top 98 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 226 points 7 months ago (19 children)

When they filmed the movie 'Van Helsing' in Prague they needed one hundred couples who knew how to ballroom dance. Everyone thought this was going to be difficult to set up, but it turned out that literally every extra they hired could waltz. Back in Soviet days, the country didn't have a lot of money for sports equipment, but every school had a record player. They taught the kids ballroom dancing for the Physical Education requirement.

  • source
  • hideshow 19 child comments
  • [–] 67 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    We went to dance classes all throughout I think eight grade and learned a few of the classical dances. Waltz, Foxtrott, Cha-Cha, Tango. That's Eastern Germany in the early 2000s.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago* (1 child)

    Dance classes in a normal German secondary school? Wow, we never had that. We had a private dance school for couple dancing in town, it was popular at about age 13.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago

    It wasn't in school, it was an after school thing at a dancing school. It was relatively affordable - I think it was at least in part paid for by the ministry of education - and we all went there together after regular lessons. I never heard of anyone not attending.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 37 points 7 months ago* (9 children)

    My middle school in the us made us learn to waltz in gym class. I'm ass at it, but it was fun.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 9 child comments
  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    My elementary school PE did a couple weeks every year where we did square dancing and line dancing. I guess that’s the southeastern US coming in. Sometimes we did some other more traditional English dance where the boys and girls would be in rows facing each other where there were some set steps and then the couple at one end would dance down between the lines to the other end, there would be more steps and then the next couple would move, and so on. It was like something out of a Jane Austen movie.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago

    I learned square dancing in high school in Ohio. I was the only boy in a class of all girls, because I had broken my wrist and couldn't play basketball. I would love to tell the story of how this helped me get girls, but I was much too big of a loser to take advantage of the situation.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    You can thank Henry Ford's bigotry for that.

    No, really. He hated seeing his employees dance to jazz (the popularity of which he blamed on 'the Jews', because of course he did), so much so that he pushed to have "proper" dances taught in public schools, dances that were old-fashioned even in his time.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 24 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    To graduate from my (American) high school, you needed a given number of gym points, and you were given one gym point per day of gym class. But, I learned, you earned one and a half gym points per day of dance class! I figured this was a great scam: I already hated gym class, so I'd get my points out the way faster.

    Fast forward a couple of months, and I'm working harder than I ever was in gym class, I'm enjoying myself more, and I'm hanging out with girls in leotards first thing every school day. There was literally no downside.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Not just Soviet days. Today, it's expected (although not mandatory) to attend a course on ballroom dance and etiquette around the age of 16. It's usually not in school PE classes, but evening lessons in dedicated ballrooms or community centers with professional lecturers.

    There are also similar courses for adults commonly available. It's considered a fun hobby for couples.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 125 points 7 months ago (6 children)

    "Don’t let AI write anything for you. Writing is to cognitive health what steps are to physical health"

    (via)

  • source
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 66 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    We can't have people forming their own ideas.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [+] 102 points 7 months ago (6 children)
  • [–] 69 points 7 months ago (5 children)
  • [–] 24 points 7 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 25 points 7 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 68 points 7 months ago (5 children)

    God forbid they learn how to think, when LLMs can do it (kind of) for them

  • source
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 9 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

    Exactly. School isn't really about memorizing facts, it's about learning and honing Critical Thinking Skills. That's how humans are supposed to think, and without it, people substitute chaotic thinking that makes them susceptible to manipulation.

    Also, it teaches us how to interact with other humans, so our first instinct isn't just to KILL them.

    That's why we go to school.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    At least it should be this way, the reality might be different sometimes:/

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    In reality the vast majority of the workload may be formatting and word choice that is quite far from thinking.

    And then you're getting a bachelor's degree and because you're big dumb dumb who doesn't really know anything, your task is to collate and paraphrase something not dumb people thought, maybe applying it to some case you have, but not thinking independently.

    A masters thesis can have just a little bit of thinking as a, treat, but most leave school before they reach levels where one thinks when writing.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 62 points 7 months ago* (21 children)

    sigh... how can one be so dumb? has to be a troll... right? pretty please.

  • source
  • hideshow 21 child comments
  • [–] 16 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    The people who don't respect the value of school generally performed very poorly in school.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 13 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    We mature too late in life to realize thats the last time anyone will ever teach us for free.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago

    Life is teaching you all the time (for free) if you but listen.

    Especially if you've learned to learn, and have critical thinking, things schools should be teaching (but often avoid in favor of quickly outdated 'job skills' or similar because some political ideologies do better with the poorly educated).

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 43 points 7 months ago (8 children)

    Realistically, schools were designed to provide a trainable workforce that could read well enough to learn new tasks and do enough math to make sure the factory machines were properly maintained.

    Many people these days don't read a single book after they get out of school. The AIs are just making things happen faster.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] 33 points 7 months ago (7 children)

    From a broader perspective "school" has been a thing since before Socrates and humanity pendulums between "a broad education is the foundation for a strong populace" and "we need a giant pool of disposable labor".

    And the US public education philosophy is similarly inconsistent. At the earliest it was Puritans who wanted everyone to be able to read the Bible for themselves and so pushed for literacy. At times it has been guided specifically by the business economy but it's inaccurate to say that schools were designed to produce factory workers.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
  • [–] 19 points 7 months ago (6 children)

    Yeah, hell modern universal public education was partly a result of the working class fighting like hell for it

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    On the other hand, a lot of good ideas ended up getting co-opted to serve the State.

    I don't think the IWW was planning on ahving kids learn the Pledge of Allegiance.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Nor did the inventor of the pledge expect it to be used for anti communism.

    But ultimately I don't want us to throw the baby out with the bathwater. If the public education system goes away the proletariat will suffer for it. Fascists are attempting to move the Overton window towards that. The solution as I see it is re-examining, reimagining, and reforming public education to serve the masses. But a big part of that is reconvincing the proletariat that education is valuable in its own right rather than just as job training.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Modern universal public eduction has its roots in prussian model and the idea was very much to make effective and loyal workforce. Im not saying modern education has the same ulterior motivations, but things like standarized curricula and grading are coming from there.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    IIRC the goal wasn’t to have a loyal workforce, but to have an army that isn’t dependent on a small number of elites.

    Basically “we won’t stop with the death of our officers, our soldiers can step up to the occasion”.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Nope, this is a common thought amongst those impressed by AI. And I can relate coz when I was in school, no one would give a good answer to why I needed to do any arithmetics without a calculator.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    As a math teacher, my suggestion to the students is during practice to try to do calculations without a calculator to invoke a bit of number sense so when they use calculators be able to notice in the result if they did a wrong input. It happens to input "14" instead of "41" . I feel like able to do mental arithmetic with double digit numbers can be helpful

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    In hindsight, I do think the right approach is not to use calculators till secondary school (about 14~15 years of age). Having a feel for numbers and how they should behave under addition/multiplication/exponentiation and ability to mentally do two digit calculations as you said is critical, and should be an "automatic" capability

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    I think it's reactionary, too. A version of "anything to trigger the libs". If so many people weren't against AI, OOP might have taken a moment to think before they type. As it stands, they reached for the first hot argument to get their opinion out. And I don't mean to absolve them from anything here, just analyzing.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    They do have a point. School should be about learning and developing critical thinking skills rather than memorizing who the 30th president was.

    I know my schooling had a ton of memorization. Funny to think about now that I know I have Aphantasia because I always excelled in math and science because they are less about memorization and more about learning a concept to apply.

    They need to teach kids how to use AI. It's like people that won't let you use a calculator in math. "You aren't always going to have a calculator in your pocket"

    I've always been a big supporter of open book/note tests

    There is no reason I should be able to recite as much of the Canterbury Tales as I can.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (2 children)

    Facts are how you build up everything else. It pretty hard to reason about complex math if you don't understand how to count to 100. It's pretty hard to reason about how societies move in waves and cycles if you don't memorize something about history.

    I think people don't understand that you don't just start doing abstract work. You build it a bunch of facts that you memorize and then you can start building higher level things like patterns and abstractions.

    I know this from trying to teach my child basic concepts like what money is. What exactly is a day. How magnet work. The entire concept of estimation. These are trivial to adults, but these are hard won concepts that were build from concrete ideas for my child.

    We know this is necessary because of cultures that are missing whole concepts like particular colors. The idea of right and left. So on.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago*

    I got a bad grade in history class because I couldn't remember exact dates, only rough timeframes, like "world war 2 ended 1945" but I couldn't say "8th May 1945". This kind of stuff happened a lot of times in many different classes in different ways.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago

    Counting to 100 is like learning to read. Yes both are basic tools needed to learn English or math.

    Do I need to know that the Ming Dynasty ruled from 1368 to 1644? Is anything about the Ming Dynasty relevant to my life? I cannot remember the other handful of dynasties so I guess the Ming Dynasty could be the only one needed to function.

    Yes history is important and definitely worth telling people. But having them memorize stuff that you can look up in a textbook is dumb.

    I could walk into any high school level history class and pass the test if it was open book and if I had enough time I'd probably find all the answers.

    Anyone couldn't walk into a Calculus class and pass the test with it being open book if they didn't know how to do Calculus. Yes they could read the whole chapter and learn to do it then pass the test. But there's no looking up the answers in the book. It's not memorizing.

    We know this is necessary because of cultures that are missing whole concepts like particular colors. The idea of right and left. So on.

    Cultures are not missing whole concepts like particular colors or left and right. They just express it differently.

    Light red is pink. But a light blue is still light blue, maybe baby blue or sky blue.

    Russia has the word голубой for light blue. It's equivalent to our pink. Are we missing the whole concept of light голубой? No.

    The cultures understand them being a different color and even more so they understand how it's a mix or part of a color group. Being able to point and say "orange" when equal red and yellow are mixed isn't a necessary skill. Like what would you say if something was a mixture of equal parts green and yellow? You could say chartreuse. If you didn't know that word are you really missing out on everything chartreuse?

    The right and left thing I think you're referring to the tribe that uses cardinal directions? Thinking in terms of cardinal directions instead of left or right is a bit bizarre and I don't know exactly how deep it goes. Like if i wanted to tell you to hang the picture to the right of the fireplace, I would have to know the cardinal directions of your house? Cardinal directions are extremely useful to use in English. East side wall of your house tells you exactly what wall it is. Left or right doesn't mean anything unless I say something like "facing your house". If I knew your fireplace was on your north wall I could easily say "Hang the picture east of your fireplace" meaning hang it to the right.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] -2 points 7 months ago*

    The statement is dumb but I it does have a hint of true. With new technologies comes a new way of life and this should be reflected in education. The traditional educational system was created when no technologies existed and children and parents lifes were very different.
    That's why every kid has "ADHD". They live in a different reality! siting down in a class for hours listening to a boring class and then having a test on what was said does not fill todays kids needs anymore. The global traditional.school system needs an urgent upgrade

    edit I said Global because it's not a specific country problem

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 53 points 7 months ago (10 children)

    I never thought this would need saying, but the point of writing essays in school is not the final product.

    That essay will almost never be good enough to be relevant or published; no one expects it to be. The goal is to engage with the material, and learn to synthesise and present your ideas logically.

    We must grade the process of writing an essay, never the final product; especially not based on how “good” an essay that final product is.

    We’ve got to stop and ask ourselves why people don’t have AI complete video games for them, but do so for essays. It’s because in one case, the value is in the process, while in the other, the value is believed to be the result, but it shouldn’t be.

    If people understood this, it would make no sense having AI write students’ essays. You can blame people for wanting to take shortcuts, but I believe our society and culture at large play a much bigger role in that trend.

  • source
  • hideshow 10 child comments
  • [–] 14 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Waay back in high school I had a teacher who just aimed for getting an essay written at all. He had one assignment per week: a 5 paragraph essay due every Friday.

    If you turned one in: automatic 75%, baseline. Turn in garbage each week? C grade free. He even said you could turn the same essay in each week. 75%. C.

    If you missed it, 0% no make-up work.

    A lot of the class failed.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Couldn't they like turn in a blank page?

    I get forgetting it. But you should have a paper somewhere that you could turn in, no?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    He demanded at least you write something down. He had a formula for writing 5 paragraph essays and he said to use it, and accepted nonsense if you plugged it in. No pencil. Had to be pen or typed. I still actually use it when trying to write.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    You're right, but there's no easy way to grade the effort without looking at the final result. That's how you end up with a school system that prioritizes test results so much it ends up teaching students how to pass a test instead of learning and processing information.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago

    I don't know if it's still the case, but when I was in school for non-exam (i.e. timed) essays, they were split into outlines and drafts, and the drafts were individually graded as a portion of the entire essay grade, so there was a way to gauge the process rather than simply the final submission.

    I always found that process frustrating, however, because English was easily my best subject and the teacher would get upset if I turned in a 2nd draft that was identical to the first because I was already basically there. Now that I'm older, I understand the reason for why the teacher structured the lessons in such a way.

    I also think that essays in general are a much better metric for measuring true understanding of a topic, at least compared to multiple choice.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    When I was in school, I was given a maximum time limit to write an essat. I was told beforehand what the topic would be. My teacher told me the best way to prepare was write an essay before the test and then memorize it so I wouldn't actually have to create anything new during the test.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago

    I never thought this would need saying, but the point of writing essays in school is not the final product.

    Surely people don't really think that? I say that, and then I think about some of the colossally stupid things I've heard people say and say about education.

  • source
  • parent
  • load more comments (1 reply)
    [–] 49 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Theres a reason American slaves weren't allowed to read or write. Why little girls in Afghanistan aren't allowed to go to school past 3rd grade.

    What's going to happen when you can't read agreements or reports. And just have to believe what someone else tells you it says.

    ?

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Whats worrying is that im already in that situation now with all the 50 page user agreements. Like fuck am I reading that every time.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 6 points 7 months ago

    You know, I do research and there are rules that the informed-consent documents have to be written at an 8th grade reading level.

    No jargon. No technical writing.

    Simple and clear. So that when people agree to be in a study, they actually do understand what that involves.

    Otherwise they can sue the hell out of you for misleading them.

    Why is this also not a requirement for "terms and service"?

    They intentionally write it in "legalise" so that the average person cannot understand it.

    I think it should have to follow the same rules as informed-consent documents.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 31 points 7 months ago (8 children)

    So funny to be like AI can retrieve facts in .3 seconds. First of all, no it can't. Second of all, can't search engines do this? Haven't they been doing this for years? Like AI is slower, less accurate and more wasteful than duckduckgo. Shouldn't all her points have been true years ago?

  • source
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Duckduckgo uses Ai now too right? Better use startpage, it's AI free and privacy based under eu law.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    It has a kill switch for all AI features. It also has a toggle for AI generated images in image search

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago* (2 children)

    I'm not fond of the results ddg gives me. Startpage results are more like Google used to be back in the days when it was a proper search engine. Like over 10 / 15 years ago.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago* (1 child)

    The results are definitely terrible, mostly due to the AI slop sites that have been popping up in the last 3 years. I'll give startpage a go, but I think we are already in dead internet theory territory. I've also heard good things about Kagi

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago

    I think we are already in dead internet theory territory.

    Yup, I believe you're right with that one, and that there's no return now with the current progress of AI. The internet is broken and it doesn't look like the ones responsible for it have any intension of fixing that. They only will make everything much worse.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 29 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    If everyone has one of these “automobiles” do people ever walk or run anymore

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 28 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Why learn to read and write while there's speech recognition and text-to-speech apps nowadays?

  • source
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 19 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    I'm sorry, but can you please attach the youtok link to your comment. I need to hear what you said, since I can't read...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 17 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

    I just looked at that woman’s twitter and it’s an absolute nightmare. AI really makes some stupid people think they are smart.

  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 14 points 7 months ago

    Don't worry, it's about to vote for y'all, too.

    Everything's fiiiine. 😶🔥🔥🔥🔥🥵🫩

  • source
  • [–] 13 points 7 months ago

    The only war is gym class war.

  • source
  • load more comments
    view more: next ›