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[–] 163 points 4 weeks ago (24 children)

Lol, we have been since the settlers landed.

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  • [–] 46 points 4 weeks ago (12 children)
  • [–] 3 points 4 weeks ago

    Many of us are frankly better. Its par for the course these days for the entire nation to be judged by the behavior of its worst, and if challenged, people will say if we don’t like it we should be in the streets protesting violently. But it’s a lot of armchair quarterbacking IMO and I try not to let it bother me. We’re donating and volunteering to support a blue wave in the midterms. If this doesn’t impress Europeans on Lemmy I have no shits to give.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 weeks ago (7 children)

    Not enough to do anything about it though, it seems.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 weeks ago* (3 children)

    I'm trying man. I vote, I volunteer, I protest, I work my ass off to educate myself and others around me. I'm careful about how I spend my time, attention and money and support people and causes I see as useful. I train, practice and prepare for if and when things get violent. I work with others in my community to make myself and those around me more resilient. I see hateful signs and stickers and I take them down and actively confront hateful dipshits around me.

    So what do you suggest I do more? And would you do that yourself?

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  • [–] 5 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    In a just world that would be more than enough. Sadly Trump's America isn't just anymore. It's extreme. What it sounds like to me is you're preparing for war, while i Trump is actively waging war.

    Would I do more than you are now? No. But I have much to lose and people who depend on me and I can't actively resist. Were I to find myself with inoperable cancer, or at my end, family deported etc, I'm not sure with anything to lose I could say I'd be inactive. That's what most surprises me about Americans now, is that there's so few people willing to go to the extremes when they have nothing to lose. It boggles my mind actually.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    I see. So you are advocating that others do something you yourself aren't willing to do. That's kind of the problem, you aren't the only one who "has anything to lose". Everyone has something to lose and it's incredibly difficult to do what I think you're getting at. Yeah most people aren't doing even the bare fucking minimum but everyone from the outside looking is like "why aren't they picking up guns and just shooting?".

    Well there's some very simple and some very complicated reasons for that. Most people aren't psychopaths or murderers until things are bad enough and they are affected directly and even then people have to get pushed pretty far.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 weeks ago

    I'm not American and I'm not visiting until I'm sure it's no longer fascist. America is not my responsibility. It's the responsibility of Americans, and I don't see anything responsible happening down south at all.

    There must be millions of citizens affected by Trump policies now, and there's been two sad assassination attempts only. That's what I'm getting at. Where's the disgruntled ex military guy, or the no more Medicare guy? They're all absent. I'm not asking family men and women to get results.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    I wish I knew how and what to do. Born into a society with unions rapidly declining in the 80s and 90s. That is where a lot of front end action starts to take place, and the U.S. doesn't have nearly the same union presence it did 40-50 years ago. It's a 2 party system, and both parties suck. The status quo here has been dismantling people's collective ability to organize, for generations at this point. Whether or not anyone will admit it, they are scared and subjected to enough propaganda on a daily basis to be coerced into being anti-union.

    The brick by brick wall built between citizens and their own well being is astonishing. 9/11 was middle school for me so a lot of the bricks were observed in my lifetime.

    The most well organized militias happen to be aligned with the current administration, which is baffling for any number of reasons, but not trying to deep dive that.

    I think it would take a large group of our politicians to admit we got way off track, issue formal aplogies to friends, neighbors, and allies. Then request formal 3rd party help. At this point, short of that happening I truly do believe the US will implode on itself within the next 50 years.

    Executive action needs to be removed or reworked entirely. Term limits across all governing bodies, Supreme Court, senate, house, all of them need an expiration date and term limits. For the judicial I would go as far as to say they are selected at random from pools of high level judges. What we have now is just a collective of leeches.

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  • [–] 6 points 4 weeks ago*

    I hear what you say, growing up in similar environments. Humans have always been oppressed by other humans when they're allowed to. The only reason we ever had freedom is because we bled and fought for it. America will need to bleed for this to be solved. Trump is ready to be violent and oppressive. The people need to be that back, but in much greater numbers to match and overwhelm.

    What you say can be avoided, but it needs millions marching with guillotines to get back on track and avoid. There will be no peaceful transfer of power, and I think we can all see that.

    I wish it were different. I truly do.

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  • [–] 22 points 4 weeks ago (9 children)

    If any society from more than 60 years ago doesn't seem barbaric, it means society hasn't progressed and shit is fucked up.

    Even oldschool public executions is tame compared to this though, because it'll be live streamed globally and recorded.

    When you look at shit happening today and it's 1,000 times worse than a century ago, it's fucking noteworthy.

    Stop acting like this shit isn't a huge deal and it's always been like this.

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  • [–] 11 points 4 weeks ago (4 children)

    The Vietnam war was less than 60 years ago. Plus all of the wars in the middle east, our torture black sites, overthrowing democracies for profit, etc.

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  • [–] 6 points 4 weeks ago* (2 children)

    ...

    You think it's a clock and is only real after 60 years?

    Progress is a constant thing. It's pushing a cart up hill. If youre not further up the hill every step, it's not progress.

    60 years, 60 months, 60 days, 60 minutes...

    The length of time doesn't matter, just that progress happens.

    Every well adjusted person should have a shit ton of regrets, because they keep progressing as a human and find prior behavior unacceptable. That's the same for a nation.

    Do you legitimately not understand that?

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  • [–] 7 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    What is the progress tho? US has been genociding an entire people for the past 3 years. It is as fucked in the head as it ever was.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago)

    What is the progress tho?

    There hasn't been any...

    From the early 90s to 2025 the neoliberals controlled the DNC. They kept moving right, so Republicans did the same to differentiate.

    We finally have a non biased DNC again (Obama just ignored it, or wed have gotten in in 2009 and shit never would have gotten this bad)

    That means a neoliberal won't win the next presidential primary, because they could never win a fair primary. It took Hillary hiding behind Bill's charisma to get them the DNC in the first place.

    But all of that was orchestrated by the wealthy to stop progress. They just plan on generational timelines.

    US has been genociding an entire people for the past 3 years.

    Gaza? The government has been enabling it, but acting like it's already America commiting a genocide, just means when/if our government crosses that line, people are numb to it.

    That's a widely used propaganda technique, and trump himself does it all the time. Everytime he says "we may do that" is so some people get outraged early, and that prevents people from getting outraged at the same time.

    Like, I fully understand your intent and that you think you're helping, but you're only helping the oligarchs when you blur lines like this.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 weeks ago

    I think that there's a difference between being barbaric while trying to appear civilized and being barbaric and proud of it. Both are bad, the latter is worse.

    If you can't see the difference, from an ethical standpoint, between livestreaming an execution and keeping it away from the eyes of the general population, you're a bit of a sociopath.

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  • [–] 110 points 4 weeks ago (7 children)

    You are a barbaric nation, livestreamed or not. You still have the death penalty for starters, and every school shooting is met with thoughts and prayers and nothing else.

    You've always been this way and it's taken a monster shining a torch on it to show you. And your plan is just to get rid of the monster, as if that makes it all OK again...

    💯 1
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  • [–] 8 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    30% barbaric. 30% not barbaric. 40% undecided.

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  • [+] -23 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    got a loicense for that opinion, mate?

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  • [+] -8 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    Yeah, the U.S. sucks but people from the U.K. can shut the fuck up about it.

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  • [–] 9 points 4 weeks ago*

    American here. People from everywhere and anywhere can say whatever they want about the US. If that makes you feel bad, you can log off and not read the comments.

    I love a lot of things about this country, I work hard and am actively working towards trying to make the America around me less shitty. But the comments and criticisms on America and the people that live here and who is in power are valid. Don't like it, fine and you may fuck off and go do something productive.

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  • [–] 50 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    Not the unprovoked bombing of a school?

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  • [–] 38 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    January 6th?

    Minab school attack, Iran, killing 156 people including 120 children.

    Federal immigration agents have shot at least 25 people, killing 9 (including US citizens Renee Good.

    The 1985 bombing of a neighborhood in Philadelphia by police.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_MOVE_bombing

    The 1968 Chicago police riot.
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2018/aug/19/the-whole-world-is-watching-chicago-police-riot-vietnam-war-regan

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  • [–] 31 points 4 weeks ago

    Sorry you already are

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  • [–] 31 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    The fuck you mean "if"?!

    Rest of the world's got news for you folks.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 weeks ago

    The people that I've unfortunately talked to that either support or don't condone it do not care that this is "barbaric". They condone violence, and they want more of it.

    You cannot shame or reason with these people. American religious conservatism is a cancer and you cannot reason with or shame with a cancer.

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  • [–] 25 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    Hegseth should get life in prison. What an arrogant twat he is.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    He's a traitor and there is a punishment for treason that is spelled out clearly so everyone knows. That's what he deserves.

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  • No. Prison isn't for punishment. It's for corrections. You can't correct someone by punishment.

    He's a sick man that needs to he separated by society and put in a faculty with the best therapy until he's able to return to society without harming others. Depending on how far gone he is, that could be years to life.

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  • [+] 23 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    The people in power have nothing to gain from stopping it. The people who are NOT in power have everything to gain from stopping it- but the cowards choose not to.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 weeks ago

    but the cowards choose not to.

    While there are definitely vast amounts of cowards, do bare in mind that propaganda (i.e. turning on the tv in that country) and isolation (union-busting and other anti-organizational tactics) make average Joe feel like they can't change anything by themselves.

    Which is true, bust most muricans don't realize they can achieve quite a bit if they organize.
    Of course they'd have to care about their neighbors and get off their obese individualists asses first...

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  • [–] 45 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    You already are a barbarian nation for still having capital punishment in the first place.

    This new development would just put you a few notches farther away from civilization.

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  • [–] 21 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    We've been a barbaric nation for a while. It's just on full display now. This display of violence changes nothing.

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  • [–] 17 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)
  • [–] 17 points 4 weeks ago (8 children)

    the US has streamed several executions already. they just happened to be extrajudicial carried out by police/ICE

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  • [–] 8 points 4 weeks ago (7 children)

    Those were streamed incidentally, not officially.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 weeks ago (6 children)

    When police body cameras are always on and you execute someone, you're not streaming it "accidentally". You know you have a camera on your body while you murder someone and choose to do it anyway.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    This is a really odd argument that I can't understand, there is a categorical difference between an official broadcast of a scheduled execution and the video from a police body camera being released following the police killing someone. I don't understand how you can say they are the same thing, whether the cop remembers in the moment they have a camera on is irrelevant. Capturing an incident as part of routine recording and then releasing that video after the fact is not at all like scheduling an execution and broadcasting it live for the world to watch.

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  • [–] -1 points 4 weeks ago* (1 child)

    I don’t understand how you can say they are the same thing

    The people doing the killing knows the cameras are on, watching their actions. And they go ahead and kill someone anyway.

    Just because the US justice system hides tax payer paid public servants from concealing their lawfully required body cam footage is a US justice problem. But the cops know they're being recorded at all times and they'll kill an unarmed civilian anyway.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 weeks ago

    I am not following. From my perspective, the people doing the killing are in very different circumstances and the purpose of the cameras are completely different. The message being sent with an execution being conducted like this seems completely different than the message being sent when there is a release of bodycam footage showing police killing someone.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Police body cameras don't stream. It is a closed system.

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  • [–] 17 points 4 weeks ago

    The country was literally built on genocide and slavery. OP, Remove the "if" and replace the comma with a period.

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  • [–] 16 points 4 weeks ago (12 children)

    I wonder how much of this is motivated by his name being Hasan lol like obviously there's more to it but they're going so hard on Piker rn that executing a dude named Hasan on live television feels particularly motivated.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 weeks ago (11 children)

    Hasan Piker fans really need to make everything about him...

    They want to label this as a traitous attack and normalize public (live streamed) executions for anyone they consider a traitor, which means against this administration.

    It is very important for serious reasons, and not because a twitch streaming nepo baby who go his start interning for his uncle podcast named after people who committed the Armenian genocide, happens to have the same last name.

    If you give a shit, stop watching streamers and actually learn about politics.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 weeks ago (4 children)

    Hasan Piker fans really need to make everything about him...

    Not a fan, and his fans aren't the ones making everything about him right now.

    I think its kinda disingenuous to act like it has nothing to do with it. These are the same people who feel the need to emphasize "Hussein" being Obama's middle name because racism.

    Hasan is popular. His politics are growing in popularity with the public. The right wing is ginning up hate against him and people like him. His name being Hasan is quite important when you're enflaming the racists.

    a twitch streaming nepo baby who go his start interning for his uncle podcast named after people who committed the Armenian genocide,

    Ok which one of us is obsessed with Hasan?...and how is this relevant?

    If you give a shit, stop watching streamers and actually learn about politics.

    Again, I think you're mad at someone who isn't even here right now. Please stop assuming you know me. It kinda just seems like you're a terminally online leftie who hates Hasan or something. Go outside lol

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  • [–] -1 points 4 weeks ago (3 children)

    He was active duty military that opened fire on other active duty military on a military base...

    Not that the last name is common with a fucking streamer

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  • [–] 7 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

    "like obviously there's more to it"

    Hey pal, 👆 that's me in my original comment beating you to the punch on this. You can intentionally miss the point all you want but you're just shadowboxing.

    We get it, you hate Hasan. Very brave.

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  • [–] 0 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    We get it, you hate Hasan. Very brave.

    Anyone else ever notice how Piker and trump supporters sound alike after 3 replies?

    Like, even your "his popular" excuse, substitute the names and I'd bet most people couldn't tell which person was being defended...

    It's crazy so many people can't see the same fucking grift.

    Like, you legitimately can't look at your last replies and see the similarities?

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  • [–] 9 points 4 weeks ago (5 children)

    If you give a shit, stop watching streamers and actually learn about politics.

    People do grow and change. I'm a pretty old fart and Hasan Piker seems to me to be a generational talent. His knowledge of politics and political theory is pretty deep. Don't hate just because of his platform of choice. He's trying to bring class awareness and political education to the younger generation and doing a pretty good job of it.

    So, just because he's a streamer and related to Cenk(he has no control over who his family is), it does not mean he isn't doing good and serious work.

    It's almost as if you've never watched any of his youtube videos, which are edited for time and relevance.

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  • [–] -1 points 4 weeks ago (4 children)

    Hasan Piker seems to me to be a generational talent

    No, he was the nepo nephew of The Young Turks founder...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_genocide

    A media organization literally named after people who overthrew their government to commit a genocide....

    His uncle put him on air, then bankrolled him into the early days of twitch.

    He is not grassroots, he did not got popular because of talent or political opinions.

    He is an outrage machine and rather than complain about literal fascists running our country and supporting genocides worldwide, he uses his platform to make people not want to vote for the literal only option in our political system

    At best he's a narcissist that just wants views, at worst he's intentionally trying to prevent progress.

    Fucking think for yourself and stop repeating twitch streamers.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 weeks ago

    I guess I don't understand why the name Young Turks is supposed to be automatically disqualifying or something? Ana is Armenian herself. If that was so disqualifying, you'd think she would be noping out or calling for a name change?

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    So ad homs are a reason why he's not a generational talent? Are you a Zionist or something?

    at worst he’s intentionally trying to prevent progress.

    Yeah that's unhinged. He wants health care for all, a living wage at least, equal rights, an end to American war mongering, green energy, etc...

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Trump also says he wants to help people...

    If someone (correctly) pointed out he's just grifting, would you label that an "ad hom" and say that we have to take him at 100% sincerity?

    Because that wouldn't make any logical sense. When someone shows you who they are repeatedly, no one else is going to be able to pull your head out of the sand.

    Just please don't get manipulated into not voting in the Dem primaries, there's literally no reason not to it doesn't obligated you to vote in the general, but it stops neoliberals and actually helps progressives.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago

    I vote in every election. Hasan consistently advocates for progressive policies and boosts awareness of progressive/democratic socialist candidates. So he walks the walk.

    The Hasan hate is really wierd.

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  • [–] 15 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    We passed the “barbaric” marker a long time ago.

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  • [–] 14 points 4 weeks ago (6 children)

    The United States is turning into the very same countries we love to bomb for doing such things.

    You want to know what a Christian Nation looks like? Well, here you go.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 weeks ago* (1 child)

    To be fair the veneer of a country that has been built on genocide (even if not entirely completed) and slavery hasn't been too thick to begin. I am not throwing stones though, coming from Austria. But at least here more people are aware that the own history hasn't been so glorious after all.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (2 children)

    We don't bomb countries for doing such things, or we'd be bombing Saudi Arabia and Israel. We give military support to countries that do such things, so long as the spice flows, and we bomb countries where the spice doesn't flow, even if they don't do those sorts of things.

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  • [–] 28 points 4 weeks ago

    We absolutely are. America isn't humane.

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  • [+] 37 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)
  • [–] 13 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)

    I always thought their oath of allegiance, done every day in school, sounded so much like something kids in North Korea would be forced to do.

    This is just another thing to add to the pile.

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  • [–] 11 points 4 weeks ago

    The fuckheads in office raided a sitting Democratic rep's house for immigration papers from three fucking years ago! The brown shirts have thrown legal citizens in concentration camps, they've kidnapped people and have done so with zero consequences. They are going to sell tickets to EXECUTE someone on live tv (who I might add is in a wheelchair). We are far passed barbaric.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 weeks ago

    It just means mask has slipped.

    White phosphorus and cluster bombs are still used by the US.

    Meanwhile the list of fuckery is so long it's hard to pick a starting point.

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  • [–] 10 points 4 weeks ago (1 child)
  • [–] 10 points 4 weeks ago

    Lmao even JD Vance was like "ehhh I dunno we'll see."

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  • [–] 9 points 4 weeks ago

    Too late, we already have a history of selling merchandise for public lynchings

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  • [–] 8 points 4 weeks ago

    I got some bad news for you.........

    ...

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