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[–] 210 points 7 months ago (60 children)

American Christians: "Oh my god! The pope is a commie socialist woke antifa!"

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  • [–] 85 points 7 months ago (10 children)

    Among evangelical hardliners it's not an uncommon belief that the Pope is the Anti Christ, so...

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  • [–] 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Hell Catholics weren't considered white for a long time

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  • [–] 35 points 7 months ago* (46 children)

    For many christians, "christianity" is a social club they strongly belong to, not an actual religion. They don't give a fuck about what the bible is actually trying to convey, they just use the bible as a tackboard to pin their own beliefs and desires onto.

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  • [–] 20 points 7 months ago (45 children)

    You described almost every religion ever.

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  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago (44 children)

    Religion is a mental disorder. Prove me wrong. (with actual studies and not anecdotes)

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  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    In order to answer the challenge, I suppose the first question would be 'what constitutes a religion?' If you're simply talking about a group of people who share a passionately held belief that tries to get others to conform to that belief through emotional manipulation, intimidation and peer pressure, well....you're pretty much talking about the entire human race.

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Yes, the entire human race is contemptible. I'm glad we could arrive at this conclusion.

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  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago

    Heh...not sure why such a conclusion would make you glad, but if there's one thing that's universally true of the human race, it's that people will do amazing things - amazingly awesome things, and amazingly terrible things. I guess the trick is to try to do more of the awesome stuff as much as we can.... shrug

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (15 children)

    Religion is just ceremony and doctrine surrounding belief.

    A bit like having cake and a party, because you believe the earth completing a lap of the sun dated from the day of your birth is worth celebrating. Or having someone arrested and taken to court and sent to prison for stealing from you, because you and many others in society believe in concepts like personal property, and justice, and morality. You know, all those things you believe in that definitely exist, even though you've never seen a photo of morality, or seen a scientific study proving that justice exists. But they must do because old books say so, and so do your peers, and anyway our whole society would fall apart if people stopped believing in them.

    Humans, simply put, are weird. We're a species composed of mental disorders unique to us and nothing else in nature. To single out religion as being especially weird and worthy of contempt is... well... a bit weird and worthy of contempt, IMO

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Religion is just ceremony and doctrine surrounding belief.

    A bit like having cake and a party, because you believe the earth completing a lap of the sun dated from the day of your birth is worth celebrating.

    Cakes, parties, planets, the Sun, rotation, years, are all real. Your gods aren't.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    Bread, wine, communion, annual religious festivities are also all real. Gods may not be real, but neither are a lot of human concepts. Good, evil, justice, aesthetics, mathematics, class, debt, trust, freedom... any number of things we believe exist but do not have any physical presence in the universe, no proof outside of human inference and intuition (and the occasional bit of paperwork) that they exist. They all, however, have their uses, and their effects are made manifest by our actions, for good and ill.

    "Those who dance are thought insane by those who cannot hear the music"

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (12 children)

    Yea go ahead and get back to me when a birthday party involves killing someone and celebrating it.

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  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago (11 children)

    So celebrating murder is the benchmark for insanity? Public executions used to draw big crowds, nothing to do with religion. Armies still give ceremonial medals for particularly inventive or brave killing, again, nothing to do with religion. Luigi Mangelone is celebrated by many for murder... admittedly the murder of a corporate 'hands off' serial killer, but still - its celebrating murder.

    Again, I say, people are strange enough already - religion is barely even the icing on the cake.

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  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago (10 children)

    Yea people are crazy, so why would you defend something that makes them even less attached to reality??

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (9 children)

    I'm not so much defending religion as opposing your point of view that it's a marker of insanity. In fact, most things that bring people closer together as a cohesive community are positive, whether that's hobbies, interests or beliefs. Its only when it spills into doing harm to others that it becomes a problem (e.g. in certain aspects of sports, nationalism, and religion) but I still don't think it's a greater marker of ill mental health than a lot of other things we take for granted

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (8 children)

    Then allow me to refine my point to specify organized religion's teachings. Sure, many develop a community, but they develop a community that specifically judges and ostracizes anyone not conforming to their extremely narrow belief system.

    Most of organized religions leverage those negative aspects to further control their 'flock'. There are many aspects that are outright horrible for individuals, not the least of which is believing things for the simple fact that an authority said so.

    I'm not against people building community. I am very against people building insular, hierarchical, tyrranical systems that brainwash people into foolish or down right horrible behavior.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (7 children)

    The Jehovah's Witness are pretty bad for all that... as are Scientologists, a load of cults, Elan Schools, and arguably even the military and manosphere. Many of these don't necessarily bring religion into things.

    Our shared objection is the human capacity for imposing power, subjugation and control of others. Where we differ is that Religion is any more a factor in that than anything else.

    I'll grant you there's probably quasi-religious elements to more cults across history than not, mind. I guess its an easier path than most to abuse of power, if you can convince people and even more powerful entity is on your side

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (6 children)

    Every Christian and most any Islam sect is also guilty of building a highly judgmental and insanely insular "community", too.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (5 children)

    Not in my experience. All the christians I've known over the last decade have been lovely, welcoming and open. They do have their in-groups too of course, and my interests are particularly bohemian so we don't socialise all that regularly, but honestly their religion only tends to come up if I ask about it. Otherwise they're just as content as anyone else to come and see a movie or go for a walk or whatever.

    Some of the old biddies at the church I grew up with were pretty judgmental though, but they're all dead now. Everyone left is just... nice.

    I only know Muslim parents through my kids school, because my kids best friend is Muslim, and the parents are perfectly happy with playdates with my secular kid. There are one or two cultural oddities - e.g. the mum won't come over our house unless my SO is also home (but will meet me in public) but I'm not sure if that's a Muslim thing or a Turkish thing.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (4 children)

    Your experience is rare and you should cherish it, then.

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  • [–] 0 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    I think you're probably mistaking the loudest christians for the majority. Easy mistake to make

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (2 children)

    Nope. I grew up a Christian. I know exactly how those 'nice' Christians think.

    They might be nice to people they like and understand, but their ignorance is profound and troubling to anyone with an actusl broad understanding of the world.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (1 child)

    If they're the sort of people I've seen on televangelist shows, then I take it all back. Those guys are terrifying

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago*

    Yea, Kenneth Copeland is the closest to a demon walking this earth I can think of. and that is including the dictators and mass murderers... Dude's the perfect example of the subterfuge and corruption a demon as described in literature would bring to Christianity. An absolute corrupting force wearing the guise of good intentions.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (13 children)

    "You should be nice to people"
    How does this need proof? Something like Buddhism isn't saying "this is how the world is" more like "these attitudes might be helpful to you" - there is nothing there to prove.
    Of course if you think that a gigantic sky daddy wants you to invade a country because the man on TV said so, then perhaps you should reassess some things.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (3 children)

    Buddhism isn't a religion as there is no deity to worship. Isn't it more a philosophy?

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago (2 children)

    Yeah, its a sliding scale. I suppose tax status is a simple line to differentiate between a philosophy & religion.

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (7 children)

    Exactly. and the vast majority of how 'religion' is used today is ...

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Yesterday I would have said intermittent fasting.
    Today? IDK probably getting their internal monologues to shut the fuck up for a bit.

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Vast majority? Christianity and Islam combined make up about 66% of the religious population. Which other religions have a sizeable amount of people and conduct crusades?

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    I hate to break it to you, but those 66% are conducting crusades... Just look at all the fucking brainless Christogooners celebrating the war on Iran...

    No, not all Christians/Islamists are bad, but their religions are.

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  • [–] -1 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Ah, so you just don't know what ‘vast majority’ means, and think you can use words willy-nilly.

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  • [–] -2 points 7 months ago (6 children)

    Religion is one of human basic mental needs, unfortunately. Oh, prove me wrong. (with actual studies and not anecdotes)

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    Religion is one of human basic mental needs, unfortunately. Oh, prove me wrong. (with actual studies and not anecdotes)

    How about you prove yourself right before demanding that others need to?

    Fun fact, only yesterday I've heard in the radio about a new study about youth anxiety and their conclusion was that a sense of togetherness is what reduces anxiety and while religious communities provide that, they are not the sole provider of that sense and other communities may as well. Also "people need community" is not the same as "people need religion", so your ridiculous claim better be not backed up by anything that confuses these two.

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  • [–] 1 point 7 months ago

    My "prove it" comment was a direct reaction on LurkingLuddite's "prove it" comment - see it to find the /s in mine. I don't have studies but I have friends with education in psychology and this seems to be today's understanding of human psyche. People need something transcendental to believe in - that's why religion is so widespread. It's not a disorder, it's the natural state. I'm not a big fan of religion, so I see it as an evolutionary trap - surely adaptive in many ways, though, unfortunately.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Aren't the least religious countries on Earth generally the happiest ones?

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    The least religious countries are those without a strong central organized religion. The people there are still mostly religious, just on an individual level - I live in one of those, I can see it all around.

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  • [–] 57 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Sorry Pope, there’s no money in that. Signed - insurance companies and Donald j Trump (because he likes his name in everything)

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  • [–] 47 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    That's rather pointed as there is only one first world country that does not have universal healthcare.

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago

    Sort of. A lot of us (countries) have some kind of public healthcare, but it's not really universal.

    From experience in Australia: dental isn't included, physio is limited, out of pocket costs can be large for non-hospital visits because it's not a public system just a private subsidy model (mostly), wait times for "elective" surgery can be way, way longer on the public system because private health is permitted to exist and the public system is underfunded/understaffed.

    What's worse is that private health cover is allowed to just cover the difference between public and private, meaning even if you go private, the public is still paying. Like, you wanna be private, fuck off and go be private then... (Talking to the private healthcare advocates, not the people. I have some level of private healthcare cover, even though I think it's a fucking stupid system)

    List goes on.

    It's WAY better than the US, but I refuse to call it universal.

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  • [–] 32 points 7 months ago

    As an American, he would be familiar with the consequences of not having it.

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  • [–] 26 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    One of the most Christian things I've heard from a pope in quite a long time

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  • [–] 25 points 7 months ago

    We do. There are like 3 countries that don't... Oh yeah, makes sense.

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  • [–] 24 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    MAGA: He is neither a true American nor a true christian.

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Down with the red sox! Down with the cubs! Down with the pope!!

    /s

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  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    red sox are boston. white sox are chicago

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  • [–] 20 points 7 months ago

    No can do. Gotta bomb brown people to protect pedophiles.

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  • [–] 12 points 7 months ago

    huh, so that's Thiel's antichrist I guess

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  • [–] 9 points 7 months ago

    USA will ask how the shareholders will cope. 

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  • [–] 9 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    I wonder how many countries’ healthcare the Vatican hoard could fund in perpetuity. The number is greater than one.

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  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (3 children)

    I was actually surprised to find out LDS (mormons) are several times wealthier than the Catholic Church on paper.

    Their total revenue is around $30 billion a year. They could, in theory, pay for an entire states medical costs like Utah that spends about $18 billion a year.

    Spefically pointed to your comment though, the Catholic Church is already the biggest private healthcare provider in the world. It operates roughly twenty percent of healthcare facilities in the world.

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Those are great points. What payment model do the Catholic hospitals usually use? Free to everyone? Or are they operating the hospitals but only under whatever insurance or government coverage exists? I’m sure it varies around the world but I’m curious about the US especially. I think I was born in a Catholic founded hospital. But it seems like they are just the care provider and not so much the funding provider. The world “healthcare” has two meanings in this way.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago

    Catholic hospitals are private in the US, unless specifically otherwise designated. You can pull up the public finance records to see how revenue is spent, to the best of my knowledge.

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  • [–] 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

    Yes, they do not pay all the costs. Often times they will write off debts or provide care for free. This is not always the case though. Typically they are funded like a for profit hospital with the major difference being there are no shareholders to take the profit.

    I have heard estimates that they subsidize $60 billion a year in healthcare costs across the US.

    I was trying to get a clearer picture of how many countries the Catholic Church could fund annually but estimating their money is very complicated. They are not centralized like the Mormon church and all their churches operate independently.

    With estimates as high as $2 trillion of total revenue, in theory, they could pay for several European countries. But not something like the whole US that spends $5.3 trillion on healthcare.

    I think this also touches on just general criticism of the Catholic church. Are they really good stewards of their money, is corruption a problem, etc. I have read a lot of conflicting information on these topics.

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  • [–] 8 points 7 months ago

    "Oh that's it, he's going to Hell for sure!" -MAGA

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  • [–] 7 points 7 months ago (3 children)

    Sorry Pope your follows say you are wrong lol

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  • [–] 9 points 7 months ago*

    protestants, including evangelicals, are not catholics and do not follow the pope

    According to a 2024 Gallup survey, approximately 69% of the U.S. population—about 235 million out of 340 million people—identify as Christian.[1] A plurality of Americans identify as Protestant (45%), followed by Catholics (22%). Smaller Christian groups include members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (1.5%), Eastern Orthodox Christians (0.5%), and other Christian denominations (0.4%).[1]

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  • [–] 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Trump will invade Vatican City.

    This is not the kind of Popeing he paid for.

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  • [–] 4 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    I fully support socialized medicine for all. One question though, the church owns and operates numerous medical universities and hospitals. Are they really cool with universal healthcare?

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago

    To be fair, church-owned hospitals are pretty much closest thing to universal healthcare USA currently has. Government chipping in with their own universal healthcare would relieve a lot of cost, paperwork and trouble from the church.

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  • [–] 10 points 7 months ago

    Conservatives: He thinks darkies and wage slaves should have universal health care! Hes the antichrist!!!

    Peter Thiel: I know. 😈

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  • [–] 3 points 7 months ago
    [+] 5 points 7 months ago (3 children)
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