" and more "actively lying and being bad faith." If someone says the elections were stolen, vaccines cause autism, and liberals hate America, I have other things I would rather do than investigate every one of the infinite conspiracy theories that I already know many others have debunked. It's essentially an exercise in bad faith rhetoric at that point, which is just so incredibly boring. I'll look into a few to see the patterns of how they lie, and then I'm good.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    That's a very heavy lifting interpretation of the comic. It literally says "I don't like this thing". Not "this person is arguing in bad faith". This is how echo chambers form, and lemmy is a textbook example of one.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    Well maybe bad faith wasn't the right term, I think for me it's just that if someone disagrees with me, my response is almost never even close to "I don't like this," unless they're being hateful, unreasonably rude, saying proven false conspiracies, etc. Most of the time it's "oh I think they don't realize or haven't considered xyz" and most of the time either they didn't know or they correct me on something.

    For things I would block, if a racist maga person comes in and says something, I gain absolutely nothing from hearing how climate change is fake, how libs are the real racists, how we hate trump for no reason. It's just negativity conspiracy brainrot and it's a huge waste of my time. Same for posts about what random out of touch billionaire #45 said, same for people generally being mean or super negative towards others, that's what I actually don't like and am happier having blocked it to never see again.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    I think this is for people who are less “annoying” and more “actively lying and being bad faith.”

    It can easily be co-opted by people willing to block either, as evidenced by the flame war in the comments here; the post suggests "I don't like this" -> Block. I don't like annoying people. I also don't like people arguing in bad faith.

    This is further complicated by the fact that a lot of people misconstrue good faith arguments from very different points of view with bad faith arguments. I can't tell you how many times I've been labeled as someone arguing in bad faith because my view differed from theirs and I didn't immediately reverse my stance when confronted, or someone simply can't read very well (literacy rates being what they are these days).

    In part, this is because trolls sometimes like to be very subtle and drag a conversation out for 50 comments.

    In part, this is because people are dumb and/or paranoid and don't understand that people with other apparent viewpoints might not be trolls.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago* (1 child)

    Well it's truly pretty rare that I block people, and maybe people do do that for things that they just disagree with, but I took it as the "block negative things out of your life."

    Lots of crazy people on the internet, I just try to remember that sometimes I'm the one being smugly incorrect (and was that way up until like 25) so I can't get too mad at other people for it. It's why I heavily err on the side of caution, only when someone does the maga loop back to something they already agreed is false that I'm like ehhhh...

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    There's plenty of documentation surrounding people getting banned for little to no reason. Blocking obviously has much less accountability and transparency to it; don't you think people are much more willing to block for even less?

    Not to be rude but, there are tons of people in the world and they're all completely different. "I wouldn't do it so nobody else would" is naive.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 months ago (11 children)

    Takes a lot to block all the idiots on Lemmy. After a few months it starts to become a usable platform.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (9 children)

    What is really funny is that the person who commented on this is blocked by me.

    Edit: Either the blocked account or someone else who is blocked by me commented. This is just too good. If a comment can't be read does it even exist?

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  • [–] 5 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    Blocking people is fine. Caressing your nipples because you blocked them is... less fine.

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  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (4 children)

    I'm not doing that. I just find it funny that in a post about blocking that the top post has someone who I blocked under it. Most people I block never know it. I guess this person does now and had some kind of opinion about it. As long as they don't inflict it on me.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Okay, but you do see the difference between finding it funny and telling everyone about it, right?

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  • [–] 9 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

    Image source btw?

    Edit: I found it on a reverse image search https://x.com/cuptoast/status/1887605740241887352

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