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[–] 228 points 6 months ago (2 children)

The old pope died of cringe when he met Vance so I'd consider this a threat.

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  • [–] 162 points 6 months ago (13 children)

    Oh yes, world renowned theologian James David Vance foremost expert on theol...wait theology is when you fuck couches right?

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  • [–] 96 points 6 months ago (10 children)

    i thought his name was jance dance vance

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  • [–] 7 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (4 children)

    Don't you think he got enough of that in high school

    Eta: I love that only a small number of people got the original reference or response

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  • [–] 139 points 6 months ago (18 children)

    Isn't the Pope supposed to be the guy for Catholics, appointed to directly hear God's voice on Earth, and spread it to the masses? And if that's the case, aren't all these faux-Christians disagreeing with him - like Vance - disagreeing with the very God they purport to worship?

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  • [–] 64 points 6 months ago (4 children)

    A bunch of Protestants think the Pope is the Antichrist, but apparently Vance identifies as Catholic, so yeah, he's defying God. Catholic doctrine also holds that the Pope is infallible when ruling on theology.

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  • [–] 18 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    The latter is not universal. Several popes have explicitly stated that they are indeed fallible (which would render total infallibility self-contradictory). Also, infallibility is generally limited in certain ways that I won't bother researching in enough depth to put into a concise description. But the pope can't just make up some random shit and have it automatically considered to be the word of God.

    Of course, pointing out that someone violates the basic tenets of Catholicism while naming those specific tenets is well within "the pope is right" territory.

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  • [–] 17 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    Pretty sure the infallibility part is only when he speaks "ex cathedra" which is a pretty narrow and specific time, but I'm not a Catholic.

    A quick Google says the last time that was done was in 1950.

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  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago

    I appreciate the nuanced info. It's pretty tough to find when discussing religion on platforms like this. It helps logical people trapped by corrupted religious beliefs realize that its okay, even encouraged, to keep their core beliefs intact while still being able to condemn those within their religion that work to corrupt the church.

    If all you see is church/religion bad, then they'll just dismiss you and move on. And the corrupt version of Christianity or Islam or Judaism or what have you will continue growing

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  • [–] 124 points 6 months ago

    Catholics can disagree with the pope on secular matters, the problem here is that the pope is quoting the catechism almost verbatim, and convert-boy is throwing a tantrum because he joined the church based on aesthetics and not any kind of conviction.

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  • [–] 30 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    The man converted to catholicism then within a few years was beefing with two popes in a row on basic catholicism.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    That is what we in the business call a poser.

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  • [–] 10 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    The American Catholic leadership are hardcore conservative, with a few exceptions, and working at cross purposes with Christ's mission on earth.

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  • [–] 11 points 6 months ago

    In my experience American catholics in general tend to be the ones who vote hard right, while saying "I think politics is tearing us apart" and "oh, I don't discuss politics" "I'm not racist, but...". They want the same thing the far righ wants they just don't want to get their hands dirty.

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  • [–] 8 points 6 months ago (4 children)

    Literally any Catholic who criticizes the Pope is a hypocrite because the Pope is meant to be God's representative/mouthpiece on Earth.

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  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 0 points 6 months ago

    Where did doctrine that come from? I'm not sure where you're getting it. Kinda sounds made the fuck up

    You can absolutely criticize the pope as a Catholic. What you can't do is attempt to supercede him on matters of faith

    Which, you know, we've got people doing that already, no need to make shit up

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  • [–] 104 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    Did they forget to give him the brochure when he converted to Catholicism?

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  • [–] 19 points 6 months ago

    Right? Is he not treading excommunication territory with this shit?

    Lay Catholics aren’t supposed to challenge the Pope like that. Even Cardinals wouldn’t get away with saying something so obnoxious.

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  • [–] 86 points 6 months ago

    I've killed a pope before and I'll do it again! - J.D 'Couch Fucker' Vance

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  • [–] 72 points 6 months ago (9 children)

    JD literally woke up one morning and decided to debate theology with the fucking Vicar of Christ.

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  • [–] 37 points 6 months ago* (4 children)

    INNNNN THIS CORNER, wearing all white and a skull cap, he's the Vicar of Christ, the Bishop of Rome, the SUCCESSOR to the Price of the Apostles, iiiiiiiIIIITS POPE LEO THE FOURTEENTH!!

    And in THIS CORNER, wearing a tailored suit and red tie, Couch fucker, white trash cosplayer and world's worst negotiator, John Dilbert Vaaaaaaance!

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  • [–] 67 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    Look, they already decided they knew science better than scientists, they knew war better than military generals, they knew economy better than economists.

    Why did aynone think they would stop at theology?

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  • [–] 63 points 6 months ago (7 children)

    The utter fucking nerve of these assholes.

    I'm not even a christian anymore, Catholic or otherwise. In fact I've long since gone full on athiest.

    But even I'M offended by this new level of horseshit by the Trump clown-show.

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  • [–] 15 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    I am with you. I don't believe in what the Pope stands for but also recognize that he is not only the head of state of a foreign government, but the mouthpiece of a significant part of human tradition. This really is like the "fake news" arguments from Trump's first campaign, i.e., "I don't agree with what they say so I will attack them personally."

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  • [–] 15 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    Right? I really dislike the catholic church and am an atheist myself, but these morons make the pope look like a reasonable statesman by comparison.

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  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    Curious how the framing makes something unreasonable become reasonable. Moving the conversation towards the unreasonable.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    It doesn't really; it's hyperbole by comparison. The distance from my home to the moon is vast and unwalkable, but if you compared it to the distance between the earth and the center of the galaxy, someone might say it looks like a short walk in comparison.

    It obviously still is not possible, but it's a way to stress how big the comparison is.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    I think it would still apply to your scenario in the sense that if the public was genuinly talking about galactical travel, then traveling to the moon would seem like small potatoes in comparison.

    However, there are better examples to get the message accross.

    The message is:

    framing makes something unreasonable become reasonable

    Concider the following:

    • The war on drugs caused mass incarceration of blacks and hippies. The term makes us think that the mass incarceration is justified.

    • Pro life is a term used by conservatives who are against abortions causing the birth of unwanted children. Pro life makes us think that the birth of unwanted children is a matter of saving lives.

    • Reducing footprint is a campaign by exxon mobile to focus on pollution from consumers instead of producers. Fossil fuel companies gains more free passes, making the unreasonable pass more often.

    • Framing critics of Knesset regime as antisemites makes us dismiss the content of their criticism, making the unreasonable Knesset become reasonable.

    • By framing billionaires as intelligent, hard working and jobs creator, we make confiscation of societal goods sound reasonable.

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  • [–] 61 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    yikes. Said by a converted catholic.

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  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    It's always the converts lmao

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  • [–] 13 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    It's really the audacity that gets you. Also he talked shit about Francis too. He converted in 2019 and has second guessed 100% of the popes after his supposed conversion. Also with issue that are not even controversial. 'War bad' isn't some radical catholic or even christian position.

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  • [–] 13 points 6 months ago

    Hell, his beef with Francis is even dumber. "Be good to refugees" is one of the most basic and consistent expectations placed on Christians. Jesus said to do it without room for interpretation, as does the old testament

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  • [–] 9 points 6 months ago

    Catholics have the worst converts lol, they expect it to be a more aesthetic protestantism witn extra ritual, but then are shocked when they're expected to listen to the magesterium and engage with theology in an educated manner without playing protestant calvinball, especially if they're going to disagree with the magesterium

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  • [–] 52 points 6 months ago (9 children)

    When Vance tells a Pope to be careful, that Pope should be careful. You know, considering Vance's established track record with Popes...

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (8 children)
  • [–] 18 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    The day (or the day after, can't remember) he visited the previous pope, the pope died.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    Queen Elizabeth was immortal right? Everyone knows that. But when Lizz Truss became prime minister, the queen was like "oh blimey, I believe it best that I take my departure from this unfortunate circumstance forthwith" which is translated to peasant English "screw this shit I'm outta here". JD Vance is like a toddler Truss so if I were the pope, I'd kill myself too. I mean, you believe in God and an after life, you are the person standing between your imaginary world and reality for whoever believes in that shit. But after meeting this bozo you can't believe in a god anymore, all hope is lost, fuck this world, it has no future. "Hoc nihil est; abeo."

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  • [–] 11 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    Vance had a visit with the last pope at the Vatican, right before he died. At the time, Francis was trying to get him to acknowledge biblical teachings to love your neighbour (and I think that ICE was the antithesis of this), and not the vaguely dystopian stuff Vance was pushing about only only offering respect/kindness/compassion to the people closest to you.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago* (1 child)

    Its quite poetic actually. The popes last action was to make one of the most evil men alive turn away from evil. And then the pope dies the next day.

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  • [–] 45 points 6 months ago (6 children)

    I still find it so fucking funny that this nimrod was the best candidate trumps campaign could find.

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  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    That Nimrod is way smarter than Trump.

    I dunno if this kind of shit works with the maga crowd, but given the other shit they lap up, the fact that it's obvious bollocks doesn't mean saying it is a bad idea.

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  • [–] 37 points 6 months ago

    Shut up, Vance.

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  • [–] 36 points 6 months ago*

    The Vatican should be taking threat very seriously. He did kill the last Pope

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  • [–] 34 points 6 months ago (1 child)
  • [–] 30 points 6 months ago (4 children)

    It's be pretty funny if ol' James got excommunicated. Do it, Pope!

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  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    He would declare himself new Pope of the True Catholic Church.

    There's a precedent to that: for a short while, there were 1 Pope in France (actually some of them are now called anti-popes) and 1 Pope in Rome. That said, I'm not sure how many catholics would get on Vance's side…

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  • [–] 8 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    He could found the Church of America and start killing off wives.

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  • [–] 29 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    It is a bit like saying a professor of mathematics with 10+ years of experience in teaching calculus should be careful when talking about calculus.

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  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    It's way worse than that. Based on doctrine the Pope speaks for God so iIf he talks about theology what he said is correct 100% of the time in Catholicism. If you're not a Catholic his words mean shit all.

    It's more like saying you better be careful about your pronunciation to the creator of the .gif format.

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  • [–] 27 points 6 months ago

    That's not how being Pope works. I know this, and I'm not even Catholic.

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