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CATL says next-gen sodium-ion battery supports 500 km range, readies for 2026 mass production (carnewschina.com)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.zip/post/48958993

energy density of 175 Wh/kg

CATL explained that sodium-ion batteries have slightly lower energy density than lithium-ion batteries but provide distinct advantages in low-temperature performance, carbon footprint, and safety.

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[–] 65 points 1 year ago (8 children)

I really hate how all these headlines give battery capacity as a distance, as though that was a meaningful measure or allowed comparing different technologies.

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  • [–] 18 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    But it's all stupid people and marketing people understand more=better cheaper=better. I think it's why ev adoption has been so poor, questions I get asked are what's the range like? Doesn't it take forever to charge? And aren't they really expensive?

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    They do the same thing with grid storage batteries and I hate it. "Our battery lasts 20 hours!" Think it was a better unit like watts per 4 hours but media and marketing mess with it.

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  • [+] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)
    [deleted]
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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    I think the issue in this case is that the range of this specific car and battery doesn’t convey the impact of the battery innovation. If they gave an example of the range with that car and battery size using current battery tech to demonstrate the improvement, I think that would be more helpful.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    It’s a ballpark number. It says to me “competitive with LiIon on capacity though not beating it yet.”

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    It's not though. Range is determined by how much battery is in a car, I could build a car with 500km worth of Ni-MH but it would be mostly battery.

    Does the same car with 500km worth of lithium batteries have more or less trunk space than 500km of these batteries? I have no idea. I do know the sodium batteries will weigh a bit more, because the article actually gives Wh/kg - and that makes sense since sodium the metal is denser than lithium, but the headline is meaningless.

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    • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    They are cheaper and the low temperature performance is better than LFP, but the round trip efficiency is less than LFP.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Question is.... How much cheaper...

    LFP is almost at the price point we could all have a freezer sized battery pack in our house, drastically changing the grid, and allowing a place for all that wind/solar to store energy.

    If Sodium is a fair chunk cheaper, then it will totally be worth buying a house battery pack. Buying energy on the cheap at certain times of day, and using the battery when energy prices are high.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Potentially 1/10th the price according to this video I stumbled on about it a couple of days ago!

    https://youtu.be/Wf84NJSiAeU

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    They also have better thermal stability, so less risk of uncontrolled fires.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    AFAIK, LFP thermal runaway can't start fires. NMC or other lithium chemistries can and they scare me, but LFPs are pretty damn safe. That being said, I'm still stoked for sodium chemistries to be developed. If the round trip efficiency issues can be solved, then I think it'll be a great solution for residential power storage.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    What does round trip efficiency mean here?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    How much energy you get out of a full charge, divided by how much energy you need to fully charge it. It’s around the 90% mark for lithium based tech, no idea what it is for these sodium ones

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    The numbers I've seen: LFP: mid 90s Sodium: low to mid 80s

    LFP seems better for cars unless you live in an area that deals with extreme cold. Sodium is better (cheaper) for fixed, large quantity storage where energy density is not as critical and lower efficiency is an acceptable trade off for lower price.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    As long as the efficiency is outweighed by price, it could move us in the right direction. Hopefully we can pick up the efficiency in time. These would also be good for my future load-shifting (charge during off peak, low carbon electricity) and maybe solar system at home.

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    • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    "slightly lower" == 2/3rds, apparently. the model 3's pack is 250Wh/kg. also, 500km range in what? the only way you could fit an equal-range battery in a contemporary compact vehicle like the model 3 would be if it had almost double the density of Li-ion.

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