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[–] 116 points 9 months ago (11 children)

Every proteat over ICE I've seen HAS been peaceful. The only time things get non-peaceful is by ICE. Spraying pepper spray in childrens faces. Slamming elderly face first into pavement. Oh, and would you believe ICE is actually murdering people now? It's true.

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  • [–] 58 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (10 children)

    Peaceful protest means not pushing back against officers. Peaceful protest means not setting fires. Peaceful protest means not breaking windows. Peaceful protests means not blocking roads. Peaceful protest means not taking a knee before the football game.

    Peaceful protest actually seems to mean sit in the corner, shut the fuck up, and do as your told.

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  • [–] 31 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    Property damage isn't violence. And it's become wild that people equate it as such.

    Peaceful protests can include property damage. I think it's entirely valid to obstruct, damage, and impede.

    The only people using violence, the ONLY PEOPLE, have been ICE and the police. The only people not being peaceful have been ICE and the police.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    The issue is that property damage usually just fucks over the community long term. Cool, you ransacked some corpo shit. Now who's going to be willing to move into that space?

    And it never stops at just damage to government and corpo-shit. Go ahead and fuck up your local spaces, but don't be surprised if things don't magically build back better when people don't want to live in places where this sort of shit goes down.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Naaaah, LA was peaceful and they set fire to some police cars and a waymo. They didn't hurt anyone.

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  • [–] 32 points 9 months ago* (1 child)

    Sorry if I was unclear, there is no protest peaceful enough for anyone claiming No Kings / Anti-ICE marches are not peaceful. Those types simply don't want protest, full stop.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago

    Oh I see, I agree. The don't want protest because they work. That's why parts of Asia and the Middle East try and stop them by slaughtering them.

    I will say though, it's easy to get your point confused with the people trying to start chaos in America by saying peaceful protests aren't enough, that you have to commit suicide by nazi or you don't love your country.

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  • [–] 60 points 9 months ago (16 children)

    You can say fuck on the internet.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (12 children)

    Something I've noticed is that self-censoring seems to artificially increase the rank of post in the feed, as the people who comment about it boost the post's activity, and thus make it show up higher depending on the the viewer's post sorting method chosen.

    EDIT: To be clear, I'm not advocating for self censoring to game the system, it's just something I've observed happening on the posts that do self-censor. Every post with censored swears has always received more comments than it normally would've due to people commenting on the censoring, which has boosted it in my feed.

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  • [–] 12 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (9 children)

    There are no (edit)engagement algorithms here. Engagement should encourage conversation on the topic, not the behaviors of the poster.

    Both self-censorship and "engagement" mentality come from the same diseased source: corporate social media.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    An algorithm is just a defined procedure to apply to a given set of inputs to give a set of outputs. Technically sorting by new is applying an algorithm to the posts, just one with a single step. Something like hot or scaled do take into account number of comments and views.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago* (3 children)

    The 'Hot' and 'Active' sorting options on your homepage is a primitive sorting algorithm, explained further in the lemmy docs themselves:

    A recent post with more comments will rank higher when using the 'Active' sorting method, hence why self-censored posts, which encourage people to call out the self-censoring as unnecessary (which I agree with) likely boost the self-censored post higher than it would've gotten without the censoring.

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  • [–] -2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Just like with the other person I said this to: There are no algorithms that shadow-drop the topic like on other platforms. You knew exactly what I meant when I typed it, but chose a different path.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 child)

    I'm not saying that lemmy's algorithm is at all similar to mainstream social media's dark patterns and addictive algorithms.

    Lemmy's use of a simple algorithm is necessary for this site to function at all (sorting newer posts from older posts is itself an algorithm), and does not imply that something nefarious is afoot. But it does use, by definition, an algorithm.

    To state there are no algorithms is objectively false.

    My observation is that the posts that self-censor happen to (likely not even intentionally) boost the popularity of said censored post due to the increased amount of comments against the self-censoring, as a result of the simple (non-addictive and non-exploitative) nature of Lemmy's sorting algorithm.

    Take note that so far, this post has received 12 comments in a short time just regarding the censoring, rocketing it up to be seen by more people, some of which will add their own thoughts on the censoring, and perpetuate its increased ranking in the feed.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Yes there are, or the 'hot' and 'active' sorting orders wouldn't exist.

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago* (1 child)

    There are no algorithms that shadow-drop the topic like on other platforms. You knew exactly what I meant when I typed it, but chose a different path.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago

    Yes, I knew exactly what you meant which is why I challenged it.

    What they were describing is a part of the Lemmy algorithm. Posts with more engagement get higher spots on the Active and Hot sort orders.

    What you said was basically a strawman.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Yep, I've heard all manner of ignorant and anti-social shit along those lines.

    "If you don't like it, leave." - From people who bitched and moaned about everything for 2 Obama terms and 1 Biden term.

    "Why don't they have jobs? / Why aren't they in church?" - About people out protesting on a Saturday morning.

    "This isn't going to accomplish anything." - From people sitting on their computers doing nothing, except claiming they want the same things as me, even though they're not willing to put any effort into anything at all that involves leaving the comfort of their devices' screens.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    Do those people even matter? What are you adding here?

    We need to resist, above all else, not try to uncover "the truth" that is plainly obvious to everyone.

    They are gaslighting you, because they see it works, because they don't see you as a person.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Put them on the defensive. Ask MAGAts why they hate freedom when they try and shit talk about protesters.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Can agree this is very effective at shutting them the fuck up. All of them have moved so incredibly far away from even a basic understanding of freedom that it becomes the easiest thing to point out with pretty much every talking point they have.

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  • [–] 17 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Unfortunately, some people have an intense "don't rock the boat" worldview. I know some people who genuinely think that any kind of protests is "extremist", even if it's protests on worsening cost of living and housing affordability.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    The vast majority of people I know offline think all these protests are staged by paid actors because they can't imagine that anyone would want to go do the right thing without asking "What's in it for me?" It's insane.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    That's a failed system if you ask me. People apply to be slaves now. They pay a lot of money and even go in massive debt, and go to slave school for 3 years just so they could be slaves for the rest of their lives. And it's not even guaranteed you will be allowed to be a slave, you need to look better than other slaves on the masters slave menu. Wasn't capitalism supposed to be about building your own business and creating something of your own? Instead, everyone just lining up to work for 3 companies that exist anymore.

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  • [–] 15 points 9 months ago

    As someone in Minneapolis it's also the most out of touch bullshit to say to people that are just trying to walk to a bus stop or pass some car on their street when it's parked in the middle of the fucking road. It's impossible to not 'interfere' with those shitheads because they think they own the 9 blocks around them

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  • [–] 14 points 9 months ago (8 children)

    Bush II's wars generated the largest peaceful protests of their time. They were ignored.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    What do you mean by “Il’s”

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (1 child)

    They weren't ignored, they were large protests but out numbered by voters who were okay with the wars. If the protests in 2003 were sufficiently large enough Bush wouldn't have been re-elected in 2004.

    Protest doesn't mean you just immediately get your way if the crowd is reasonably large.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    And I remember there were reports of garbage bags fill with ballots found during the 2004 election that were never investigated. Nothing that Trump and his administration is doing surprises me because we've seen smaller versions of it during Bush.

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  • [–] 14 points 9 months ago

    Even this post mocking the concern trolls is too generous. People are already protesting peacefully - what they want is for you to protest in a manner that won't make them uncomfortable. In other words, where they can ignore it.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago

    The thing they're protesting isn't peaceful.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago

    Yep and also whats your definition of "peacefully" because often people try to frame any disruption of life as "violence" never even mind property destruction.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Just a quick reminder,

    Protests are the peaceful alternative. Even "violent" protests are the peaceful alternative.

    If you want to see what kind of behavior let to e.g. democracy and protests, think french revolution.

    French revolution like stuff is the default. Protests are the mercy of the masses.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Isn't there are a similar thing with Unions? Or so I have heard.

    CEOs love slandering it but before we invented sitting down to negotiate with them, exploitive factory owners still existed.

    It is said that when enough workers got mad, they would fucking burn the owner; and there was much rejoice.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago

    I'm really worried that it's the people protesting the illegal death squads that aren't peaceful enough

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago*

    Why can’t people protest peacefully? shut up and let me live in willful, convenient, ignorance?

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago* (2 children)

    What does she suggest everyone do? Get executed like Alex Pretti for just having a gun on him?

    Minnesota fucking rocks and don't belittle how they and LA handled this shitty situation. Fuck, trump had to pull his goons in LA because they didn't get what they wanted.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago
    [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    Like cops yelling "Stop Resisting" while they beat you with their batons.

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago

    The word is "fuck." Lemmy isn't TikTok, Facebook, YouTube, or whatever location you got this habit from. Stop censoring yourself. We know what you're trying to say when you abbreviate it; doing so is complying with the corporate powers and other entities that want to control our language.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    i have a friend who keeps touting the line of "oh they attacked ice first." he's even been spreading j6 denialism too. i absolutely hate this timeline, he wasn't always like this.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    You are in control of who you’re friends with. People change, for better or worse.

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    easier said than done when you've known someone for half your life. i've known some others who have gone way further off the deep end than him. i guess i'm just holding on hoping there's a come to jesus moment.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Why couldn't ICE been a little nicer about murdering Renee Good and Alex Pretti?

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    Fck

    Fck

    Fck

    Fck

    Just say fuck.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    ITT: People ignoring-concept because of the use of "fck" instead of "fuck"; also others undermining the usefulness of mass-movements without violence

    I'm all for offensive-defending, but we aren't quite there yet (but unfortunately close). It's trying to save what we can and take back what we lost. The consequences can be read about later, but for now... fascists are cowards and fear actualization of their own consequence

    They'll fight tooth and nail to instill fear of repercussions, because of the fear of their own actions having consequences... cowards — as well as a small minority.

    They're afraid of peoples united, so they act-out and terrorize in order to stave-off the people, and defend their own intolerance

    It won't be pretty, but it doesn't need to be a blood-bath. "Strong in the real way" is harder for masses to agree on... but that's what the fascist fucks count on. They need fear to survive and control

    Fuck Nazi's. (pissant peasants clinging to an idea of power to quell their own self-hatred)

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    I go to peaceful protests and I yell at the liberal cucks "why can't you be violent! Kill people now. Condone first degree murder. Commit arson!"

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago* (4 children)

    These protests are the fisher price version of what should be really happening.

    We are basically fighting organized crime with pool noodles.

    Imagine being so absent from reality that you aren't at a point weighing life and death in order to make change for the positive cause.

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