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[–] 13 points 9 months ago (3 children)

As someone who worked in an actually agile team years before the project managers co-opted the idea and contorted it into "Scrum" I feel this comic in my bones.

It is absolutely maddening how these people have perverted a system that worked so beautifully into the concentration-breaking wasteland we have now just to make themselves feel relevant.

While I'm presently a fan of Kanban, my happy agile experience was under sprints. If anyone is curious what that looked like, I've written about it here.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 child)

    I haven’t read your blog post, but I agree with your comment.

    Unfortunately, Scrum is often misused. Why? Often, I think people don’t understand the problems that Scrum is trying to solve. So people implement Scrum poorly. And, when evaluation time comes, they blame everything but their lack of knowledge and skill regarding Scrum.

    But Scrum is actually a framework to help you solve very common problems.

    If you understand that, then Scrum becomes useful.

    There’s a set of problems that teams will always have to deal with: how to choose what to work on, how to coordinate, how to know when something is done, how to see if your work actually solves the problems you’re trying to solve, how to deal with task-switching costs, how to deal with cognitive load, how to deal with complexity…

    And those problems can be solved with Scrum. Or Kanban. Or any other Agile way of working.

    What’s important is that it works.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    Yeah, this is probably going to sound like a truism, but to avoid shitty Scrum, you need to resist management trying to alter the processes, but you should absolutely tweak the processes to account for the needs of the devs.

    Basically, yet another reporting meeting does not help deliver the software faster. But more (or less) meetings for devs to sync what they're working on, that can help, depending on your team's specific needs.

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  • 63 comments in c/programmer_humor@programming.dev view that post
    [–] 100 points 9 months ago (20 children)

    I don't know man. For the past 6 months we went with approach "Fuck scrum, let's just work". It didn't go well. We were really disorganized, everyone going their own direction, things being overlooked, ...

    When a new colleague joined recently, he suggested taking more structured (scrum-like) approach. Things improved immediately.

    Like I don't know how you want to call it - scrum, kanban, whatever, I don't care. But you need some structure in your team and you need some meetings where you talk about status, about looking back at things, about plans for next weeks, ...

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  • [–] 38 points 9 months ago (9 children)

    My only requirement for team processes is that they be mostly up to the team. Absolutely some type of structure is needed. If something isn't working for the team, they need to have agency to address that, whether it means adding, removing, or changing something.

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  • [–] 48 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    Well, yeah, that's what Scrum is. From the guide which takes maybe 10 minutes to read

    Scrum Teams are cross-functional, meaning the members have all the skills necessary to create value each Sprint. They are also self-managing, meaning they internally decide who does what, when, and how.

    That's not a throwaway sentence - it is fundamental to how scrum works and that is reinforced throughout the scrum guide.

    Every conversation about Agile and/or Scrum being "the worst", after some prodding it turns out that their company has refused to read or implement one or several of the fundamental principles, often without even being aware that was an essential requirement. You're baking a cake and you decided to not use any butter, that's on you champ, don't blame the fucking recipe.

    The biggest valid criticism of scrum is that the thing that makes it so great - its structural empowerment of individual teams - is also what makes it structurally incompatible with any traditional top-down management style. The company must fundamentally be (re-)organized to have a flat corporate structure within its R&D department - most are simply incapable of mustering the necessary changes, if only because too many middle managers' jobs are at stake. So they call their middle managers "POs" or "Scrum Masters" and wonder why their version of Scrum sucks.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago

    I reached for the up button about five times reading this. I absolutely 100% agree. Agile, and all of it's little branches, were created by self managing teams. Each team did it differently so named what they were doing differently, we got XP, scrum, kanban, etc. Spoiler alert: it wasn't the specific flavour that led to success, it was the diverse, empowered, self managing team of mature, talented people. Get yourself a team like that and the rest will care of itself.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago

    This is what’s most important. Allow for experimentation!

    What works well for one team might not work well for your team. What worked well for your team 1 year ago might no longer be what you need now.

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  • [–] 24 points 9 months ago

    My understanding is that Scrum is a tool box. You figure out what tools fit for your team. The problem arises when people are in charge that don't understand the what the team is doing or the toolset provided by Scrum. They then try to use every tool and it goes poorly.

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  • [–] 22 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    My team has moved to a thing we call "ScrumBan" and it's worked pretty well. There still are 15-min Dailies, and a Review and a Retrospective each Sprint, but we cut almost all meetings that are about sitting around and "planning" tasks (aka awful 7-hour meetings where everyone just zones out and guesses random story point numbers). Instead, tasks are planned and moved to the board on demand and never in the presence of the entire team. It gives everyone so much more time to just focus on their work.

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  • [–] 18 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    That’s scrum. One of the defining features of scrum is timeboxing meetings. Daily standups are 15 minutes. A two week review should be two hours. Ditto for retrospectives and sprint planning.

    A seven hour meeting means the scrum master wasn’t doing their job.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    story point numbers

    how many different ways can I say "I simply don't know yet?"

    well give us a guess

    could be one point... could be 50? I DON'T KNOW

    well yeah but give it a guess anyway

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago* (1 child)

    Most teams I've been in would do a time boxed task (sometimes referred to as a spike) in those cases. Basically, you get a task with maybe 3 or 5 story points, and the goal is to either complete it or find out what it takes to do so. Then you make follow-up tasks for the next sprint. It's worked pretty well for me in those cases with a lot of uncertainty.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah thats tough. I hate when they do that. The beauty is, it doesnt matter. Usually I just drop a mid number and agile seems to give the flexibility to change that as you identify the true scope of work. Do what you can in the sprint, but eventually update the points to match or break it up and adjust points best you can at that point. Given I haven't been doing agile long, so I could be missunderstanding how it should work.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    I love working on the edge of exploration, but also recognize it's going to be a lot of dipping the toes in and seeing what the water is like before I can reliably predict these things. I'm fortunate that no one on my team does what I do, so, sometimes they just accept "will report back next week with an estimate based on actual research".

    also not getting ambushed with large hypotheticals beyond our actual tool chain support help but

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago

    I worked with my team and we naturally evolved to a Scrum-lite. Or what scrum consultants might derogatorily call scrum-but. We do sprints, the team plans their own work, we do not do the daily standup since no one wanted it. Just having time blocked focused work has made us very productive without burnout. If your manager locks in too Mich on by the book scrum it becomes a pointless waste of time and ceremony.

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  • [–] 29 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    I don't send my dad memes often, but considering he has that exact book in his closet I had to send him this.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Now that you mention it, I don’t think I’ve ever sent my Dad a meme in my life. He’s kind of a boomer tho. I’m not sure he even knows what they are lol.

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  • [–] 26 points 9 months ago* (1 child)

    I am so sorry to everybody here who never saw the real agile. All you ever saw was fake / wasabi scrum. The little side gig scrum with the tickets and the sprints and a scrum master without any power to change a company is a frustrating distraction for everybody.

    As soon as the team makes their own decisions and the bosses in every level actually help them on this, they can become agile and the framework just a communication theme.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago*

    Meetings! Meetings as far as the eyes can see!

    There's no escape, there's no rest. Life is only meetings now.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago

    S c r o t u m

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  • [–] 36 points 9 months ago (6 children)

    My job has a "scrum master". She's nice, I guess, but as far as I can tell her entire job is sharing her screen so we can look at tickets. Then people tell her what to click on and what text to change. It's excruciating because it would just be faster for the person talking to change it, instead of being like "remove the second bullet point. No, not that one"

    On top of that they have all these tasks for "unit testing" but they don't actually do unit testing. Someone just said, in the distant past, we should do testing so it's there.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    I loved being the scrum master but the responsibilities should be more than presenter.

    I had to deliver project status notes to product shareholders, let them know of any directional changes we had to take due to blockages, drive the team to deliver on time for product launch, manage the backlog workflow to ensure the dod was accomplished, manage the backlog and attribute 15% of it to housecleaning/bug fixes.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

    This. A scrum master's job should be first and foremost making sure that the dev team has what it needs to get real actual work done. Ideally, the scrum master should be face tanking status/ update meeting, coordinating with outside entities, and ensuring that as few distractions make it to the team as possible.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Exactly. A good scrum master shields the team from the bureaucracy, facilitates the meetings while keeping them targeted and on-topic, and keeps everything running instead of slowing it down. They also coach the team in self-organisation.

    There are far too many people that call themselves scrum masters that are actually just pressurising ticket managers.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago*

    I'd rather say an SM does not shield the team from bureaucracy, but makes them face it and empowers them to take it down.

    The SM coaches the team on targeting the right topics themselves. Making them realize what to focus on. Ideally, don't to the work for them, that they should be able to do themselves. That would make them ignore these topics, because the SM takes care of it for them.

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  • [–] 12 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    This is just like PMs where I work. They are generic PMs with no background in the work we do, so they end up being spreadsheet updaters and meeting schedulers (which literally everyone can easily do themselves).

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    which literally everyone can easily do themselves

    Key word here is 'can'. People can update it themselves, but unless kept accountable for missing something bad, they don't do it unless a PM drags it out of them. In a perfect world we'd all show enough accountability to share the info that could affect a project in a democratic and orderly way, but even when ignoring a lack of PM experience, people usually feel it's bureaucratic and takes precious time away from their specialisation.

    A PM with a good background will definitely have a chance to be better than a PM without, but being able to contact the right specialists at the right time and keeping the project flowing is what truly matters.

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  • [–] 12 points 9 months ago

    The biggest problems with scrum, in my experience, are when the managers and directors don't understand it and ruin it. I've been a few places that implemented SAFe, but to this day I don't know what SAFe actually is beyond waterfall with pointless sprints. I've worked in a couple of places where the directors kept their noses out and scrum worked really well.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Anyone got the original or know the creator? Thanks!

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago

    Welcome to the Meeting factory!

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  • [+] 4 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (10 children)
  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    You can actually see sprints as mini-Waterfalls. But the point is to fail and learn from it. I am sorry you had no Scrum Master with responsibility. Not finished on Friday? So be it! Find out why and try a solution. You had distractions, complexities during the sprint: reduce them! You planned wrong: why? Were you forced to, by people outside of your team? Put the decision making back to the team, where it belongs. Nobody else.

    Embarrassment at the review? Don't cover it up because no one will learn from it. Dont fix something in secret over the weekend. Someone will not notice something was ever wrong.

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  • [+] 3 points 9 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (2 children)

    I guess I fundamentally reject the idea that a team should be able to plan and estimate weeks worth of work and if everything doesn’t go according to plan, then you did something wrong and need to figure out how to do better next time.

    And you wouldn't even disagree with scrum here. Whoever taught that, misinterpreted the scrum guide. You don't need to figure everything out. See scrum as an instrument that shows you a result, nothing more. You as a team interpret the result as you like. If you see no problem in the result, fine. Nothing to do, move on.

    The way you say it sounds like someone put disappointment or bad energy into 'failing' a sprint. The point of scrum is that you can not plan perfectly and expect funny results. A good SM might ask: "do you see this as a problem?" and let the team decide.

    Scrum actually doesn't even mind spill over or unfinished work, etc. At the end of the sprint we check out the outcome and then talk about the next opportunities. Half finished work is no problem and not even mentioned in the scrum guide. If there was disappointment or bad feelings about it, then some one among you did that on their own. As a team you can literally decide that you don't mind spill over from sprint to sprint because you see no problem in it and move on without worry.

    estimate weeks

    In my opinion, time estimations are a distraction to everyone involved and never work. I'd recommend to estimate in complexities. To talk about them. Nothing else.

    The problem is that committing to a fixed scope in a fixed timeframe with a fixed team size is always bad idea and Scrum makes an entire process out of this bad practice.

    Again, misinterpretation. The sprint length is just for consistency, like planning meetings is easier that way. And measuring is easier too. Scrum even allows you to renegotiate the scope dureing the sprint. It even says that in the scrum guide...

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  • [+] 3 points 9 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago*

    thanks for your words.

    I always wonder what the point is of time-boxing in the first place

    When all work is done inside of sprints (including merging, testing, delivery, troubleshooting) etc., as it originally is meant, this becomes a really convenient thing. Sales people, the customers or the manager, know at 1pm every other Friday they can come to the review, check out a new iteration, with contiguous items, without interrupting anyone or having to make changes in their full calendar to get in touch. In kanban, i wouldn't be so sure when a good moment is to review with others, in advance.

    I like kanban too, by the way.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Scrum as mini waterfall isn't supposed to happen, but it usually does. The idea is everyone can help the people will are currently busy

    The problem is test and build can't do much to help the system analysts; the analysts and testers can't help build because they don't usually know how to code, so all that happens is everyone tests when build is done

    As an analyst I don't do any testing because I had a bad team leader in a past job as a function tester which soured me on the job, so it's pretty much mini waterfall to me

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    the mini waterfall is kind of the intention of a sprint. The whole idea is to reduce the huge waterfall and its horrible surprises at the end when it is way too late. Have those surprises early by doing small waterfalls. But everybody is splitting it wrong so all the small waterfalls have no outcome until the whole thing is done, just like you do without sprints.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, great iteration is the feature. But the other side where we're expected to all help out each other, to keep everyone busy all the time doesn't work

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    to keep everyone busy all the time doesn’t work

    I agree but that has nothing to do with scrum. It does not say how busy everyone has to be. Things like these are left for the team to decide. If you felt like you had to be more busy, then someone among you probably pushed it.

    In fact i prefer a bit of slack time so people can react to incidents better. Imagine a 100% busy highway. Not nice. And then you need to spontaneously deliver something from A to B, using that highway -> there will be a traffic jam and everything works terribly. Have a bit of slack here and there so the spontaneous delivery does not mess up the flow -> much more effective and everyone is happier too.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    So...

    I just got my PMI-ACP and PSM I.

    I'll just see myself out.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago
    [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    The worst thing that ever happened to software development.

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  • [–] -3 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    What’s up with the text on the book spine? Is this AI generated? :(

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