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[–] 1 point 1 year ago

Time to start blasting

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  • [–] 253 points 1 year ago (30 children)

    In authoritarian regimes it isn't uncommon for the state officers and soldiers to engage in casual theft along side their official duties. With the way our country is going, there is a non-zero chance this was an actual ICE officer just working his "side hustle".

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  • [–] 92 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    American cops have been robbers for a long, long time under the guise of civil forfeiture.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_forfeiture_in_the_United_States

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  • [–] 32 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    That is "legal" theft, which can be fought in court, and isn't what I'm referring to. A law enforcement officer committing theft not associated with their duties is what I'm talking about like this example reported just yesterday.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    "Legal theft". Careful not to choke on your words. It is a well known and well documented abuse of the legal system. A great many police departments, corrupt even more than usual, use it to fund departmental expenses, staff perks and bonuses.

    Fighting street level injustice through inaccessible and notoriously corrupt courts is also a sad joke.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    “Legal theft”. Careful not to choke on your words. It is a well known and well documented abuse of the legal system.

    Abuse? Its codified in law. Its working as intended. I don't agree with it, but its not extra-judicial. You'll see I specifically put it quotes to communicate that, while it meets the letter of the law, it is far from actual justice.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    Just because it is codified into law doesn't make it not abusive in nature. That just means the law is attempting to justify abuse.

    Almost as if something being a "law" is nothing more than those in power attempting to legitimize their oppression of the people under their authority.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Just because it is codified into law doesn’t make it not abusive in nature. That just means the law is attempting to justify abuse.

    Are we really just having semantic arguments now?

    "Abuse of the law" I interpret as equal to "breaking the law". Civil Forfeiture doesn't break the law it is written from. Is it unjust? Absolutely! Do I agree it should be abolished? Absolutely!

    Almost as if something being a “law” is nothing more than those in power attempting to legitimize their oppression of the people under their authority.

    Again, I've clearly separated the concepts of "lawful" from "justice". They ARE NOT always equal. This is a case where they aren't.

    Are we done having arguments over grammar and semantics? You can keep going if you like, but I'm more interested in focusing on our world burning than arguing over something we both already agree should be abolished.

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  • [–] 32 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    You are very lucky if they stop with casual theft.

    Lavrentiy Beria, the head of the secret police in Stalin's USSR was a serial rapist and murderer. He had at least hundreds women and children kidnapped off the street, both people who weren't missed but also celebrities, and raped them and then murdered them if they wouldn't pretend it was consensual. A pile of bones covered with lime was uncovered near his one-time residence 15 years ago, but contemporary testimonies say that his torture chamber of a basement had underground passages to other burial sites.

    Once some people are above the law, nothing is off the table.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Yep.

    Obviously this is a pretty extreme example but without the rule of law, government officials will engage in corruption, hold overs, and blackmail.

    With ICE just seizing and deporting whoever they like, it provides white Americans with incredible power over others because they can just threaten to call ICE.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Also Stalin told his daughter to never be alone with Beria because even he couldn't ensure her safety. Honestly I'm convinced that Beria was on Stalin's shit list and the only reason he wasn't purged was because WW2 kicked off.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    Maybe everyone should become an ice agent...what would they do then if everyone was larping

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    This was basically the end state of East Germany right before the wall fell. Something like 1 in 6 people were either in the Stasi or were Stasi informants working alongside them. One wonders what the power dynamic might have mutated into once there were no more sheep because everyone was working for the wolves.

    Maybe that's the kind of loyalist utopia these (and those) chumps were dreaming of but I'd doubt that'd actually shake out how they expected it to.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Fascism is a means to an end. The end result of fascism is cronyism, where power is delegated based on fealty.

    Each level of fascism is a concentric circle, with a new out group named at every iteration.

    Right now, it's LGBT, specifically trans people in addition to immigrants. Once all of the outgroup is gone, a new one is named.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    As a non-American this is really one of the weirdest things about ICE. Why don’t they do their raids in uniform/with badge and face uncovered (perhaps apart from tactical headgear) like any other law enforcement agency? Even when arresting terrorists/mobsters you would expect the cops to be identifiable.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Why don’t they do their raids in uniform/with badge and face uncovered (perhaps apart from tactical headgear) like any other law enforcement agency?

    As far as I know the plain clothes arrests and covered faced raids are new artifacts of the GOP's trump administration. I think there may have been plain clothes investigators before for some undercover work, but never used in the way it is today.

    There are two reasons, I think, they are doing it today.

    1. Masks add anonymity and reduce accountability. These folks are deeply disliked and under the hoods and masks, yet they're people with homes and families. They need to conceal their identity so their actions don't follow them home.

    2. The trump administration wants a law enforcement arm with broad authority to arrest and detain with federal powers. ICE and CBP (Customs and Border Protection) have broad sweeping powers in the most populated portions of our country.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    It’s already been happening, it’s documented in this Afroman song Edit: 3:50 timestamp

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I know it happens with other law enforcement. I even posted a link to a police officer fired for stealing just a few days ago. However, I was specifically talking about ICE, which isn't what Afroman was talking about, but this thread is.

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    [–] 113 points 1 year ago* (5 children)

    Or was he a real ICE agent with a side hustle?

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Either way, this person is incredibly ballsy and an absolute genius, especially if they just leave with the money and don't actually take anyone (to avoid kidnapping charges).

    All you gotta do is go to your van to "get an evidence bag" or "handcuffs", then start the engine and drive off. By the time they realize that you're never coming back for the zip tied person, you're already hid the van and swapped outfits several miles away from the crime scene.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    That's not genuis, like that's a pretty obvious thing to do

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Then why aren't more people doing it?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Where l'm from we had a couple of incidents of people dressing up as police and then stealing money from people. We don't have ICE so people don't dress up as ICE. Maybe I don't get it because police and ICE are so different in the USA? Just didn't strike me as genius.

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  • [–] 93 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    Only one thing to do now. We have to treat all ICE agents like armed criminals until they show their face, a badge, and a warrant.

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  • [–] 19 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I don't see how that absolves them of being criminals. We should ship them to El Salvador and sort out the good ones later.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Ha! We all know ICE agents dont get local warrants.

    They are supposedly running around Chicago with Douglas County warrants. If that is real it means ICE is getting warrants from a judge 2 and a half hours away

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  • [+] 18 points 1 year ago (1 child)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Agreed. It is easy to say "do it" ... but there are a lot of things that could go wrong for a good guy with a gun.

    I was thinking more along the lines of trespassing them if they are on your property or at a business that the employees may not want ICE at. Also maybe calling the police on them ... an armed guy in a mask with a Temu printed Tshirt that says "ICE" is certainly suspicious.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    This is something I've thought about a lot. Obviously this is not legal advice, don't try this shit based on this comment. Say a cop shows up to your door with a warrant and says "Let me in to search your house." How the fuck am I supposed to react to this? If a cop asks to search something, you should always say no (unless there's some sort of implied consent like breathalyzers in Georgia for drivers). But if they have a warrant, how do I even know it's a real warrant? I'm not a legal expert. I don't wanna sound like a sovereign citizen type who believes random words make you immune to things but I feel like the proper thing to do is say something like "I don't consent, but I'm not resisting." Then just stand there. Don't close the door, but don't open it more either.

    Like imagine a vampire. Right? They can only come in if they're invited. As humans we use certain phrases to make orders sound like requests to be polite. I used to get in trouble with my mom as a kid because of it. She'd say things like "Please do X" and I'd protest saying because she's saying please it's like she's asking, not telling. That's not necessarily the best example of it, but it helps demonstrate the point. "Let me do X" is sort of a request to be given permission to do X without actually asking to do X. If they have a warrant, why ask at all? Why not just come in?

    Idk, I pray that I'm never in a situation like this.

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  • [–] 88 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

    Everybody pretends to be an ICE agent to steal or commit violence, it is an utterly illegitimate mob of thugs loyal to a dictator.

    The only thing that isn't pretend about ICE is the bigotry and violence.

    I see no meaningful difference between these people and "actual ICE agents".

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I’m gonna pretend to be an ice agent and go into a McDonald’s and order a McFlurry and pay for my it and say thank you and eat in the lobby and clean up my mess and leave and never mention I’m an ice agent.

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  • [–] 70 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    I hope we start seeing people dressing up as ICE agents and then disappearing real ICE agents while they're off duty. Just round them up. When they protest and try to show their citizenship papers, just call them fake. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

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  • [–] 65 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Remember, in the US, you can be charged for obstructing a plain-clothes officer's duties even before they ID themselves. (I'm not a lawyer but you could refer to 18 USC 111 or 18 USC 1501, or the fact that police don't need to know the law properly to enforce it, Heien v. North Carolina)

    And, fake-ICE cosplayers like this guy can have their charges dropped by DOJ or pardoned by Trump.

    So if you get visited by someone unknown, you're damned if you do or you don't. Demand a judicial warrant and wait to receive one with an actual judge's signature, before you open the door to agents you don't know.

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  • [–] 49 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    If ICE agents behave like criminal thugs why wouldn't criminal thugs behave like ICE agents?

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    or they are one in the same, ooh.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    i think a guy who steals a $1000 is still overall a more decent human being than a guy who kidnaps and imprisons people because, well, he didn't like the vibe (of their skin colour or accent)

    imagine the relief of that latino woman when instead of being taken and thrown into a cage with no way to get out or prove her citizenship status the guy just took some money.

    ICE are worse than thugs

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  • [–] 44 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    After the guy left the lady was probably like “thank god that wasn’t an ice agent.”

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  • [–] 28 points 1 year ago

    Remember the right claiming Floyd protesters were all looters? Itso happens whenever the nation is in distress (in this economical and societal context) the smartest of potential crimedoers would take that as an opportunity. Whenever it's some natural disaster or social conflict, there would be some to use it. And it's fucking frightening that America came to the point that the thing that bothers us is that thugs didn't have a real license to do thugs' things, and every other article going by the #ICE tag is not just stealing, but kidnapping people into Salvador camps, so getting mugged by fake ICE officer is better than meeting the real ones now? It's a fucking circus.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    How many ''ICE'' agents does it take to empty out a bank? I'm thinking of writing a Hollywood film.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    "We're seizing this money as evidence!"

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  • [+] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)
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  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    He low key helped show why we want law officers to have a branded uniform, name tag and provide ID.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I mean, sure that would be a nice fringe benefit of police reform.

    But this was only possible because of the terror police inspire by their mere presence. Nobody is willing to fight back against this guy for fear he's an actual officer. Nobody has any faith in the Real Police (assuming this guy wasn't actually a cop who decided to moonlight as a robber) finding and stopping this guy.

    It isn't as though the crook couldn't have slapped a "Hi I'm Jim_" name tag on his chest and done the exact same thing. You have to believe knowing the officer's identify would result in some consequence to the owner of the gear in order to see that as a material benefit.

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