Stop signs in France say “STOP” but in Quebec they say “ARRÊT”
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Okay, (funny) story time.
I'm French and live in France. Many years ago I met a girl from Quebec (Chicoutimi), and in our discussion she told me that when she arrived in France, her first night the heating was off in her flat and it was very cold. She tried to sleep in what she referred to as her "slip" (French for panties), but even though it was a Canadian slip that was very warm that she used in her cabin in Northern Canada, she was too cold to sleep.
After a good 5 minutes of thinking "that story doesn't make sense, if she's hitting on me it's too obvious and weird", she saw my confusion and asked me if I knew what she meant by "slip" (panties in French).
It turns out she was referring to her sleep, short for sleeping bag in English. In French we use the French word "sac de couchage". The pronunciations are identical.
So both French and Québécois has a lot of borrowed word, just not the same ones.
Love the idea of extra warm Canadian panties
Ha I enjoyed that tale. What happened after?
We didn't date but became friends. One or two years after we met, with a group of friends we went to Quebec with her and stayed at her family cabin that was very far north of Chicoutimi, near a small lake, and it was breathtaking.
There was another confusion though. She referred to going on the lake on the "ponton" (pier in French from the metropole). But we saw the lake and there was no pier on it. She was in fact referring to the kind of boat they have to chill on the lake. It was more some kind of draft : square, flat, with a lot of room to chill and no focus on going un a particular direction, which makes sense. It looks more like a pier than a boat, it was just not on the water when she talked about it.
Ah interesting. I think that’s what we call a “pontoon” which is just a floating…platform, that you move with an oar. Well, the barrel things under it keeping it afloat are the pontoons.
Languages. Funny things.
Je suis du sud du Québec et je l'aurais pas compris. J'ai jamais entendu sleep de ma vie pour désigner un sac de couchage.
Je suis du sud du Québec et j'ai toujours entendu ça... C'est pas juste au Saguenay, en tout cas.
Slip from slipinne bague. Did you at some point offer her to meet your "gosses"
So both French and Québécois
I like how you think your language is "French" and hers isn't.
Fair point I guess I should have said French from France or from the metropole? Pretty sure the term dialect can't be applied here.
In France nowadays French is a relatively homogeneous because of radio and TV, but when I was a child (40 years ago) old people in the alp valley I grew up in still used the local dialect, and it is way more difficult to understand to other French than Québécois is. It's closer to modern Italian but still far from it.
It's pretty dead now. I only know a few sentences and child songs.
Even with radio and TV, and easier travel, there are still a lot of interesting dialects, maybe not within France itself, but Belgian French is different, so is Swiss French. Sub-Saharan African French is really interesting because it has a vocabulary that's more similar to France French, but some of the pronunciation is more different than Quebecois French. And then there's Haiti where they speak a Creole that has a lot of French-sounding words in it, but can't really be understood by French speakers.
When I played Cyberpunk 2077 and realized the voodoo boys spoke creole I was totally hyped and really wanted to join them. As the missions with them are early in the game I imagined there was a possibility to choose a gang (you can't). Because of that every time they tried to get rid of me, and you are really disposable to them, I always choose dialog lines to play it down, saying it was okay.
That made me roleplay the most naïve and dumb person of the world in a universe that really don't call for that.
Even if you're trying to go for something that the devs didn't intend to be possible, those are still memorable moments in games. I like it best when devs allow for something unusual like that, but even if they don't, a game that feels immersive enough that that might be possible is fun.
That must have been a challenge to dub. In the original Bart is speaking English, not Quebecois French. So, when Bart is speaking Quebecois French he must have really leaned into the accent to make it believable that the policeman didn't understand.
Here's the original for comparison:
https://youtu.be/EUSGPubsxcM?t=93
It's funny because in the original the policeman is the only character in the scene with a decent French accent. The two criminals sound absolutely horrible.
Great, now I'm imagining a warm French slip.
Also, they dub The Simpsons into French separately in France and Canada, and while the European French dub is content to have Homer crave «les donuts», the Québécois dub gives no quarter to creeping Anglo-Americanisation, replacing them with a French pastry
So they actually spell it "donut" and not "doughnut"?
Not a big fan of hyper-nationalist culture policing. I like the malleability of American English, because we can just make shit up, and the points don't matter!
Common sense:
Surely no one could be more up their own ass about being French than the French.
Quebec, for some reason:
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Did you mean for this to resemble a polar bear up its own ass, or was that just lucky coincidence? Either way, it's a perfect use of the meme.
I think we should translate all the fast food place names to the local language :3 this will help nobody or serve any purpose
In France, they call it le Macdoh
But how do you order a quarter pounder?
I've traveled the world and can highly recommend the Giardino degli Ulivi in downtown Tuscany. Best grissini I've ever had.
You joke, but I had a bunch of (northern) Italians recommend Pizza Hut to me. To be entirely fair, it was in Germany and it’s better there than in the USA, but it’s still not good pizza.
As someone who is within a ten minute walk from Québec, that's Québec!
It will make them sound ridiculous(er) and help all of our healths
And it is fin de semaine and not 'weekend', too.
Joyeux festin, not "happy meal".
Stationnement, not "parking".
Course à pied, not "du footing".
Magasinage, not "shopping".
Téléphone intelligent, not "smartphone".
And yet Quebecois will stop you in the street and say "t'as une smoke ?"
Du footing?
Téléphone intelligent, not "smartphone".
Ordiphone, actually but it comes from one of the most shittiest french administration
https://vitrinelinguistique.oqlf.gouv.qc.ca/fiche-gdt/fiche/8360216/telephone-intelligent
Looks like ordiphone is accepted, but I honestly never heard that. Everybody simply calls that a "téléphone" in Québec, and advertisements usually use "téléphone intelligent".
Yeah, I guess. I learnt it in a project subject during college, frow a teacher insisting that it's a bibliothèque and not a librairie for a .so
Bibliothèque is a library, librairie is a bookstore. Big difference. Bibliothèque can also refer to a bookshelf, depending on context. But you always pay for books in a librairie.
Duolingo only has Brazilian Portuguese
I hear you québécois in the comments, you have French words we dont have and I do think it's great. And when I watched your TV it seemed to be mostly French.
But when I listen to podcasts it's English words in every sentence.
Same is happening I France now, but we suck at English so it doesn't sound good. "Cette chanson est un ban-guhrr"
Also everybody started using "du coup" 10 years ago. Ainsi, donc, apres quoi, puis, car, puisque, etc... - > du coup
It's funny from afar, but not fun to be in. They have what essentially amounts to a language police that enforces absurd and IMO human rights infringing laws. They regularly land in the news for things like threatening to fine a restaurant for using the word "pasta" on their menus.
Nom shit There s a great documentary about it. https://youtu.be/M1p52z6XEmI
Human Rights infringing?!? Everything all right up there on your kilometer-high horse?
Having received warnings from the OQLF for stuff, they have always been courteous, patient and open to accommodations. Honestly, if you don't throw a hissy fit it always works out fine and any penalty is easily avoidable.
The unfortunate reality is they have to investigate every complaint even if it's spurious.
They also have cool guides on vocabulary for stuff you might only have english words for. People need to move on from 1976 lol.
The only people who stand to benefit slacking on enforcement are big American companies who want to save a tiny expense. The same who are pressuring us in current trade talks. So no, I don't accept this constant malicious framing of reasonable enforcement of the law.
a government body won't prosecute you if you don't throw a hissy fit about their human rights abuses. I never had problems with it, and they even have cool guides for you to avoid violations. We need to move on from that discussion
Yeah, no, that's not an argument. It doesn't change that the system is unacceptable.
And no, it's not just big American companies who are affected - in fact, they're affected the least. They have the deep pockets that small, local businesses don't have. And none of it changes the fact that the government has absolutely no fucking business telling anyone which languages they are and aren't allowed to speak.
You are quoting me having modified my words, so you are not engaging with this in good faith.
Signage laws are not human rights abuses.
The right to work in French is not a human right abuse.
Making a strawman of it doesn't change reality.
My rights as a Quebec anglophone have been better respected in the last 100 years than the rights of francophones in Ontario, Manitoba and New Brunswick. We should be proud of this heritage we built for ourselves in Quebec. Our cultural rights are legally protected.
Yes you are simping for American companies who have literally been pressuring the federal government for weeks/months/years to cave on every single language protection.
Small businesses have been, at worst, mildly inconvenienced in the last 50 years of signage laws existing. Society has been fine, apart from angryphones bitching now and then.
I was paraphrasing you. But OK, then we'll play by your rules:
Signage laws are not human rights abuses.
If they restrict what I'm allowed to write in which language, that's a restriction of my freedom of speech, which is a human right. Next.
The right to work in French is not a human right abuse.
Making a strawman of it doesn't change reality.
I never said it was. But ah, the accusations that are actually confessions. Next.
My rights as a Quebec anglophone have been better respected in the last 100 years than the rights of francophones in Ontario, Manitoba and New Brunswick
Hmm, weird, I don't recall laws forcing Francophones in Ontario to run their businesses in English, make their signage English, forcing them to go to English schools, and a whole range of other things.
Yes you are simping
Ah, another accusation that's actually a confession. Next.
Society has been fine, apart from angryphones bitching now and then.
Yeah, when a significant portion of the province's politics are "how can we further restrict what is allowed to be done in one language while using the excuse of protecting another language as a way to drown out any opposition", society is not fine.
-Commercial speech is not protected speech and is highly regulated in every democratic country.
-The right to work in French is the basis of why workplace language laws exist.
-Yeah actually, read your history. French schools were banned by those provinces at different times.
👍🏻
-Commercial speech is not protected speech and is highly regulated in every democratic country.
What a cop out. They regulate things like false advertising, not the words and the language you're allowed to put on your signs. False equivalency.
-The right to work in French is the basis of why workplace language laws exist.
That's like saying "the right for white people to work is the basis of why segregation laws exist". It's absolutely unnecessary and a sorry excuse for trampling on people's rights.
-Yeah actually, read your history. French schools were banned by those provinces at different times.
To be fair, I was thinking of more recent times, but fine, let's go back 100 years. Manitoba had restrictions on teaching French, but that's only an earlier part of the last hundred years. Regulation 17 in Ontario was repealed in 1927, so one of the last 100 years was affected. New Brunswick, on the contrary, even promoted french very strongly with a goal of becoming a bilingual province. So no, you can't say that the last 100 years were generally worse for Francophones in Canada than the present is for anglophones in Quebec. And even if it were the case, what's your point? "They suffered, so you have to suffer too"? What a pitiful argument. But it shows the hypocrisy fairly well: when it happens to Francophones in Canada: "bad, unacceptable repression", when it happens to anglophones in Quebec: "necessary measures to protect the French language". Give me a break.
-Its not a false equivalency. Its laws around displaying products accurately to the population, ie. must be in a sufficient amount of french so the majority of the Population can read it.
Btw, you can list any other language on signage, as long as french is also present and sufficiently prominent. Chinese restaurants have menus in chinese... but they double list the French items in a slightly larger font.
-Why is it similar to segregation in any way? English is permitted in the workplace. Workplaces under certain # are fully exempt and workplaces needing english/or other foreign languages have broad exceptions. How is anyone's right trampled? The laws prevent requiring english proficiency when it is not necessary. Requiring it would be exclusionary.
Try maintaining a job at companies in Toronto refusing to speak any english and see if you can argue a human rights abuse case for your subsequent dismissal.
-I'm sorry, but this is contemporary enough. If you are upset at law 101, it came about in a context were some of these laws had only begun to be reversed in the 1960s and only partially. They had been in effect for many decades by then and its impact on french spoken outside of Quebec has been dramatic. Manitoba's french demographic has been effectively erased. Ontario's was maintained by underground clandestine schools. New Brunswick's dialect was creolized.
Both Ontario and New Brunswick's school systems are systematically underfunded. Francophone communities are constantly lobbying to not get dismissed by chauvinistic governments, even today. Doug Ford and former Blaine Higgs were no friends to francophones.
Compare honestly the state of English hospitals and schools, including cegeps and universities to those in New Brunswick, Ontario and Manitoba for francophones. Compare the language used in all four provincial legislators. Quebec's english language institutions are amongst the safest and best protected in the entire country. Find me a more protected minority group in the Western World.
Its laws around displaying products accurately to the population, ie. must be in a sufficient amount of french so the majority of the Population can read it.
Give me a break. They're being displayed accurately even if they're in another language. And if, for instance, you have something in english in Montreal, or especially in one of the predominantly English boroughs in Montreal, then the majority of the population can read it. The majority of the population also very definitely knows what pasta refers to.
English is permitted in the workplace. Workplaces under certain # are fully exempt and workplaces needing english/or other foreign languages have broad exceptions.
Hmm, if certain workplaces are exempt, maybe it's not as simple as "English is permitted in the workspace"? Or maybe that statement is even flat out false?
Try maintaining a job at companies in Toronto refusing to speak any english and see if you can argue a human rights abuse case for your subsequent dismissal.
Again, false equivalency. We're talking about forcing workplaces to be in a certain language, not refusing to speak the language of a workplace.
Both Ontario and New Brunswick's school systems are systematically underfunded
Lol, I've seen the EMSB. Don't even get me started.
Find me a more protected minority group in the Western World.
The problem is: you talk your way around, find excuses for and misrepresent the transgressions against anglophones. You excuse restrictions on free expression with things like "there's a handbook to avoid writing the wrong thing", you try to indirectly excuse abuses against anglophones with "look how bad Francophones have it elsewhere", and you do mental gymnastics to explain how forbidding languages is somehow an anti-exclusionary practice, it's absurd. At this point, there's no point comparing since you don't even accept what is happening with anglophones for what it is.
Good god, it reminds me of arguing with fascists.
Its ok, when you catch your breath and think it over rationally, you'll understand you are the one misunderstanding and misrepresenting it. And like its not your fault. The Montreal Gazette has been stoking this hate for decades.
I gave you all the context you could possibly need. Now you just need to put yourself in the shoes of another person.
Related "fun" fact: Quebec is the most prolific user of the Notwithstanding Clause, which allows the Parliament of Canada or any province or territory thereof to "temporarily" override parts of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (essentially Canada's Bill of Rights). They know what they're doing.
I'm not sure why you're getting all the downvotes, you're absolutely right.
It's natural to have many enemies with a career as long as mine.
(I have no idea.)
With the trade war on, Quebec has been declared the good side. Whyever would you mention negative things about the good side? Are you on the bad side????
Downvote deployed, take that, evildoer!
-AverageLemming, apparently
I am legitimately curious what portion of the municipal budget is spent on having every fucking sign in two languages.
I am quite conflicted about it. On one hand, it's kind of hilarious. But it's also extremely tryhard and tedious.
It's not even that, signs have to be mainly in French. Bar a few small exceptions, the English has to take up significantly less space than the French. Their stop signs literally say "ARRÊT" instead of "STOP" because that would be too much English influence. It's incredibly fucking petty.

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