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Lemmings, please give us your info dump. (mander.xyz)
submitted 8 months ago by to c/science_memes@mander.xyz
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[–] 2 points 8 months ago (3 children)

Why use the ISP router at all? If your ISP uses IPoE or can provide you the PPPoE connection details, can't you use any router you like?

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (2 children)

    Yes and no, usually the ISP router is also the modem, converting from either VDSL, DOCSIS, or some flavor of GPON, and most people don't have the knowledge or patience to figure out how to do a modem delete for their ISP.

    Having the ISP put the modem in bridged mode usually nullifies the instability of it. Bridged mode turns the ISP modem router thing effectively into just a modem.

    You can improve communication by removing it entirely, if you can sort out the modem delete, but unless there's a pretty clear demarcation between the line handling gear and the ISP router, you might be up a creek.

    The other caveat is that with a modem delete, you won't get help from the ISP. You have to revert to their gear before they will troubleshoot your connection. To them, that modem router is their demarcation line, so it must be in the path somewhere, or they get pretty grumpy about it all.

    But, if you have the skill and the aptitude to do it, you can cut ping times by quite a bit. On my VDSL line, when I did a modem delete, replacing whatever lowest bidder modem router my ISP gave me with a Cisco 1911, and a VDSL2 line card, I got my, already quite reasonable ping times (somewhere around 10ms? Or so, to the local datacenter), down to about 4ms. Over VDSL2. That's crazy good. Nearly FTTH speed.

    I did something similar when I was on FTTH for a bit, I got a fiber ont SFP transceiver that could be reconfigured, programmed it with the MAC and other critical information from my ISPs device, and used that in my own router. Which also cut ping times from ~5ms? To ~2ms maybe? So, yeah. There's benefit to it, but it requires specialized expertise most of the time. If you have an easy path to a modem delete with your ISP, then it's a no brainer.

    Disabling the routing in your ISPs combo router/modem, is essential for any mid sized household that values their performance.

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  • [–] 1 point 8 months ago (1 child)

    Sorry, what is a "modem delete", and how does all of this work if you just don't choose to buy a router from your ISP at the time you first order an Internet plan from them? Like, it's included there as a standard option with most ISPs, and they have instructions that at the very least seem simple (usually just making sure you have PPPoE with the right connection details, or IPoE set) to use.

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  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago

    So, in my case, I had a modem router model by a company called SmartRG. Details aside, I pretty much instantly put it into bridged mode so it wouldn't participate in the IP routing. That modem did modem things only.

    The connection went from provider phone line to SmartRG to my firewall.

    I was weird and got a set of WAN IP addresses, so I put a router in front of everything to handle that, so the connection went from provider line, to modem, to router, to firewall.

    It's not super relevant, but the router I was using was a Cisco 1911. This is a semi modular enterprise router. The modular part, which will be important later, is in the form of "WIC" modules, or "WAN Interface Card" modules. The 1911 has two.

    Anyways, I managed to get a WIC that supported VDSL2 with all the options and configuration that my ISP used. Happened to be the ehwic-va-dsl-m. Long story short, this module would integrate with my router and act as a modem of sorts to "translate" to the provider line. When I implemented this, I basically threw out my SmartRG. The phone line went directly into my router. So the connection was from the provider line, into my router, then to my firewall.

    So the modem was "deleted".

    Another instance was for a fiber GPON line. The provider in this case, gave you a modem with a GPON connection, but they didn't really tell anyone that the GPON interface was just a plain old SFP transceiver. So I pulled the SFP, put it into the firewall and threw out the modem. The provider line went right into their module in my firewall. The modem was effectively "deleted"

    The idea of a modem delete is to remove whatever standalone device the provider has converting their signal (DSL, cable, or fiber) into Ethernet, and effectively plug that into your gateway.

    It's not always possible.

    I'm currently looking for an option to do a modem delete for a local ISP that's switched to xgs-pon. They put out a modem router for it that has the transceiver built in, so there's no way to extract it and plug it into something else.

    I'm hopeful I'll find a SFP+ module like I found for the GPON ISP in my area.

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