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[–] 93 points 7 months ago (5 children)

I'm an atheist and I celebrate all kinds of holidays. Because campy traditions are silly and fun.

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    [–] 82 points 7 months ago (1 child)
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    [–] 49 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I've never met a pro-lifer that didn't celebrate their day of birth instead of their day of conception.

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    [–] 45 points 7 months ago (5 children)

    Most Atheists use it as a gift-giving holiday.

    I've met very few people, Christians included, who actually celebrated it as the birth of Christ. They just do gift exchanges, too.

    I have celebrated Hanukkah with a Jewish family once. That was very interesting. My father dated a Jewish woman for about a year or so. Very religious. Never tried to convert us. They had some interesting ways about them. I was like 10 or 11, I don't remember much. I remember potato pancakes, I remember they got lame presents every night for seven days (or nine? Whatever it is). It's not like multiple Christmases. Whole different holiday.

    We mainly use it to exchange gifts.

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  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Most Atheists use it as a gift-giving holiday.

    I’ve met very few people, Christians included, who actually celebrated it as the birth of Christ. They just do gift exchanges, too.

    Yeah, that's it for me, too. Time with family eating yummy food and playing games, and exchanging gifts. Zero mention of anything religious by anyone.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    It's funny because, to religiously conquer the pagans, Christians co-opted their holidays. There's a bit more to the St Nicholas legend than we observe, but it's amusing that outside of Nativity scenes at churches, we mostly just celebrate Santa Claus on Christmas.

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    [–] 32 points 7 months ago (12 children)

    Did the celebrate the birth of christ, or were they celebrating a day off work to be with their family and exchange gifts as a way of strengthening familial and social bonds?

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  • [+] [S] -10 points 7 months ago (11 children)
  • [–] 17 points 7 months ago (8 children)

    If they were celebrating the birth of christ, their lord and savior, then they were by definition, not atheist.

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  • [+] [S] -10 points 7 months ago (7 children)
  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago (6 children)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism

    On the flip side. I know a lot of christian magats that worship trump despite the bible being pretty explicit about "false idols" and "thou shalt have no other gods before me."

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  • [+] [S] -5 points 7 months ago (5 children)
  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Sure.

    Atheism

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    "Atheist" redirects here. For other uses, see Atheist (disambiguation).

    Atheism, in the broadest sense, is an absence of belief in the existence of deities. Less broadly, atheism is a rejection of the belief that any deities exist. In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities. Atheism is contrasted with theism, which is the belief that at least one deity exists.

    Historically, evidence of atheistic viewpoints can be traced back to classical antiquity and early Indian philosophy. In the Western world, atheism declined after Christianity gained prominence. The 16th century and the Age of Enlightenment marked the resurgence of atheistic thought in Europe. Atheism achieved a significant position worldwide in the 20th century. Estimates of those who have an absence of theistic belief range from 500 million to 1.1 billion people.[1][2] Atheist organizations have defended the autonomy of science, freedom of thought, secularism, and secular ethics.

    Arguments for atheism range from philosophical to scientific to social approaches. Rationales for not believing in deities include the lack of evidence,[3][4] the problem of evil, the argument from inconsistent revelations, the rejection of concepts that cannot be falsified, and the argument from nonbelief.[3][5] Nonbelievers contend that atheism is a more parsimonious position than theism and that everyone is born without beliefs in deities;[6] therefore, they argue that the burden of proof lies not on the atheist to disprove the existence of gods but on the theist to provide a rationale for theism.[7] Definition

    Writers disagree on how best to define and classify atheism,[8] contesting what supernatural entities are considered gods, whether atheism is a philosophical position or merely the absence of one, and whether it requires a conscious, explicit rejection; however, the norm is to define atheism in terms of an explicit stance against theism.[9][10][11] Atheism has been regarded as compatible with agnosticism,[12][13][14][15] but has also been contrasted with it.[16][17][18] Implicit vs. explicit Main article: Implicit and explicit atheism A diagram showing the relationship between the definitions of weak/strong and implicit/explicit atheism (sizes in the diagram are not meant to indicate relative sizes within a population). Explicit strong/positive atheists (in purple on the right) assert that "at least one deity exists" is a false statement. Explicit weak/negative atheists (in blue on the right) reject or eschew belief that any deities exist without asserting that "at least one deity exists" is a false statement. Implicit weak/negative atheists (in blue on the left) would include people (such as young children and some agnostics) who do not believe in a deity but have not explicitly rejected such belief.

    Some of the ambiguity involved in defining atheism arises from the definitions of words like deity and god. The variety of wildly different conceptions of God and deities leads to differing ideas regarding atheism's applicability. The ancient Romans accused Christians of being atheists for not worshiping the pagan deities. Gradually, this view fell into disfavor as theism came to be understood as encompassing belief in any divinity.[19] With respect to the range of phenomena being rejected, atheism may counter anything from the existence of a deity to the existence of any spiritual, supernatural, or transcendental concepts.[20] Definitions of atheism also vary in the degree of consideration a person must put to the idea of gods to be considered an atheist. Atheism has been defined as the absence of belief that any deities exist. This broad definition would include newborns and other people who have not been exposed to theistic ideas. As far back as 1772, Baron d'Holbach said that "All children are born Atheists; they have no idea of God."[21] Similarly, George H. Smith suggested that: "The man who is unacquainted with theism is an atheist because he does not believe in a god. This category would also include the child with the conceptual capacity to grasp the issues involved, but who is still unaware of those issues. The fact that this child does not believe in god qualifies him as an atheist."[22]

    Implicit atheism is "the absence of theistic belief without a conscious rejection of it" and explicit atheism is the conscious rejection of belief. It is usual to define atheism in terms of an explicit stance against theism.[23][10][24] For the purposes of his paper on "philosophical atheism", Ernest Nagel contested including the mere absence of theistic belief as a type of atheism.[25] Graham Oppy classifies as innocents those who never considered the question because they lack any understanding of what a god is, for example one-month-old babies.[26] Negative vs. positive Main article: Negative and positive atheism

    Philosophers such as Antony Flew[27] and Michael Martin[19] have contrasted positive (strong/hard) atheism with negative (weak/soft) atheism. Positive atheism is the explicit affirmation that gods do not exist. Negative atheism includes all other forms of non-theism. According to this categorization, anyone who is not a theist is either a negative or a positive atheist. Michael Martin, for example, asserts that agnosticism entails negative atheism.[14][12] Agnostic atheism encompasses both atheism and agnosticism.[15] However, many agnostics see their view as distinct from atheism.[28][29] Richard Dawkins sees theist, agnostic, and atheist positions as existing along a spectrum of theistic probability

    According to atheists' arguments, unproven religious propositions deserve as much disbelief as all other unproven propositions.[30] Atheist criticism of agnosticism says that the unprovability of a god's existence does not imply an equal probability of either possibility.[31] Australian philosopher J.J.C. Smart argues that "sometimes a person who is really an atheist may describe herself, even passionately, as an agnostic because of unreasonable generalized philosophical skepticism which would preclude us from saying that we know anything whatever, except perhaps the truths of mathematics and formal logic."[32] Consequently, some atheist authors, such as Richard Dawkins, prefer distinguishing theist, agnostic, and atheist positions along a spectrum of theistic probability—the likelihood that each assigns to the statement "God exists".[33]

    Before the 18th century, the existence of God was so accepted in the Western world that even the possibility of true atheism was questioned. This is called theistic innatism—the notion that all people believe in God from birth; within this view was the connotation that atheists are in denial.[34] Some atheists have challenged the need for the term "atheism". In his book Letter to a Christian Nation, Sam Harris wrote:

    In fact, "atheism" is a term that should not even exist. No one ever needs to identify himself as a "non-astrologer" or a "non-alchemist". We do not have words for people who doubt that Elvis is still alive or that aliens have traversed the galaxy only to molest ranchers and their cattle. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make in the presence of unjustified religious beliefs.[35]
    

    Etymology The Greek word "atheoi" αθεοι ("[those who are] without god") as it appears in the Epistle to the Ephesians 2:12, on the early 3rd-century Papyrus 46.

    In early ancient Greek, the adjective átheos (ἄθεος, from the privative ἀ- + θεός "god") meant "godless". It was first used as a term of censure roughly meaning "ungodly" or "impious". In the 5th century BCE, the word began to indicate more deliberate and active godlessness in the sense of "severing relations with the gods" or "denying the gods". The term ἀσεβής (asebēs) then came to be applied against those who impiously denied or disrespected the local gods, even if they believed in other gods. Modern translations of classical texts sometimes render átheos as "atheistic". As an abstract noun, there was also ἀθεότης (atheotēs), "atheism". Cicero transliterated the Greek word into the Latin átheos. The term found frequent use in the debate between early Christians and Hellenists, with each side attributing it, in the pejorative sense, to the other.[36]

    The term atheist (from the French athée), in the sense of "one who ... denies the existence of God or gods",[37] predates atheism in English, being first found as early as 1566,[38] and again in 1571.[39] Atheist as a label of practical godlessness was used at least as early as 1577.[40] The term atheism was derived from the French athéisme,[41] and appears in English about 1587.[42]

    Atheism was first used to describe a self-avowed belief in late 18th-century Europe, specifically denoting disbelief in the monotheistic Abrahamic god.[a] In the 20th century, globalization contributed to the expansion of the term to refer to disbelief in all deities, though it remains common in Western society to describe atheism as "disbelief in God".[19] Arguments Epistemological arguments

    Skepticism, based on the ideas of David Hume, asserts that certainty about anything is impossible, so one can never know for sure whether or not a god exists. Hume, however, held that such unobservable metaphysical concepts should be rejected as "sophistry and illusion".[43]

    Michael Martin argues that atheism is a justified and rational true belief, but offers no extended epistemological justification because current theories are in a state of controversy. Martin instead argues for "mid-level principles of justification that are in accord with our ordinary and scientific rational practice."[44]

    Other arguments for atheism that can be classified as epistemological or ontological, assert the meaninglessness or unintelligibility of basic terms such as "God" and statements such as "God is al

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  • [–] 27 points 7 months ago

    I celebrate Christmas in the sense that I get together with family for a good meal and exchange some gifts, but none of us spare a thought to baby jeebuz or any of that jazz.

    Also, I'm Norwegian and I seem to recall that jule celebrations were a thing before christianity forced Thor & Co. to step aside.

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  • [–] 23 points 7 months ago (5 children)

    Hello.

    Also meet more people of various backgrounds.

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  • [+] [S] -11 points 7 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 17 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Broader experience will help you make more informed decisions about the world.

    Also when you say something like "I've never met an atheist who didn't celebrate Christmas" you sound extremely, let's say, provincial, and that may have adverse consequences for you in some social contexts.

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  • [–] 45 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    I've never met a loud and outspoken Christian that was really Christian.

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  • [–] 20 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Christmas predates Christianity in my culture. We just didn't call it Christmas.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago*

    Yeah, Christmas was part of the genocidal strategy to supress the culture of our ancestors. Romans also burnt holy sites and killed everyone opposing to build churches at the exact same spots

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  • [–] 19 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Define celebrate. Do they go to church? Do anything religious on those days?

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  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago

    Exactly.
    I am agnostic but still "celebrate" it with my family which arent super but still religious enough to attend church.
    Even on Eastern I enjoy the public holidays. After all they are for everyone ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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  • [–] 38 points 7 months ago (6 children)

    And I've met very few Christians, if any, who actually follow all the rules in the bible

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  • [–] 11 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Well there's some rules that contradict the other rules

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  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Then they should write a better version

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I've been working on it, but I'm not sure about how to handle the creation story. When reboots redo the hero's creation story, it starts to be a drag. However, the last time they rebooted, they kind of started in the middle, so maybe it's time to start again from the beginning.

    Or maybe, we go pre-creation and see what God was up to beforehand?

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    [–] 18 points 7 months ago

    Its part of my culture but not part of my belive.

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  • [–] 16 points 7 months ago (1 child)
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    [–] 31 points 7 months ago (7 children)

    Hi. I'm an atheist that doesn't celebrate Christmas. You are probably from a part of the world where there is a Christian majority. Honestly I'm assuming American lol

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  • [+] [S] 3 points 7 months ago (6 children)
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    It's funny, I keep seeing you comment about how spicy the comment section is, but this is one of your first responses.

    I think the problem is your shower thought just feels so painfully obvious to people, hence the comments vs votes. This person is trying to show you why it feels so obvious, and your response seems to denote both an understanding and an ignorance, it's childlike.

    If you are American, you had like an 80% chance to be born into a family that celebrates a traditional xmas, tree/present/Santa, with Jesus being a common addon, but with an entirely separate mythology kinda tacked on to it.

    So you have a tradition celebrated since youth, attached to a national holiday, where the religious part of the tradition is unconnected to the fun part. Santa Xmas is totally secular. It's would be more notable if you didn't celebrate xmas. Which is why basically everyone finds jehovas witnesses so odd.

    Just kinda of a mid shower though, more of an I'm 14 and this is deep. Which if you are, no shade, just explaining.

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  • [+] [S] -2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)
  • [–] 14 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Celebrating cultural traditions doesn't necessarily have to involve religious themes.

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    [–] 14 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Xmas was commandeered by christians but we have been celebrating Winter solstice for a lot longer than there has been christians on this planet. (same goes for most other 'christian' holidays)

    I don't celebrate the birth of any fictional character, but I still celebrate the holidays in general, they mean different things to different people and there's nothing wrong with that. It should be about spending time with your loved ones and showing your appreciation. It should be to find a little bit of peace and relaxation this world with those you love, and taking a break before starting out on a new year with new problems and challenges.

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    [–] 13 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Well yeah why not. The holiday was a pagan holiday long before the Jesus thing anyway. Besides the idea of gathering with your family to share meals and exchanging gifts because you love and care for them is not strictly a Christian thing.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    Yes. But having traditions that create great memories with the people I care for most just isn't the same without an infinitely babyfied diety who we will celebrate murdering in about four months. (This is just meant to try to get a laugh.)

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  • [–] 12 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    Most Christan holidays are co-opted pagan celebrations. Easter is the celebration of spring hence the chicks and bunnies and eggs, all symbols of new life. Christmas and the tradition of bringing evergreens into the home are the winter solstice celebration. Christians can't steal peoples holidays and then complain that non-christians celebrate them.

    Celebrating these holidays without being Christan is actually standing up against thousands of years of forced conversion tactics.

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  • [–] 12 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    “Celebrate” is doing a lot of work here. What are we supposed to do? Go to work?

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  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago*

    On the flip side I’ve never met a loud and outspoken Christian that didn’t celebrate Christmas.

    You know, since it’s a stolen Holliday used as a yearly excuse for a capitalism orgy.

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  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago

    I'll be your new person to meet for today.

    I'm spiritual but still atheist and my family has been agnostic atheist for 3 generations. Back in the 80's my grandfather started celebrating the winter solstice because he wasn't happy celebrating holidays for a religion he didn't agree with. He picked it because it's the longest night in the year and that's a good reason to give a gift.

    40 something years later, I'm raising my kid to celebrate the solstices and the equinoxes. Winter is a quite calibration of your closest people and you exchange gifts that will help them through the next year. During summer it's a celebration of the people you know and everyone gets together and brings everyone they know to eat and party with the goal of meeting some one new. Both equinox are a celebration of the community and we go out to do community service.

    That's 4 generations of non Cristian celebration.

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  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I'm no expert, but I think Santa Claus isn't exactly a biblical figure and neither is the Easter Bunny. These are normal holidays around here, but you'd be hard-pressed to find many children who know any of the christian stuff.

    Also, I think Christmas was actually built on top of the prior winter solstice celebrations. It's not like anyone knew the exact date of birth for a random guy from hundreds of years ago.

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    [–] 9 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    I don't care what holiday is it, as long as you make it an official holiday that has legally mandated paid time off... 😏

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  • [–] 9 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Pretty sure Jesus’s birthday isn’t the first and only mid-winter celebration in the entire history of humankind. Most people are just happy to get the solstice out of the way.

    What are your views on atheists eating Easter eggs?

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    [–] 8 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Christmas is now a secular holiday. It was here before Christians anyway.

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    [–] 8 points 7 months ago

    Saturnalia Gang rise up! Our time is now!

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  • Eh, whatever religious significance it ever had in the West is long gone, but it's still a nice occasion to meet up with family, break bread and share gifts. I'm not much for rites and celebrations, to a point my wife hates, but I see the value of it (and in sharing with your loved ones, ofc) even if it's completely separate from religion.

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  • [–] 15 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Atheists here who's favorite holiday is Christmas.

    I do kinda wish it had a different name, and kinda wish it was on the winter solstice; but as long as no one wants to go to church, read the Bible, or reinact the nativity; it's a fantastic areligious holiday to enjoy with loved ones.

    Most Christians I know only pretend it's a religious holiday while they enjoy family, food, and gifts. Though some actually go to church, and I kinda feel bad for them.

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    [–] 7 points 7 months ago* (4 children)

    Christmas is a pagan holiday co-opted by Christians. Christmas is most definitely a secular tradition in the US and there is nothing unusual about an atheist celebrating it.

    What is unusual is Christians trying to bring Christ into the celebration when the timing just doesn't make any sense. Was he actually born during this time? Where does he fit in with Santa Claus? Why do we bring a tree indoors? What about Jesus equals buying gifts to give to loved ones?

    Clearly Jesus doesn't belong in Christmas no matter how hard Christians try to pretend he does.

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    [–] 7 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I have, including myself.

    It's still a public holiday where I live, so it's a convenient date for visiting family for a few days. But apart from some joke decoration (like a single bauble on a tiny potted citrus tree) there is nothing Christmassy about it.

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    [–] 6 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I don't most years, unless a friend really wants to do something with me for it in which case I might go along for their benefit. Not really a holiday person in general though.

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    [–] 6 points 7 months ago (1 child)
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    [–] 6 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    What do you mean with celebrate? I mean, i get free from work but hardly celebrate anything (although maybe slightly at the winter solstice, when the shortest day had happened, happy that the days will get longer again)

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    [–] 10 points 7 months ago

    We call them Christmas and Easter, but they're really just secular holidays for the family to get together. No religious aspect whatsoever, but great getting together.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago

    Typical war on Saturnalia bullshit.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago* (1 child)

    I don't celebrate christmas. There, now you have.

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    [–] 5 points 7 months ago

    I'm not loud and outspoken, but I don't really celebrate. Though in my case I grew up JW so I never had the habit. I've heard arguments from outspoken atheists that religion doesn't get to claim holidays, because you don't have ro believe in something to enjoy the festive aspects, plus those holidays were stolen or merged from various religions anyway.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Im an atheist that doesn't celebrate. I don't do holidays and haven't with my kids since their birth. Everyone is over consuming.

    Nor do I want to contribute to the ignorance of religion.

    Idc if everyone wants to pretend its not a religious holiday, the Christians around here foam at the mouth at the chance to spout their nonsense. Christmas lights didnt go down until recently.

    Religion has caused so much harm.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Well it is the most wonderful time of the year.

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    [–] 5 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    Just about every culture has a winter celebration. Religious or not, a large portion of the population is struggling in the cold. The party around the solstice gives a distinct turning point in the year as the days get longer. So why not take advantage of the existing merch, the existing day off work, and the spirit of your friends and family and partake? Going with the flow and pretending to celebrate a holiday in a religion you think is fake anyway is easier than having the same conversation over and over with family. And don't underestimate the power of marketing, consumerism, and the lingering imperialism. I've been to India and many people expressed their wish to visit New York City at Christmas. It permeates local culture, it broadcasts globally.

    As others have said, you're showing a small world view and admitting your sample is small. Christianity creates atheists that celebrate Christmas. Judaism, hannukah. Modern non-religious cultural holidays, the new year. Traditional religions, some combo of the solstice and moon phase. Even those of other faiths that live in areas dominated by Christianity celebrate Christmas, heathens and pagans alike.

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Hello. Allow me to introduce myself. 👋

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    [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I don't really celebrate it. Not because I am an atheist, tho. Because I am poor. 😩

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    [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I've never met a protestant that wasn't into a catholic saint's day at least once a year (valentine's day)

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    [–] 4 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

    I've never met an Asatru who wasn't a Norwegian guy named Bjørn with extremely long naturally blonde hair who loves Iron Maiden.

    Sample bias is a thing 😉

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Beyond its religious context, it is one of the most widely-celebrated and practiced social gathering events, and a massive economic driver in many local economies. It would be strange to not celebrate it for the social aspect, even if you don't practice the religious aspect.

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    [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    How can you be sure?

    When you meet someone you judge to be loud and outspoken in their atheism, do you add them to a list, find out where they live, and then spend your Christmas checking what ever one of them is doing on that day?

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    [–] 4 points 7 months ago

    Sounds like you haven't met very many of them.

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  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Did they haul out a nativity scene? Go to church? No? Then it was a cultural celebration, not a religious one. Nothing hypocritical about that.

    Might be a good time to remember that Christmas has adopted many pagan traditions.

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    [–] 7 points 7 months ago (1 child)
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