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[–] 311 points 11 months ago* (9 children)

This is getting weirder. Did they realize they were being shitty on camera?:

“I’m a U.S. citizen, please help me,” she shouted after agents forced her to the ground. “This is unfair. Why are you doing this to me?”

Agents then placed her in a patrol vehicle. She was released a short time later.

“She refused to cooperate and identify herself with all levels of law enforcement there,” said agency spokesman Alan Regalado, noting Monroe County Sheriff’s Office deputies were there. A Herald reporter saw deputies moving drivers along who were slowing down to watch the stop.

After agents removed the woman from her car, they found her driver’s license in the vehicle, ran it through their system and confirmed she is a U.S. citizen, Regalado said.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/florida-keys/article313356223.html

Edit: So basically, she wouldn't show them her gold star. WTF country are we fucking living in.

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  • [–] 91 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    Why would they bother with the license if the ICE facial app scan said she was an immigrant? I thought it was absolute and infallible...

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  • [–] 74 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (5 children)

    A racist one

    Edit: no lie, my phone autocorrected Fascist to racist (I probably fucked the spelling). Accurate both ways

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  • [–] 25 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    And fascist don't forget that part!

    It's quite sad to watch the decline of America.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    Ya, speaking as an American, America really jumped the boat with Iraq and Afghanistan and the idea of American Exceptionalism. Like I get it, America is the best, but the minute you start seeing results that are not agreeable, change the method. No, these chuckle ducks said we are America and rammed thorugh terrible idea after terrible idea. 'Cause we the best. It's this mindset that has everybody denying, America was already close to the bottom. Now it seems we trying to be the best at being the bottom. And seeing if that floor can go lower.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    It goes all the way back to the founding of the United States. The country itself is built on stolen land and is rotten to the core.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago

    What is wrong with a bunch of wealthy racist land owners creating a country to benefit themselves?

    Everything you learn growing up in the US is propaganda and objectively false. There is so much white washing bleach should be the national drink.

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  • [–] 93 points 11 months ago* (5 children)

    All ICE agents should be treated with nothing but disdain and ridicule for the rest of their lives. We need a running list of their identities so they can be ostracized. Monuments should be built at Arlington so they can join Robert E. Lee in their shame. Make it a public urinal, right at the entrance.

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  • [–] 88 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    Since when do we have to show our papers to the secret police?

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  • [–] 41 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    If you are white, around 11 months. If you're not white... Well, haha... Funny thing that.. Umm, let me uhh, ya.. Let me just go look that up...

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  • [–] 155 points 11 months ago (14 children)

    Only a truly sick society would allow this

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  • [–] 64 points 11 months ago (6 children)

    A society steeped in misinformation and propaganda ultimately embraces fascism

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  • [–] 24 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    Sick from poison, no doubt, but sick nonetheless. I hope there's a cure that opens their eyes some day, but it won't come from a TV screen.

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  • [–] 11 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    The cure to misinformation and propaganda is critical thinking and the scientific method

    We have the tools. We need the talent.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Exercise doesn't cure poison. Using individual tools like critical thinking can help you avoid internalizing the misinformation and propaganda, but it sure doesn't inoculate you from it. We need to cut it out at its source and find ways to ensure it doesn't get replatformed. Otherwise the toxin is there, just waiting for a day when you're not on alert, slowly poisoning your mind.

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  • [–] 7 points 11 months ago

    There are always going to be people whose honest assessment is just wrong, or very probably wrong. Or its one of those black swan moments and the crazy person is right.

    There's no getting rid of uncertainty. Science helps us quantify that and work with it.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    It really isn't, fascists love using "science" and "rationality" to "prove" their ideologies. You can argue that they're not doing real science, but their followers will believe it.

    The cure to fascism is anarchism. That is the only effective way to prevent it.

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago (5 children)

    It's been allowed under the laws for a long time, it's just like everything else been a polite agreement not to do things like that. The constitution isn't really suited for actors in bad faith in all parts of the government.

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  • [–] 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (4 children)

    But it's not, simply put if you are not committing a crime you are not required to ID.

    Border control is allowed to ask you if you are a US citizen and they have expanded authority at established checkpoints. ICE can only ask you are a citizen. They can request ID, but you have the right to refuse.

    Now if they can give probable cause that you are breaking a law then you can be detained and compelled to ID. The current legal standing is that race cannot be used to establish probable cause. Now of course the Supreme Court can over turn that anytime.

    But all of this to say this has been the law for decades. ICE and local police departments struggle to understand that you do not have to ID when asked except under specific circumstances. Several departments have escalated to arrests that ultimately get thrown out. You can do a search online and find dozens of examples of cities having to pay a lot of money in settlements over false arrests.

    But if you are driving a vehicle you are obliged to produce a driver's license in every state. You can't be pulled over just to have your license checked though, there has to be other cause for the stop.

    Know your rights and fight for them before they are taken

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    The current legal standing is that race cannot be used to establish probable cause. Now of course the Supreme Court can over turn that anytime.

    Which they did on September 8th.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    Source? I'm not doubting you it's just been a hard year to keep up with everything

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  • [+] 143 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (16 children)
  • [–] 25 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Nothing will happen to them. Nothing happened to the National guard who murdered and stabbed students in 1970.

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  • [+] 7 points 11 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 6 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    These people will be protected and suffer no consequences, because the oligarchy in the US knows it will need more thugs who can operate with impunity. This is why Trump released the Jan 6th rioters. National guard literally murdered and stabbed students in multiple instances in 1970 and nothing happened to them. Most got promoted.

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  • [–] 19 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Sadly most Nazis minus a few higher ups went without punishment. Many scientists even ended up working for the US as part of Operation Paperclip. Like the Civil War, the punishment NEVER fits the crime and these assholes mainly get off scot-free with no repercussions. Which always leads to a resurgence at some point.

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  • [–] 15 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    You lovingly forgave the traitors of the civil war, you gave high research positions to nazis after world war II, the signs are not hopeful

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  • [–] 7 points 11 months ago*

    It's actually surprising how they happen to have two million prisoners. Clearly, some people are going to jail.

    In other news the justice department commissioned an AI to automate sentencing of convicted felons but had second thoughts when it transpired the robot had become racist after being trained on the judicial records. True story.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago*

    I hope so too but I have no faith in the democrats or the current American justice system to make it happen. The only way I see it happening is revolution or war. Otherwise, the federal government will just go on acting like all of this was perfectly normal

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  • [–] 139 points 11 months ago (27 children)

    Uhg. FTA:

    "She is visible white and 👱 blond, a medical worker, speaks with no accent. This should be a warning sign for MAGAt as they could be preyed by ICE at any time!"

    None of that is a reason to believe she's not an undocumented immigrant. And being brown, curly-haired, not-a-medical-worker is not any reason to believe they're an undocumented immigrant.

    Is this objectionable behavior by ICE? absolutely. But not because of who the victim is. but because there IS a victim. everyone in this country is protected by the constitution, and afforded the rights of due process- which ICE is flagrantly violating the shit out of.

    Can we please stop with the special classes of people like this?

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  • [–] 128 points 11 months ago (8 children)

    It is important because of the reason they cite.

    By going after this woman, they're making it clear to MAGA folk that allowing the rights of minorities to be eroded also removes their own protection. Even racist assholes should be appalled at the civil rights violations being committed.

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  • [–] 22 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    And in making that argument, it signals to the racist assholes that the problem being that she's white, blonde and professional, and therefore the rest are fair game.

    which as you say, erodes everyone's rights. But that's not particularly important to me. the rights of all are worth protecting even if that weren't true.

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  • [–] 54 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    I think it is about opening the eyes of the racist ICE supporters that in fact they are not safe from what they have initiated. Even if they cannot make the jump to being decent human beings caring about all people, they usually care about what happens to themselves.

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago

    Yeah and as much as we all hate having to interact with these absolute chuds, the most successful ways of deprogramming people have been through empathetic outreach.

    If these MAGA chuds experience the boot of fascism first hand, that might open them up to listening to people from other groups that have had to deal with this kind of treatment for much longer.

    It's a slow process, a metric fuck ton of emotional labour, and not everyone is willing to do that work, which is understandable given that you'll be competing against the whole outrage media and "attention economy".

    But if enough of us are willing then through genuine human connection, which everyone but a very minute actual clinically psychopathic portion of the population is so desperate for, can get these chuds to open their eyes and grow a little more empathetic.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago

    If MAGA people were able to understand the subtext of this event, they'd be smart enough not to be MAGA in the first place. You might as well try to explain to a dog why drinking antifreeze is bad.

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  • [–] 22 points 11 months ago

    Yes, yes, yes! But also, it's particularly notable that she's white and blond with no accent because they claim to their supporters to be protecting those specific people from "illegals." Pointing out that they're not only doing something awful but also defying their own stated principles is always a good thing to do.

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    It makes a point of slapping people who truly believe, even now, that all the ICE activity thus far has been against illegals.

    Illegal only. For real. They believe that.

    A maga relative in landscaping was mystified as to why half his employees had either left or were leaving and weren’t coming back for the next season. In his words: they’re believing all the lies and hype being spewed by the media.

    In his mind, even now, ICE is only doing their job: removing people here illegally. Because media can’t be believed and is filled not with lies but terrible twisting of the truth.

    So putting a face on this, that looks like MAGA, is about all that’s left to try to get their attention.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    And has your family started the "well she should have just complied" victim blaming?

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  • [–] 9 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Whoever wrote that doesn’t realize Canadians can also be immigrants.

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  • [–] 16 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    No, they are appealing to MAGA folks that are picturing getting rid of all the dark skinned people they don't like.

    The people that consider that nuance have already been against the ICE crap, you don't have to convince those. The only people that can be convinced are those that you need to get their racism aside before they'll join you. It's distasteful, but it's a way to grow the voices condemning this behavior.

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Pretending special classes of people don't exist is just stupidity.

    They definitely do exist.

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  • [–] -3 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    and they exist, in large part, because articles like this normalize it.

    congratulations in defending part of the problem.

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  • [–] 0 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    they exist, in large part, because articles like this normalize it

    This complaint is missing the forest for trees.

    Special classes of people have existed for as long as civilization has exited. Leaders and followers, kings and peasants, the wealthy and the poor, etc. As animals, it's in the nature of some of us to desire a greater share of resources and luxury at the cost of depriving others from having the same.

    An article repeating the notion of people with specific skin tones are part of a privileged class isn't the problem, it's just a symptom of the problem. The problem is the bigots who put that into practice, singling out and causing problems for people with specific tones while providing benefits to those with other specific tones. Getting rid of public acknowledgement about class disparity isn't going to get rid of class disparity, it's just going to get rid of discussion about class disparity. The racists will still be there, being racist.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago

    Getting rid of public acknowledgement about class disparity isn’t going to get rid of class disparity,

    that article isn't recognizing class disparity, though. it's perpetuating and normalizing it. and yes, the people that are bigots are absolutely also part of the problem. the media is complicit in that, though, including that article.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    You're completely right. All this does is fuel more racism and elitism. Unfortunately it is the reality we currently live in. Many people who are MAGA absolutely believe blonde hair blue eyed white people are true Americans and are safe. Pointing out these facts tells them that they're next and that all of this is wrong. Some people won't realize their mistakes until it happens to them personally. A white woman with blonde hair hits home for many of them and could be a wakeup call.

    Again I want to say that I DO NOT agree with bringing up this information. I do not believe it should be relevant at all. It is just unfortunate that this is the reality we are living in and I believe we do need to be the change we want to see by not bringing this information up ourselves.

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  • [–] 58 points 11 months ago (11 children)

    I hope she sues the fuck out of them.

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  • [–] 22 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

    I hope someone hunts down her assailants one by one, tortures them psychologically, makes them suffer physically and broadcasts it all as a warning to other fascist fuckwits before delivering upon them the fate all Nazis deserve.

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  • [+] 25 points 11 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 25 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    From an outsider looking in, it sounds like more reason to sue or to run to the media. Otherwise, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy

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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    She literally can't, ICE agents are federal agents which means they have civil immunity from lawsuits that are a direct result of their duties. Unless they're doing something that a reasonable person would understand to be a breach of the law. That said the federal courts seem to use Donald Trump's circumstantial definition of a reasonable person and only his. So fat chance there's a legal solution to this.

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago

    I feel very reasonably that warrantless searches and seizures while not in uniform and face coverings and no badges IS A BREACH OF THE LAW!!!!

    Not to even mention all the countless people that have been disappeared or deported to God knows where with no information given to their families or anything. Just poof gone. No jury, no trial, no proof they did anything wrong, no positive ID they are even who they are. None of it.

    Please explain how any of that could possibly be legal and how any reasonable person wouldn't consider it evil and terrible and utterly terrifying and dystopian?

    How is everyone NOT upset at how awful this all is?

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    [–] 47 points 11 months ago

    These ICE agents deserve the worst possible sentence. Especially as they caused many forced disappearances, which are crimes against humanity.

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  • [–] 36 points 11 months ago

    She is visible white and 👱 blond, a medical worker, speaks with no accent.

    She was eventually let go.

    The first one is why the second one happened.

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  • [–] 36 points 11 months ago

    Jail. For all these ICE assholes and everyone above them.

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  • [–] 29 points 11 months ago

    Prison sentences for ICE agents who participate. There is no excuse.

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  • [–] 54 points 11 months ago

    Had to check the date on the article because this is not the first woman in scrubs on her way to work being yanked out of a car while telling ICE that she is a citizen.

    We live in a dystopian hell and for some reason we keep acting like it’s all fine.

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