cross-posted from : https://lemmy.zip/post/62636876

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[–] 10 points 6 months ago (23 children)

Somehow I'm skeptical of how organically popular pro-chinese trends are on tiktok. It's like trying to use youtube views to gauge the popularity of google products...

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  • [–] -1 points 6 months ago

    It's not just a TikTok thing, though. And isn't the fact that TikTok has gotten as large as it has (despite its current status of being run under US oligarchs for US users), and how many USAmericans decided to start using RedNote when it initially was banned in the US, also evidence to the claim that China is having a big cultural moment?

    I can at least say anecdotally that random people I've met who aren't politically involved have been getting more into specifically Chinese cultural products. Games, movies, etc. And among my inner friend group (who, admittedly, are definitely much more inclined to support China politically, not just culturally) we make jokes about Chinamaxxing too.

    Also, there is no equivalence between the relationship between TikTok and Chinese culture as a whole versus YouTube and Google products. "TikTok is to China as YouTube is to Google products" is not valid because TikTok is to China as YouTube is to the United States. And while checking how people feel about a country based on trends on social media wouldn't be the ideal way to gauge things (polls are obviously better) it still seems reasonable.

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  • [–] -1 points 6 months ago (21 children)

    Those who haven't lived under a rock know TikTok is now under control of the USSA regime.
    As they don't allow free media

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (20 children)

    Mmm. Yes. Very. That's exactly how it worked. You can trust the Trump admin, they for sure didn't misrepresent how the deal worked when they explained it.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (19 children)

    sure they faked the sale and Bytedance or anyone involved is in on it.
    Is the orange also a Chinese agent according to whatever is under your tinfoil hat?
    amercans lol

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (18 children)

    It'd depressingly telling that you're trying to use "americans" to dismiss this when you're just straight up swallowing the US propaganda about the tiktok sale... and presenting that as somehow the pro-china position. Perplexing.

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  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago (17 children)

    Yes the entire world and press swallowed " the US propaganda about the tiktok sale".
    But do explain, americans and their ideas are always good for a laugh.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (16 children)

    Well no, clearly it's not the entire world - but you sure did.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (15 children)

    I can find articles from the entire world believing the wild conspiracy theory that it was sold to the banana republic.
    Can you at least try to make clear what your delusion is about that or if you even deny that?
    IDK your level of insanity?

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (14 children)

    "I'm gonna insult you for a while, misrepresent your position then act like I'm going to be reasonable by asking for you to elaborate on your opinion". Classic.

    That article beautifully highlights the problem - you really have just swallowed the propaganda line that it's a US app now, without doing any research into what the handover actually entailed.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (13 children)

    The 'article' is nothing more than China bad cope and fearmongering from the typical american think tanks.
    It says literally nothing about the sale. The sale to Oracle your regime's scummy CIA company BTW.
    As they want to keep their control over the press and any social media.
    It's them who want to influence people, this garbage article is a perfect example.
    You offer zero facts for what is supposedly wrong about the sale only parrot your regime's scaremongering.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (12 children)

    The article I was referring to was the one about the tiktok sale. That you just linked.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (11 children)

    which like any other article confirms it was sold to the USSA.
    So I still don't see what you're so upset about

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (10 children)

    TikTok closes deal to split US app from global business

    That's the headline of your article, the one you said had nothing to do with the sale. It also has no 'china bad' or fearmongering - it barely discusses china at all. You're just making shit up and trying to gloss over when you're called on it.

    Seriously you can't even keep the details straight in this extremely short conversation, but I should act like your insights into geopolitics are worthwhile to consider?

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (9 children)

    you really are insane, I was talking about the posted article saying nothing about the sale of TikTok or your imagined conspiracy about it.
    I just posted a random link to another article to show that (for the 4th fucking time jeez!) it has been sold to your regime.
    And for the 4th fucking time you still can't come up with any validation for your paranoid propagandized BS.
    Since that article has also nothing 'highlighting your imaginary problem'.

    So for the last time, if you're not going to explain your batshit crazy conspiracy I can't ridicule it and then you're just boring me.
    Get to the fucking point or go away

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  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (8 children)

    Oh no you weren't, come on with this.

    The AP article is neutral or pro-china, it has no fearmongering or 'china-bad' in it at all, and it has nothing to do with US think-tanks. You very blatantly got it confused with another poster in this thread, the one who posted an anti-china article from the think-tank ECFR, and responded like that's what I was talking about.

    Again: You cannot keep the details straight in a tiny comment thread. Why would I waste my time trying to further explain how the trump admin lied about the extent of the influence the US holds over TikTok? The article you posted clearly lays it out. If you won't trust in (or apparently remember) your own sources, what hope do I have in penetrating the misasma of propaganda you're so happily submerged in?

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (7 children)

    You are the confused one (deliberately) , I definitely ment the AP article,as I said.
    It's far from neutral and simply China bad fearmongering about China becoming more popular: "Xi has long pushed for his government to promote Chinese soft power abroad, calling on officials to “tell China’s story well”

    This comes from the NYU "Center for Global Affairs".
    While it's connected to a university and not purely a think tank with little clout, they do the same things and parrot the same narrative the US regime wants.
    Not surprising, when they hire these types

    For the 5th and last time you did not back up your BS and divert with this weak BS excuse.

    so: "further explain how the trump admin lied about the extent of the influence the US holds over TikTok"
    is absolute garbage, You explained absolutely nothing.
    The reason for this is you are suffering from propaganda, being from the US banana republic where they are in fact submerged in unhinged propaganda.
    So you're clearly projecting.
    I'm European, at least we have some objective views and can see through your BS and scaremongering about anyone and everyone the US regime doesn't like.

    So its clear, you have nothing and failed to justify your slanderous insinuations, which is all they are.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (6 children)

    Oh my gosh you're back! How brave! And with fresh, nearly plausible denials over just making a mistake.

    Listen even if you were talking about the AP article, which you clearly weren't, it was still obviously not the article I was talking about. Just... own the mistake, dude. Maybe we could get somewhere if you were capable of that kind of reflection. As it stands tho, all my previous points about the futility of me discussing anything with you stand proudly undaunted.

    Alas though, ultimately your strategy of "start by repeatedly insulting the other person and then act all huffy and stomp your lil' feet when they refuse to play your game" continues to not win me over. But good luck next time!

    PS:

    "Xi has long pushed for his government to promote Chinese soft power abroad, calling on officials to “tell China’s story well”

    This... this is what you think "china bad" is? Lmfao dude this is such a fucking stretch. "Oh nooo, Xi told them to make china more popular in media! WooOooOooOOOOooo, scary!!!"

    jfc get a grip.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (5 children)

    LOL you failed completely when called out on your BS.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (4 children)

    Ooo, declaring victory instead of addressing any of the substance, trump will be so proud of you!

    Anyways I think you've demonstrated there's nothing of value to be gained from entertaining your ravings, blockin' ya (actually no, on second thought just taggin' ya as a moron in cass I see you trying to pull this BS on anyone else) and moving on.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (3 children)

    addressing any of the substance

    Is all I asked and yoiu failed.

    trump will be so proud of you!

    typical american idiot take.
    I despise Blue and Red MAGA from your shithole but you morons only have 2 cultist beliefs.
    He doesn't like my side so he must be the other one.
    The infantiule and pathetic level of the banana republic and its unedicated ignorant peasants.
    Oh please block me so I don't waste time on your absolute nonsense.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (2 children)

    Oh no you're still saying mean things about americans to try and bait me how will I surviiiiive oh my wounded pride oh u so mean how dare u.

    Seriously it's getting embarassing to watch you behave like this. This is getting under your skin to the point that you're even starting to sound like trump. Just stop dude, or I shall be forced to mock you a second time.

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  • [–] -1 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    you're american, you lack the brains to mock me.

    You've made a fool of yourself already.
    But since you're starting to be annoying and not even worthy of ridicule I'll just block you.
    Plenty more of you suckers delivering idiotic takes

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago*

    Oh nooo, my pride my pride etc. etc.

    Hey listen, I'll happily take being able to correct your cringe pro-america propaganda without risking your tediously damp ire in response. Sounds like an absolute win to me, please feel free to block away.

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  • [–] 10 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    Cool, another unspecified "here" in a world news comm.

    looks inside yep it's the US

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago

    I too love the smell of astroturf.

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  • [–] 16 points 6 months ago (10 children)
  • [–] 19 points 6 months ago (8 children)

    It seems like the user who posted that article makes similar posts attacking China exclusively, day-in and day-out. 4000+ posts in the last year.

    This particular post is a summary from a report from a large European think tank that's obviously quite pro-NATO and worthy of skepticism from any anti-imperialist audience. The report itself seems to cast an extremely broad net as to what should count as nefarious Chinese meddling:

    However, China’s efforts today are about shaping public opinion at scale. In a wider casting of the net, Chinese FIMI now relies on a busy ecosystem of other actors. For example, Beijing uses research partnerships, business associations, cultural exchanges, diaspora networks and social media influencers—who may or may not recognise their role in communicating CCP narratives. These locally based people and organisations (such as, for example, a Polish influencer talking to Polish audiences) provide familiar cultural and linguistic references and possess legitimacy that Chinese authorities lack. They help embed Beijing’s narratives into debates that, at first glance, may seem unrelated to China, such as the future of European industrial policy, global governance or the economy.

    The underlying logic runs as follows: influence the wider information environment first, allow preferred narratives to become familiar and “common sense” in everyday online discourse and then let those narratives travel—with the help of local intermediaries—into mainstream media agendas and, eventually, national politics.

    According to this report, a Chinese academic who's just participating in a research program in Europe is part of China's "FIMI" (their buzzword for disinformation/propaganda) efforts. But that, and the examples cited throughout here (except maybe AI which I'm willing to say is a different kind of phenomenon) is just a normal part of a country integrating itself in the globalized world.

    If Algerian students start coming to European universities, and Algerian traveling influencers start talking about how cool it is to travel to Algeria, and Algerian artists make media that is consumed in Europe, European people's opinion of Algeria will improve. And I think that it would be perfectly OK for that to happen, and for the governments of Algeria and Europe to try to cultivate that cultural exchange and bringing down of barriers. Same with literally any other country on earth (especially the ones that I'm very critical of, e.g. USA and Israel, because it still is cool for people to be less ignorant, although with the US particularly I think people are already extremely familiar with their culture and it dominates everything).

    Why is it any different with China? Why are Chinese people treated with this suspicion? Why are we contributing to sinophobia by acting like it's crazy that young people kinda want to be Chinese?

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  • [–] -2 points 6 months ago (6 children)

    I've travelled all over China, it's crap. You can't fool me.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (5 children)

    ??? Was this before like 2010?

    Its a wonderful country, I'm returning in like a week.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    They're the lead dev of PieFed, super biased from what I understand of them.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago

    Are you sure? Something tells me that their conclusion that there's nothing worthwhile in a country of 1.4 billion people that covers nearly a quarter of the largest continent on earth, with 5,000 years of history, and incredibly varied ecosystems, architecture, cultures, and landscapes might be biased. But I don't want to be uncharitable.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (2 children)

    China is fucking huge, maybe Rimu was in like a shitty part of it, while you visited somewhere awesome?

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  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago

    They say they went all over. Its hard to imagine they didn't go to at least 1 cool place.

    The only not-awsome places I experienced were small rural border towns with nothing to do and pretty bad construction quality. Even they had decent, suprisingly diverse food.

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  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago (8 children)

    lol. Amazing propaganda. They’re good, gotta give them that.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago (7 children)

    Is it Chinese propaganda that living conditions and future prospects in the Western world are really bleak and young people are coping by imagining how much better life would be in the biggest country in the world that doesn't seem to be suffering from those problems at quite the same level?

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (6 children)

    Anything I say to you will result in you pasting propaganda, links to known biased sites, paid articles, and other propaganda.

    Nothing an ML says can be trusted. You know this.

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (3 children)

    It's not propaganda and nor is it limited to Israel's Bitches. Around the world, young people have much more respect for China than the USI.

    You should leave your bubble every once and awhile so you're not as ignorant about everything outside of it.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Due to propaganda, not due to having been there and experienced living in China. TikTok videos leave out all the bad stuff, like how you don’t have freedom of speech, and cannot marry your same sex partner. Something “young people” in the west enjoy. And because of the great firewall, we all know only the “right people” have access to western internet.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago

    You're right that the grass always looks greener on the other side. I'm sure a large number of the Gen Z people who post Chinamaxxing memes only do it in jest and/or wouldn't do it if they knew a bit more of what they would have to give up to live in China (especially if they're queer, but otherwise moreso in the realm of access to cheap foreign goods that people in imperialist countries get than "free speech" which anyone on TikTok of all platforms has already learned is never guaranteed in a capitalist country). Yet Western countries seem to be backsliding on those aspects, while the older generation in China that's stricter and more conservative is aging out of politics. I think you don't have to be pollyannaish to think that in ~20 years, China will have surpassed the largest issues you might have with it, but it gets harder and harder to think Western countries will do the same.

    we all know only the “right people” have access to western internet

    Quite literally anyone in China is capable of grabbing a VPN and have unsupervised access to the same internet as you and me. The so-called "great firewall" only exists as a means of making it more difficult for Chinese internet users to patronize Western (mostly American) internet services. If there was no firewall, companies like Meta and Google would have access to the Chinese market and it would be hard for local Chinese companies like WeChat or BiliBili to grow.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    It is honestly surprising, that it took so long. China is a massive country, with a large economy. They should be an absolute leader in exporting cultural products. Especially since China inherited Hong Kongs massive movie industry, which decline after the hand over.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    It is also terrifying since China has been know to do "ethnic cleansing" from time to time

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  • [–] -1 points 6 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2025/country-chapters/china

    The human rights abuses by China are well documented. They aren't the only country who has abused human right but that doesn't make it somehow better.

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  • [–] -2 points 6 months ago*

    They dealt with terrorist attacks and China has jails, shocker.
    It's not like they have a Guantanamo, luckily Obama closed that first day in office like he promised.
    Anyway, not getting into that, the China bad crowd have milked this non-issue long enough.
    And 'ethnic cleansing' is beyond pathetic

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    A user in the comments section referenced American surveys that show the Chinese government is much more popular among its people compared to the American one. It got heavily downvoted and one use unironically responded:

    The fact that people feel free to express their disatisfaction in America is a feature... not a bug.

    Not the Onion level of Western chauvinism

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  • 14 comments in c/world@lemmy.world view that post
    [–] 13 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    Videos proclaiming users are “Chinamaxxing,” or “in a very Chinese time of their lives”

    This sounds like bullshit, of course we know people have clubs that are fans of country music or Star Trek or whatever cultural things people may find interesting.
    But I never heard about USA maxxing, and I doubt there would be more reason to do that with China.
    Some Chinese cultural elements may be fun, popular and interesting, but Chinamaxxing sounds more like a mental health issue than a cultural thing. And definitely not an element of soft power.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago

    It's a TikTok trend, Batman

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  • [–] 10 points 6 months ago

    I hope this means less Sinophonia and not copying the government's authoritarianism lol

    I wanna highlight this:

    “Appreciation does not erase the racism that many Chinese people grew up with,” said Elise Zeng, 28, from Brooklyn, New York. A video she posted critiquing the social media phenomenon was liked by more than 36,000 people.

    She recalls how during the COVID-19 pandemic she was afraid for her parents stepping out of the house because they heard about people getting attacked just walking down the street. At the time, many Asians reported being assaulted or verbally abused by people who blamed East Asians for the spread of the virus.

    “Those experiences don’t just disappear because Chinese culture is suddenly cool and trendy,” she said.

    I really hope my future children can go through school in the west without ever being called "ching chong" or kids do the racist "pull their eyes back" bullshit...

    But like... the reality is: Obama being president for 8 years didn't prevent George Floyd from getting murdered by a white cop.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago

    Boomers trying to explain the kids memes from like 3 years ago.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago

    Your father is Chinese

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  • [+] 8 points 6 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 7 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

    If you block the OP you'll get rid of a huge chunk of it. They're one of the most blatant agenda posters on the Fediverse - they're on track to hit 6,000 posts in their first year, many (most?) of which are puff pieces about China.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    I wish I had a great firewall to filter what gets out about my country... Oh wait, no I dont. At least the remnants of our free press will document the genocide against my people. Leftists who believe the USA is as authoritarian as China are propaganda-fucked on par with conservatives.

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  • [–] 9 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    US is not by any means as authoritarian as China.

    To achieve that, the US would need a government that controls mass media, kills people just for protesting, disappearing enemies of the government in remote prison camps with no oversight or accountability, have mass surveillance everywhere, make books illegal, demonstrably suppress all ethnic minorities, threaten religious leaders for speaking ill of the government...

    All run by a hardline government that has a strongman leader that people respect and a cabinet full of loyalists with competence in the task they're assigned.

    Once the US achieves that last bit, THEN they'll be as authoritarian as China.

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  • It wasn't before, but the USA is currently a fascist dictatorship and it's kinda hard to argue it gets more authoritarian than that. The few freedoms we still have are fading remnants that have yet to be snuffed out. Just because they have yet to build the firewall doesn't mean they won't.

    The major difference between the two going forward is whenever or not the state steers the country, or the self interested oligarchs. It's very clear that China's industrial capitalism was more wise for the interests of their empire, while America can't compete so long as oligarchs steer the ship towards short term profits. This isn't to say that China is eternally better than the US, as imperial prosperity ebs and flows.

    However, China is the safer bet going forward, especially if we see another red scare as Americans begin to realize that their empire lost. If people get distracted fear mongering about communism, they'll never fix the problems that actually made America fall behind. If I'm right about that, then the US is in for decades of decline.

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  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago

    I doubt the article is correct. In the US, Mexican food is the most popular. What Chinese movies and songs are hits?

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  • 3 comments in c/world view that post
    [–] 17 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    This is just another absurdly weird propaganda spread by Tiktok influencers.

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  • Yeeeeep. The idea of swapping one imperialist crusher of human rights for another because of the embarrassment that the US has become is too stupid for anyone other than influencers to bite off on. I hope the next generations become better about seeing through propaganda like this.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago

    Wonder why though... Mainland Chinese are xenophobic cunts, as per party policy.
    Their literature/media has to uplift China and/or denigrate any other culture to avoid being censored. And often ends up disconnected from reality in pursuit of mindless ass-kissing.

    Are we really that easily susceptible to cults of personality? (It's rethorical, of course we are.)

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