They walk among us (discuss.online)
submitted 2 months ago by to c/atheism@lemmy.world
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[–] 128 points 2 months ago (19 children)

Maybe we should start reviewing churches the same way: Nice church but the guy at the front was talking funny about his imaginary friend... Only two stars.

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  • [–] 85 points 2 months ago (14 children)

    Lol the stained glass was beautiful but they hate gays here

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  • [–] 37 points 2 months ago (13 children)

    The priest clearly doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Matthew 6:5-6 states “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.”. One star for not obeying the Bible.

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  • [–] 13 points 2 months ago* (9 children)

    You are not wrong but Jesus wasn't against group prayer, he intended on building a church a few pages later

    Matthew 16:18

    And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

    You should have referenced a couple of pages after that where he has something direct to say about preachers

    Matthew 23:8-12

    “But you are not to be called ‘Rabbi,’ for you have one Teacher, and you are all brothers. And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah. The greatest among you will be your servant. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.

    Jesus had some pretty rad opinions even if his reasoning was often flaky

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  • [–] 8 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Yes, sure, he's a little flaky. But God is just so perfect, all loving, and timeless...

    Exodus 21:20-21:

    Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 months ago* (5 children)

    Matthean Jesus is cut your balls off for god levels of wild.

    I'm not sure one can just pick lines out of random Gospels as 'what Jesus said', the US got really weird with that a while back with a red letter 4 gospel meme thing going viral.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    I'm not sure one can just pick lines out of random Gospels as 'what Jesus said',

    That's literally how Christianity works. I don't know of any denomination that follows the entire Bible exactly. It's not even possible because the text is self-contradictory in places.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

    Peter was demonstrably a superstitious idiot throughout the gospels. Jesus was just letting us all know what kind of people would be in charge of the organized religions with his name on them.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 months ago (3 children)

    More importantly, if your faith is having an effect on policy.. guess what, your religion must now start paying taxes.

    Why should the rest of us pay for your idiotic ideas that are now turning into policy and law.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    That would gladly pay the taxes if it means they get to force their religion on people. They already openly.defy election law by endorsing candidates and "vote yes on prop 66” statements during services, inviting prosecution because they expect to win in court.

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  • [–] 193 points 2 months ago (12 children)

    when people flat out refuse to consider facts, evidence, reality in forming their worldview, then the only thing left is mockery and ridicule, lest other people buy into the stupid bullshit

    religion is a fucking cancer on the human species--it's causing preventable deaths ("nO iNsULiN fOr BaBy!!! PRAYING WILL FIX IT"), and it's long past time for it to be relegated to the embarrassing/shameful/fucking asinine drawer of history files

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  • [–] 74 points 2 months ago (3 children)

    Now remember: These people are still allowed to vote...

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  • [–] 45 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    And worse they exist in sufficient numbers for political parties wanting to cater to their views and ideas, changing the political landscape. Influencing policies, law making.

    (This is a pretty echoey comment I guess)

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago

    They captured the religious racists in the south with the "Southern strategy" then Jerry Falwell captured the "religious" right with his anti-abortion message. From there we slithered into the Republican utopia of corporate dictatorship, poverty, ignorance and unaffordability.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    “God put those fossils there to test our faith!”

    Always gets me.

    They’d sooner believe that their god would lie to them rather than that they’re wrong.

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  • [–] 5 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

    The sad thing is that even mockery probably won’t help much, because this type of person, unfortunately, defends their ignorance with the very same, utterly idiotic strategy that allows those who control them to shield their outrageous nonsense from rational arguments: They convince their deluded followers that they belong to "the select few" who know the truth—"the enlightened", or whatever they call themselfs. Thus, they proudly flaunt their absurd ignorance, paying no heed to arguments or ridicule, since they are genuinely convinced that they are the only ones who cannot be deceived.

    However, these people cannot—and, above all, do not want to—realize that the deception lies precisely in their leaders’ strategy, for that would mean, of course, that they have wasted half their lives on some charlatan who has not only shamelessly exploited them but has also made them the laughingstock of society. Their idiocy is an integral part of their self-image and their personality, which is why turning away from it often means turning away from everything by which they define themselves - and that surely is a hard thing to do.

    These are the typical tactics used by cult leaders. Unfortunately, there is an frighteningly high number of people who are susceptible to them—and not just in matters of religion, as the MAGA cult makes abundantly clear: It operates according to the same logic—an in-group is formed and sworn to the cult leaders’ goals, with the immediate understanding that rationality must be replaced by slavish faith in the leader or some kind of promise of salvation, because otherwise the cult members would, of course, immediately see through all the crude lies.

    It's truly amazing that even in an age when almost everyone carries the entirety of human knowledge in their pocket, it still works, but unfortunately, the internet also has the effect of bringing like-minded people together in their absurd worldview, as is the case with Truth Social, for example—though the name of this deranged platform already makes it very obvious that it is a tool designed precisely and exclusively to fulfill the aforementioned cult tactics.

    Edit: Of course, you’re still absolutely right: scorn and contempt are the only things one can show toward people like this—they themselves are probably beyond redemption anyway, but openly rejecting them makes it harder for them to recruit new members for their cult. These people should be treated for what they are: a danger to society, even if they themselves are often nothing more than foot soldiers who may even be unwittingly advancing the interests of their evil masters.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago*

    It's probably corny to reference Star Wars here but Andor really nailed it with the Mon Mothma speech when she said the distance between what's said in the senate and known to be true has become an abyss and that the loss of an objective reality was perhaps the most dangerous thing to risk in a democracy. There is no common ground to have with these nutjobs because every time you offer them an inch, they'll ask for a mile more.

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  • [–] 94 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (30 children)

    It's wild that some people do genuinely believe the earth is only 6000 years old.

    There are human-made artefacts you can go look at in a museum right now, potentially even touch with your own hands, that are older than 6000 years old.

    Even if you refused to accept other archaeological evidence, recorded human history goes back about 10000 years. So are those 4000 years worth of humans just non-existent?

    ((Edit - @Danquebec@sh.itjust.works is kinda right. The very earliest of proto-writing, for when one could even argue that recorded history begins, is around 6000-6600 years ago. So that actually would be within the Christian faith timeline, but just barely. And I seriously doubt the Christians had these people in mind as their earliest ancestors.))

    Like it really must take some proper mental gymnastics to deny something you can see with your own eyes and say some demon made it all up specifically to fuck with Christians.

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  • [–] 58 points 2 months ago (9 children)

    Quite easy to explain: 6000-6500 years ago, when god created the world, it put those things there during the creation process for... reasons.

    Checkmate atheists!

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  • [–] 51 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    Because he's a trickster! Haha! And if you fall for one of his tricks, he sends you to hell! For eternity!

    The sanest worldview.

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  • [–] 29 points 2 months ago (3 children)

    No, you see, the devil, who is a trickster and definitely not the same entity as God, created those fake artifacts to own the libs

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  • [–] 44 points 2 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 31 points 2 months ago*

    “I do not understand,” reads an ancient line of pictographs depicting the sun, the moon, water, and a Sumerian who appears to be scratching his head. “A booming voice is saying, ’Let there be light,’ but there is already light. It is saying, ’Let the earth bring forth grass,’ but I am already standing on grass.”

    “Everything is here already,” the pictograph continues. “We do not need more stars.”

    (thank you for sharing the link. i hadn't read that one yet and it's very good <3)

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  • [–] 20 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    In North Africa 40,000 years old tools have been found as well

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  • [–] 12 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    There is also hand stencil art in places like Indonesia and Australia from 67,800 years ago

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  • [–] 15 points 2 months ago

    And as I understand it, the aboriginese can actually "read" the stensils and paintings. A continuous culture over 40k years old....

    It would be like we could read and understand the Lascaux Cave paintings like modern signs. And they are freshly painted compared to the Australian stuff at a mere 20k years old.

    This does not get the attention it deserves

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  • [–] 17 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    We've found 28,000 year old dildos.

    To be clear, yes there are sex toys older than Christians think the world is old.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

    Like it really must take some proper mental gymnastics to deny something you can see with your own eyes and say some demon made it all up specifically to fuck with Christians.

    Well, you can't see the age of a thing. And young-earth creationists certainly don't understand how we know the ages of things. So instead, they believe what they're told by people they trust, and those people say shit like "were you there?"

    And honestly, my response (if it ever comes up) will be this: "Yes. I was there. I am God. I was there before there was. I formed this world from nothing. I am your God. Worship me." And if they question any of that, I will respond with "WERE YOU THERE?!! CUZ I FUCKING WAS!!! AND I SURE AS HELL DIDN'T SEE YOU THERE!!!" followed by "PROVE ME WRONG"

    Thank you, have a nice day/night <3

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    For a lot of people, science is just a matter of believing in something someone tells you, no different from religion...

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    Well I'm pretty sure you can boil ALL science down to a simple equation. 1 + 1 = 2. Then science is built up from that. Until 1 + 1 isn't equal to 2, I'll go ahead and trust in science.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    While that is a valid argument for someone to make, I'd counter by saying that science is fundamentally built on the idea of empiricism and falsifiability.

    With enough time, money, and the right equipment you could theoretically retrace every discovery science has ever made, from the stone age to the modern day Dr. Stone style.

    Whereas the same really cannot be said for Religion. You can't test for God. You can't discover a miracle. There's no hard evidence, only belief.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (1 child)

    Now try explaining that to someone who thinks science is a matter of belief. Spoilers: they will stop paying attention after you say "empiricism and falsifiability".

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    Yeah. Fair enough. That counter only really works against someone playing devil's advocate or who would actually hear you out.

    It'd have to be a bit snappier otherwise. Probably just "Every scientific discovery ever made could be retested and remade if you had enough time and money. There's no test on Earth you can do to actually show me God"

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (1 child)

    Recorded human history doesn't go back 10'000 years. It's closer to 5000 years.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    You're very much right. Complex writing systems like we have now begin around 4000-5000 years ago. You can get closer to the right number with proto-writing systems, but unfortunately just barely within what the Christian faith allows.

    I guess the Christians can take the W on that one, discounting all over physical evidence of humanity's existence beyond 6500 years ago.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (2 children)

    Humanity in 6k years would be quite the speedrun at a humorous glance.

    Any other perspective arguing this is absolute lunacy.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Exactly. By the time you get to 6500 years ago, humanity has already been doing settlements and agriculture that we have archeological evidence of for 1000s of years.

    Judging from the estimated timeline of humanity, 6500 years wouldn't even be long enough for us to migrate beyond the hunter-gatherer system and stone tools.

    Our ancestors had 100,000s of years, and we only got to settlements and agriculture maybe 10-20K years ago.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    Also mind biological changes aren't really quick (but sometimes spontaneous, yes) and even I can now talk about things that happened in two different centuries. So a few thousand years aren't even that much generations (even if you count shorter lifespan but that is mostly a statistical thing due to high death rate of babies).

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  • [–] 69 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    This exact thing happened to me when I was visiting Luray Caverns in Virginia. A kid kept interrupting the tour guide to spout this nonsense, while his parents looked on proudly. The rest of the group eventually audibly groaned whenever the kid opened his mouth. Besides the absolute nonsense the parents were happily teaching this kid to be a rude dickhead.

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  • [–] 36 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    They are trained to act when some words are said. The parents reward this behavior because it "brings more souls to salvation". In the end it just annoys professionals and makes them unable to teach in class or to even give a tour.

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  • [–] 22 points 2 months ago

    Worse is it's almost guaranteed these insufferable types will suddenly clutch their pearls if you tell them to stop talking "you're interrupting my presentation" "you're suppressing the word of God. I'm the victim here, not these people I'm repeatedly annoying"

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  • [–] 14 points 2 months ago

    "You are using the Lord for your own Vainglory, you claim your words for His, that is Heresy at best and Apostasy in truth. You have turned your back on The Lord and thus must be silent on his workings Apostate."

    I've found this tack works real good for shutting up most crazys in public spaces, I don't recommend using it in private or with people you have to interact with regularly/repeatedly.

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  • [–] 64 points 2 months ago (12 children)

    Imagine being confident that its not 300m, but unable to pin it down to the exact number of years. It was only 6000-6500 years ago, did you lose count?

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  • [–] 61 points 2 months ago* (11 children)

    Both views can be right, assuming big enough errorbars.

    Earth is 6000 years old ±14 billion years.

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  • [–] 38 points 2 months ago (8 children)

    Earth was actually created last Thursday.

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  • [–] 34 points 2 months ago (5 children)

    Actually, no. The earth was created this morning, when I woke up. I was dropped into it in media res, complete with a backstory and the lore. It will be deleted when I go to bed tonight.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 months ago

    Actually all that exists runs entirely in RAM. But it's virtual RAM so nothing really exists. This is all just an illusion of existence, a false reality. Persistent potential state that is never realized.

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  • [–] 58 points 2 months ago (7 children)

    The author of that review also doesn't know how to use punctuation.

    "They gave inaccurate information from a Christian perspective," is most straightforwardly read as if the person giving the information is Christian.

    Whereas, "They gave inaccurate information, from a Christian perspective," is what they meant, that the receiver of the information is Christian.

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  • [–] 12 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Yeah, I had originally read it as if the tour guide was giving incorrect information, like by using religious terminology instead of B.C.E./C.E.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    What if the tour guide says "300 million B.C.E."?

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    lol, in my defense I had that thought after only reading the first 2 sentences, and I could see a cave tour including information like "This cave was discovered in B.C.E./C.E." But "300 million B.C.E." would certainly get me to literally laugh out loud if a cave tour guide said that.

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  • [–] 11 points 2 months ago* (1 child)

    The Venn Diagram of People who believe a literal interpretation of the Bible & People who don't know how to write well, is pretty much a circle within a circle.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    That makes me think. Has there ever been a person who actually wrote a lot of fiction, like a novelist or something, who read the Bible and didn't see signs that the authors were mostly either making shit up or retelling a story that they heard? Like, if it really was the inspired word of God, like God is just whispering in people's ears, you'd think an author would sense something unusual or different about the quality of the writing, but it's really no different from any old shit that some human might write.

    So, it may in fact be that the only people who can believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible are people who cannot write well. Once you learn to write well, you lose the ability to believe in the literal interpretation of the Bible. Well, that ignores the real problem of compartmentalization, but it's an interesting idea, I think.

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