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[–] 37 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (25 children)

Why wouldn't you use one of the dozens of existing p2p chat apps?

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  • [–] 14 points 3 weeks ago* (23 children)

    Most of them are already banned or restricted. I think Briar is still accessible. But it entered into maintenance mode.

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  • [–] 17 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (15 children)

    How can they be banned? I mean like logisitically. It's just software. Navigate to where the file is hosted and click download.

    What prevents this new app from being "banned" in the same way?

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  • [–] [S] 11 points 3 weeks ago* (14 children)

    Briar is a great option and that is the other option we are pushing people to install! removedat's latest version has a critical bug and the only way to add people is via QR code scan. We are looking to looking to build on top of Briar, since it does not have some important features we are looking for out of the box.

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  • [–] 13 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    What features are you looking for?

    Don't mean to be rude but there are hundreds of private messengers out there and it seems like it could save you some trouble.

    How about Berty? It's FOSS, P2P and works with BT

    https://berty.tech/features

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  • [–] [S] 5 points 3 weeks ago (11 children)

    why is lemmy censoring bit chat's name? that's weird ...

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  • [–] 15 points 3 weeks ago (6 children)

    It's a flaw with the censors. If you stick bit chat together, the b word can be found inside, which lemmy.ml censors.

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  • [–] 7 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)
  • [–] 4 points 3 weeks ago* (2 children)

    But so does your comment now, and it is still there.

    Edit: Oh right, but you're not posting from same instance as the other person, I see now

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  • [–] [S] 4 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Couldn't find any one that works well. Even Berty is not good, the link it creates has a bug, the "Open in the app" button is glitched out. There is no easy way to add someone by just their ID. And even then some of the other features we need dont seem to be there. But please I am open to other suggestions and I will do another deep research again, but what we are looking for is something built specifically for a scenario involving mass mobilisation and there is an option that allows you to consent to relay anyones message, which does not exist.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

    yes. as far as i tried I couldn't even access the briar website or GitHub with a vpn. granted i used free proton vpn.

    also, our main thing is getting information where internet is jammed out from the protest site and to the public. which is why we want the relay feature, so that messages jump across phones to reach people instead of pf having the sender and recipient be directly connected.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Dude what dns are you on?? Also if I remember right they use dpi level packet inspection. Let me research stuff.

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  • [–] 25 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)
  • [–] 23 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (4 children)

    This is also a reason to have functional LoraWan mesh network running before stuff happens, even if it in modern world feels like pointless techy thing for enthusiast.

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  • [–] 12 points 3 weeks ago* (1 child)

    exactly. we need to decentralise communication very desperately considering the direction big tech and the entire world seems to be going in. we're planning on supporting LoRa radios as relays in this app as well.

    i was thinking we can crowdfund a few but then they need very tech forward people to set up, which are scarce. most "tech people" in india including most engineers, are just corporate slaves with no thinking for themselves. Open Source enthusiasts are so rare.

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  • [–] 8 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 child)

    This is also a reason to have functional LoraWan mesh network

    fyi LoRa is a useful building block for building offline (non-internet) mesh networks but LoRaWAN is not: LoRaWAN is for IP-over-LoRa and it requires one of the nodes to have internet access to talk to a centralized server which mediates everything. (tldr: forget about LoRaWAN.)

    Sorry I don't have time to braindump on other things in this space, but I will say https://columba.network/ looks interesting - it is a reticulum client for android which can use LoRa (if you have a LoRa radio) and also BLE (100m range) and WiFi (both locally to other nodes and to the internet to talk to distant nodes). I have not actually tried Columba myself, but i think it looks promising.

    edit: looking closer i think the one big missing feature in Columba for this type of application is group chat. Unfortunately Reticulum doesn't have a decentralized group chat yet; its 1:1 chat protocol (LXMF) is completely decentralized (two people can keep talking if they're in range of each other even when they can't see anyone else in the mesh) but the group chat protocol it has now (called RRC, similar to IRC) requires a centralized relay server. You can run an RRC relay yourself, including on a non-internet-connected network, but it only works for people who are able to reach that relay (and it doesn't keep history so you miss what was said while you couldn't reach it). I see that the Columba author has actually implemented RRC for Android, but it's currently in a separate app called eridanus. I don't know if anyone is trying to build a decentralized group chat protocol on top of reticulum yet but probably someone is. It's a very complicated problem to solve well, though.

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  • [–] 21 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Im just spitballing here but why make a new app? Can't you implement a custom interface for a mesh network? (Like reticulum)

    The benefit would be that you won't have reimplement messaging apps, encryption stuff etc. it might be a bit slow though but i guess that is a good tradeoff to make

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    will have to research on this! isn't reticulum specifically for stuff like LoRas though? can it use just phones as relays in a mesh?

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  • Reticulum is built on the ideology that hardware layer should be independent of application layer. So it can use LoRa, normal internet etc as the harware layer. Im not super informed about it tbh, but I would recommend a project like this where you only have to implement the communication layer over bluetooth rather than everything all at once.

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  • [–] 17 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)
  • [–] [S] 10 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Briar is our next best option. We have shared with our communities a proper guide on how to set up and use Briar. The only issue with Briar is that mesh communication can happen only through Forums and its functionality appears to be a bit un-intuitive for people not that comfortable with such technology.

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  • [–] 54 points 3 weeks ago* (5 children)

    Just use Briar. Anything else is not just pointless but dangerous. Use existing software that has been audited and is known to be safe. More fancy features are never more important than security.

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  • [–] 24 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    No! We have to the develop a new better app!

    https://xkcd.com/927/

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  • [–] 11 points 3 weeks ago* (2 children)

    Note that these types of messengers are considered 'illegal' by the Govt. BitChat (fuck Dorsey) got removed from app stores recently.

    So if this gains some attraction you will probably get cease and desist or ISP level bans. You will need backups for addressing all these blockers down the road.

    Good luck.

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  • [–] 16 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    I highly doubt you will be able to put together anything secure and stable enough within few days, especially by vibe coding. Just pick any existing maintained messenger even if you have to make some compromise. Remember to switch to encrypted dns and a vpn as well. If you are still unable to access something, let me know and I will do my best to help you out. Good luck!

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago*

    hey! we did fork an existing project only. we didn't use briar because briar doesn't have the mesh capability, and also, it was WAY too unstable and will hinder wide adoption. if it's not adopted widely, it's basically useless.

    bit chat was removed from both the app store and the play store and its latest release had a pretty big stability issue where it straight up crashes when you try to scan a qr to add someone. also it can't be shared offline like briar can. I don't know, i guess you all right, we just built this out of desperation because the mesh feature is the most necessary one which actually allows information to get OUT of protest sites and into the view of the internet.

    and as of the last protests, removedat didn't have the talk over internet feature implemented at all.

    and I mean, we're only just looking for guidance to make the most accessible and widely adoptable route for communication and organising. any help is definitely appreciated :)

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 3 weeks ago

    Luckily things are not that bad (yet)! SMS texts were working during the last protest (NOT the July ones which eventually led to the resignation of the Education minister) and Supreme court has directed that internet facilities shall remain unhindered amid the ongoing protests. So this does not have to be done within even a week or so. If you are willing to help though, it would be great to get in touch on Signal. Can I DM you?

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  • [–] 5 points 3 weeks ago
    [–] [S] 4 points 3 weeks ago

    Being banned is not the issue, we can distribute the APKs one way or another. Its that they dont have the features we need and are not user friendly enough.

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  • [–] 11 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    It's really wild that someone wants to vibecoding while their threat model involved state level bad actor. What you guys need is not toys moving fast, but a team of security experts to ensure your app not being used as bait to trap the whole team. Tragedy is not no tools to use today, tragedy is we ignore dictators in globe reuse same strategy on others and we ignore others' scream,tears and think dictators will spare us and hence not develop these tools, network in day 1. I am no expert,but I would learn from someone who prepare these threats in day 1 instead of vibecoding. And I am glad someone to contribute their expertise to help the hopeless one. Good luck.

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  • [–] [S] 11 points 3 weeks ago* (1 child)

    Indeed! Looking for experts to help with this. We will NOT go forward with publicising and having anyone use this until its audited and worked on properly. Cheers!

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  • [–] 0 points 3 weeks ago

    I read lots of comments already give you suggestions. I don't want to comment which solution is the best, but inconvenience is not a good reason. If death threat is real, you will and have to be patient and learn whatever to save your life. Heros already show up and give you a hand and it's up to you to reach his hand.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago* (2 children)

    What about bitchat? It uses a local bluetooth mesh, no server required and you can install the apk directly from their site.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Sorry I too am not an app developer and have a suggestion for an app. Have you considered https://f-droid.org/packages/app.getknit.knit?

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  • [–] -3 points 3 weeks ago

    you do realize that any mention of AI immediately nukes any credibility for the project, right?

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