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[–] 109 points 1 year ago* (11 children)

in case there are others like me who have to see what it looks like on a Mercator projection map:

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

    Wow. I can't believe my perspective of the world is that distorted. It makes me want to only look at it in 3D. If we've all mainly looked at Mercator projections our whole lives our sense of where everything is relative to everything else and what direction is completely off.

    People complain about the proportional sizing of Mercator but the sense of direction it gives us is completely broken. I think the average person knows it's off and people think there is an error factor to consider that a really straight like might be a little squiggly. But nope. This made me realize the Mercator gives pretty much zero accurate sense of direction if real distance is involved.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    People complain about the proportional sizing of Mercator but the sense of direction it gives us is completely broken.

    With respect, this is silly. People complain about the proportional sizing of the Mercator projection because disproportionate sizing is literally the only problem with the Mercator projection.

    The sense of direction being off has got literally nothing to do with Mercator. That's an inherent drawback of trying to project a three dimensional globe onto a 2D image. Literally every single projection has this exact problem, in one form or another. It is considered ot be an acceptable trade-off for not having to work with globes all the time.

    Stop looking for yet more baseless reasons to bash the Mercator projection, which is a perfectly reasonable and acceptable projection to use within its intended usecase (which this specific example literally is).

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    Short distances are fine, and obviously directly east/west are fine. Directly north/south is also pretty alright, but, as you move further from the equator, any east or west movement is covering less distance, and vice versa.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    So would there be turning involved still orrrrr?

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  • [–] 79 points 1 year ago* (4 children)

    The word "can" Is doing some heavy lifting here. I mean, there is a difference between theoretically possible and actually being done.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Yeah, it's going through the most dangerous water passage in the world IIRC, between South America and Antarctica. We do go through it fairly regularly at this point, but it's still not "safe."

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  • [–] 47 points 1 year ago (17 children)

    Don’t the circumpolar winds essentially prevent this, or at least make it really impractical?

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  • [–] 88 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    Sorry, can't hear you down here in my submarine

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  • [–] 48 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    DON'T THE CURCUMPOLAR WINDS ESSENTIALLY PREVENT THIS, OR AT LEAST MAKE IT REALLY IMPRACTICAL?

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    No diesel sub is going to have the range to make that trip. And NZ doesn't allow nuclear subs in its waters.

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  • [+] 27 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    The only place you can't sail is directly into the wind. You can go all the other places eventually but it's a lot of back and forth.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Tacking back and forth is kinda the opposite of a straight line though, isn't it?

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  • [–] 39 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    That southern ocean is brutal tho

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  • [–] 35 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Even better, imho, you can sail in a direct line from OG Zeeland (Netherlands) to New Zealand.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Can you, though? You'd have to squeeze through the narrow English Channel first, and that would probably require some turns.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Never mind the English Channel, Drake Passage will probably kill you.

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  • [+] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    "This, then, was the Drake Passage, the most dreaded bit of ocean on the globe—and rightly so. Here nature has been given a proving ground on which to demonstrate what she can do if left alone." -Lansing

    Below 40 degrees south there is no law; below 50 degrees south there is no God -sailing proverb

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  • [–] 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    If it makes you feel better, the line is actually curved along the surface of the earth, you know, if you believe in a spherical earth.

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  • [–] 28 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Now all we need is some insane person with a kayak.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)
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  • [–] 26 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    I got this far on the Wikipedia and gave up:

    On a curved surface, the concept of straight lines is replaced by a more general concept of geodesics, curves which are locally straight with respect to the surface. Geodesics on the sphere are great circles, circles whose center coincides with the center of the sphere.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    I went down a rabbit hole about globes and maps recently

    Basically, to find the shortest distant between two places on a globe (a 'straight' line), imagine a hoop or circle round the earth that cuts it exactly in half, and rotate it until it passes through both places (still cutting it exactly in half)

    That's a great circle.

    There are 2d map projections that are built around this, but they only work when one of the locations is at the center of the map. So it could show the shortest distance from, say, London to anywhere with a straight line, but it wouldn't work for a route not including London

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Another way to think about it is with elastic bands.

    Imagine getting a globe and putting a pin in each place. One pin in the UK, and one in New Zealand. Now put an elastic band between those two pins so that it's tight. The elastic will be as short as possible, which is as straight a line as possible. But, since the globe is curved the elastic has to curve with it. So, that's your straight line on a curved surface.

    If you wrap the elastic around the other side of the globe (you might need a bigger elastic), you can find the other half of the circle. It's the place where the elastic is at its tightest, but also where its evenly balanced between slipping to either side. For example, say you have a pin in California and another one in Japan. Both Japan and California are at about 30-40degrees north latitude. But, if you put an elastic starting in Japan and then going around the earth at 30 degrees north through China, Turkey, Spain, etc. when you let go the elastic will slip to the north until there's no tension anymore. To keep it from slipping you have to balance the tension so it doesn't slip to the north and doesn't slip to the south, so it's going flat around the whole globe. That makes the long half of the great circle.

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  • [–] 26 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    There is also a route that can be drawn from Halifax, Nova Scotia on the Canadian east coast on the Atlantic ... head a bit south east and without touching land and only going over the ocean, you can end up on the west coast of British Columbia, in Canada on the Pacific coast.

    I used to reference a website that showed that ... but now I can't seem to find it. :(

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago* (4 children)

    Another fun one is to ask someone if they were to take off in an airplane from Miami and fly due south, which South American countries would they fly over?

    The answer is none of them. You end up missing the entire continent because you are too far west.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    You hit Panama first, but small portions of Ecuador and Peru are west of Miami (80.2 degrees west). The broader point that South America is much farther east than many Americans think is definitely true, though.

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  • To expand on this idea: the most eastern part of the South American continent (Brazil) and the most western part of Iceland are only about 10° longitude apart. Meanwhile, Iceland shares lines of longitude with a number of countries in western Africa.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I tried replicating this with Google Earth, but once you get past the halfway mark it tries to flip around and draw a line in the other direction. Guestimating it by drawing two lines seems to work ok, but I can't find a way to avoid Australia, while shifting the start and end points between northern and southern NS and BC, and keeping the midpoint either just missing Africa or just missing Antarctica.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    There used to be a website or post where I originally saw this .... I can't find it any more. And there are no more easily accessible websites that can diagram maps with 'great circles' on a globe. This was ten years ago and it used to be easy to find this stuff ... interesting to see that most of those sites are either now gone or don't work any more.

    But from what I remember, the line between Halifax and the west of Canada skirted the edge of Africa and the edge of Australia to make it across the globe without touching any land mass or island.

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  • [–] 25 points 1 year ago

    Hopefully someone shares this with Geowizard, ultimate straight line challenge.

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  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    You can also build a nearly straight railway going from California through Canada and Alaska all the way to China.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bering_Strait_crossing

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    That'd be awesome. That probably wouldn't work because it would take 100 years for California to build their first high speed rail

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago

    You can plot a course in a straight line. Unfortunately, weather.

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  • [+] 10 points 1 year ago* (1 child)
  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago

    The Polynesians took the long route.

    The European explorers actually took a very similar route, so this seems to be an obvious option for sailors doing island hops in that area.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    One of the few world maps with New Zealand on it.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    Only with an icebreaker

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    This is my new favorite globe trivia.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Math nerds are going to have a field day with this statement haha.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Straight line? That looks hella curved, innit? Can't fool us with a globe. A flat map, maybe. But not a globe. Despite it being a 2D representation of a globe

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago


    Comms Officer: Sirs, we still have quite a bit of time to change course.

    Red: But we're going straight.

    Purple: Yeah. Turning's no fun. Why is this happening? Make it not happen.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    straight line

    So the azimut you set to your compass would be a constant, right??

    /s/j

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    This isn't actually surprising, like in a vacuum it is but when you conceder that each point on earth has a full 360 degrees of points that means a line can be drawn to every possible point on earth unless something happens to be in the way, the Earth's surface is 70% water so you only have a 30% chance of hitting something that is already low but it gets much much lower since we know this is cherry picked as the most exaggerated example you only need one instance on the entire earth of a point that can reach around it out of all the infinite points.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    30% wouldn't be a lot if the land were all even-sized islands, but it's all in big chunks; most of which is in a pair of unbroken masses that runs from more or less the North Pole to the Drake Passage. There aren't any straight lines from the British Isles to Hawaii or to Indonesia, or even to Australia if I'm doing the geography correctly; nor are there any straight lines from Madagascar to Greenland, or from Iceland to anywhere in the Pacific, at least by liquid water.

    Add in the fact that we're not used to seeing the roundness of the Earth from any perspective other than along the equator and split on the date line, and it's really just something that puts two things into a category together that don't seem like they should be connected.

    It's like the fact that Mercury is (on average) the closest planet to Venus, but also to Earth, Jupiter, even Neptune. Ok, yes, that shouldn't be a surprise, because it's the closest to the sun and the sun is always in the middle; but it's not the way we usually look at the Solar System, and also we know that Neptune is so far away from Mercury that it's mind-boggling that Mercury could ever be the closest planet to it. It's very unintuitive based on our usual perspective and existing understanding.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    Hum, so it's a straight line, but it's curved, and the compas turns half way.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    Well, yeah..if you want a line that is straight in 3 dimensions then any point on earth at sea level to any other point earth at sea level will require you to go below the surface of the planet.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Fun fact, the UK is about the center of the land hemisphere and new Zealand is about the center of the water hemisphere

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    why do we have to frame info as "cursed"? so cringe

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