FFS I can watch you clear a firearm and the first thing I will do is clear it when handed to me or I pick it up at the range.
Always assume it's loaded. It's not hard.
FFS I can watch you clear a firearm and the first thing I will do is clear it when handed to me or I pick it up at the range.
Always assume it's loaded. It's not hard.
Take a bullet, leave a bullet
I can't tell you how many times this has saved me at checkout.
Every gun you see is always loaded.
This is clearly a lie, but is a useful lie that if you live by will make yourself as well as others safer around guns.
Better way to word it is: "Treat every gun as if it is loaded"
Followed with:
Never aim your weapon at anything you do not intend to destroy.
Keep your trigger finger straight and along the receiver until you intend to fire your weapon.
Keep your weapon on safe until ready to fire.
Be aware of your target, your surroundings, and what lies beyond your target.
It's no use reasoning with people who would rather be correct than be safe.
There is a fallacy named after this.
If you treat loaded and unloaded guns with the same safety, you don't have to lie.
The slippery slope fallacy. Just because you just checked and know that the gun is unloaded doesn't inextricably lead to danger if you always treat a gun as if it were loaded.
You don't have to lie to yourself or others that the gun is loaded if it is not, just always treat it as if it is.
The only thing you do by lying is give people reason not to trust you.
Rule #0 of firearm safety: Trust no one.
obligatory firearm safety reminder:
only by holding each other accountable can we make sure that everyone stays safe and has fun.
My grandpa who takes me shooting was going over the firearm safety rules and with rule two I was like “that seems extreme” and his response it’s supposed to be, a gun killing or injuring or damaging isn’t as vivid as the word destroy
And yeah for me the other rules kinda seemed a given, bullets move fast and possibly through our hanging rubber targets, the gun probably can’t fire if you don’t give it a squeeze, and as for loaded better safe than sorry.
These rules seemed almost obvious to me, and yet there’s all these guys at the range behaving like absolute idiots
Thanks. I've never owned, fired, or even held a gun.
I have no intention to. I knew most of these, but I'm glad to see it officially written out like this.
If I'm ever in the position where I need to handle a gun, I can do so more safely then I would have before.
Good work. Keep that shit up.
Calling a firearm "fun" is already part of the problem
Disagree. I’m not from the US, so maybe guns being seen as fun is more of a cultural issue in not aware of, but plenty of weapons are seen as fun here in the UK. And while we do have gun crime, I think firearms are seen differently here vs the US.
People will go axe throwing for fun. With Scouts, we shot air rifles on camp a number of times (supervised by people who knew what they were doing). Knife throwing is also a thing. Clay Pigeon shooting is also not uncommon here.
I genuinely believe using a weapon on a (non-living) target is fun for a lot of normal, well adjusted people.
You are talking about activities.
Sure you can have fun like that. But that doesn't mean that these things should be sold as "fun" like toys are marketed.
They should be marketed to make clear these are dangerous weapons that require training and responsibility, not sold as toys to play around with.
Firearms are fun. Knives are fun. Martial arts are fun. At least to a decently large number of people. That doesn't mean that their roles in society don't suck.
One might say that the danger (to people, to society...) outweighs the benefits of allowing target shooting as a sport. Maybe, I'd still disagree, but that's an opinion we can argue about. We don't allow people to build their own nuclear reactors for fun, for example. But saying something isn't "fun" is ignoring that a lot of people perceive the world differently.
A lot of stupid things are "fun" to a huge number of people. Loud cars, street fights, guns... Normal people grow out of it. Just because some adult children still think it's "fun" doesn't mean we have to tolerate and allow it.
Have you ever tried it?
There's nothing quite so uniquely irritating as someone intensely critical of something they know very little about.
Not wanting to to call the private ownership of deadly weapons fun is hardly "intense". Of anything it undersells the point.
Speaking as someone who enjoyed regular target rifle practice and competitions for the best part of a decade since you insist that matters.
I'm not American, and this kind of absolute is completely unacceptable.
You're basically fun-shaming.
There's plenty of stuff that's universally disliked, like... Idk, murder.... But that's not the whole reason guns exist. Sport shooting, hunting, event target practice, can be lots of fun to people, and they all involve guns, and no person is harmed, if done correctly.
Stop being so hateful.
I don't even like guns. I've never held, nor fired one. And I wouldn't ever, even slightly, say that there is no "fun" to be had with firearms.
You're a dick.
You missed the point. Saying that calling it "fun" is problematic doesn't imply that you can't have fun, of course you can (I have, a tonne). I assume the above comment called it problematic because they weighed the "fun" of gun owners against 40k dead Americans a year and decided maybe we shouldn't be focusing on the entertainment.
You can absolutely have more gun control and not really inhibit firearm sports or hunting BTW. The USA ought to have a monopoly on Olympic shooting medals if that weren't the case 😅
If they had IDPA or USPSA events they probably would, to be fair. The Olympics only have like four shooting events (coincidentally the ones less popular in America) there's way more shooting sports than that.
Besides, if you look at the wiki's medal table like I just did after you made me curious, it seems to indicate the US has 121 medals (incl all metals) for shooting, and the next highest China has 77, so, I mean, I guess we kinda do anyway?
Across all sports the US has over 3 times china's all time medal totals in both summer and winter games. Not even having double is a pretty significant underperformance.
Maybe we should conclude gun culture makes a nation better at track and field because people get more practice running away 😂
Guns should be marketed as dangerous goods that require training and responsibility in owning them.
There is nothing wrong with having fun with firearms, but marketing them like toys is messed up in all kinds of ways.
So yeah, if people want to sell these like they sell candy to children, I am shaming them.
Yeah you expect the American public to abide by the rules and make smart choices?
I'm a member of the American public. I abide by the rules, make smart choices, and don't tolerate those who don't. All my friends are the same way.
Less than 1% of American gun owners commit 100% of gun violence in the US.
Over half of Americans read at a 6th grade level. The culture promotes violence and individualism. You think this populace deserves easily accessible guns? People can turn at any moment due to mental health issues or resort to criminal activity.
To quote K from Men In Black: "a person, can be smart. but people, are dumb."
also yes. I do.
I don’t and it shows in our gun deaths compared to every other developed country.
Once you subtract suicides, self-defense, justifiable homicides, officer involved shootings, and accidents, what you're left with is a statistic that indicates 100% of gun violence is caused by less than 1% of gun owners.
Overall, the vast, VAST majority of gun owners in the US are safe and do make good choices.
The justifiable homicides would contain the officer involved shootings (presuming they were legal). Those are still violent acts compared to suicides and accidents which make up the overwhelming majority of gun deaths.
We shouldn't discount suicides imo. It's tempting to say that a person who wants to kill themself will find a way, but the reality is that when you take away the quickest, easiest route, most people end up not committing suicide
Yeah fuck suicidal people and anyone killed by cops they had it coming. Jesus christ.
As for "justifiable homicide", you mean like... when the other guy had a gun... You want to discount those deaths why?
If we take your number at face value. This is kind of a trolley problem thing right. Should 99 people get to have a nice day out at the range once a month, which they could easily replace with any other leisure activity, if it means one person has to die violently. If you honestly like those odds then fair play mad max.
Worlds largest prison population with highest murder rate of any developed country wants guns to be available like candy… lol
The biggest problem with the American Constitution is the right to bear arms, IMO. I'm not American so take this with a grain of salt, but think of the dumbest person you've met, would you trust them with a gun? Probably not.
It shouldn't be a right to own a gun. I'm not saying the barrier should be all that high, but you should be required to prove that you're more intelligent than an oak tree to own one.
No, the biggest problem (IMO) is that we enshrine the right to bear arms, but mandate no education about firearms in public school. If we're going to embrace guns the same way we do cars, we should teach "shooter's ed" the same way we teach "driver's ed."
The second biggest problem is, even though most Americans agree that the root causes of violence need to be addressed (poverty, homelessness, unemployment, mental health, etc.) the sad reality of our political system is that these interests aren't represented because capitalists have hijacked our government for their own benefit.
Tbh some schools used to, kinda. All the ones around me used to have a rifle team until the early-mid 00s (some got rid of it earlier). I'm not sure they're allowed to anymore now that schools are federally mandated gun free zones (which seems to be the only thing that mandate stopped by the looks of it.)
My high school required a firearms safety class to graduate. Not sure if that had changed since it’s in an area where everyone hunts.
Was that recent? They all did around here too but stopped, and we have a lot of hunters too. Hopefully they still do!
Not really all that recent (mid to late 00s). Unfortunately I don't really know anyone in the area anymore to ask if they still teach or require it.
I would argue that they do follow those rules. They're just willing to destroy other kids at school with hopefully more kids behind them. Same goes for muslims in mosques, etc
About 80 percent of the time yes. Even the dumbest slack jawed hick knows not to fuck around with guns, doesn't make them not twitchy but that's a different issue. It's white trash and rich yuppy types who are generally the threat.
-"It’s white trash" Why are you assigning race to shootings?
Yeah the ones that want to be like the rest of the world and not have the entire populace be gun obsessed morons. They are the issue 😆
I was referring to folks who generally speaking were progressive yuppies back in the day but melted their brains on fox news then Facebook before going out to buy a gun without any training whatsoever. The type who when a protest happens are in their front yard swinging around their gun like their lives are on the line. Mind you that grouping is generally overlapped with white trash.
If you don't want a gun do your own thing. I frankly would kill to get mandatory gun licensing requirements.
Ah I see. I don’t disagree.
Yeah kinda forgot that most folks aren't half feral hicks where the term yuppy very specifically refers to shitstains who moved to the city back in the 80s and 90s only to move back in the 2010s and 2020s to gentrify everything. How I wish to bleed the condescending ones in particular.
1: Don't have a gun.
The only rule You really need.
Oh come on. I get what you are trying to point out, but that is like saying you don't need to know forklift safety rules, as you will never operate a forklift.
I get your point, but hunting, as a sport, is about as old of a sport as you can get, and for that sport there will always be people who prefer firearms.
At a basic level, firearms really can't be barred from most countries as a blanket rule for everyone that is never allowed to be broken.
Therefore, firearms exist and people have them. That might not be you, or your neighbor, nor anyone you know, but they exist and people have them.
If you are ever in the rare position of being in the presence of one, and/or the situation where you need to handle one for any reason, would this information not be better to know ahead of time, rather than unknown until that moment?
It's like first aid, IMO. I've known first aid for well over two decades, including CPR and everything. I've never needed anything more than how to correctly apply a bandaid. I'm still grateful to know what I know in case I'm ever in a situation that I may need it. That situation might never come, it may never happen. I'd rather know, and never have the need to know, than have the need to know, and not know.
Safety, first aid, anything that keeps people alive, should be universal knowledge. Doesn't matter if it's guns, cars, CPR, bandaids, or forklift safety... It's better to know it, and never need it, than need it, and not know it. Period.
Running is a sport. Swimming is a sport. Football is a sport. Hunting is a game at best. For mentally unwell people.
This mindset is why kids that receive abstinence-only sex ed end up getting pregnant way more often
Americans will say the dumbest shit to protect their guns. Having sex and owning a gun are 2 different things. Only one of them is a biological need.
You know how old I was when I learned the most important rule of firearms? Five.
I learned it from watching an anime called Saber Rider and the Star Sheriffs.
The rule is "the weapon is always loaded, treat it as such".
When a fucking anime from the 80s has better firearms safety than a boatload of CERTAIN people, something is horrifyingly wrong.
American things.
Its easier to paint all gun owners as reckless at best, criminals at worst, when you have dumbasses like this walking around. Truth is, the vast majority of american gun owners I've met have been strict followers of the 4 rules. If I ever meet someone who isn't, they immediately become strangers after I leave the situation. Ill try to correct behavior, but not everyone is receptive. Thats where common sense gun laws would be great to have, like proving competency with a firearm and the safety rules especially, every year if you want a ccw. Unfortunately, the ccw in my state is an online course with 10 questions at the end, and fees and a waiting list to get your physical card. I could (and did, but did not carry until confident with my setup) get this ccw without ever having fired the gun I intend to carry, much less handled it safely.
Also, for people less familiar, if you are ever handed a firearm, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CLEAR IT YOURSELF. Just because someone clears it in front of you, does not make it clear. I dont care if the person field strips it in front of me, the first thing im doing after they hand it to me is clearing it myself.
Gun owners reading maybe? Please be more reponsible/safe with your firearms. Be as safe as you think you should, then be a little safer. There's countless little things to work on, like not breaching the fire line or responsible clearing before leave line. We all take a huge responsibility when we decide to carry concealed. You have to delete your ego, you can't be short fused. There's no room for prejudice, or stupidity. You alone are responsible for what comes out of your weapon, and if the responsibility is shrugged off, tragic things happen that you have to live with. Don't mess around, stay sharp.
Treat EVERY GUN as if its loaded (imagine that rounds can magically appear if you set it down or take eyes off, because they sometimes do!) Keep your finger off the trigger until ready and safe to fire. (Keep your booger hook off the bang switch!) Do not point your firearm at anything you are not willing to destroy (whether youre firing or not, whether its loaded or not) Fully know your target and all things behind it(bullets have a tendency to keep going)
I dont care if the person field strips it in front of me, the first thing im doing after they hand it to me is clearing it myself.
This kind of attitude is the exact right way to do it when safety is involved. You make it automatic, not a decision. It's like wearing your seatbelt. It saves you time and energy while producing the best results.
Put another way: Crazy shit happens every day. You make it automatic not because you distrust the person unloading it in front of you. You do it because you shouldn't trust yourself to be perfectly flawless in life and death situations. You do it 100% of the times that you rationally know for certain that it's empty, so that you skip the check 0.00000% of the time that some crazy sequence of events quietly creates a dangerous situation.
top 99 comments