Or maybe just band together and fight for more time off for everyone so you aren't at the will of a few billionaires obsessed with you as slave labor?
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Best thing my job ever did for me was give me a phone stiped to get a dedicated work phone. I work in government and it allows me to log into work systems without mixing with my personal stuff, allows me to work remote more easily, and keeps my main personal phone from being subject to Open Records requests.
But what it also means is I can leave the phone at the house and forget work when I'm off the clock. With previous jobs I couldn't help myself and I'd read emails and shit I got over the weekend. Now I just turn off the work phone and enjoy my time off.
And if there's a legit emergency that needs my attention, they do have my personal cell number, but simply having it as a separate number keeps them from sending bullshit to it.
Also, it's handy for my boss to be able to send me a short Teams message or something they want me to take care of first thing Monday knowing that they're not interrupting my weekend.
I would never allow any business, private, public, governmental or otherwise to dictate how I use my personal phone. If they're not providing a company device, I'm not interacting with, messaging, logging in, synching, answering emails, etc. with my personal device. It's simply a hard no.
Ya, I just leave the office whenever I need to. I think if asked I might bullshit something about fresh air breaks being in the safety training, but nobody asks.
One of the best parts of a job with a strong union culture.
If I'm not going to be able to get to work, that's literally all I am required to tell them. At this point, management doesn't even want to know why.
Or better yet, don't have social media that's connected to real world people. If nobody knows where you are based on photos nobody can call you out on "being sick" and cashing in a couple of sick days for a quick break.
Might make for a decent prank.
tbh I think it's a bit cruel. If it was real it would ruin your life thinking that your life could possibly be ruined must not be nice.
So I've seen in a previous job where someone was complaining that a guy was leaving at 4pm to get his kid and how it was unfair just because he had a child.
What that person bitching and moaning didn't see was that the parent was getting into work MUCH earlier than him, and would regularly log back on when getting home.
Sure there are some parents who take the piss, but there are also plenty of parents that put the hours in and more, they just need a little flexibility because childcare and the associated costs are a fucking joke and society isn't set up to enable single income families.
I know of jobs where people with kids get to choose assignments more regularly if there's travel involved because they have kids and because the managers have kids. Like, you no kid person, hit the road next week. I mean I get it, but it is discriminatory.
Raising a kid is work. If one of your co-workers had a random second job they had to keep and it paid nothing, how would your treat them?
They chose to get that job. I did not choose to get discriminated against for not choosing that job.
Did they? Most pregnancies are voluntary, but not all
Well you can bitch and moan all you want about breeders but the fact remains that their offspring will finance society as you age.
I am a parent myself and I see reproduction as the most egotistical thing you can do. At the same time those who do not are more or less leeches from a societal perspective.
I the end we are all free to chose paths but stop complaining about the choices others have made. Yours do not make you superior.
Leeches? You're kidding right? I pay into the taxes which fund your child's schools, WIC, libraries, Medicare and all of the other things which children benefit from, that I do not, because I do NOT have children. I'm the opposite of a leech, I contribute more and use less than most parents. You need people like me contributing monetarily, socially, and culturally and not using all of the services to make it all work. I'm not going to shit on people who have kids, because as you said we all make choices, but don't for a second think you're somehow superior because you made a different choice than me.
Yes and when you get old and stop working those kids will pay for you. You do realise that a declining population is problem for this reason, right?
You're assuming I'm not making provisions for myself and will be reliant on the system of taxes for my wellbeing. A declining population is only a problem when the entire system is in shambles. There is more than enough money and resources for every person on this earth to live comfortably; we're just busy throwing away food and spending wealth and resources bombing each other and preventing "unworthy" people from accessing basic necessities.
Don't come at me as if I'm some child hating monster who thinks all parents are bad. I replied because you called me a leech for having the audacity to choose differently than you. I respect parents for the tough job they've taken on, especially in this day and age, but that doesn't somehow make you superior. It takes a village, and not everyone in the village needs to reproduce to make it successful. Get off your high horse.
I may have come of as a hater of the childfree life but I am definitely not. I just can't stand those who complain about others having children. I am if the opinion that you have to choose to have children or not. Neither will make you superior.
their offspring will finance society
That is quite an assumption
stop complaining about the choices others have made. Yours do not make you superior.
those who do not [breed] are more or less leeches from a societal perspective.
Wow. I guess I missed the part where people without kids don't have to pay taxes and just get free retirement...
Well when you get old and stop working those kids will pay back by paying taxes themselves. That is the part you missed.
So when I invest in the future by planting fruit trees I become A leech when I collect fruit off those trees?
The money needed to pay for all elderly people in society is not purely from the taxes we pay whilst we work. We who pay taxes now, are also paying for retired people. If the ratio between retired and non retired is too skewed the quality of life will reduce for the elderly and the retirement age will also have to go up to cover these costs.
I simply meant that if enough people do not provide to the pool of working adults this retirement ratio will be affected. Most economic systems in the west are based on the assumption that people will have kids. Without them there will a deficit since the pool of older people will cost a lot more than what society can handle.
I regret using the word "leech" and I agree that it was too harsh. But if enough people stop producing offspring we end up with a behaviour that is not far from parasitic in that they will at some point expect others to pay for them, others who not exist.
Given the state of the world I totally get why people do not want to have any kids. But I do not understand why people hate on parents so much when they are actually providing something of societal value. So when someone wants you to imagine what it is like to have a second job, this second job is, in fact, indirectly supporting future you as well.
Obviously some people cannot have children and that is fine. It becomes a problem when there is a wave of people who will not. Again, understandable but problematic. I kind of get r/fatpeoplehate vibes from these discussions and it made me react.
I kind of get r/fatpeoplehate vibes from these discussions and it made me react.
Complaining that a group is being given privileges that other people are not, such as more flexible hours and the ability to turn down traveling for work, and expressing a desire to receive the same privileges, is not the same as hating that group.
Fair point, and my mistake. But what these parents receive is humanity, not privelage. This is like a rich person complaining about poor people receiving economic support. Help should be bestowed to those in need.
You say "it takes a village" but how are you, as a childfree person which is complaining about others receiving aid that you yourself do not need, being part of said village? What is your contribution?
But what these parents receive is humanity, not privelage
You've just made it worse. You've gone from "Parents receive privileges that non-parents don't" to "Parents deserve more humanity than non-parents," then you compare non-parents to the mentally ill:
This is like a rich person complaining about poor people receiving economic support
I am in favour of Universal Basic Income, the first word of that being universal. Let the rich person have a drop in their bucket while providing the basic needs of living to everybody.
You say “it takes a village”
When did I say that?
but how are you, as a childfree person which is complaining about others receiving aid that you yourself do not need
What makes you think I don't need a flexible schedule or the ability to turn down traveling for work?
being part of said village? What is your contribution?
As established earlier: Taxes that fund schools and safety nets.
Why would anyone assume that a child free person would automatically need anywhere near as flexible schedules? To do what? Tend to your horses? You seriously underestimate how much extra time raising kids take, whether due to unforseen circumstances or not. I guarantee you, even with all the supposed privileges these parents receive they are drowning by the added workload and they are more stressed at work than they were before having kids.
Why would anyone assume that a child free person would automatically need anywhere near as flexible schedules? To do what? Tend to your horses?
And once again being dismissive towards people for the sin of "not having children." That's not going to convince anyone who disagrees with you to listen to you.
It's infuriating that you don't see how incredibly fucking stupid that is. It isn't a universal truth either; it hasn't always been this way and it isn't even this way all over the world today. Hell, it doesn't even actually work currently in the US, how many retired people do you know that actually only live on Social Security? Basically fucking none because it is nowhere near enough money to retire, despite paying in an absolute fortune over their entire working lives. That same money saved in almost any other imaginable way would do more to support retirees than the awful fucking system we have now that relies on the next few generations to pay.
That's because what you are espousing the benefits of like it is the obvious and only system is just a forced fucking ponzi scheme.
Your taxes finance the retirement of the people currently retired. Your retirement is financed by kids who will work when you're retired
You conflate work and responsibilities. everyone has the latter, and the schedule juggling that comes with it.
"Raising a kid is work" Its also voluntary lol. You dont get to have sympathy for a decision.
My kids are more important than work or my coworkers. And so are my coworkers kids to them. Those who don't have kids get to take off just the same for any issue at my work so maybe my life is too good for this meme
I mean somewhat a generalization. Still if you don't want to empathize with the parent you still should empathize with the kid, you can't just like leave the kid there unless you want to argue the kid should be taken away from this person which just feels cruel for both sides.
"Raising a kid is work" Its also voluntary lol.
That's like saying payments on your car financing are voluntary.
Once you have made the decision the consequences are no longer voluntary.
the consequences are however due the decision that you chose voluntarily.
Agreed. But this does not make the consequences voluntary. If it's your kid, you have to raise it.
At the extreme, child neglect is a jailable offence.
yes, you have to raise it from that point - due to a decision that you made on your own volition. you opted for that decision, knowing that it has consequences. so you have to deal with the consequences because of a choice, which was optional. in other words, these consequences are self-inflicted.
Yes. Similarly putting a vacation on the credit card is a decision made on your own volition. But no-one is going to describe the consequential repayments as voluntary.
you could have just chosen not to run your card that in the first place. especially if you're not in the position to deal with the consequences.
likewise, having kids isn't "like a second work", it's caused by one's decision. you could have opted not to have them. it's purely a voluntary choice. why do the consequences for someone else's voluntary decision warrant others being forced to accomodate it or change their plans?
Having the kid is voluntary.
Once you have one, rasing it is not.
why do the consequences for someone else's voluntary decision warrant others being forced to accomodate it or change their plans?
Ah. In this case your issue is with the employer not being able to plan or be flexible, not the person rasing the kid.
I would treat them like a fucking idiot, because that is a terrible decision to have made... Your analogy really sucks here. I don't think coworkers with kids are complete fucking idiots, but the hypothetical person in your comment is a complete fucking idiot.
I remmeber reading a story about a lady or a dude who did this same thing.
They got elaborste with it too. They made it look like one of their nephews were actually their own child loool!
I pretend to be an alcoholic so I can act like an ass at the work parties. I don't even drink.
Everyone I work with has kids, so... We're all in the same boat?
Also, leaving the office whenever? You know that shit is falling under sick time or people are skipping lunches to have two hours off one day.
When you adopt a cat, you should be entitled to paid caternity leave.
Kids are understandable. What (mildly) annoys me is the free pass for smoke breaks.
UNO reverse card: Kids are a choice, smoking is an addiction.
But smoking is to a degree a choice. Tobacco isnt like heroin. You can quit it cold turkey . And YES I GET IT its a hard addiction to defeat , weve known this for like half a century now.... but it can be defeated with enough time and patience away from tobacco.
But kids are not a choice you can or can not take care of once you have produced them. Personally I feel that the modern economy makes it so that EVERYONE should be discouraged from having kids cause the hours and pay that person has to work these days in most places is nonsensical. So I dont get why we STILL have so many cultures that continue to peer pressure people into having 'band-aid babies' or 'young-love, straight-outta-college babies' but thats just me. Only choice you have when youre having a child is to abort or not and to give them up to adoption or not. After that? Youre only options are 'take care of them when you have the time to' (break time) or 'watch them destroy your life, your community , and their lives' '
You don't "defeat" an addiction. You always will be an addict, just one that stopped using the substance.
Ah youre correct. Im wrong. Sorry.
Its more like you avoid the substance( like alcohol addiction or nicotine or whatever youre addicted to ) or the pracetice (whether that be gambling addiction or self-harming addiction or whatever) and find that it doesnt impact your life . You dont ever truly 'defeat' an addiction. You just significantly taper its impact to your life.
I try to be very open and forgiving, as it's the same as what if I have a sick parent or spouse that I need to take care of. Same thing.
HOWEVER. I have a WFH job that is very heads down and forgiving on time, and most days we have 1, count it ONE meeting that lasts 15 minutes. A daily standup. I have coworkers with kids who miss it DAILY, usually because of childcare. How, how do you miss our ONE meeting? If your kids are at home then how do I trust that you are actually working most of the day if you can't set aside 15 minutes daily? If your kids need to be dropped off then I'm sorry but how does it take that exact 15 minute period every day? Can't drop them off 15 minutes earlier or later? (And yes, we've adjusted our daily times, but then after a month or so it starts happening again). To be fair I think they're just blaming the childcare.
If your kids need to be dropped off then I'm sorry but how does it take that exact 15 minute period every day? Can't drop them off 15 minutes earlier or later?
The school drop off windows are very strick. They usually cant legally let the children in before a certain time, and if theyre late, then the they get tardies and discipline as theyre missing class. My kids need to be dropped off between 7:45 and 7:55. I have to account for car line. And schools 20 minutes away. If i worked from home, id be spending basically 50 minutes to drop my kids off.
And i only have 1 school to drop off at. Multiple kids of varying ages can easily have multiple schools with varying start times. And not all districts and locations within those districts have busses.
This is what has happened because families need 2 workings parents to function now. In the old times when 1 working parent made enough money to support a family, the other parent would be supporting the kids. We're basically asking parents with kids to work 3 full time jobs now
What happened to walking to school and playing in the yard for an hour untill school starts?
Do they not have busses where you are?
Legit question. Why not use the bus?
( I am assuming it's available as I've never heard of a place that doesn't have buses. So my assumption could be wrong. )
Lived in 2 districts that didnt bus for us. 1 we were "too close" so we were cut off the route after they didnt pass a tax levy, so they didnt have funding. Our current location is "too far" so we dont have busses
Just addressing your last paragraph - it's August, which means rather than the relatively stable school schedule (less so around Mondays and Fridays, for some reason), we're coming off of summer camp season.
We had our kids enrolled in a different camp every week, just to get nearly-full coverage. And they all have different schedules, with similar dropoff and pickup requirements.
To reiterate - US childcare is a joke, and everyone suffers for it.
I have a 2 year old and can confirm that as long as the meeting is 15m and does not collide with pickup/dropoff/morning routine (e.g. 10am) I would make it every time.
Yeah they need to move that meeting or abolish it. Schools arent going to shift the dropoff windows and if you're regularly missing staff then it's not vital
Oh yeah... Parenthood.... Real easy. We're doing it for the work breaks.
This tweet is not advocating for removing the breaks for parents, it's advocating for also giving the same breaks to everyone. Same as with smoke breaks.
It's healthy to take small breaks every once in a while, and every worker should have access to them. You shouldn't need to have a kid or an addiction to enjoy your breaks.
Hell, I myself take smoke breaks and I have never smoked.
People should be able to take breaks and get time off regardless of addictions or dependents. Crazy concept.
So parents should get extra time off to make up for the fact that their “breaks” are often spent caring for their children.
In which case people will complain and say they should fake being parents to get the extra time off.
No. How you choose to spend your free time is your thing. Some people decided not to have kids, maybe even for that exact reason. Some people decided to have kids, even though they knew kids would take away their time. It's just how everyone decides to spend their time, and there's nothing wrong with it.
Caring for other people is not a “decision”, it is care. That’s like saying looking after an elderly parent or disabled family member is simply the way people wish to spend their free time.
Equity matters, not equality. Not everyone’s circumstances are the same, and if we have decided everyone deserves a break we need to realise those who spend their time caring for others are not getting the same opportunity for an actual break.
its not even work "breaks". Work was always easier than dealing woth the kid. If youre getting called out of work, sometging is obviously not gone to plan, and dealing with that adds more stress. Id rather just be unbothered at work.
This shaming shit is garbage. second or third time ive seen this childfree comm come up, this place is so lame. be childfree, do it. I was supposed to myself, but blaming parents and shit stirring is so fuckin stupid. This some reddit level garbage.
...BUT we clearly arent blaming parents .
We are blaming the billionairss and politicians who have structured our modern work hours and modern economies. Wot are you on about? Did I miss something?
Seriously nice response, anything to divide us, see they got people pissed at coworkers, next religion, sports team, neighborhood, school. Skull fuck the wealthy!!
No War But Class War.
Was a great saying when it was only used in reference to fighting literal wars.
These days it reeks of class reductionism and anti-intersectionality.
That is not the tone of like half the comments I'm seeing, just in this post. A lot of "snarky" backbiting towards people speaking up for parenting needs. "You chose to be a parent, so why should you get special accomodations for that?"-type of attitudes.
and the funny thing about snarky comments like that is that there are A LOOOOT of people on the planet who literally dont have any other option but to become a parent.
Sterilizations, birth controls, protections from S Assaults, abortions are not universally available worldwide . ALSO there's a stupidly high number lf cultures that persecute and prosecute a childfree person soo....
On another note, why cant we live in a world where such things ARE universally available to any adult who asks for them? And one where a person is not given the death penalty for simply choosing to remain childfree?
Theres a real peace that i feel every monday morning when i sit down at my desk at work

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