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[–] 28 points 3 months ago (4 children)

Only correction I have is that soney already decides when your game stops working. What we need isn't physical media, it's DRM free media

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  • [–] 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    On top of that, everything since the PS4 and even some of PS3, has been game files are on the disc, but incomplete. Disc is more or less a DRM security check to make sure you still have the game. Outside of that, you still have to download the full game basically. The disc is useless if you tried using this in the year 2067. By then I'm sure any service related to the PS5 will be long dead. Right now, I can buy and play NES games from 1985. I have no issue doing that. As long as your TV has component cable input, I can play an NES on your TV with an NES I can buy on ebay. The game and console both made in the 1980s. It will still work. Might need some isopropyl alcohol and a few q-tips, but it will work. 1985 was 41 years ago. 2067 is 41 years from now. I have zero faith that you'll be able to use anything from the PS4 or PS5 era. That will become lost media. There may be issues connecting an NES to a modern TV in 2067, but if there are adaptors to make it work on whatever they use at the time, and if the physical plastic and brass hasn't eroded, then you'll STILL be able to use an NES in 2067. I have zero faith that Gen-Z will be able to show their grandkids what they played in 2018.

    Good chance I'll be dead before then, so I may not even see the day. My point stands though. We're living in a digital only age, when we haven't figured out how we will forever preserve these games. Because unless something crazy changes, I fully believe this generation is a generation you can only play now, while you can. My PS3 still has the PSHome app installed. I remember playing on PSHome for years. Then one day, they announced it would die, and all access to the service would be lost to time. Which is how it stands to this day.

    I forget what the error says if you try to launch it now, but I stopped trying to launch it, because I was afraid it might self-delete.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Here's a database of games, whether they play offline or require internet, and whether they require a download to play.

    It's at 94% of PS4 games that require no internet to play, 87% require no patch to beat, with more being validated. Far from "everything".

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    While I agree that @Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world's data isn't exactly correct in covering the percentage of games that can be played, their sentiment is not so random.

    For example:

    • Both the PS4 and the PS5 in the database you linked show that roughly 25-28% of games will require a patch to be played without "bugs that are either too severe or too many to provide a mostly flawless experience". That is almost one game out of three that, without internet connection/dead servers, will live in an odd limbo in which you own a disc with unpatched/crude software. One out of ten will be useless plastic. In comparison, a GOG installer can be re-downloaded as soon as a game is patched, and you can store it away locally once again.
    • Often, buying games at launch means you don't have a complete package for the title, which nowadays comes in the form of DLCs and season passes. Those are not registered in any way onto the disc (naturally), and are only tied to your account. If Sony closes down services that check that you own such content, you don't have access to it anymore.

    One could argue that Sony's going at great lengths to keep services alive; for example, the PS3 still lets you download and update content. One also can, however, easily imagine that there will be a day when such service is not considered profitable enough, since you soon won't be able to buy games for it anymore. What then? Can we realistically expect Sony to keep servers and checks alive for a console that does not generate any new profit whatsoever? I honestly doubt so.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago*

    Physical deterioration is another reason to focus on DRM free rather than physical for the sake of physical.

    Classic ROM-based cartridges have proved pretty resilient so far, but older games on CD are experiencing a culling due to disk rot. Lots of folks with PS1 collections will already have a few unplayable games, even if they don’t realise yet.

    Thankfully almost all of them are backed up somewhere, but those backups are in a precarious legal position and could be lost.

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  • [–] -4 points 2 months ago

    This is stupid. The choice would be don't buy sony.

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  • 22 comments in c/pcgaming@lemmy.ca view that post
    [–] 24 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Discs being discontinued was inevitable. Games don't even fit on a disc any more.

    SKG should pivot towards digital rights. Give us actual ownership over digital products. If I want to transfer a game license on my account to somebody else, I should be able to.

    There is no technical reason this can't be done, but lawmakers will have to push them into it.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Yk, most game still fit on discs, you can also put games on more than 1 disc and guess what: we can also stop using discs and start using other storage medias

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    Yeah. SSDs are more than viable. Discs as well. And having to include media price in a game gives that bit more pressure on the developer to prefer a less obscenely obese game package.

    Making physical a necessity (at least for a "premium" feel and package) will make your online downloads take up less space!

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  • [–] 21 points 3 months ago (8 children)

    Sony's decision to stop selling physical disks for its games

    If Sony ends physical disk sales

    PC Gamer, I know you know better.

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  • [–] 9 points 3 months ago (7 children)

    As a PC Gamer, I don't know what you mean. My guess is, that we are used to digital games? Well that is not even the biggest problem. The biggest problem with Sony ending physical disks is, that Sony would become the only market place on their systems. And have full control over everything, on a locked down system. That means no competing stores and prices, which will keep the prices high. On PC, we have an open platform and many stores. Even if its digital only, we still have more control and choice.

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  • [–] 9 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    Correct. I mentioned this earlier when it was posted before, but we still have option of physical media for games on PC.

    I was at a convention last year where a solo developer was selling their game on USB sticks. No company demanding he go through their storefront so they get a cut!

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  • [–] 4 points 3 months ago

    Some storefronts are just there to sell you the game without DRM too. We have GOG and itchio in example. Or they sell the game on their website just letting your download the game, which would be like you got it on the USB stick or CD. And even for shops like Steam, they can sell the game on other platforms and websites a Steam game key to unlock it in Steam, without them paying ANY money to Steam! And all of that on top of what you mentioned with physical media being an option.

    The "only problem" is, that most publishers and developers don't do that.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (4 children)

    My guess is, that we are used to digital games?

    I don't know why someone decided to say "correct" on my behalf, but no, it's baser than that: "disks" is the ellipsis for "hard disks" and "floppy disks". "Discs" is the correct terminology for an optical disc.

    The author already acknowledges what you did re: digital games.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    I still don't understand what you mean by "PC Gamer, I know you know better.".

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago* (2 children)

    I mean that I know someone writing for PC Gamer (the outlet whose article this is) knows (or should know) the difference between those words.


    Edit: In case you didn't know, italicization is used to indicate (among other things) the name of an outlet. So for example, The New York Times, The Verge, and so on.

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  • [–] 16 points 3 months ago (8 children)

    You have a choice... not to buy from Sony. I'm all for the Stop Killing Games movement, but we should stop telling us that we HAVE TO BUY and have no choice. You have a choice to not play something, just like I stop using Windows, even if there are games only available there.

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  • [–] 5 points 3 months ago (4 children)

    Keep running to different ports and you run out of safe ports. It's not about what you should buy - although buying-to-own is apparently a level of smart that the average de-furred ape doesn't understand anymore, it's about preserving choice. I already feel icky about Steam being (mostly) license based, but they've at least shown themselves to be trustworthy for the most part. The companies that would happily push an oligopoly, however, hell no.

    I converted to PC some years ago and don't see myself going back to console. That said, I can understand the appeal of why someone would prefer the no-fuss experience of a console and I don't think it should be enshittified. Current console gamers may be too stupid to fight for their basic rights, but I'll do it for them anyway, because one day, those morons could have kids who're smarter than their parents and will have been fucked over by their forebears otherwise. I already hate my parent's amd grandparent's generations for being so nonplussed about things that my generation is as fucked as it is so it genuinely terrifies me to think of how fucked the generations after mine could be if someone doesn't wake the fuck up and draw a line in the sand.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago* (3 children)

    Most people might not be stupid or morons, but simply don't care because it's just video games. Sony will never revert their decision to drop discs and this lawsuit is not even about that.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    If people don't care about devaluing their money and aiding monopolies, even actively when you see the hoops the fanboys are jumping through to defend Sony, they're absolutely stupid or morons. Just tell Sony you home address, entry code amd where you keep your money, why don't you?

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (1 child)

    So are people who exclusively use Steam morons (the vast majority of pc gamers), too? Or are they alright because they chose a different computing platform?

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    The ones who blindly believe their games are safe just because they're Steam, yes. Gabe has shown to generally be on the side of the gamers and the free market (free as in choice), but it's foolish to not be concerned about what happens in a Post-Gabe Steam landscape.

    While Steam is leaps better than the walled gardens that are loudly pushing for full monopolies now that the masks are off, it was still massively controversial back when it launched and the concept of a wholly digital library was uncomfortable for a lot of people. Those concerns only went away once DLCs were shoe-horned into every game being released in the late 00s, normalising the concept, and have now resurged thanks to Sony showing how happy they are to delete digital libraries that were labelled 'purchase' and 'buy' at the time of sale. Twice.

    Short of GOG's approach of giving the full executable with no DRM requirements and things like the recent mandate in China to be able to pass on one's digital library, digital holds no value and has little difference from throwing money in a dumpster fire. At the very bare minimum, there needs to be legally-mandated full-disclosure agreements at the time of sale to inform the customer of how long they're renting a product for. Not some nebulous warning of "We can remove this from you at any time of our choosing, with barely a lift of our finger and with almost no warning or avenues for compensation". That is the line of theft and anyone who is supporting it is not only fighting against their own interests, but actively screwing over everyone else too.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago (2 children)

    Exactly GTA VI will come out on Xbox with disc and I will buy it through them. Long as Xbox doesn't decide to follow Sony lead.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 months ago

    Well GTA 6 will come on disc for Playstation 5 too. But it will be just a code in a box, confirmed by Rockstar. And honestly don't think the XBOX version will be different. I think that wasn't the best example.^^ I do actually expect Microsoft stop producing discs for newer games, but we need to wait and see. If you really want a disc, I think there is not really good choices in the future.

    Sorry for being this negative, but that is what I believe.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago

    This specific case is a bit a fight against windmills, no?

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