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[–] 93 points 1 year ago (22 children)

Coming from a man, Woman's hair products come across as such a scam.

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  • [–] 48 points 1 year ago (21 children)

    It's not about men vs. women, it's short hair vs. long hair. Most men don't have long hair, the dish soap works for short hair but depending on your hair type you want to use something better for long hair.

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  • [–] 46 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    There's a lot of nuance to this topic I think. In my (VERY anecdotal) experience men often have thicker hair which tends to be less brittle less quickly. At least that's my experience as trans woman, around the time my treatment started my hair got slightly thinner and more prone to damage. So it's probably also a hormonal thing.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Cis man here with long hair. My hair is super thin and breaks like crazy. I went to dermatologist (thought I was going bald lol) and it seems that hair changes a lot between people and some advice I've seen online isn't as general as much as people think, like not washing your hair everyday (she told me my hair NEEDS to be washed everyday cause it gets mega oily quickly).

    But yeah, longer hair needs more care for sure, like, I had never used hair conditioner before but now it's a must, started using a hair drier sometimes too. I used to think that women taking a long time to shower and get ready we're just slow but fuck, long hair is a lot of work.

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  • I'd been scrolling through the comments, contemplating sharing my own "dish soap" story, when your comment and the one above both inspired different anecdotes. So although I'm responding to you, I'm just going to go ahead and tie all these topics into one post:

    My hair is like yours. I'm a woman (though I don't feel right saying "cis," since I don't really "get" gender) and have very fine hair on a very oily scalp. Like you, I cannot go a day without washing my hair, lest I encounter issues. 24 hours without a wash is obvious, by sight, by touch, and possibly by smell (if you were to get close.) I wish people would stop spreading that no-wash "advice" as if it'll 100% work for everyone of every hair/skin type. For some of us, it can actually make problems worse.

    I also had a time where I was losing my hair (unrelated to hygiene.) It turned out to be a hormone thing - but not in the way the above commenter hypothesized it would. My estrogen levels were low, which meant my testosterone levels were relatively high. Rather than fortifying my hair, testosterone was making my hair thinner, and the result resembled male pattern balding. Thank fuck, going on an estrogen pill managed to correct and even reverse most of the damage. (Though now I fear the US government trying to take away my birth control, which is actually "magical hair maintenance pills" in my mind. But that's another topic for another day.) Either way, hormones absolutely play a role in hair. Pregnancy and its cocktail of hormones is well-known to cause changes in hair thickness, texture, and even color. However, there are too many variables to precisely pin any one particular effect to any one particular hormone across every single person. For me, estrogen vastly improved my hair. Others' results may vary.

    As to dish soap, I was around 11-13, middle school age. A (female) friend had said she used dish soap instead of shampoo. I was curious and decided to try it. It worked to wash my hair all right, but my hair didn't feel the same afterwards. It's hard to recall by now exactly what was different, but there was something about the resulting texture that was off. I've tried a number of different types of shampoo throughout my life, but every single one of them provided a certain result that dish soap couldn't provide. So although it might suffice for some people, I'll have to add "dish soap as shampoo" to the "things that personally don't work for me" box.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I wash my very long hair 2-3 times a week and often get compliments from women. Many express some variation of "I wish my hair would grow that long" but none of them like the answer. "I do nothing to it. No heat treatments, no bleach, no color, no tight braids, no styling. Shampoo approximately every other day and condition weekly."

    (Dish soap would probably strip the natural oils too aggressively, even for short hair. Rough on the scalp.)

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago*

    I also get those compliments and I also just use shampoo and conditioner (once or twice a week). When I travel and use hotel shampoo/conditioner my hair usually feels noticably worse after (sometimes the hotel stuff is actually nice though).

    I think a lot of it is genetics, and not coloring or bleaching or anything also helps a lot. But conditioner is great and not a scam (and I don't let the male targeted 2 in 1 soap/shampoo stuff anywhere near my hair anymore, that was noticably worse as well)

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Dish soap on hair is actually awful, leaves it dry, clumped/stuck together, and unmanageable. I got something in my hair when I was under 10, all I remember is it was SO BAD I willingly went to wash my hair.

    I have a similar routine to you I don't blow dry either it is towel dry, except I condition each time I wash, and get the same responses from women who equally do not like the "I wash, condition, and cut it (well its been a few years now but) every 3 months, and do nothing else."

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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (13 children)

    Long haired cismale here. I can use the cheapest shower gel and look magnificent.

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  • [–] 25 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Good for you. My hair is frizzy as fuck and I can tell you there is certainly a difference between a $3 and $12 conditioner.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I feel you. There's also a huge difference between cheap conditioner and no conditioner.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Water hardness matters a lot, too. When I visit my family and shower with their super soft water, I could use industrial degreaser and my hair would be just fine.

    But when I'm at home where the water is super hard? I better use a shampoo without sodium laureth sulfate and condition regularly or my hair will become an uncombable abomination within a few days.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    This actually might be the secret! I live in a hard water area but I’ve got a water softener for my hot water in the house. I’ll have to test this out when I visit friends next who don’t have a softener.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    My hair is also frizzy as fuck and the only thing that matters is styling gel. Hair care routine is basically meaningless for me, when either washed or unwashed, I get the same frizzy style until I gel up and style my hair.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I’m a guy. I’ve had very long hair and very short hair, and everything in between. I’ve always just used regular shampoo whatever generic regular brand I find.

    As someone else mentioned it’s more about the styling afterwards. And also the hair type.

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  • [–] 61 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    As a guy with long curly hair, it is not that simple.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    True, when I plan well enough it's glorious: shower the night before, CG shampoo bar + stay in conditioner and I can just run my fingers trough my hair to style it the day after

    When I shower before an event it's a very thin line between too frizzy or too greasy and flat.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    My brother spent a week using dog shampoo because he forgot to buy new shampoo. Hair looked the same

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  • [–] -3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

    I prefer those too as the regular soap based shampoo leaves my hair very dry and electrostatic, and my scalp flaking. Well, I use baby shampoo, but dog shampoo is chemically almost the same.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Bold of you to assume the top half of my head still grows hair.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago*

    Am girl. I don’t find that the kind of shampoos and conditioners really matter. I buy all kinds of volume ones for example, and there’s barely any difference. It’s more the styling that comes after. Getting a haircut that works for your hair helps too

    Also I think a lot of guys are just blessed with thicker hair!

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  • [–] 29 points 1 year ago

    As a man who used to have long hair for decades, this is just wrong. But also, usually using more than one shampoo + one conditioner is not going to make much difference.

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago

    Part of the solution is actually not washing your hair too much, or using too much product.

    Your scalp naturally produces a lot of oils etc to keep your hair healthy, and shampoo actually removes this to an extent. Conditioner helps, but it's not the same.

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Relevant Screaming Trees:

    I nearly lost you there

    (Also, bring back 90s hair!)

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Counterpoint: look at any rock band from the 1970s to see what just plain washing with shampoo (very occasionally, apparently) produces. If they ever invent time travel, I'm going to let everybody else handle killing baby hitler (and baby cheetoh I suppose) and go back to the '70s with some conditioner. I will rule the rock world!

    Edit: I might also try at least mentioning to people how fucked up it was that these guys were raping 14-year-old girls all the time (and sometimes the same 14-year-old girl).

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago

    "If it's good enough for penguins, it's good enough for me. 😎"

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    Boys: now bald

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago*

    It's mainly to do with longer and seldom cut hair being a lot harder to keep healthy than shorter and often cut hair is.

    Being a man or woman doesn't directly dictate the quality of one's hair, rather in the current cultural environment it influences how long one's hair is likely to be allowed to get before it's cut (and how much it gets cut) which in turn influences how healthy one's hair naturally is.

    Then there's also the whole concern with one's external appearence which again in present day culture is also different in average for men and women, with the latter under more social pressure to look well groomed.

    Plenty of guys out there with long hair have to go to a lot of trouble to make it look healthy when they actually try to.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Length and type of hair is what matters. Men with a typical short haircut with straight hair do not benefit from conditioner.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

    As a man with straight hair that is usually on the shorter side I can tell you I get a distinct difference between shampoo only, and shampoo then conditioner. I get a similar effect from 2 in 1 that I just use that... I notice a benefit from 2 applications though (people will actively comment on how soft it looks and ask if I did something different), it is diminished after 2 though.

    I try to only wash my hair a few times a week though when it feels too greasy (longer it gets the quicker this happens) and water isn't enough, usually don't bother with the double wash though.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Yes, it certainly isn't universally true that not all short hair needs conditioner but it is more universally true that long hair does which is why women have more hair products.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    Dishwashing liquid? That’s just good bedhead.

    Well, technically, good bedhead is something much more satisfying, but I hope y’all get my drift.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    For me it didn’t matter what I used, until I tried growing it out and trying long hair. Frizzy hair horrors, until I figured out what hair care process worked for me.

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  • I literally don't use soap or conditioner in my hair except right before I get it cut. They are always like "wow! You have such healthy hair!" Your hair will take care of itself.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I never expected there were so many other long haired men here secretly dealing with hair issues! I thought I'd been dealing with this alone the last few years since I decided to stop buzzcutting myself. Now I wish we had a more active hair community. Not necessarily male only, as this post seems to show we have "human hair" and not "guy hair" or "girl hair."

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  • Apple cider vinegar is the trick

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    That's not true.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    The amount of upvotes this boomer shit has is just fucking embarrassing. Gender has absolutely zero impact on hair. It's all genetics. I'm male and my hair is long and thin as fuck.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago*

    Hormones can play a role as well. Anecdotally, my wife's hair during pregnancy became fuller and less brittle. Duckduckgo "pregnancy hair". A monthly cycle, being on hormonal birth control, etc. will likely have some effect. I definitely agree that genetics does play a bigger role, but claiming that gender/sex plays no role is definitely incorrect.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Cool. Joke is "men dont buy products so they use shit at hand".

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    [–] 2 points 1 year ago
    [–] 0 points 1 year ago
    [–] -4 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Why do people put so much energy into projecting identity politics on a superfluous detail like hair? Who cares? It's all just a vanity concern, selfishly obsessed with what others think about how you look.

    Does your hair make you have some intrinsic identity to others that you are or are not going for? Fuck you, I don't care.

    Do you authentically care, yourself?

    Maybe you care about the politics - I can understand that. There is legitimate fear around legislating serious, dangerous things to your identity (not hair). Why the fuck are you spending your time and energy on hair???

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Do you care about your appearance in any capacity or do you just roll out of bed and go on with your day?

    If so, why the fuck are you spending your time and energy on your appearance?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I do, of course. I even do my hair. I didn't mean to imply that one should not care about it hygienically, just for your own health and personal self image.

    I just don't understand the urge to thrust gender identity onto hair style and then argue about what that means to the polity online.

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  • [+] -15 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    Yeah, men also don't have long hair. Women use proper shampoo because they have long hair which has to stay in good condition for way longer.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    You've never been to a metal concert, huh?

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Ok I'll bite.

    Men with long hair either have shit hair, like I did when I had long hair, or they use multiple shampoos and conditioners, like my metal friends do.

    Lets not do this gatekeeping shit.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    Genetics and other factors play a roll. I have long hair and am male. I use a cheap shampoo 3 times a week and a conditioner once a month. I find the most important thing is brushing regularly to keep it looking good and spread the natural oils around.

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  • [+] -9 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    What's this got to do with gender though? It's not the hair, but the product which differentiates. "Woman's" products are a scam, in every single category. Especially "woman's only" products like tampons etc...

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    How are tampons a scam? Especially in the context of hair products?

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  • [–] -3 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    gendered products are scams, tampons are actually toxic, plus insanely expensive, which they don't need to be.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    tampons are actually toxic, plus insanely expensive,

    That's a scandal, not just a scam. But tampons are actually a necessity for many women who are not comfortable with other period products.
    I see your point with many gendered products like pink kinder surprise that cost more than the regular or an unnecessary bunch of hair products marketed gendered.
    But the way you delivered your example in this context was not well phrased.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Yeah maybe, these topics make me sad and I don't really like to indulge in them. So I don't spend time thinking about my arguments, but generally, period products are way overpriced, and often use chemicals proven to be harmful.

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