1398
I really would (reddthat.com)
submitted 4 days ago by to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
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[+] -20 points 3 days ago (25 children)

And what if they didn't actually SA'd and it is a false claim?

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  • [–] 27 points 3 days ago (13 children)

    Well that'd be a different context entirely. The premise here was that they had, but it would be unfair to make them face the consequences of their actions.

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  • [+] -15 points 3 days ago (13 children)
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  • [–] 16 points 3 days ago (5 children)

    Yes but that "grayscale and nuance" is also what stops people from reporting stuff that actually was SA. A fair judicial process is what solves this. Raise the claims if the are true, that is what justice is for, but know that if you raise false claims you are also entering yourself into that justice system. Malicious acts against people and groups should be punished, and victims should be able to seek help.

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  • [+] -11 points 3 days ago (4 children)

    Yeah, I'm not saying is not like that. The problem is that forgetting that actually the world is that grayscale, is a double-edged sword, as it will polarize and/or cause extremism or maximalism from one side, or another, or both.

    I totally agree that sexual abusers are scum and should be tortured until die, but what I don't see as fair is that the (even if really few) victims of FA have to pay for the crimes of other people they don't represent.

    I often feel depressed thinking about this and the fact that there's not easy way out of this septic pit, and that things seem to be worse every fucking second. I hate this world.

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  • [–] 8 points 3 days ago (3 children)

    I think the problem here is that you're addressing an entirely different question.

    The question of if someone should report someone who raped them is entirely separate from the potential chance for false allegations.

    If someone is raped, they should report it. If someone isn't raped but wants to make a false allegation, real cases of rape being reported won't change that person's decision to file a fake claim.

    The entire point here is just "if you are raped, you should report it, even if that could ruin the rapist's life in some way, because they raped you, so they deserve consequences". It doesn't make a judgement call on how we can combat false allegations.

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  • [+] 0 points 2 days ago (3 children)
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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    You have got to stop projecting. There are way more rape victims that were actually raped than people out here filing false rape reports.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    Yeah, and that doesn't make that any fucking less important. Can you stop projecting yourself and trying to be a fucking cop?

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  • [–] 22 points 3 days ago* (3 children)

    When we talk about sexual violence, the focus too often falls on what survivors did, where they were, or whether they reported. But rape happens because someone chooses to violate another person’s consent.

    According to FBI crime data, an average of 107,418 U.S. men are the perpetrators of reported rape each year.

    Each year, an average of 5,510 female perpetrators are reported for rape, according to law enforcement reporting.

    Prevention efforts must focus on the people who cause harm, not on blaming survivors for the violence committed against them.

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  • [+] -5 points 3 days ago (3 children)
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  • [–] 19 points 3 days ago* (2 children)

    It is overwhelmingly men that rape other men, women, and children.

    The more important stat that only 8% of rape and sexual assault cases see a courtroom I have stated elsewhere in this thread.

    False rates of sexual assault happen at the same rate of false reporting of any other crime, between 2-5%.

    I can pull sources for each and every one of these statistics.

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  • [+] -7 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    Actually, the most reliable source goes from 2-8%

    It's still small, but it should be zero just as any other crime. That's at least my Utopia.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 days ago (2 children)

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  • [+] -1 points 2 days ago (2 children)
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  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    It's disgusting how you undermine rape victims at every turn.

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  • [+] -1 points 2 days ago (1 child)
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  • [–] 14 points 3 days ago (5 children)
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  • [+] -3 points 3 days ago (4 children)
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  • [–] 5 points 3 days ago (3 children)

    They are inextricably entwined. When people only consider a certain type of rape "real rape", it impacts which cases are investigated and prosecuted and what is considered a false claim.

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  • [–] -2 points 3 days ago (2 children)

    Yes they are intertwined, but still there's an important difference and I think it's useful to be clear. But apparently we can't talk about it here or messages get deleted. Oh well, enforce the hive mind at all costs, I guess.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 days ago (1 child)

    You're mixing two concepts here. 1) The inaccuracy of stereotypical rape definition, and 2) The existence of false accusations.

    Then why didn't you admit they were intertwined with your initial comment? You didn't because you falsely asserted that they are two different concepts.

    Some false accusations are labeled as such because of people's perception of what entails rape.

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  • [–] -1 points 3 days ago

    They are distinct things that are interrelated. Like the pressure and temperature of a gas. Distinct things to measure and understand, yet one tends to affect the other unless you're very careful. In the topic of this thread, it's very important to make the distinction: an accusation is not a false just because it doesn't follow the stereotypical definition. So we need to be clear when we're talking about false accusations, ie if we're not talking about incorrect definitions - but real malicious or erroneous false accusations. And that's an important facet of this discussion because although it's quite small and similar to other crime accusations; this particular type of false accusation is very hard to defend oneself against and it can ruin lives. And even more importantly, can make it harder for real victims, especially when you add on the problem where different people have different definitions of the crime.

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  • [–] -5 points 3 days ago*

    Well, your own sources say the opposite, so you are contradicting yourself, or perhaps you didn’t actually read your own sources, but instead sent whatever you thought supported your biases.

    Methodologically rigorous research finds 2-8%

    In contrast, when more methodologically rigorous research has been conducted, estimates for the percentage of false reports begin to converge around 2-8%.

    • For example, in a multi-site study of 8 U.S. communities involved in the “Making a Difference” (or “MAD”) Project, data were collected by law enforcement agencies for all sexual assault reports received in an 18-24 month period. Of the 2,059 cases that were included in the study, 140 (7%) were classified as false.

    This is particularly noteworthy because a number of measures were taken to protect the reliability and validity of the research. First, all participating law enforcement agencies were provided training and technical assistance in an ongoing way to ensure that they were applying consistent definitions for a false report. In addition, a random sample of cases was checked for data entry errors.

    More information on the MAD Project is available at http://www.evawintl.org/.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 days ago (1 child)

    If you trust the Americans justice system to keep incarcerating those judges guilty, then why don't you trust their system to judge appropriately for those that SA people? I get the feeling from this comment that a very large part of it is just plain misogyny. It is a fact that women already suffer harsher prison terms for comparable crimes to men. Even with the inappropriate harsh terms minorites serve. It's clear from studies on this subject and all your comments do it discourage all genders from reporting. The American justice system seems fine with their jailing of other innocent's, just to "make sure ppl feel safe". It's broken all over the place, people are suffering, I don't have a solution. I do encourage speaking up! The Constitution and Bill of Rights ensure the option of speaking publicly about problems to attempt to solve them. Be a part of the solution, stop preventing discussion of the issues!

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