For real, that's what triage is for. A lot of people go to the hospital for something they think is serious but is actually minor. My ex started getting panic attacks at one point, and after taking him to the ER for like the third time and waiting like 2 hours he calmed down and we went home instead. People who are actually bleeding out or whatever will be seen first.

Correct. Moreover many provinces have seen flagrant de-funding and de-prioritization of health care as right wing grifters attempt to purposefully erode public healthcare in a bid to prop up private care. This has led to availability shortages which in turn cause more people to seek ER assistance than they otherwise would, and hence the long wait times.

My hope is we collectively pull our heads out of our asses and see how fucked things are in the US and reverse course.

Your comment would imply that most Americans are smart enough to understand the concept of triage.

our system here in Lake Statesiaville River is to send you down shit creek. some of us are lucky enough to get the family turding stick or a paddle.

Godamn I envy this

Dead* not death,

Death is like the subject of dead/dying, whereas dead is a state that things can be if that makes sense, as I type this I'm realizing I'm still a little drunk, excuse me

I think, by this point, most Americans who are willing to listen to reason know that emergency medicine is 1000000x better in basically every other developed country, and even in many less developed countries. It can be a country where the entire medical system is publicly funded, like the UK. Or it can be one where it's all privately funded but insurance is mandatory and the lowest-cost plans are controlled and subsidized by the government like in Switzerland.

But, what's hard to convey is how much freedom and peace of mind this all gives you. So many Americans are locked into a specific job because it has good health insurance, or because if they switched jobs they'd have to find new health insurance while having a pre-existing health condition. Being unemployed is terrifying because your health insurance is tied to your job. And, even if you have insurance, there's the fear that they won't honour a claim or will weasel out of a payment.

Even if someone has good insurance and isn't afraid of losing it, there's all the bureaucracy. There's in-network doctors and out-of-network doctors. There's co-pays. There's trying to decide which spouse goes on the other's health plan. There's filing forms. There's even sometimes stuff like wondering if the doctor is prescribing something because it helps with their bottom line, or if they genuinely think that you need it.

Then there's the billing. If you have good insurance you might never actually have to pay anything other than a nominal co-pay, but you often can't escape the billing paperwork. At best that's just time consuming and annoying. At worst it's a constant source of terror and stress. This is especially true with serious health issues that are expensive to treat, and where your time, energy and effort should really be about getting well.

I'm in Canada but I've lived in the US, and I hated every second of their health care system, despite having effectively a Rolls Royce insurance plan. In Canada can be fired, quit my job, retire, join a start-up, or do anything I want and my health insurance is completely unaffected. If I had a spouse, they'd be on the same plan, there's not second spent thinking about strategizing about that, or about anything else. There are no co-pays. There are no forms to fill out. I never worry about a doctor upselling me on something I don't need. Behind the scenes doctors still bill for their work, someone pays for the medicine, the hand sanitizer, the bedding, the wheelchairs, and everything you might see in a hospital, but the patient (and their family) never sees any money change hands, it's just so much more simple that way.

Oh, and I just forgot another example of where the US system fails in ways that Americans probably wouldn't notice: airborne illnesses. In most countries, people get flu shots. If they feel sick they have sick leave, and if they want to see a doctor they can. If you're on public transit in Switzerland you don't often see someone coughing or sneezing because if they're not feeling well they're not out in public. In Japan they take that even further and people put on masks when they feel like they might be coming down with something so that they don't spread it. In the US, a lot of people don't have healthcare coverage. They can't see a doctor if they're feeling ill. They expect to be charged for vaccinations and maybe flu shots. So, if you're on public transit in the states, you're more likely to be sharing a cabin with people who are coughing or sneezing or sniffling because they can't get it looked at, and they can't afford to miss work (and there are no guaranteed sick days).

This made the pandemic so much worse in the US. Even before you throw in the anti-vaxx misinformation and "the gubmint can't control my body" idiocy, you still have people who probably have COVID out in public spreading it around because they can't miss work, and don't believe they can get tested or treated for free.

Anyhow, I hope that the more obvious benefits of socialized medicine, like being treated for free no matter what are becoming more clear to Americans. But, really, they should understand that that's just the big, obvious thing. The massive social and mental health drag their system puts on their entire society is something that's hard to appreciate if you haven't lived in both systems and felt how different they are.

It’s called triage. We do the exact same thing in the usa. And that’s the case whether you have insurance or not. They don’t even know if you have insurance at this step of it, to be honest.

Oh yea, but in the states is going to cost you a car or 5.

necessito aprender espanyol. i gotta move there if the medicine works on that fee structure

They are educated in triage, which is the only sensible way to handle emergency responses. A man with a sore throat should never take priority over a kid with a broken arm.

People think they are paying for medical attention, but what they are really paying for is their minor problems being taken more seriously than major problems that poorer people have.

Private for-profit healthcare, even in conjunction with public healthcare, is a blight upon humanity contradicting everything modern medicine stands for.

This was once the case in the US prior to EMTALA laws being introduced in 1986. Which is pretty dystopian, even if it's not the case today.

It wasn't so much the insurance company though. It was private hospitals dumping uninsured patients into public ones without stabilizing care even if they were actively dying because they didn't want to absorb the cost. Essentially pure evil / end stage capitalism.

I went to the ER in the US for an infected gallbladder full of stones, it was so bad I had to be hospitalized for almost a week. I was in the ER waiting room in the fetal position for literally hours after a nurse took my vitals before a doctor saw me, there were a couple other people in the waiting room. I nearly died. Over $20k bill after insurance.

I've also gone to the same ER with relatively mild UTI, I peed blood and fainted from the sight but otherwise didn't really need the ER. They saw me immediately, and it was very busy.

Triage is a thing, whether they do it properly is another thing.

you are probably there for a runny nose or something equally silly.

It's silly to go to the ER for a runny nose if you have better options, like a family doctor with whom you can get appointments within a few days. Sadly, a lot of Americans don't have health care coverage and have to go to the ER for "silly" things because they don't have other options.

Very much this.

I've had seven heart attacks.

When I go in with heart attack symptoms, which I've had to do a handful of times (that it turned out not to be a heart attack, I mean) - I don't like going in there and them getting me back quickly. It means things are potentially bad. heh.

I understand that nobody likes waiting, and i've waited before and it sucks. But it sucks less than needing to be taken back quickly, really.

Exactly my brother came in with a cut bleeding all over the ER, he needed like 12 stitches. They took him right away. All he remember from that day(he was pretty out of it) was some woman complaining that she been waiting for hour why his getting to go first.

While his blood spilling out on floor she had the gull to say that.

Same with chest pain. If you go to the ER complaining of chest pain most times they take you straight back. Happen to me was sick told my boss chest was hurting he suggested hospital cause you know heart attack. Er by house so went they wisk me straight back.

Funny not funny story about that visit. One thankfully no heart attack. But they did find a mass on my lungs ( lucky turn out to be acid reflux due to a cough I had) anyway when he sees this he says. "Might be cancer but I don't know. " scare the shit out of me. I just replied "well if you don't know don't say that. "

They scheduled me a specialist but it was a 2 month wait, by time they saw me the mass was gone. That doctor figured it was the acid reflux got in there. Good news is got on meds for that and no more acid reflux for me.

I think wait times were better. And now they're terrible, but what you say plays a big role. And as such, we've seen urgent care businesses (hate saying that) explode. There's one every mile where I live, including pediatric urgent care. And I'm not complaining. I'll complain maybe about costs, but the idea of this stepped-down, non-emergent care, is a great way to deal with the problem.

Now, make it free* (except I pay taxes already so just use those).

People go to ER or get a prescription here sometimes. Then complain about the wait 😭😭😭

Canadian here its not silly, you can wait 12+ hours for very serious conditions (as I have once, I realize this is anecdotal).

This doesn't mean its worse than in the states. I understand on average we are doing better healthcare wise than the states (interms of cost and mortality). However for the well insured in the states I believe the care is better.

Yet another issue with being so close to the states our health care suffers because our corrupt politicians see your system and drag us closer to it. You all also attract doctors away from us.

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.

Lots of people don’t understand that it isnt a deli counter where you take a number and are called in order.

Conservatives tend to be stupid and ignorant, yes.

That's all very, very dependent on what kind of appointment you're trying to get.

Want to see my GP/family doctor? 1-2 days, same day if it's an emergency.

ENT? Month or two at most usually, unless it's a super busy time for them. May need to go to one in another city of course.

Want to see a dermatologist? About a year, 2 at most.

Want to see a psychiatrist within the national healthcare system? No.

As a Canadian, that's about right. If you don't have an immediate problem but go to the ER, it can be brutal. I've waited multiple hours in the ER before and my mom was there once with my uncle for I think longer than 12 hours.

However, if you do have an actual emergency then things are completely different. You get in instantly, you are treated extremely well and the medical practitioners you see will stop at nothing to help you. When there is no threat of cost, they do everything in their power to save you.

They all “know a Canadian” who comes to the US because healthcare is better.

Uh okay. Sure buddy.

Certain things like non-emergency (but important) surgeries could take longer to schedule in Canada.

Yeah, hip replacements and that sort of thing have a months-long or even years-long waiting list. But, most people waiting for those things can still live pretty much normal lives. IMO the wait is too long. But, people can get by walking with a limp until their turn comes up.

If the trade-off to get treated more quickly for that sort of thing is to accept the for-profit medical system of the USA, there are virtually no Canadians who would accept that deal.

Here the urgent clinics charge you $500 to tell you to go to the ER.

i dunno. last time i was waiting 12 hours in the triage area, my surgeon burst through the doors yelling at people for making me wait because he had a bed for me eleven hours ago. sometimes there's a paperwork fuckup.

What a shitty take. Where do the libruls git owned in this scenario?

in a&e

I've never understood why Brits feel the need to add "accident" to emergency. Are there people who are waiting there because they've had an accident but there's no emergency?

We still have some private medicine. The existence of the NHS keeps their prices and practices in check. It’s no longer “pay or die” instead its “pay for convenience”.

This is how it may start. But, be careful because as more people start using the private option, the public option starts getting starved for funds, and then bit by bit there is no public option.

They don't care. They just believe they have enough money to get priority in a for-profit system, at the expense of those who have less money but actually need urgent care.

Yeah but like... Where do you live I guess

Edit (clarification):

It's just, unless you include that information, how do we know which one you're saying is fine?

There are unfortunately a bunch of right wing idiots in canada who absolutely are :(

Some people are, but universal Healthcare is almost universally accepted in Canada.

So they debate goes around whether there should be a two tiered system with private hospitals/clinics so rich people can skip the queue for surgeries, etc.

They’ll have our system soon enough, rural areas tend to be conservative and anti government because they care about themselves and family and don’t want to get taxed to pay for others

And the reason for that is the aggressive privatization efforts done over decades by conservatives and many liberals.

My wife found a GP for the family, and saw the doctor every time, because she has a few chronic issues. I always saw the NP, because all I ever get is a sinus infection or something every year or so. We went to that doctor for five years before I ever actually met the doctor.