Please don't expect the community to give you answers to your questions which you then delete right afterwards. Those of us who put time into answering your questions are not doing so just to serve your personal needs, we are here to help build a community knowledge base that others can search and reference.

This has become a chronic issue with Lemmy and its starting to feel like it's a waste of time to answer questions.

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[–] 70 points 5 months ago (12 children)

Has that been happening a lot here?

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  • [–] [S] 101 points 5 months ago (10 children)

    Lemmy in general, yes. Here in self hosted at least a couple of times that I've seen. Including earlier today. But I don't interact on every post.

    I only find out because sometimes I like to go back to posts I comment on and see what additional information people have offered. (There's always something to learn.) Then I find the post has been deleted.

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  • [–] 25 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Is there any way for a community to disallow post deletion? If not, this seems like a needed feature.

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  • [–] 20 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    or maybe a feature where posts cannot be deleted past a time period + amount of engagement.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago

    These would have to be added to Lemmy development, because currently I can delete a post of my own on a community on another instance and there isn't a technical way to prevent it. Reporting and banning for behavior is tricky too unless you manage to remember the username of who posted it.

    So, that's an uphill battle at the development level and the moderation level.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    What if I accidentally posted to the wrong community? Or posted something with a username/password in it? Or accidentally selected a picture of my penis wearing a little monocle and top hat to this community?

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago

    I see now there were 3 posts removed in the past that all seen relevant to the community me. Going back I see ones I've read and interacted with.

    Seems like it might be more mod actions to me, as others have pointed out. Maybe a more general self hosted community if the mod doesn't want those sorts of (relevant to selfhosters but not specifically selfhost software announcements or whatever) posts here.

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  • [–] 191 points 5 months ago (28 children)

    It doesn't make sense, either. There's no rational reason to delete a thread after the question has been answered.

    Even if it wasn't actually a person but was an AI agent asking questions so it can scrape the data from the answers, there's no real utility in deleting the posts after receiving responses. It just seems so weird.

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  • [–] 53 points 5 months ago (25 children)

    Could they be astroturfing, looking for a specific solution to fill search engines with their own product placement, then deleting because most of the comments are other FOSS solutions?

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  • [+] -66 points 5 months ago (23 children)

    It might be to stop the damn notifications you keep getting whenever anyone posts to a thread you started. Also it's reasonable to think discussion forums are in some sense ephemeral. If you want a persistent store of knowledge, try Wikipedia. Lemmy could also host wikis if it's worthwhile, like reddit does.

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  • [–] 72 points 5 months ago

    Also it’s reasonable to think discussion forums are in some sense ephemeral

    This is 100% wrong. This isn't Discord or chat. People expect forums to appear in online search results, i.e. be persistent.

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  • [–] 53 points 5 months ago (15 children)

    Uncheck "Send notifications to Email" in your settings. Or get a 3rd party app with a notifications setting.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    I don't get email notifications, but that number next to the icon changing is annoying. I have a few old responses that I've left "unread" on purpose, so I'm reminded to get around to dealing with them (look at some url or whatever). When the number changes, that means there are actual new responses, which after a day or two tend to be useless depending on the topic. So I'd rather shut them off.

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  • [+] -49 points 5 months ago (13 children)

    If it's easier to delete the post guess what people will do.

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  • [–] 47 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    How is it easier to delete a post every time than to set preferences to not be emailed just once, then you never have to again?

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  • [–] -3 points 5 months ago (8 children)

    How do I do that for just that post? And how do I ignore replies for that post so I didn't get any other notices?

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    if you don't want replies, just don't post. everyone will be better off than if you are deleting posts. actually it's the easiest thing to do.

    that being said. are you guilty of deleting your posts after they had discussions? because if so, I'll just block you because you are taking away value from the community, not adding to it

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  • [–] -2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Somebody may want an answer and once they get it don't want the other replies to keep notifying them.

    No I don't do this. But it's remarkable that all the lemmykins arguing with me and down-voting me simply can't see things from another person's pov.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (2 children)

    Somebody may want an answer and once they get it don't want the other replies to keep notifying them.

    • the first answer is often not the best one
    • don't take away the discussion from others

    But it's remarkable that all the lemmykins arguing with me and down-voting me simply can't see things from another person's pov.

    I'm sure we can see that point of view, we just refuse it because it's such a mean pov

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (1 child)

    I mean... I don't disagree but you're arguing against somebody who is not here. I honestly don't know what you expect in response. If you want people to behave a certain way you can either:

    a) Say they're stupid and change nothing and continue to bitch about the problem or

    b) Understand why they're doing what they do and try to address it.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago

    I mean... I don't disagree but you're arguing against somebody who is not here.

    I thought it was obvious. I was arguing with you, because it seemed you were sympathizing with the user that regularly deletes their post. I was arguing that the reasons given are not good reasons. also this is not a DM, others are reading it too. evidence is you got a downvote on this comment, and it was not me. and most people lurking rarely vote.

    a) Say they're stupid and change nothing and continue to bitch about the problem or

    why, what can I change?

    apparently it was already fixed a year or two ago in a yet unreleased version of lemmy. so it seems a software change will not help in a reasonable amount of time.

    b) Understand why they're doing what they do and try to address it.

    tried, and it makes not much sense to me. nobody is receiving live notifications from lemmy, or if they do, that's because they use a niche client where they didn't turn them off.

    but also.. starting a discussion and then not wanting to participate, so dropping a bomb.. that makes no sense.

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Why don't you like getting replies? That's the fun part!

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    Your comment isn't popular, but we all know the rule: "the best thing needs to be the easy thing", since people will often choose what's easy and fast vs what's ultimately better. We see this in security all the time (hello-oo NPM).

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  • [–] 21 points 5 months ago

    I have no idea what you are using to browse Lemmy because the only notification I get is a number next to my profile icon in web browser or Thunder. And that's often delayed by several days so I frequently look through my own old posts to find replies because don't get reliable notifications.

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    no. everything shpuld be petsisted, which is why i donate to the internet archive.

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  • [+] -16 points 5 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago*

    i had to lookup what the acronym csam meant..... c'mon - you know what i mean. i am talking about words, the context of the conversation. but to your first point, if a post had misinformation, backing that up so historians can see and have evidence of the behavior of this time. You can flag it but i think there is a lot of history that is washed away.

    but no - i dont mean illegal pictures of children - this post was about deleting help posts.

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  • [–] 44 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    Have you checked the modlogs to see if the posts you're talking about were deleted by the mods? The mods here seem to really not want this community to be a support community and will delete it under Rule 3.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    Realistically, a platform where you can delete your own questions so that they disappear for everyone isn't the best platform for technical support communities. But a platform where you can't delete your own posts is not the best platform for for a lot of other things, like privacy.

    Two use cases without overlap seems like a good argument that there should be two different platforms.

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  • [–] 23 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Fediverse is not private in any sense. Anything you post (or up/downvote) is blasted out to every federated instance and only gets deleted if that instance respects the delete command, which you cant rely on.

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  • [–] 15 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 child)

    Too many people are ignorant of this.

    I have a belief (not based in law, just my personal feeling) that once you post something in a conversation in a public forum, you no longer have any natural right to control it. By posting it in a conversation on the public internet, you have, in a practical sense, waved any right to control it. That is a part of a conversation that belongs to the public, and you gave your comment away freely. It is public record. You cannot demand that it be forgotten or erased any more than I can demand that something I said to my friends yesterday be forgotten and erased.

    If I hosted a forum, I would make it clear that this is the policy, and I would not allow people to delete comments that they posted. Edits would be allowed, but the history would be available. Deletions would only ever happen if I was legally compelled.

    This all gets complicated if someone posts private information about a third party. I would rapidly delete such posts and ban such users. The third party never consented to anything, so it's not the same.

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  • [–] 40 points 5 months ago (8 children)

    Well OP. Looks like your post resulted in a moderator resigning and the appointment of two new moderators in this community. As I've said previously, it was a moderator removing posts for a very far stretch interpretation of Rule 3, and not users deleting them after getting the answer.

    Let's hope this results in a better community for the selfhosters here.

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  • [–] [S] 13 points 5 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    Oh my GOD that's probably what happened to mine! I was discussing something on my last post and then suddenly the mod removed it because of "Rule 3". Because we were talking about selfhosting. Which, all selfhosting is on our own hardware..., but I think my post leaned more hardware than the mod liked. Super annoying when you're having a valid conversation, people are chiming in and helping, and then suddenly Removed: Arbitrary rule violation.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    And I'll use your comment as my post here for a local mod appointment of my lw account!

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    a moderator removing posts for a very far stretch interpretation of Rule 3

    ...stretch by which party? in the sense that the post not really about self-hosting (and OP tried to use rule 3 in a stretched interpretation), or that the post was about self-hosting but moderator applied it in unnecessarily strict way? The way you phrased it seems like the former, but then why would that result in moderator resigning?

    (I'm not a native English speaker so sorry if it should have been clear.)

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  • [–] 36 points 5 months ago (12 children)

    I don't get it. why are they deleting their posts?

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  • [–] 7 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    It's just another type of advertising to them. Ask a question trying to solve a problem, then use your alt account to shill your own solution.

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  • [–] 8 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Doesn't work that way on lemmy: if they delete the post, then the alt's shilling disappears, too.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (4 children)

    Frankly, I don't think users should have that power.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    I'm not against it, post something it the wrong place, or during a bender. Would be kinda cool if lemmy tracked user starts on deletes like it does on posts and comments

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I'm still undecided about their own text (deleting comments or post text disrupts the conversation but there's valid reasons), but I don't think the OP of a thread should have any control over the existence of that full comment thread.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Maybe some form of engagement or time limit would serve. If the post is empty or low engagement and less than 2 days old, it can go. After that it's up to mod?

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago

    Or just do it like reddit did, where you can delete your post content and remove your username from it, but the thread and comments remain.

    Though with how the fediverse works, it's possible to spin up a custom instance that highlights deleted content instead of deleting it, meaning the attempt to get rid of it can be what brings it more attention if anyone has decided to do it. Just like with vote identities, they aren't anonymous and there are instances/sites that just show who voted for what.

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  • [–] 33 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    Hadn't noticed, but wow. I wonder what the motivation is to delete info that would help other people.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    There are a couple of accounts who were doing this regularly for some reason on all sorts of different topics. But I would need to see more evidence of this happening. As someone else mentioned it could be mods or a couple rare cases or all sorts of things.

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  • [–] 6 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    Lately in all of the lemmys like each time I go to look at my replies (if I ever get one), the reply, my comment, and the thread are all gone. I'm often thinking it's mods just nuking threads because of inflammation or whatever.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I wonder if someone is trying out an AI or something and seeing the results. Then deleting. More evidence will pop up eventually.

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  • [–] 9 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    My guess was that it’s users who fundamentally misunderstand federation, and think that deleting their comments will prevent them from being scraped or used to ID them later. In reality, if someone was truly concerned about avoiding doxxing, they’d just switch accounts. Because anyone can spin up a single-user instance, federate to scrape content from all the communities they want, and then simply refuse to respect delete requests.

    Because when you delete something on a Lemmy instance, the instance simply sends a delete request to all the other instances that federated with it. But those other instances can easily ignore the delete request and retain the deleted content for as long as they want.

    That’s also part of why it’s so stupid that AI crawlers are scraping Lemmy and thrashing instance owners’ rate limits. The AI crawler could just set up a new instance and automatically gather the content via federation. But instead, they just send crawler bots. Because fuck the instance owners, I got my content either way and using a crawler bot didn’t require me to learn how federation works.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    My guess was that it’s users who fundamentally misunderstand federation, and think that deleting their comments will prevent them from being scraped or used to ID them later.

    I really don't understand these people. If you don't want to be doxxed or scraped, stop participating online. It's that simple. Even if you participate in a private sub, it will eventually get scrapped.

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  • [–] 24 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Oh, I thought this was about me since I just asked for file transfer stuff but you're specifically talking about deleting it right after. It happened to me on asklemmy where the user deleted it right after

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  • [–] 22 points 5 months ago

    Asking questions in a public forum (after searching imo) is generally a positive thing. Answers are then public and the next person with the question can find the answer. That sort of behaviour should be encouraged, and no one will ever complain about it imo.

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  • [–] 24 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    I haven't noticed many posts deleted by the user themselves. I see a lot of 'deleted by user' comments. I try to remember to put [SOLVED] on any serious post I make, after the fact. That way, someone searching can cross-moginate whatever their issues are with what solved the issue for me. Maybe the user deleting the post once it was solved is embarrassed they asked a supposedly 'stupid' question?

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  • [–] 15 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    I try to remember to put [SOLVED] on any serious post I make, after the fact.

    You (and folks who do the same) are unsung heroes. Thank you.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago

    I wouldn't go as far as to say I'm a hero. It just seems a 'thank you' and a [SOLVED] would be a common courtesy, especially if someone took the time, and had the patience to muck through my feeble brain to tweeze out exactly what the issue was. LOL

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  • [–] 43 points 5 months ago (10 children)

    I just want to apologize for being the person who asks questions and then doesn't respond to the comments. I get overwhelmed D: but I'd never delete my post, what's the purpose in that?

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  • [–] 21 points 5 months ago (9 children)

    Someone may have the same question in the future and there will be answers. You not responding is not that bad but it is even better that you do and provide an update to your situation, if you wish.

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  • [–] 11 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Editing original post and including steps which helped would be great. I don't expect anyone to reply to each an every comment separately, but a summary on what caused the problem and what fixed it would be nice. Specially when someone later finds the post with similar issue.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 months ago (4 children)

    Someone may have the same question in the future and there will be answers.

    With 8.4 billion people on this planet, I can't be the only one asking the question.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago

    and if everyone who asks that question has that mindset then we end up with no answers longterm.

    its annoying to scroll through 15 threads asking the same thing looking for an answer, but its infinitely worse to find no threads related to what you're trying to do.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    For technical issues I've come to the conclusion that if there are no other people asking the same question, then I need to re-think my approach, because I'm probably doing something silly.

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