Karoline Leavitt, the White House press secretary, dismissed Trump’s comments in a statement, saying, “The Wall Street Journal should learn to take a joke, however, the President’s pardon power is absolute.”
It’s just a joke, bro! Unless…
Karoline Leavitt, the White House press secretary, dismissed Trump’s comments in a statement, saying, “The Wall Street Journal should learn to take a joke, however, the President’s pardon power is absolute.”
It’s just a joke, bro! Unless…
There is a pretty significant chance that Trump won't keep his word.
And that's if he doesn't just die before he has a chance to.
Generally speaking, you want to pardon your Capos because you don't want them ratting on you.
You say this as if trump thinks things through.
Hows that Iran situation going? Oh, he declaired absolute victory? How very odd, and also factually untrue.
If they’re pardoned they can’t hide behind the fifth, especially if he issues the blanket pardons like he’s threatening.
Might make for some interesting TV. And you KNOW those dumbfucks would then somehow screw up their testimony, subjecting them to perjury charges…
Yeah but on the other hand, if they are pardoned then the 5th doesn't apply to them and they can face charges for not answering questions.
I’d love it if the media would stop reporting that Trump doing the worst fucking thing imaginable is a “bombshell.”
But this is a bombshell, though? Would be the worst scandal of any other administration.
“Bombshell Report: Trump tells his staff no one will be getting a pardon.”
Now there’s a headline I didn’t see coming.
“bombs’ hell” created by US & Israeli unprovoked aerial bombing attacks in Middle East
Openly manipulating markets and now betting sites for personal gain. They have already embezzled billions. Crypto scams up the wazzo.
The grift knows no end.
They can't be pardoned if people get upset enough and remove them
A pardon doesn't magically suspend physics, that's for sure.
If impeachment goes to trial in the Senate and it looks like it might not go well for him, he will make sure everyone is pardoned before he is removed from office.
That would require the repubilcan party to have a spine, and they gave that up a decade ago to better lick trumps "boots"
What are the odds of people getting "upset enough" about this, but not about putting your shitter full of top secret documents and getting away with it scot-free?
The interesting thing about child rape, is that it activates the completely unhinged QAnon-esque people, who actually do commit violence with glee. Though I disagree with them on many things, we just happen to be aligned on "child rape=bad". That crime creates a visceral reaction that "stealing and selling state secrets" doesn't quite emit.
So I feel like Epstein is the one thing that could actually get through to many in MAGA cult.
Okay, but do QAnon folks associate child rape with Trump or his administration? A tiny majority maybe, but most are still mainlining the Kool-Aid.
Most Christians are vehemently opposed to many things approved of in the Bible, but it doesn't seem to bother them much.
So I feel like Epstein is the one thing that could actually get through to many in MAGA cult.
Too bad the majority will find a way to justify it rather than admit they supported everything they hated. Calling it now, "Trump had to rape those kids, how else could he have gotten in with those people to take them down?"
It'll always be a game of percentages. There will always be some amount of hardcore cult members, but as worse and worse things come to light, the new info will pick off sections of MAGA one piece at a time. We can debate percentages, but I think a critical mass of MAGA would leave if they had crystal clear proof of Trump raping children.
One source I'm using is The Necessary Conversation youtube podcast, and while it's just two data points, it give the regular person a really good insight into the cult.
As long as it's talking or writing about it people will find a way to justify it or just ignore it for sure.
It'd be a different thing altogether if some VHS tape of him and a crying child happened to appear. That'd turn all but the most vehemently ghoulish people against even him. There'd be no coming back from that. Some might say deepfake this and that but it'd still have an impact.
Probably why some survivors/witnesses simply disappeared. Probably why Melania did her little stunt the other day. Probably why Maxwell is still breathing, too. If someone stashed some tapes it would've been her. She had too much to lose. Nobody is truly untouchable when state actors are involved.
And citizens are supposed to pay taxes to support these criminals?
He could do something really funny and have a heart attack before pardoning anyone.
They would have a weekend at Bernie's before they would let the public know.
The response to this needs to be a resounding, "LOL, no," from whatever administration comes next. The constitution gives the President the power of the pardon? Well, if gives Congress power of the purse, but we let him ignore that. The Supreme Court will intercede? One of them is married to a J6er, another one is openly taking bribes, and ar least three of them committed perjury when they told Congress said they wouldn't overturn precedent. Our country can't continue without accountability.
I guess a future president could fix it with more pardons. Make a list of people who if they receive mob justice from, the mob are instant pardoned. Might at least get the SC to rein in pardon power.
Because for me it's not really about the people in the administration. Yeah, they suck and should be sent to the Hague. But there have been so many people that have bought pardons from the administration and they are the worst of the worst. Talking people who robbed and killed the elderly, some of the biggest con men and fraudsters. So damn many, they don't even ever make the news.
I've been thinking about this a lot, but the problem is that the President can only pardon federal crimes, so if a mob drags Steven Miller from his house in California and kills him, the President can't do anything to intervene. However, I'm pretty sure that the President could pardon crimes committed in D.C., and the Supreme Court has basically said the President can't be held accountable for crimes committed in office, so in theory, a future President could order agents to take Miller into custody, bring him to D.C., and execute him. He could then pardon everyone involved and no one could be held accountable.
Considering that the SC has basically given the President king powers, the president could make an executive order that any place that domiciles those people on that list is considered federal property while they are there. The current admin has argued more absurd things then that in court already.
How is this a "bombshell"? Like really? Was this not assumed? Hell we don't even know if this shit is technically illegal, immoral yes completely.
The bombshell is: His staff, despite interacting with the guy daily, believed him, I guess...
Well why not? He likely will throw pardons around (it likely makes him hard to abuse the system). At this point they kinda have to go for broke, they are "all in" so to speak.
Has he ever kept a promise, even accidentally?
I still want SOMEBODY in his corrupt regime to end up in prison.
Promises like his tax returns, the Epstein Files, payments to contractors, payments to rally organizers, that kind of a promise? Or the promises to stay faithful to his 3 wives, of which he cheated on the prior one with the future one.
Thwump has never understood the definition of the word "promise".
That's quite literally not a way out for these traitors. That will just give the individual states easily winnable cases against anyone that accepts a pardon.
If the non-fascists take back Congress, we can change the current laws & simply extradite the rest of them to the Hague. And we've now seen how fast the federal government can move when it wants to.
At the very least, these traitors are going to be fighting civil lawsuits until they die.
If the non-fascists take back Congress.
Big "if" right there...
yeah agreed. I keep circling around the fact that our government is completely captured across every branch and party, and the interests that have it captured care nothing about Americans, or are hostile and just using us. The 2 political parties dictate the outcome for primaries, so they will never let an honest actor win a national primary unless a secret-decent person manages to sneak through their net, which seems unlikely given the grooming process politicians need to go through before they get any real power. Mamdani won because mayoral races arent as hard to enter and get funded as federal races are. But he did it despite the dems massive efforts to backstab his campaign into oblivion. Can that scale nationally? Seems hard to beleive. Bernie's candidacy and the outcome of his suing the DNC showed us that they can hand pick whoever they want at any time and the primary system is not legally binding, and need not be fair or impartial. Its not really an election.. Only the general election is.
https://observer.com/2017/05/dnc-lawsuit-presidential-primaries-bernie-sanders-supporters/
So whats inevitable now : Social programs and free speech/protests will inevitably be removed. I cant see a midterm win by dems leading to a turnaround in our national descent into fascism. Its really just a matter of time until some sort of revolution happens, and the centrists are just playing for time in an utterly doomed system. We're in a dead zombie democracy that was a watered down version of democracy even when it was alive.
How do pardons work on war crimes?
Trump has previously pardoned at least one guy convicted of warcrimes in US courts. So I assume pardons work just fine, for that purpose.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/dec/27/eddie-gallagher-trump-navy-seal-iraq
But does a US President even have the right to send US citizens to The Hague? I imagine not, since the US is not a signatory.
If there is no legal US framework, then sending them to The Hague against their will would presumably literally be a crime under US law. In principle, US President can't just kidnap people.
Oh, don't worry. Gdub signed the Hague Invasion Act back in 2002, so we already have a legal justification to invade the Hague if they get uppity and checks notes hold these evil fucks accountable for their crimes.
When you start pardoning everyone... When you start operating so much outside of the law that this becomes SOP....
...You gotta stop and really question if what you're doing is actually right or not.
And this guy is the PRESIDENT? Damn man. For shame.
I know the US has had an extremely troubled history and is constantly making costly ethical mistakes. But... This is just like... An exceptionally dark time for the USA. And that's saying something.
Like, for real. What's the exit plan here? What's the actual outcome of this gonna be? How bad is this gonna get? And how do we, as people, overcome this?
All black pills and cynicism aside, this has got to stop, and the only way it's going to, is with leadership with power. What type of leader is going to be the spearhead for the step forwards?
Biden already set precedent by pardoning his entire administration to prevent malicious prosecutions from this one. Motivation may have been different, but that doesn't really change that he just promised to do the same thing Biden did.
Trump weaponised the DOJ. Trump is a war criminal. Trump would pardon his illegal deeds regardless if Biden used that power, however, the former president had to pardon unless continuous prosecution seems like a fun everyday activity.
Trump will say he does what Biden did, but he is a living sack of human garbage so his comments mean nothing. By that logic Biden could've removed democracy too, as Trump started his first term.
He will pardon everyone who can afford it.
Ok hold, that's fine let him do that. Now what the next president should do just assassinate them and then pardon the assassins. Since it seems that we can do whatever the fuck we want with the pardons now.
So what. He promises a lot of things he doesn't deliver. Staffers know that best of anyone.
They should, but so many still get caught out thinking they were special and that surely after 79 years, they'd be the person Trump didn't screw over
I'm not sure they are thinking that. I bet they think they are the one person who can somehow ride the wave that it trump and find a way off it and still win. Like how a golddigger is hoping the guy will die soon. I mean, while hw is a grifter, he is a sloppy one. So the people around him end up recieving plenty of the spoiles of his grifting (points to stock market data right before trump does something that affects it greatly). So even if he does turn on them, they usualy come out rather rich.
Why do they need assurances that they'd get pardons?
This is the guy that claimed anyone taking the Fifth was guilty, now promising pardons?
His pardon means nothing in the Hague.
The US government and the entire US Armed Forces would have to be in complete collapse for that to happen without enormous bloodshed.
Unfortunately America wouldn’t let an American appear at The Hague. Like I’m sure they’d send special forces to recover them before that.
America does, and always has, done only what serves America. Biggest threat to world peace for like half their existence.
Unfortunately America wouldn’t let an American appear at The Hague. Like I’m sure they’d send special forces to recover them before that.
Gdub signed the Hague Invasion Act back in 2002, so we've already got laws on the books to do it.
Those laws can be rescinded by Congress, just like any others.
It's cute you think we wouldn't send the military to stop it. Gdub signed the Hague Invasion Act back in 2002
You know, you always have the power to void any pardons from Trump (create a new law). But that would require you lot to grow some balls which I don't see happening.
Until you disappoint him somehow and he ignores your legal peril, like last time
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