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[–] 67 points 9 months ago (6 children)

“We really recognise the tremendous opportunity that ebikes can offer for getting anyone, including younger people, from A to B, independently,” McLean said. “[It] is a really, really positive thing that connects them to education, to work, to social things and communities as well.

“There’s lots of benefits that go along with them, but when we have really high powered ebikes and people driving them dangerously and without helmets, then they certainly pose a significant risk.”

Seems like a pretty balanced take honestly.

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  • [–] 43 points 9 months ago* (3 children)

    If it goes faster than 28 mph, has a motor more powerful than 1000w, or lacks usable pedals, it's not an e-bike at all. People riding these things get people who ride actual electric bicycles fucked over though, which is unfortunate because electric assisted bicycles open up a lot of opportunities for people who are elderly or have other physical disabilities.

    I am all for making e-moto and e-bikes legally distinct but punishing cyclists because of e-moto bullshit is a stupid decision. Also, parents who buy their kids motorcycles with no training, safety gear, or evaluation of their child's judgement should be held accountable instead of the people who are just trying to get to work on an e-bike.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago

    Yeah I completely agree. This exact issue kind of triggers me, and I did draft a longer diatribe complaining about exactly this, which I didn't post.

    I have an assortment of bikes including e-bikes, all of which I love equally. They're truly amazing machines.

    If you purchase a $200 k-mart commuter, and a $400 wheel hub motor and battery from temu, then perch a 12 year old precariously in the saddle that's not an e-bike it's an unregistered unregulated electric motorbike. This type of set up can easily achieve 50km/h with the majority more like 60km/h and some exceeding 80km/h.

    The bikes just aren't built for this kind of stress, and the people riding them don't have a reasonable understanding of the risks. They scream around on bike paths weaving around kids and babies in strollers.

    The current rules here in west aus (as I understand them) merely allow pedal assist up to 25 km/h. Critically, that means the bike can allow you to switch between modes providing more or less assistance, but no throttle. Additionally a lot of the temu bikes require you to move the pedals but do not require you to provide any effort - the pedals moving is more like a switch that allows the motor to engage.

    The basic problem is that existing legislation just isn't sufficient. Guilting parents isn't enough. There needs to be better laws, and they need to be actively policed.

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  • [–] 171 points 9 months ago (10 children)

    "Get off your phones and meet people your age in real life!" "Wait not like that!"

    Feels like kids can't win these days.

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  • [–] 63 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Can't wait for the e-bike gang wars of '26.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Teens especially, since that law was catered more towards children. These days, teens are being disregarded and grouped in with children, even if they are vastly different.

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  • [–] 102 points 9 months ago* (6 children)

    Just gotta keep making the world as hostile as possible to teenagers.

    Because the school to prison pipeline can only do so much

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  • [–] 29 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    This is such a gross oversimplification, it's insane. They could also join the military.

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    I mean banning teens seems a pretty good policy.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (6 children)
  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 15 points 9 months ago

    I met one of these teens on a train he showed me a few news clips he was in with like 100 other teens on ebikes and scooters lol

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  • [–] 14 points 9 months ago* (1 child)

    In my community a couple of years ago some middle aged guy assaulted a teen who was riding his Surron (non peddle ebike/motorcycle) in the park. Was he speeding? Probably, but that doesn't excuse what that twat did. For the most part kids on these types of bikes aren't the problem.

    Our real problem has been pre teens on 110cc dirt bikes. They ride in groups and have been literally terrorizing people. I talked to one lady who had to put her horse down when they scared it and caused it to break a leg. Then they laughed at her and rode off. The police can't catch them, though they've tried, but not that hard since they could actually do some simple detective work if they wanted to

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    We had the same. But the child on the bike died from there injuries. The bike went missing. so we don't know the condition of the bike. No one talked to the "filth" cus snitches get stitches and all that. You would think the community would learn and ban it internally however there is still mini dirt bikes on the green where it happend and it's As if it never happend.

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  • [–] 43 points 9 months ago (6 children)

    The answer is simple: ban teens

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  • [–] 22 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    That's pretty much it. Ban them from congregating in parking lots. Ban them from malls. But if your kid has friends over and one sneaks beer and has a wreck, you're getting sued. But don't discipline your kids or that's abuse. Also, if you kid has a vape at school, they are getting a criminal charge. Whatever you do, don't allow kids to exist, especially with other kids outside of your house, but also, don't let them be entertained when they're bored either.

    My point is, maybe it's all too complicated and there should be a different approach.

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  • [+] 25 points 9 months ago (3 children)
  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, I was going to say that the problem actually appears to be children.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    No, the problem is that parenting became a bad word or something, so you have feral critters loud mouthing and sometimes assaulting their own parents, who in turn complain the government should fix it.

    But it's never the parents' fault...

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  • [–] 24 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    Just wait until all those teen grow up and figure out that old farts on social media are responsible.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    Unfortunately the old farts on social media were once the teens being treated like criminals for existing. It's a cycle. Yesterday's rebels become tomorrow's pearl clutchers.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (3 children)

    Define old fart? To me a old fart is in their late 60 early 70's. This is the boomers. They were the first true generation of plenty. They were promised a good life and they had one unless they were foolish with the opportunity. Let me assure you they have been against any ones freedom except their own from the start.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I know plenty of older Gen X who've turned into pearl clutching, curmudgeonly hypocrites and even a few younger folks who've developed early onset "get off my lawn" syndrome. While I'll certainly grant that it seems to be far more common among older folks it's a mindset we all can fall into if we're not self aware enough.

    Hell I know more than a few joyless Gen Z's who already have fallen into the habit of being utterly scandalized whenever they see someone enjoying life a bit too much. Not all by a longshot yet, but a concerning amount for ones so young.

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  • [–] 35 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    "Why aren't the kids going outside anymore?" "Why are there kids outside?!"

    Let teens exist in public spaces for fuck's sake.

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  • [–] 22 points 9 months ago

    I dunno, can't parents just keep their kids in a box till they're 18 and can become productive, compliant wage slaves, like everyone else.

    /s

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  • [–] 14 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    all yall folk running hamburger software: 25kph is around 15mph and change. 4 minute miles. Really fast sprints.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    I could go for a burg about now

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    we got this great burg place at the other The City. they have a vegan The Fryer for their fries so i can actually eat the fries. fuckin good fries, fuckin good beer (i wouldn't know, i don't know beer, but my buddies say it's fuckin good) fuckin good burgs. I gotta go back. Unfortunately we lost out on the raffle for Banana League tickets so we will just have to go to a regular baseball game like chumps.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    Seems like a pretty big logical leep to link the two things.

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  • [–] 20 points 9 months ago

    Beware! The anti fun police are in effect!

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  • [–] 19 points 9 months ago

    Your throwing stick trick has boomeranged on us!

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  • [–] 31 points 9 months ago (28 children)

    Let me rephrase: Australians concerned about children on vehicles that can go 25mph with no requirement for a license or training.

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  • [–] 16 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    The issue is more that they sell 500-1000W ebikes that are not specced for road usage, only for riding on private ground - and then hand them to teenagers. As so often, the parents are the issue, not the teens. As so often, everyone will pay the price for it through stricter regulation.

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  • [–] 17 points 9 months ago*

    Wrong.

    we have two issues

    One is crusted old cumstains losing their shit about the presence of Visible Teenagers after the social media ban. They can go fuck 'emselves

    The other issue is teens on illegal wattage ebikes that are souped up to 50/90kmph and ridden in areas not designed to have things at that speed tearing through them. Because of pedestrians, kids, horses, etc.

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  • [–] 21 points 9 months ago (10 children)

    25 kph, not mph. Which isn't very fast.

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    25kph is the legal speed limit for ebikes. It does not magically prevent them from going faster.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (6 children)

    and it's not hard to get up to 40kph just using your legs and a hill without a motor. we've got a great hill that's steep enough to get up to 50kph, but i'm not quite brave enough for that.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    No doubt, but that's not what is happening. Kids are doing 40 on the flat on their "ebike" and they don't look or indicate and they can't do 40km/h uphill so they slow down a lot unexpectedly.

    There needs to be some kind of training and regulation.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (2 children)

    There needs to be some kind of training and regulation.

    I'd have it be part of the drivers ed, but i'm an old stick in the mud

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    That's pretty close to my average speed and I'm just a commuter on a 30lb hardtail MTB with shitty infrastructure. I'd wager anyone who can ride a bike can easily go faster than that on a flat, even if they weren't a regular rider.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    The article doesn't mention any "miles per hour". Do people in Australia use mph?

    In December, the NSW premier, Chris Minns, announced a plan to halve ebikes’ power – and therefore reduce their top speeds – to 250 watts...

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago* (4 children)

    You can go 25mph and faster on a bicycle no problem, I reject the argument that e-bikes (not e-moto) are a significant danger. That's mostly cabrain propaganda that people who chose to stop thinking accept.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Not unless you are are really gunning it and on a fitted road bike.

    There is a pretty big psychological aspect to it in that without putting in the work, you can become disconnected in how fast you are accelerating/moving. With bicycles you tend to work up the speed as you start to understand and get comfortable with what you are riding; a process that isn't really present with e-bikes.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    Fitted road bike? I do it regularly on a 3x7 hardtail MTB loaded down with pannier bags and a frame bag. That's not downhill, that's on a flat. I am just an ordinary bike commuter too, not an athlete and I have a low end steel Trek meant for single track MTB riding. It weighs at least 30 lbs with all my stuff on it.

    I think you are overestimating how hard it is to go fast with little to no training and the right gear, even someone who doesn't ride regularly could probably hit 20 on a flat if they tried. Downhill you can hit 35mph+ even if you aren't in shape and barely know how to ride.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    A dude got up to 90mph on a bike just off his own steam before

    I remember all the adverts when I was a kid telling me that if I got hit by a car at 30mph there was a 90% chance I'd live (this was the happy path of the advert). This is also cars ostensibly driven by licensed people.

    E-bikes with a 25mph limiter are not a risk if we allow cars in the same space as pedestrians

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  • [–] 10 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    As an Australian the problem is largely what you imagine.

    An unregulated industry brought in bikes that were closer to motorbikes than pushbikes and parents didnt do their due diligence on it. The same industry also brought in a huge amount of bikes that were perfectly sane when stock but were literally childs play to turn into something closer to a motorbike. Now the vast majority of kids went out and did kid shit and they were slightly annoying, a not insignificant number of them got hurt, but there was no real outcry.

    The govt as governments are want to do reacted way too fucking slowly in putting sane limitations on what could and couldnt be sold and hold manufacturers and importers accountable. In their defence partly because 90% of them are coming out of china and the govt arent idiots in that they know how easy it would be for an importer to find a new frontman and the Chinese manufacturer to rebrand and force them to play whackamole and partly because they are very popular among adults and people who arent riding them like dickheads AND they didnt want to look anti-green by discouraging people to find car alternatives.

    But Here come the fuckwits like takeovers are to "legitimate" street racing on quiet backroads, kids started doing wheelies through shopping centers while filming it for the gram, deciding it would be funny to absolutely destroy the grass and surfacing on local sporting fields and swerving in and out of traffic in 80 zones.

    Its not that the cops dont care, the cops know what the reality is that if they start trying to catch them, the kids will run and eventually someones "good boy who never hurt anyone and loved to laugh" is going "to be chased to his death over a modified E-bike and the police are the reason for his death" regardless of what prompted them to chase him in the first place.

    All in all its a 3 layer shit sandwich.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    and parents didnt do their due diligence on it.

    Pretty much sums up a lot.
    Parents these days...

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    In all seriousness its not exactly the most simple thing for a layman.

    I speak petrolhead, so when you tell me something has a 2000W motor (Light bulbs and plug in heaters are measured in Watts. I honestly believe they do that on purpose to confuse the issue) I immediately do the conversion to 2kw, which is 2.6 hp on an e-bike that weighs 50kg. A 50cc Vespa makes 3.1hp and weighs 100kg. Now you throw a 50kg rider on there and you have a better power to weight ratio on the E-Bike, and shitloads more torque.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Same thing here in the Netherlands: cheap, poorly made Chinese fatbikes that were incredibly easy to unlock flooded the market. The result: teens are riding around at 40kph and stunting on a bike that has no brakes. Because those wear down rapidly if you overclock the motor, and nobody does maintenance on those shitty bikes.

    So now they’re trying to regulate it, much too late. When honestly, they should just ban the fucking things for anyone under 25 without a disability…

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