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[–] 126 points 9 months ago (5 children)
  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I wouldn't be naive enough to believe there's not a backdoor somewhere in LUKS.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

    "Naive" doesn't sit right with me. Anyone can scrutinize LUKS, or BitLocker for that matter (via cryptsetup). Backdoors aren't the issue here, even for MS Bitlocker. The issue, as stated in the article, is:

    by default, BitLocker recovery keys are uploaded to Microsoft’s cloud

    No need for a backdoor if you know you can get keys to the front door.

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  • [–] 86 points 9 months ago
    [–] 430 points 9 months ago (54 children)

    So, this means Microsoft has copies of every single bitlocker key, meaning that a bad actor could obtain them... Thereby making bitlocker less than worthless, it's an active threat.
    MS really speedrunning worst possible software timeline

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  • [–] 212 points 9 months ago (36 children)

    They don't have a copy of every single Bitlocker key. They do have a copy of your Bitlocker key if you are dumb enough to allow it to sync with your Microsoft account, you know, "for convenience."

    Don't use a Microsoft account with Windows, even if you are forced to use Windows.

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  • [–] 142 points 9 months ago (17 children)

    To use Windows without a Microsoft account requires tech literacy these days, I thought. I would not be suprised if users didn't choose to sync with a MS account but it's doing it anyway, if that's what MS want.

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  • [–] 48 points 9 months ago (13 children)

    If you sign in with a Microsoft account at all I don't believe there's the capability to opt out.

    I only use local accounts. I have never had a Microsoft account. I never will.

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  • [–] 52 points 9 months ago (12 children)

    You can't do that anymore, at least not with a normal Windows installation. All of the tricks of forcing it offline, clicking cancel 10 times and jumping up and down don't work anymore, they've disabled them all, the only way to install Windows 11 now (using the normal Microsoft installer) is by linking it to a Microsoft account.

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  • [–] 34 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Using Rufus still works. I did it as recently as a couple of days ago.

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  • [–] 26 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Sorry, but the argument above was for a regular user, who doesn't know what Rufus is, who doesn't know the concept of OS, who simply knows thinks the files are saved "on the computer" (while they somehow ended up on OneDrive).

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  • [–] 12 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    This is not true. There are several tools to create a bootable USB that uses a local account.

    They just made it hard for Joe Schmoe to avoid it.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    I download win11 from Microsoft last week and the 1st method in the page worked (ms-cxh localonly)

    https://learn.microsoft.com/sv-se/answers/questions/5581996/windows-11-local-account-on-installation

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago

    I have a windows 11 installation without an account. You got to get an alternative image (I got LTSC).

    I was really hoping there would be a jailbroken version of windows by now, you know a version that doesn’t update and doesn’t have any bloatware.

    I guess it’s just not worth it given how far Linux has advanced.

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  • [+] 16 points 9 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Main issue with Rufus is secure boot unfortunately, otherwise Rufus is easy enough that I gave a couple “click here, then here, then here and here are some screenshots” to a friend they were able to navigate it just fine. At this point I swear Rufus is easier than using the official installer provided Secure Boot is off.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago*

    Images patched by Rufus can definitely pass secureboot, as long the bootloader wasn't touched. Secureboot only checks the signature of the bootloader, not every single file of the operating system, otherwise it will take hours to boot

    Plus Rufus touches some XML read by the installer, doesn't crack the executables

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  • [–] 41 points 9 months ago

    It's a bit harsh and unfair to say "you are dumb enough to allow it". Microsoft makes it damn near impossible to avoid this unless you are extremely particular and savvy about it, and never have an off day where you make a mistake while using your PC.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    But, by default, BitLocker recovery keys are uploaded to Microsoft’s cloud, allowing the tech giant — and by extension law enforcement — to access them and use them to decrypt drives encrypted with BitLocker, as with the case reported by Forbes.

    I mean it's dumb to sync but at same time it's not like MS isn't great at either making it almost impossible to not sync it re-enable syncing for a bit after updates.

    You can constantly tell it not to sync but all it takes is MS saying we want it now and they'll get it

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago*

    Whats dumb is this issue is very easily resolved by encrypting the users security pin or password against the bitlocker keys and then only storing that.

    or better yet have the pin/password an isolated thing from the microsoft system, so when a key gets uploaded, it requests the recovery pin, and if the pin matches it uploads, otherwise it states invalid pin and offers to change it while warning that it will remove existing keys, then optionally next time a system whom contains a drive with an identifier (which wouldn't need to be encrypted only the key) goes online, it can prompt the user "note: due to recovery pin, drive X recovery key needs to be backed up again, would you like to do so?"

    This type of system would make it so the only data MS has stored is the already encrypted recovery key, and as such would mean that the data they gave law enforcement would be worthless.

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  • [–] 5 points 9 months ago

    Are you naive enough to believe the surveillance OS that uploads literally all of your activity along with screenshots of your desktop doesn't automatically upload you keys no matter what little box you tick on the installer?? 😂 there is absolutely not one single 3rd party auditing that they actually follow any of the options at all that they give.

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago (9 children)

    Save a copy of your bitlocker keys to a Veracrypt drive with a password no shorter then 15 mixed characters. Then upload that encrypted container to any free service. They wont be able to open it and now you have a remote backup copy.

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  • [–] 13 points 9 months ago

    I employed the super secure expedient of never exporting my keys. I have no idea what they are, I never did, and I never will.

    There's really no irreplaceable data on my Windows machine. If I have to reformat it some day A) that's no big deal, and B) it's Windows, what else is new.

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  • [–] 9 points 9 months ago (5 children)

    Why not save a step, fuck bitlocker, and use veracrypt to encrypt your drive in the first place?

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  • [–] 7 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Why not save a step and don't install Windows in the first place.

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    If you can have two computers one should always be Linux. But gaming and certain software just does not work on Linux yet sadly. Hoping steam can turn that around.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    Made the switch about a year ago. Every game i wanted to play worked just fine. I suppose it depends on the games you play, but to say it just does not work is plainly just wrong

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  • [–] 0 points 9 months ago

    That is a option but it's performance is bad and you need at least fifteen mix character password every time you boot. If you game you need to use bitlocker sadly or load times dive hard. Having a second drive in full Veracrypt is fine for things like basic documents but not to game on.

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago

    They do have a copy of your Bitlocker key if you are dumb enough to allow it to sync with your Microsoft account, you know, “for convenience.”

    Which I don't believe is the only way it can leak. It's well known Microsoft can access anything and everything on an internet connected Windows PC whether there's a Microsoft account or not. If the nazi's push for the device of someone on a local account only, you know they'll magically find a way.

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  • [–] 44 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    No they do not have copies of every Bitlocker key.

    Bitlocker by default creates a 48-bit recovery code that can be used to unlock an encrypted drive. If you run Windows with a personal Microsoft account it offers to backup that code into your Microsoft account in case your system needs recovered. The FBI submitted a supoena to request the code for a person's encrypted drive. Microsoft provided it, as required by law.

    Bitlocker does not require that key be created, and you don't have to save it to Microsoft's cloud.

    This is just a case of people not knowing how things work and getting surprised when the data they save in someone else's computer is accessed using the legal processes.

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  • [–] 44 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    Except that Microsoft basically puts a gun to every users head to login with a Microsoft account which can/does backup the recovery keys.

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago* (2 children)

    This is why we Jason Bourne style snatch the gun out of their holster before they can draw it and beat them unconcious with it, I mean oobe\bypassnro

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  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    If you sign into a Microsoft account during setup, Microsoft automatically turns on bitlocker and sends the key off to Microsoft for safe keeping. You are right, there are other ways to handle bitlocker, but that's way beyond most people, and I don't think Microsoft even tells you this during setup. It's honestly a lifesaver for when bitlocker breaks(and it does), but it comes at a cost. In the business world, this is seen as a huge benefit, as we aren't trying to protect from the US government, mostly petty theft and maybe some corporate espionage.

    As is often the case, the real solution is Linux, but that, too, is far beyond most people until manufacturers start shipping Linux machines to big box stores and even then they'd probably not enable any encryption.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago

    I question whether we are rapidly approaching the point where Linux is simply easier to use in a safe, secure, and practical way for the average user, because it doesn't try to actively fuck you over like Microsoft does

    It's easier when you don't need to jump through hoops to make a local account. It's easier when you don't need to turn off a dozen settings you might not know about regarding data collection or advertisements. It's easier when you don't have an antagonistic system that treats you like the product, not a user, not pushing you towards confusing things you don't want

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    And people make fun of me for turning off secure boot and tpm. They just cause grief for no benefit.

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    Both are completely unrelated to the discussion. TPM sometimes have issues regarding their security, but you can certainly use Secure Boot with your own signing keys to ensure the kernel you run is one you installed, which improves security. And you can use TPM to either keep your FDE keys, or only part of them combined with a PIN if you don't fully trust them to be secure, so you keep strong encryption but with a bit of convenience.

    Without a (properly configured) Secure Boot startup, anyone could just put a malware between the actual boot and your first kernel. If the first thing that happens when you boot is something asking for a password to be able to decrypt your storage, then an attacker can just put something here, grab your password, and let you proceed while storing in a a place it can be retrieved.

    Is this scenario a concern for most people? That's unlikely. But every computer sold these last five years (at least!) can be setup to reduce this risk, so why not take advantage of it.

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  • [–] 61 points 9 months ago

    Linux. LUKS it yourself or it isn't really encrypted.

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  • [–] 50 points 9 months ago (4 children)
  • [–] 11 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    I've read someone blabbering how BitLocker is better than FDE on Linux or BSDs just recently. I didn't do fact checking, but honestly just uploading keys to MS wasn't something I expected even from them.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    Not even from the company that tried to provide you with windows recall? 🤣

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  • [–] 47 points 9 months ago (7 children)

    What does Microsoft think the fucking point of encryption is? Do they think I am encrypting my data to protect it from my dog?

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  • [–] 6 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    i saw your dog using arch linux

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  • [–] 3 points 9 months ago

    Why do you think the encryption capabilities on your PC are there for your sake? They might have sold them to you on that, but they are really there to protect copyright data because TPM allows encryption/decryption that is completely hidden from the rest of your system. Like an encrypted handshake that then transfers an encrypted key to decrypt the video stream. But it doesn't save the decrypted data, it immediately re-encrypts it using your display's private key (or whatever device is next in the chain, maybe your GPU). They can make it so that the unencrypted stream never touches your RAM or travels on any wire, which means you can't pirate shows as you watch them unless you point a camera at your screen.

    Obviously if they just said that was one of the main points, no one would want it and media companies couldn't benefit from it because they'd have to compromise to sell content.

    The other point was so that they could build a system where they hold the encryption keys and get to choose whose data is actually private. Obviously that's an even harder sell.

    So they did what marketers always do and lied by omission about what it was for and just outright lied if they ever said they'd never give the keys to law enforcement (did they ever even say that?).

    Let go of the idea that someone selling something to you implies any kind of loyalty, especially when either party is a large corporation.

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  • [–] 34 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    People called me paranoid when I said this would happen someday...

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  • [–] 34 points 9 months ago (1 child)

    What a slap to the faces of everyone who had been locked out of their data because they never knew about this crap and thus never saved their keys

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  • [–] 28 points 9 months ago (4 children)

    Daily reminder that verified boot is objectively superior to "secure boot", once again a common Linux W and another example of Google actually promoting some good security practices

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  • [–] -1 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Same thing?

    You can add custom keys to secure boot.

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  • [–] 4 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    That doesn't make it the same thing

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  • [–] 1 point 9 months ago (1 child)

    Both are different names for a process that ensures the boot process is loading the correct non-malicious code.

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  • [–] 2 points 9 months ago

    Secure boot verifies the system is booting correct code, verified boot can ensure total system integrity and can protect against tampering. Furthermore the Linux implementation of secure boot is very often in the least secure method.

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  • [–] 25 points 9 months ago

    Wasn't this by design? Otherwise why keeping the decryption keys on servers located in the united states'?

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  • [–] 23 points 9 months ago

    BitLocker provides for a recovery key. This is to allow someone to regain access to an encrypted device in the event that they lose their PIN, any one of these scenarios happen, OR when suspects do not want to cooperate with LEOs.

    Find your BitLocker recovery key

    If the target device is part of an enterprise and managed with EntraId/Intune this is the option. Escrowed keys.

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  • [–] 17 points 9 months ago (3 children)

    Is anyone shocked by this? With everything that DHS, FBI, ICE, military, elected representatives, etc. are all doing without any concern or care for laws, civil rights, human rights, the Constitution, this should not be a shock to anyone. Corporations are bending over backwards to appease the talking orange and make more money. They do not care as long as profits are up and the shareholders are happy. A companies primary legal responsibility is to the shareholders, not the customers.

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  • [–] 8 points 9 months ago (2 children)

    +100. People forget, or chose not to pay attention to the fact that Google sensor vault data was key evidence in convicting the January 6 insurrectionists (who were exonerated to become ICE). Surveillance capitalism doesn't care which side you are on.

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  • [–] 17 points 9 months ago

    Federal investigators in Guam believed the devices held evidence that would help prove individuals handling the island’s Covid unemployment assistance program were part of a plot to steal funds.

    Damn, they weren't even doing this to go after pedos.

    I'm curious where in the economic ladder this person fell. Rich enough to get a significant amount of money from the system, but still too poor to make the government look the other way.

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