295
TIL that the City of Edmonton made it extremely easy to build housing. Edmonton started building so much housing that the government got angry and forced it to stop (www.theglobeandmail.com)
submitted 2 weeks ago by to c/til@lemmy.world
33 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

all 33 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 127 points 2 weeks ago (9 children)

It’s almost as if rich speculating landlords captured the govt or something

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 9 child comments
    •
  • [–] 70 points 2 weeks ago (7 children)

    It‘s insane. Members of the German government are proposing to change the law so the city of Berlin can‘t force for-profit renting companies to sell their assets to the city to stop exploding rents. Their reasoning to intervene in perfectly legal city politics? It could scare foreign investors! They literally want to sell out housing in Germany so some dickheads in other parts of the world can fill their pockets even more with our money. Insanity!

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
    •
  • [–] 10 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

    Yeah, fuck that noise. What we're seeing in NL instead is the pension funds are getting into a landlord business. I am actually okay with that kinda circular economy.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
    •
  • [–] 10 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

    All housing should completely be handed over to cooperatives ("Genossenschaften" in German). Low rents, high quality, no hassle.

    Ask me how I know 😁

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
    •
  • [–] 8 points 2 weeks ago* (3 children)

    Cooperatives, self owned or the state are all fine by me. I just don‘t want people to make moneyjust from renting out. It‘s unproductive revenue because you‘re not actually providing a service. That feels wrong. We all need a roof over our heads and the cost should only cover repairs and not fill the pockets of someone else. Renting shouldn‘t be a business.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
    •
  • [–] -3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    But landlords are providing a service, a roof over a head. For what ever is negotiated. Not everyone wants to own. Go over to first time home buyers and Reddit and see how many regret buying, renting is actually cheaper most of the time now.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 child)

    There's no negotiating when a commodity is rare and a core need. That's when greed enters the "market" and makes the lifes of people hell.

    In other words: You are advocating for a class that could do right but often doesn't.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] -3 points 2 weeks ago

    It is a core need but not rare, there’s housing everywhere. Just depends on how you want to live. You want a sfh, apartment, studio, rent a room, ADU? There’s places out there, people just don’t like the market rate. But my place has rented twice and not been on the market for more then 24 hrs each time. It’s way cheaper then buying it at current interest rates. I haven’t lived in an apartment for many years so maybe I’m nieve on how bad it is.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 7 points 2 weeks ago

    I'd be cautious. I guess neither of us has concrete numbers but "Enteignung" means forcing someone to sell. This also means Berlin would buy the real estate at a mark up to make up for the forcing.

    Now Berlin is in debt and buys real estate for their voters. In the framework of Länderfinanzausgleich basically bavaria is paying a portion of that. Have you looked at Munichs rent? Also why should person A live in what is basically a subsidized flat and person B not.

    Furthermore the real estate in question is older pre heatpump era. Now Berlin wants to buy condos that need expensive repair at a mark up? Sounds like a great deal for vonovia.

    Finally politics flip flop. Next gov wants to sell these expensive bought condos to the private companies again at a loss. Done so in Leipzig i think.

    It's a good idea to make a law against state buys expensive flats and sells them cheap. It also reeks of corruption. But i agree, the other way would be better: dont allow the state to sell assets that are meant for allgemeinwohl.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 2 weeks ago

    !twnw@fedia.io

    We must be taxing these ultra-wealthy fucks into the ground. Their negative impact on the world is outsized and they are just pulling the wool over the public's eyes. "Won't you look at these minorities over there? No no no, not this minority with a lot of power, wealth and money, that one with none of that!"

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
    • [–] 68 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

    By provincial fiat, Edmonton must revert within three months to 2024 zoning rules that restrict anything but single-family homes in wide swaths of the city

    Only millionaires that can afford to buy a huge plot of land with only one building on it are allowed to have a home i guess?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 5 child comments
    •
  • [+] -7 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

    You don’t need a huge plot. The other piece is that prefabs have to have 2x6 construction to hold up on a freeway drive to the plot. Double wides and single wides are not what they were in the 70s. They’re not bad, structurally. And, you can slap them down on basements, depending on location. That scenario is very popular in the Midwest where basements are standard.

    You could, quite literally, do a mobile home park style neighborhood where everyone owns. No shared walls. Skirt the zoning.

    Granted, these would be far more palatable with 1 car garages and decking. The old school alley style layout with the garage facing the alley could work.

    Double wides are 3 br 2ba standard with a decent floor plan. Again, slap it on a basement and you have a lot of space.

    The issue is zoning tends to balk at those too.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
    •
  • [–] 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (3 children)

    Idk, 60 m₂ should be the minimum, with 20 m₂ for every extra person. Here's my reasoning.

    Why 60 sq m₂ is the minimum to live comfortably

    Counted for floor space are areas in where you can stand fully and stretch, so about 2.5 m tall.

    Toilet: 1x2 m (2 m₂)
    Bathroom: 2x3 m ( 6 m₂)
    Boiler, utility closet etc.: (2 m₂)

    Kitchen: 3x4 m (12 m₂)
    Bedroom: 4x4 m (16 m₂)
    Living room: 4x4 m (16 m₂)

    Hallway (2x3 m (6 m₂)

    Arguably, if you're eg. a student or often out of house, you could do away with the living room and have no need for a hallway, with a smaller kitchen/bedroom. You'd then need only 40 m₂. But if you want a solution that broadly should work for everyone, then 60 m₂ is necessary.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    I agree, but it would skirt zoning.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child)

    Skirt meaning here? If you mean violate, why not abolish zoning for all but heavy industry, and encourage having stores on ground floors with housing upstairs? Could also pedestrianise the areas, which will make it easier for people to shop.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago

    Shops with condos or apartments upstairs is already done a lot, at least it is in the states. Usually condos. I see a lot of rental type scenarios being converted to condos. So, of course, that brings the price, or the credit needed for the mortgage, out of reach for most.

    I don’t understand why condos cost so much. It’s shared walls, essentially an apartment, with HOA life, so now you’re paying monthly on top of the mortgage for potential Karens in your life.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
    • [–] 33 points 2 weeks ago* (1 child)

    Edmontonian here!

    This is just a conservative Provincial govt sticking it to one of the TWO MAIN left leaning cities because we're going to vote them out

    Also the provincial govt is under 6(7?) active RCMP investigations for corruption, money laundering, conflicts of intrest, foreign bribery and gifts, etc.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
    • [–] 23 points 2 weeks ago

    Alberta so it tracks.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
    •
    [–] 21 points 2 weeks ago

    Boldness doesn't pay

    Boldness is All

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
    •
    [–] 33 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    North America tends to suffer this problem the most. Large, populated cities tend to be under-represented in provencial/state government. And then the rural, aerogel density parts dictate terms to the urban, tungsten density parts. Takes a lot less effort to convince some rural voters (who trend xenophobic and bigoted) to vote for you to capture power, than it is to deal with a plurality in a dense urban environment. Seems like more large cities should tell their next level government up to fuck off.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 14 points 2 weeks ago (1 child)

    And then the rural, aerogel density parts dictate terms to the urban, tungsten density parts.

    While benefiting from the wealthier urban areas' tax money and complaining that the opposite of these things is happening.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
    • [–] 13 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    How much did they manage to get started before this? Enough to transform the city for the better regardless of this decision?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 6 points 2 weeks ago* (1 child)

    The infills are kinda checkered throughout older neighborhoods. No it hasn't transformed the city in just two years. Maybe it would've long term but we can't have anything nice here in Alberta. Edmonton always votes NDP so the provincial government hates us. The provincial government is going to spend 100+ million of our tax dollars ripping out our bike lanes for us next up. How nice that they can overrule municipal government like that. Fun fact, city pays for the police that we have zero control over, the province instead does. Fucking stupid clown ass life here.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
    • [–] 3 points 2 weeks ago

    Removepaywall Use Option 2

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
    •
    [–] -3 points 2 weeks ago

    Y'all are filthy peasants

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
    •
    [+] -7 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

    So, they built shitty housing then?

    We regulate housing for a reason. Safety, affordability, density, and good urban planning.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
    •
  • [–] 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    No. Why would you say that?

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] -4 points 2 weeks ago (1 child)

    Because that's what happens when you have less regulation. See cities hit by hurricanes and earthquakes and floods and fires

    Good regulations on new housing slows developments, but saves lives and prevents hoards of homeless folks

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] 5 points 2 weeks ago

    My question was why did you assume they made shitty houses? Why did you assume they got rid of regulations? Neither of these things were suggested even remotely in the article.

    Also I don't know where you got the idea that good regulation on homes slows down development. What we have is the exact opposite. Which is poor regulation which leads to shitty homes. And bad zoning laws which slows down development. Are you equating zoning laws and regulation? Do you think those are the same thing? Cuz they're not.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent