Thoughts?

Is this imperialism by China, a country which is supposed to be left-wing? Leftists are normally anti-imperialism. Wouldn't it be better to let Taiwan democratically decide whether they want to be part of China or not?

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[–] 55 points 10 months ago (42 children)

Invading Taiwan without damaging the things that make it valuable seems tough.

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  • [–] 25 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    They don't care about damaging things now.

    Almost all of TSMC's output is now powering US' Stargate AI project. They also have their own fabs, they have equivalent to TSMC fabs (from stolen TSMC research) in larger numbers - the only reason we don't see it flooding the market here in the west is that TSMC got injunctions against all the Chinese fabs selling 7nm and smaller chips.

    If TSMC is gone and Intel+Samsung can't keep up, then those injunctions are going to disappear pretty quickly to keep the economy rolling.

    TSMC is no longer a card Taiwan holds, largely due to corporate greed.

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  • [–] 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

    The latest info we have says they don't have the equivalent high end chip prod yet but they're closing in. What you're describing would likely be the reality within several years. That said I think it's not in China's interest to take Taiwan by force since they'd have to live with it. It'll also do enormous damage to their soft power.

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  • [–] 6 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    I think China does fervently wish that they can just "close in" to high end chip fabrication, but it's not that easy. We'll see, though.

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  • [–] 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

    For sure. It's gonna be bad for TSMC but I'm cautiously optimistic for its effect on us regular non-US peasants. Especially given the shortages created by the AI bubble. Should lower the cost of compute.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago

    TSMC was never a card. China has been wanting Taiwan since before TSMC exists. Taiwan is in a strategic geographic location that makes it difficult to project its navy. It's the same reason the US controls Hawaii, Midway, Guam, and many other seemingly useless pacific islands in the middle of nowhere.

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  • [+] -27 points 10 months ago (35 children)

    Famously what happened during German unification

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  • [–] 28 points 10 months ago (34 children)

    Except that was a peaceful process, not an invasion/annexation. Because part of Taiwan’s strategic defense policy is “we will melt our chip fabs to slag if the PRC invades”. Thus, they hold a gun to the head of pretty much all of the most advanced chip fabrication in the world, which most of the rest of the world has a vested interest in keeping working.

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  • [+] -26 points 10 months ago (33 children)

    Except that was a peaceful process, not an invasion/annexation

    The only invasion I'm seeing is US Navy vessels encircling the island and threatening their economy.

    they hold a gun to the head of pretty much all of the most advanced chip fabrication in the world

    That's been the American line for going on ten years. But the real gun has always been the Pacific Fleet, threatening to repeat the crimes of Vietnam on Chinese civilians, much like they did in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, and now Venezuela and Nigeria.

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  • [–] 29 points 10 months ago (19 children)

    The only invasion I’m seeing is US Navy vessels encircling the island and threatening their economy.

    Saying this on the same day that Chinese warships encircled Taiwan.

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  • [+] -20 points 10 months ago (18 children)

    Guy who has never seen a world map

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  • [–] 15 points 10 months ago (17 children)

    Wtf are you talking about? Imperialist China just finished encircling Taiwan in a "defense exercise"

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  • [+] -6 points 10 months ago (16 children)
  • [–] 3 points 10 months ago (13 children)

    Yeah, China should definitely subjugate Taiwan to fend off those Americans who have no intention of attacking China and who have benefitted from trillions of dollars of trade from the US.

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  • [–] -2 points 10 months ago (12 children)

    China should definitely subjugate Taiwan

    Only you guys seem to think this.

    You're obsessed with global conquest and you think you're in a race with China to do it.

    who have benefitted from trillions of dollars of trade from the US.

    Have they? Why is Taiwanese standard of living so low?

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  • [–] 5 points 10 months ago (11 children)

    Only you guys seem to think this.

    China's overall end-goal is specifically to annex Taiwan. Taiwanese people do not want this. What would you call this?

    Have they? Why is Taiwanese standard of living so low?

    Is it? Based on what? What data are you referring to?

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (10 children)

    China’s overall end-goal is specifically to annex Taiwan. Taiwanese people do not want this.

    China's overall end goal is to build a prosperous nation, safe from future re-colonization.

    Taiwanese people are happy to trade with, travel between, and live amicable with their Chinese peers. And one day, their position on annexation may change. That's the project Beijing leadership is working towards.

    Americans are trying to turn Taiwan into a forward operation base for regime change. And that's what leads to these endless naval patrol pissing contests and US fear mongering campaigns aimed at Taiwanese expats.

    What data are you referring to?

    Here's an excellent write-up

    in Taiwan, the average starting salary for a university graduate is around 33,713 New Taiwan dollars (about US$1,100), and even a department manager at a major corporation earns only about US$2,100.

    Meanwhile, housing prices in Taipei are comparable to those in Seoul—and in some areas, they even surpass Seocho, the most expensive district in the Korean capital. Until recently, people could endure thanks to relatively low living costs. But after COVID-19, things changed: not only was home ownership already out of reach, but inflation has driven everyday expenses sharply higher.

    Nothing illustrates the poverty of Taiwan’s youth more clearly than the phenomenon of the taofang. A taofang is essentially an apartment divided into multiple tiny units, often with illegal extensions that stick out like container boxes to maximize floor space. These cramped rooms, barely large enough to lie down in, rent for $290 to $360 a month in Taipei.

    If you know Taiwanese Americans, this isn't a secret. Nobody wants to go back to the island and earn a tiny fraction of their American salaries under a ruinously expensive living standard.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    Do you imagine Taiwanese LGBT people want to live under CCP rule?

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    More than the KMT or TPP certainly. Taiwan only legalized same sex couples in 2019, after repeated populist opposition campaigns and defiance of court orders.

    But, more pressing, do you think homeless LGBTQ people want to live under a government that denies them rights to the barest essentials of survival?

    Social conservative politics dominates the Pacific Rim. It isn't unique to any single country. Economic progressivism is where you find the sharpest divide.

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  • [–] -1 points 10 months ago* (2 children)

    You understand Taiwan is by far more liberal on LGBT rights than China, right? When did China legalise same-sex marriage? Or any of the rights granted to LGBT people in China?

    Do you think LGBT people in Sweden or Canada would prefer the social and legal situation of LGBT rights and expression in China as compared to their countries?

    Also, where is your data that homelessness is more prominent in China than Taiwan?

    Moreover, do you think journalists, activists in Taiwan, etc want to live under a one-party state where all dissent against the CCP is curated?

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    You understand Taiwan is by far more liberal on LGBT rights than China, right?

    They've had a liberal turn with the DDP. That's coming to an end. The '24 election introduced a reactionary majority in Parliament.

    Taiwan's Conservatives are in ascendence, and the island is taking a reactionary turn.

    Also, where is your data that homelessness is more prominent in China than Taiwan?

    I've already been linking you sources and you've been ignoring them.

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  • [–] 0 points 10 months ago

    What legislation is planned that will somehow roll back LGBT rights in Taiwan to be equivalent to the PRC?

    Your source did not compare homelessness and poverty rates in China as compared to Taiwan.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    Where is your evidence that Americans are trying to use Taiwan as a base for regime change? How would this even work?

    And your analysis on Taiwans housing prices and rent could be literally any major city in any major western country on earth. It does not demonstrate widespread poverty across Taiwan.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    Where is your evidence that Americans are trying to use Taiwan as a base for regime change?

    A century of US foreign policy aimed at rival governments, combined with stated positions within US think tanks.

    And your analysis on Taiwans housing prices and rent could be literally any major city in any major western country on earth

    Crazy how free market housing prices just do that, huh? Almost as though it's a consequence of their public policies.

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  • [–] 0 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    Sorry, again, you unironically think that the USA is going to attack China? A nuclear power with over double the USAs population?

    The point here is that you aren't even comparing it to China. What are the metrics and standards of living in Taiwan as compared to China?

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    Sorry, again, you unironically think that the USA is going to attack China? A nuclear power with over double the USAs population?

    We've been building up the Pacific Fleet since the Bush 43 administration. War with China was the plan for PNAC prior to 9/11. And the Trump admin is flush with China Hawks.

    What are the metrics and standards of living in Taiwan as compared to China?

    PPP is a great place to start. Taiwanese cost of living has been climbing since Trump 1 while China has kept itself stable.

    Basics - food, housing, transportation, education, health care - that Taiwan domestic policies privatized during the boom years have come back to eat their lunch in the lean years. Flat wages, rising debt, you do the math.

    You see the same problems across the Pacific Rim capitalist colony states. Everyone from Japan to India has been pinched by supply chain failures and venture capital excess. Taiwan's not unique in this regard (honestly doing a lot better than most of their peers). But the check always comes due.

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  • [–] 0 points 10 months ago

    We’ve been building up the Pacific Fleet since the Bush 43 administration. War with China was the plan for PNAC prior to 9/11. And the Trump admin is flush with China Hawks.

    Okay, so? You do realise that China has changed a lot since then. Again: This is a nuclear power with over double the USAs population. What exactly do you imagine the war goals here are?

    PPP is a great place to start. Taiwanese cost of living has been climbing since Trump 1 while China has kept itself stable.

    Can I see your data points here?

    Basics - food, housing, transportation, education, health care - that Taiwan domestic policies privatized during the boom years have come back to eat their lunch in the lean years. Flat wages, rising debt, you do the math.

    Still no data points.

    You see the same problems across the Pacific Rim capitalist colony states. Everyone from Japan to India has been pinched by supply chain failures and venture capital excess. Taiwan’s not unique in this regard (honestly doing a lot better than most of their peers). But the check always comes due.

    Even if this is true, why would the Taiwanese want to become absorbed into a one-party state?

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  • [–] 5 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    You think the USA is going to start an aggressive boots-on-ground assault on China?

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  • [–] -5 points 10 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 5 points 10 months ago (8 children)

    The only invasion I'm seeing is US Navy vessels encircling the island and threatening their economy.

    I must be going colorblind because those ships are flying a very red American flag...

    repeat the crimes of Vietnam on Chinese civilians, much like they did in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, and now Venezuela and Nigeria

    Lol wtf? Unless you really bought dubya's WMD bullshit, one of these countries is not like the others... I really doubt that any Chinese civilian on Chinese soil is going to get so much as a dirty look from any US armed forces...

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  • [–] -1 points 10 months ago (7 children)

    I must be going colorblind because those ships are flying a very red American flag…

    You're spitting distance from the coast of Fujain. I gotta wonder why you'd expect to see an American warship on the Chinese coastline.

    Unless...

    Ticonderoga-class guided-missile cruisers USS Antietam (CG 54) and USS Chancellorsville (CG 62) are conducting a routine Taiwan Strait transit August 28 (local time) through waters where high seas freedoms of navigation and overflight apply in accordance with international law.

    Crazy how it's international waters when an American warship is in them.

    I really doubt that any Chinese civilian on Chinese soil is going to get so much as a dirty look from any US armed forces…

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_espionage_in_China

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  • [–] 5 points 10 months ago (6 children)

    Crazy how it's international waters when an American warship is in them.

    Never said shit about it being international waters or claimed the US Navy was never there, we were talking about encircling Taiwan which the PRC literally just did. I hope you have the same decorum about US ships totally not practicing invasions of Mexico (😉). It's right over the border after all.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_espionage_in_China

    Come on champ, you can do better than that. We're talking about big scary warships and military bases and all you can link me is some run of the mill espionage shit? And it's on Wikipedia no less, I'm gonna need to revoke your tankie card.

    You're name dropping Iraq and Afghanistan and Vietnam, I need a chance of a military occupation or some Hueys blaring CCR. Give me a real military threat that requires a show of force on this puny island. If flimsy proxy wars counted the USA would be the #1 most righteous belligerent in every conflict from 1945 onward with how much the KGB/GRU tickled them.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (5 children)

    we were talking about encircling Taiwan which the PRC

    How do Chinese ships depart from Fujain without encircling Taiwan? Literally look at your own maps. They're neighbors.

    Might as well declare Australia is encircling New Zealand.

    Are these international waters or aren't they? Do ships have right of passage or don't they? Or is it your belief that Taiwanese waters are American territory?

    Come on champ, you can do better than that.

    You want to play at denialism then scream about foreign aggression. No wonder nobody takes your foreign policy seriously anymore

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  • [–] -1 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    How do Chinese ships depart from Fujain without encircling Taiwan?

    You are an absolute clown:

    China's Eastern Theatre Command conducted 10 hours of live-fire exercises, launching rockets into waters to the north and south of [Taiwan] [...] naval and air force units also simulated strikes on maritime and aerial targets and carried out anti-submarine drills around the island, while state media released images touting Beijing's technological and military superiority [...] China's military said on Monday that simulating a blockade of Taiwan's deep-water Port of Keelung to the island's north and Kaohsiung to Taiwan's south, its largest port city, was central to the drills.

    I can read you, verbatim, CCP press releases saying they are doing this to intimidate Taiwan ("[they will] smash their heads bloody against the iron walls of the Chinese People's Liberation Army") and you pretend they're just out for a sight seeing cruise. Absolutely incredible levels of delusion. Xi should mail you some kind of medal for this...

    You want to play at denialism then scream about foreign aggression.

    Lmfao what did I deny?? I didn't deny anything in any comment! I'm the one drawing the obvious parallels to US aggression! You're just pulling from your stock response bag because your argument is completely hollow.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    You are an absolute clown

    The US and Taiwan signed a two-year specialized training program for Taiwan’s navy, the Ministry of National Defense said today, in an unexpected announcement confirming US training.

    The US has a history of stationing military instructors and special ops teams in Taiwan to quietly assist with training, but details have been classified.

    On Jan. 2, the ministry’s military delegation to the US signed an agreement with the American Institute in Taiwan, an announcement from the ministry showed.

    We can do this all day. China drilling to repel a US assault is about as threatening as the US running drills out of Hawaii.

    Weird that the US is running drills significantly farther East.

    I can read you, verbatim, CCP press releases saying they are doing this to intimidate Taiwan

    You can read US agitprop that selectively quotes and mistranslates statements. Or you can just throw up generic statements with a flashlight under your chin.

    Lmfao what did I deny??

    Jesus, it's like Charlie Kirk never died with this level of bullshit

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  • [–] -2 points 10 months ago* (2 children)

    Nice, glad to see you admitting defeat. Fucking quotes from the CCP are agitprop? Give me a fucking break. Go ahead and translate those for me; you're clearly a bastion of free and rational thinking. Oh wait, you can't read anything but English and are arbitrarily choosing to discard sources that don't fit your bias? Anything that runs counter to your red fanfic is a lie or a conspiracy.

    The sheer lack of basic logic is incredible. You think that the USA is sneaking in and forcing Taiwan to prepare for PRC military action? Like they've got a gun to these poor Taiwanese soldiers forcing them to do push ups? The people of Taiwan want them there to maintain the status quo against PRC annexation. The polls say that in no uncertain terms (as I've covered in other comments). Maybe they wouldn't be so willing to jump at the USA's aid if they didn't have fucking PRC rockets landing all around them.

    Conversely, if the PRC held domain over Taiwan then they wouldn't allow this interference. But they clearly don't if Taiwan is acting independently to protect its own sovereignty. If you ignore reality by starting with "PRC owns Taiwan" then no shit your circular logic will justify any PRC action. This is insane.

    "Stop training to defend against a PRC invasion invade mainland China [with your 150k troops 😂] or we'll invade you" is a lunatic stance when you're preaching peaceful reunification. Is this tiny island with 1% of your population a military threat? Or is the superpower with ICBM nukes the problem? Because if so, bullying [sorry "protecting"] Taiwan does literally nothing but feed plausible excuses to the USA hegemony machine. Ignore Taiwan and go run those drills off of Hawaii if you're dying to be a tough guy. But if they're not doing that then they must have a different plan in mind 🤔...

    Now go ahead, it's your turn to pick some minor point in this dead simple logic and try to counter it by citing an anonymous blog post or something...

    Also I'm still waiting for you to tell me what I denied, I don't think eye rolling is a real answer 🙄

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (1 child)

    Nice, glad to see you admitting defeat.

    The people of Taiwan want them there to maintain the status quo against PRC annexation.

    https://x.com/MariaCorinaYA/status/1976642376119549990

    This recognition of the struggle of all Venezuelans Taiwanese is a boost to conclude our task: to conquer Freedom.

    We are on the threshold of victory and today, more than ever, we count on President Trump, the people of the United States, the peoples of Latin America East Asia, and the democratic nations of the world as our principal allies to achieve Freedom and democracy.

    I dedicate this prize to the suffering people of Venezuela Taiwan and to President Trump for his decisive support of our cause!

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  • [–] 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

    Lol good job just equating two things as if it's a gotcha. Damn, America really do be doing shitty things, therefore by association... Taiwan bad? The PRC must be the evil incarnate with all these decades keeping USA as their top trade partner. 'Merica bad, you really got me.

    And btw, love dodging the entire argument with a tangential tweet and NO SUPPORTING EVIDENCE. Come on, give me a prolewiki link or something; tell me why every Taiwan public opinion poll is actually fake or, if they're real, why the Taiwanese public is wrong and papa CCP needs to spank them. I need a good laugh! And tell me more about denialism ☕

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  • [–] 100 points 10 months ago (6 children)

    Alternative headline:

    China's authoritarian leader Xi Jinping reiterates intent to subjugate neighboring country Taiwan in New Year's Eve speech.

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  • [+] -56 points 10 months ago (5 children)

    It's not a neighbouring country, it's the same country. Ask Taiwan.

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  • [–] [S] 49 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    Okay, I looked at what the current President of Taiwan has to say. He says this:

    Taiwan is already a sovereign, independent country called the Republic of China.

    That's not the same as the PRC.

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  • [+] -11 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    archive.is seems to be down right now.

    The People's Republic of China and the Republic of China are two different governments that both claim sovereignty over mainland China and Taiwan.

    They both want to unite China, but only one of them is in the position to do it.

    Internal to Taiwan, there are parties that support reunification and support independence (opposing views), but Taiwan has not yet reneged on its claim of mainland China.

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  • [–] 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child)

    Their president reneged it like 30+ years ago but that doesn't mean much because it's basically baked into their constitution. Changing the constitution to reflect their real borders would require triggering a vote and a bunch of formal processes that would absolutely instigate a conflict with the PRC.

    Nobody wants that, including the voting population. Thus you see a milquetoast shuffling between independence and reunification parties in order to maintain the status quo (independence for all practical purposes) without being too radical for Beijing. In terms of polling:

    • 48.9% are pro-[eventual]-independence
    • 11.8% are pro-unification
    • 26.9% want status quo

    And when forced out of status quo, independence support jumps to out 60%. But for now they're caught in a Catch-22 that allows the PRC to spit out this propaganda that people gobble up.

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  • [–] [S] 10 points 10 months ago

    As @stickly@lemmy.world pointed out, polling shows that Taiwanese people mostly want the status quo (de facto independence of Taiwan from the PRC) or they lean towards formally declaring independence.

    As for Taiwan claiming sovereignty over China, maybe that is still in their constitution, I don't know. But I'm pretty sure modern Taiwanese leaders are not asserting this claim. Instead they seek to preserve the status quo, where Taiwan is de facto independent.

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  • [–] 88 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    Yes, it is imperialism. Also, China has an authoritarian state controlled by a privileged ruling class and is therefore far-right.

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  • [–] -1 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    Could you please provide us with some data regarding wealth inequality between citizens and politicians in China vs, say, the USA for comparison?

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago

    Since China carefully controls access to information, that's functionally impossible but traditionally corruption by party officials in China was notorious and wide spread. China's only recently been able to tackle it, partially thru advances in technology, but the true extent of their success is difficult to gauge. Critics have also argued that eliminating rivals and ensuring loyalty was the true purpose of anti-coruption efforts. It's suspected that Xi Jinping's extended family has amassed a hidden fortune of around a Billion Dollars.

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  • [+] 59 points 10 months ago (7 children)
  • [–] 15 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    I wonder how many people living in Taiwan were alive back when China controlled it. Probably 90% + of the population has never known anything but independent Taiwan

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  • [–] 7 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    Did they declare that tho? I thought they viewed themselves as the legitimate government of all China.

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  • [–] 150 points 10 months ago (16 children)

    Lol calling China Leftist isn't quite the thing. They are technically "communist" but no more so than the National Socialist German Workers' Party was socialist.

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  • [–] 3 points 10 months ago*

    Yeah, and no wonder why hardline Maoists hate Mainland China for what it is now, completely deviant from Maoism and becoming the very enemy they tried to destroy.

    China is a socialist country, and a developing country as well. China belongs to the Third World. Consistently following Chairman Mao’s teachings, the Chinese Government and people firmly support all oppressed peoples and oppressed nations in their struggle to win or defend national independence, develop the national economy and oppose colonialism, imperialism and hegemonism. This is our bounden internationalist duty. China is not a superpower, nor will she ever seek to be one.

    What is a superpower? A superpower is an imperialist country which everywhere subjects other countries to its aggression, interference, control, subversion or plunder and strives for world hegemony. If capitalism is restored in a big socialist country, it will inevitably become a superpower. The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution, which has been carried out in China in recent years, and the campaign of criticizing Lin Piao and Confucius now under way throughout China, are both aimed at preventing capitalist restoration and ensuring that socialist China will never change her colour and will always stand by the oppressed peoples and oppressed nations.

    If one day China should change her colour and turn into a superpower, if she too should play the tyrant in the world, and everywhere subject others to her bullying, aggression and exploitation, the people of the world should identify her as social-imperialism, expose it, oppose it and work together with the Chinese people to overthrow it.

    https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/deng-xiaoping/1974/04/10.htm

    Also, fuck the 996 System.

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  • [+] -21 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (14 children)

    China isn't technically communist. The Communist Party of China is technically communist in ideology. They have implemented a type of a mixed state that has both socialist and capitalist parts, decently described by the term - socialist market economy. Or socialism with Chinese characteristics as it's been called in the past. Why socialism? Because the socialist part controls the capitalist part of the economy. Why socialist? Because it's controlled by the CPC/CCP which has over 100M members and growing, which means the wider society is decently represented within the party that controls the state.

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  • [–] 62 points 10 months ago* (4 children)

    A horse can call itself a duck, but that doesn't make it a duck; it's still a horse.

    Likewise, a country that calls itself communist while practicing capitalism under a hierarchical ruling party isn't communist. Even if every member of the CCP had equal say in the country's policies and direction, 8% of the total population is far from representing the working class, let alone being led by them.

    They're not communist, correct. They're capitalist.

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  • [–] 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

    8% of the total population is far from representing the working class, let alone being led by them.

    Yup, it can and it should be much larger. I saw a chart showing membership growth of 2-3% per year. That said even at the present numbers it means every third family or so has a party member.

    Again, China isn't calling itself communist. And I don't think they're. That said capital is subordinate to state control, which is subordinate to an org that most people can participate in, so personally I grant them the socialist (market economy) label that they tend to use. But I do understand why not everyone does.

    To be clear, if you're not communist, it doesn't mean you're capitalist. There's a lot in between and it's often a matter of degree of one thing or another. Feudalism didn't turn into capitalism the moment the fist capitalist firm formed. It transitioned to capitalism as more and more production became capitalist, at some point becoming the dominant mode of production.

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  • [–] 3 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    That said even at the present numbers it means every third family or so has a party member.

    This is assuming an even distrubution. I have seen no reason to believe this. Certain segments of society are likely far more represented, which means the others are far less represented.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (1 child)

    You mean like the parts that weren’t Mandarin Han Chinese decent?

    Yeah it’s impossible to ignore what The CCP has done to vulnerable populations that they have decided need to be assimilated into their idea of a dominant culture.

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  • [–] 28 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    socialism with Chinese characteristics

    It's literally the same functional mechanics as free market capitalization EXCEPT that the state owns a part of every company. The people don't. The state does. And only uses it for authoritarian control, which is the Chinese characteristic. China is functionally a capitalist market with state owned companies.

    If China controlled the 3rd party companies in the country then maybe it could be construed as socialist but they own nothing about Apple or NVidia yet billions of dollars flow through them. China is an open market that uses subsidies to offset poor management in those companies. Basically the same thing America did to failing companies in 2008 (looking at you GM).

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  • [–] 4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 child)

    China has a large fully state-owned sector which tends to operate key industries. They also have outsized control over private firms because the banks doling out capital are state-owned. It's how they can effectively direct the private sector to build EVs, chips or whatever other strategic commodity is desired, in addition to having partial ownership in large private firms. Yes Apple and NVIDIA aren't state-owned. You can read about the state owned sector and how it affects the economy. The structure is very differrnt than the US today. It resembles somewhat FDR's US in the 1940s but with even more state control and direction.

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  • [–] 3 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    Nice deflection, as all discussion of economic policy is nothing more. Authoritarianism (coercion through power) is right wing by definition.

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  • [–] 6 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    Isn't any democratic structure performing coercion through power on people who comprise the minority opinion, by doing what the majority decides?

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago

    Authoritarianism (and all Right Wing politics) is about the minority performing coercion on the Majority. A political elite makes decisions. The further Right you go, the smaller the minority.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago

    They have implemented a type of a mixed state that has both socialist and capitalist parts

    Personally, I find it very similar to corporatism.

    I would describe the CCP political ideology as "authoritarianism" and the economic ideology as "corporatism".

    I don't really see anything about the communes, the economy is not socially owned (not run by cooperatives) and the social aspects are veeery limited.

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  • [–] 57 points 10 months ago

    China is only nominally left; they're deeply conservative, and don't exactly empower the people. They are imperialist, as was the USSR.

    And Taiwan did democratically decide what they want. It would be better if China also got to democratically decide what they want.

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  • [–] 15 points 10 months ago (6 children)

    Now is the perfect time for them to do it, I can see why! America may not even respond.

    Yes, I know we are an ally and we're supposed to immediately go to war. So what? We promised to defend Ukraine from Russia, too. Look what happened.

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  • [–] 2 points 10 months ago (5 children)

    Japan has openly vowed to defend Taiwan if China invades.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (3 children)

    Japan is but a USA lapdog. They won't do anything that would displease their master.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (2 children)

    I don't know about that. Most of the world isn't happy with the US right now. They may have been the case 10 or 15 years ago.

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  • [–] 14 points 10 months ago* (1 child)

    it really sucks for the 90%+ of Taiwanese people who don't want to become part of China

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  • [–] 13 points 10 months ago* (2 children)

    There is an expression in science that needs to be used more in polysci 'all models are wrong" The right wing vs left wing political spectrum is a model of political ideologies and a very simplistic one at that. It is also used interchangeably for fundamentally different political tenants. Large government-small government, authoritarian - libertarian, capitalist - socialist. Models are only as good as their ability to predict reality and they are always wrong, they are just simplified models of reality. The moment you are confused saying "but if this country is X-wing, why are they Y" You are either misunderstanding the model, misapplying the model, or are misunderstanding the actual value of a model.

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  • [–] 13 points 10 months ago

    WW3 all the imperialists are acting at once

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  • [–] 34 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    China, a country which is supposed to be left-wing

    Uhh, citation needed? Communism by name only does not a left wing country make

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (2 children)

    So it's never left unless things work perfectly fine? It's always fake left? China's government control of the economy is very very lefty.

    I'm left myself, but this easy escape by some left people really annoys me. Things can only improve if one acknowledges the mistakes and flaws.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago (1 child)

    I mean it's the same reason the Nazis weren't socialist despite being the national socialist party. It's in name only. I don't see a single way in which China is making steps towards becoming a stateless, classless, moneyless society.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago

    Nazis were national-socialists, the contradiction was in the name already. But they also had socialists as main enemies.

    China is ruled by the communist party who still issues vast left literature. If China is not left, no country is left or ever will, as there are no perfect countries and that seems to be the condition number one to count as real left.

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