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[–] 69 points 4 months ago (10 children)

Well it does contain a psychedelic drug, just not one that we've identified yet.

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  • [–] 42 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    You don't know that. Maybe it just disables the tiny people filter we normally have.

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  • [–] 8 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    It doesn’t need to be, there is reasonable proof that humans and other mammals naturally synthesises (trace amounts off) dmt, which are presumed to be used and broken down incredibly quickly. We still don’t know why, what its used for or have hard proof where its produced (pineal gland is main suspect for having all ingredients in theory)

    In theory something could trigger an effect that stops it from breaking down or produce it at a faster rate, therefore triggering psychedelics effects with out the consumed substance containing anything psychedelic itself.

    Dmt is known for seeing (machine) elves, does not sound that far away from seeing mini people.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Maybe the DMT causes our dreams? Anybody who has tripped knows that dreams are just another hallucinatory experience. Wouldn't surprise me at all if we found out they were caused by our own bodies creating an hallucinogen.

    After all, it wasn't that long ago that we discovered Endorphins, which are addictive drugs in their own right.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    The reason we suspect the pineal gland is cause it has all the ingredients..

    Which it also needs to produce the sleep molecule melatonin. Which is a triptomine.

    The theory is that it shifts over to producing a large amount of dmt twice, at birth, and at death. (If i recall correctly)

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  • [–] 62 points 4 months ago* (2 children)

    Lanmaoa asiatica

    My sincerest apologies. I know the way out.

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  • [–] 169 points 4 months ago (8 children)

    "Biosynthetic gene mining of the L. asiatica genome found no close hits with any genes known in the production of mushroom psychoactive compounds," write the researchers in their published paper.

    "This supports our hypothesis of the presence of a novel unidentified metabolite responsible for the unique hallucinogenic properties of L. asiatica."

    Yeah. No known hallucinogens.

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  • [–] 38 points 4 months ago* (3 children)

    Exactly. Or even- no known hallucinogens synthesized by their canonical biochemical pathways by enzymes expressed from the host species genome.
    The OG hallucinogen, ergot, is ingested by eating wheat. If one presumed that the substance is made by wheat, and mined the wheat genome, they would never find the genes for its synthesis, because the hallucinogen is made by mold growing on the wheat.
    It’s very rare you can draw a strong conclusion from negative results.

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  • [–] 19 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Rye is the most common place ergot grows, which is another common bread grain. I am not disagreeing with your post, and ergot can grow on wheat too, just pointing out that rye is a much more common source of egot contamination.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago*

    Now it gets interesting, as they try to figure out the mechanism. It's interesting that it can be cooked out of the mushrooms over enough time.

    I love mushrooms, and sometime cook them well-done, for burgers and such, and sometimes I keep them medium, for eggs and spaghetti sauce. I'd probably be tripping now and then.

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  • [–] 41 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    they found no close matches to genes associated with psilocybin or ibotenic acid, two well-known mushroom hallucinogens

    None that we already know about, not the same as none

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  • [–] 80 points 4 months ago (12 children)

    Maybe it's not a hallucination at all. Maybe the mushroom is actually an anti-hallucinogen. It suppresses the hallucinations that normally prevent us from seeing the tiny people.

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  • [–] 16 points 4 months ago (5 children)
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  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    It's the W-class Mnestic agent in the mushroom.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    You will forget everything once you exit the room anyway

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  • [–] 36 points 4 months ago (14 children)

    Regardless of the actual metabolite responsible, this does raise the question of whether, if any other species consume them and are susceptible, they see tiny versions of their own species?

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  • [–] 15 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    I always wonder if the cows get high. On the right day it's like daisies in summer and they're just munching grass all day.

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  • [–] 11 points 4 months ago (9 children)

    Now that's a question. How to test it?

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (8 children)

    Monkeys seem like a good place to start. Similar enough to us to see if it’s unique to humans, small enough to not start ripping someone’s face off if it goes badly.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (7 children)

    Yeah but how do you get an experimental result from them?

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  • [–] 8 points 4 months ago

    Mackaques love touchscreens, amd can be trained to do complex tasks on tablets placed in their enclosures.
    You make a test where they need to press a button when and only when they see tiny monkeys that you can project on a screen or on their floor.
    Then you give the drug at various concentrations and placebo, and see if there is a dose dependent increase in the monkeys indicaions of mini monkeys.
    Then you can repeat the experiment after treatment with antipsychotic, if it prevents the mini monkey reporting, you already have a hint at the mechanism.
    Any nonhuman primate lab can do this from 1-2 million dollars, should we start a go fund me?

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (3 children)

    I think you could watch pupil response, body temp, sweating, brain scans, etc and get a good idea.

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I thought we were trying to see if the hallucinations of the tiny men changed to match your species' body shape

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Monkey brain scan will change depending on what it sees. Monkey sees humans vs monkey sees monkey is a very different looking scan result.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Trying to scan a monkey's brain, while it's awake and interacting is not a trivial task. MRI scanners are uncomfortable for humans, and we know what is going on with the big scary machine.

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  • [–] 31 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    They're just enabling you to see the fae that are always there. DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR NAME, NO MATTER WHAT!

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  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    prob also grow in a perfect circle

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago* (2 children)

    I just saw a beautiful Fairy Ring, about eight feet in diameter. It was nearly perfect, with a couple of small breaks, but it was a clear circle, populated with a wide variety of sizes, from little ones, up to some that were about 6-8" across! I was kicking myself later for not pulling over to take a picture. I'm kicking myself now just writing about it.

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  • [–] 26 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    Potentially (potentially doing a LOT of heavy lifting here) unethical, make a reasonably comfortable tiny person cell, take the mushrooms, put a tiny person in the cell. A second person who is completely unaware of the previous events takes the mushroom and we see if they can see the same tiny person still in the cell.

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  • [–] 25 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    They finally found it. The Blue Angel mushroom really does exist...

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  • [–] 25 points 4 months ago

    Clickbait headline, the primary object of that study was to figure out phylogeny of these mushrooms. finding no known genes associated with known hallucinogens is a bonus and pretty useless info because the compound responsible for this activity is not known, how do you know how it's made then

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  • [–] 41 points 4 months ago (31 children)

    Can't wait for it to become known so governments all across the world can throw you in a prison cell and ruin your life for it like the other known hallucinogens.

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  • [+] -94 points 4 months ago (30 children)

    Junkies being angry about saving their life.

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  • [–] 41 points 4 months ago (7 children)

    If you don't know what you're talking about, why comment at all? Get that shit out of here and go back to Reddit with it.

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  • [+] -55 points 4 months ago (6 children)

    If you don't like my opinion why should I like yours? Let me do my thing to break through the opinion bubbles you are living in.

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  • [–] 25 points 4 months ago*

    “Junkie” is pretty much understood to be a narcotic/heroin user, not hallucinogenics. Regardless, decades of prohibition policies have proven your opinion isn’t a valid both-sides argument, but patently incorrect. This is supported by many professional opinions from medical doctors, psychologists, sociologists, economists, etc. looking at the impacts of strict criminal penalties for drug use to both the individual and their communities.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago* (1 child)

    It's not an opinion, your assertion that "junkie" refers to anyone who has used drugs is just objectively WRONG.

    And thinking you are somehow educating the rest of us is STUPID, since you were flatly wrong from your initial assertion.

    You are too dumb to understand any of this, but the rest of us do.

    And we're laughing AT you, MAGA.

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  • [+] -6 points 4 months ago

    Wow you got heated. Calm down man. You don't know me. I'm not even in the US. But I'm starting to understand why you hate this opinion that much. It's because your enemy tribe used to say this probably. Luckily, I don't get US propaganda so I don't need that much drugs.

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  • [+] 34 points 4 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 10 points 4 months ago (16 children)

    Is that how you justify telling other people how they’re allowed to spend their time? You just have to presume that their life is (1) in danger, (2) at their own fault, (3) and it’s your responsibility to do something, (4) even against their own will—and you can just apply this rubric of thought to any particular discontent with their character? How convenient. So, if you don’t like gay people, should you also teach thy neighbor about god? Maybe force them to read the bible in a conversion camp? It sure would be better if everyone thought just like us, huh?

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  • [+] -26 points 4 months ago (15 children)

    I think you're talking about adults, otherwise it wouldn't be a question that yes, you should save them from themselves.

    Talking about adults, haven't you seen videos about countries where they allowed every drugs? Have you ever bought a product and disappointed in it despite the PR and research you put in? Have you ever bought a product without research? No, people can't decide responsibly, they learn from their fault when it's too late. The market needs to be green.

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  • [–] 18 points 4 months ago (11 children)

    There is not a single country where every drug is "allowed," wtf are you talking about?

    This is such "I'm 17 and grew up in a conservative household" energy. How did you even end up on Lemmy?

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  • [+] -14 points 4 months ago (10 children)

    If you're interested I'm 29 and born in a hungarian village where nobody was religious. I ended up on lemmy because I am a developer and free software supporter. I want a nice place to live in, and psychedelics does not fit into that picture.

    Maybe just accept that not everybody has the same opinion. Let me express that I think psychedelics should be banned.

    I have to correct myself, it's not a country, it's a city Portland. https://youtu.be/2GU3TGSWPsw?is=5lJ-PJ44vzzfmCfM

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    Okay, I'll bite. What is it about psychedelics that makes you think they should be banned?

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  • [–] 8 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    The fact that Hungary is a DEEPLY right wing country and unfortunately very trad in its ideology of the body and consumption.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Left and right wing here probably means different than for you. Now we don't have any socialist or communist parties, the left is only from social democrats, and they won recently. They support gay people and stuff. I also voted for them. In the US, people are very religious. In contrast, under socialism, it was forbidden here, so we are not that used to that. So we are not that conservatives. There are also many government owned companies working outside of free market, and have free healthcare and stuff.

    So religion, capitalism, what else do you consider right wing?

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Thanks for the reply.

    Let's do a thought experiment.

    Imagine that you enjoy alcohol, as in you like to pair wine with cheese and you like to relax with a beer after work. Now imagine that I tell you that alcohol should be banned, and as evidence I show you a news story of some teenagers who don't know how to control their drinking and drink too much and get into a fight with police and almost die. Not only would you think that I'm hopelessly uninformed about alcohol, but you would also feel vaguely threatened by me because when I say that alcohol should be banned, I'm implying that harmless wine connoisseurs like you should be persecuted and locked in cages. You might point out that the teenagers are actually the victims, and the real perpetrators are the store that sold alcohol to minors, and the parents who failed to teach their children what responsible drinking looks like. You might also say that it's a violation of personal freedom to tell responsible adults what they can and cannot drink in the privacy of their own home.

    You would be absolutely right, and all of your arguments would apply equally to psychedelics.

    Sincerely, A psychedelics connoisseur

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

    We are heading into a direction where drinking too much gets more and more accepted. My grandmother has never drunk alcohol. My grandfather has drunk only little. My father and mother had been drunk sometimes. And I was drinking almost every week during university. Please tell me why we kill ourselves, and what can we do about it if not with bans. I would support no alcohol and no cigarettes. I want to believe that we can be happy without them.

    But banning a socially accepted substance, and banning a socially not accepted substance is different. It needs to be different, because black market would flourish if they are fine with it. Now imagine you allow shrooms, it gets socially accepted and now we have another problem that we cannot deal with.

    It's enough to see misbehaving drunk people in subways, it's already too much.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

    I have a rather interesting view on the matter. Typically even my in-group doesn’t agree with me on this. Yet I think all drugs should be legal. Access to drugs should be strictly regulated (imo), but easy. Therapists should be able to obtain license to administer psychedelics. There should be therapeutic centers specializing in use of psilocybin, ketamine, and MDMA. There should be other types of therapeutic centers where you can get access to methamphetamine, opioids, and other drugs—as prescribed necessary for addiction treatment. There should be places to buy recreational drugs like cannabis.

    Everything has a place, in my view. Banning something outright is naive, creating more problems in the long run. If you swap from enforcement of prohibition to a more utilitarian approach, you can get a lot more done. That doesn’t mean you give drugs away and create addicts. It means you be a grown up and stop acting like everything is the boogie man, while also acting like anyone who touches it has caught cooties.

    People do a pretty good job policing themselves when the system is established in a manner to empower them with good choices. It’s the same idea as the panopticon, as old as Jeremy Bentham, but in reverse. People aren’t going to go get their free meth when culturally it’s known to be for addicts who are at a bad place in life. People who do just want free meth are now surrounded by psychologists who can help.

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  • [+] -7 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    There are some social crises in people life where policing themselves gets lower focus e.g. on a break up. I think the easy access is the problem. And to fix it with opening it up even more is not a good idea.

    I would give people money if they can tell who is a dealer. So the market itself would fix the problem.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago

    Easy access isn’t the problem and hasn’t even been tried. There isn’t easy access. There’s illegal access through shady networks with unverified merchants and products. That’s the result of the prohibition… that and decades of a stupid war on drugs.

    “Opening it up more” presumes that I mean “give more people more access to more drugs in the same way they do now.” That’s not at all what I mean.

    There are some social crises in people life where policing themselves gets lower focus

    Sure. Then they can just go to their local gas station drug dealer and buy some meth then. Your solution doesn’t seem much better. I don’t see how this really argues against a utilitarian approach to drug regulation.

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  • [–] 18 points 4 months ago

    Awkward? Unexpected results are the building blocks of science!

    We learned a new question to be answered.

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  • [–] 25 points 4 months ago

    Well yeah, these guys live there

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