To see it in action:

Crust.piefed.social (the Piefed development instance)

Not all instances implement it yet, I guess it depends how often they pull from the dev branch

Example of search for 'movies'

all 25 comments

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[–] 18 points 1 year ago (17 children)

What we really need is a revival of the functionality of the bot at !trendingcommunities@feddit.nl that died. I still miss it so much :(

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  • [–] [S] 15 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    There was a revival attempt at !trendingcommunities@lemmy.cafe , but it was short lived.

    That probably shows a trend: those type of tools need to be built-in into the software, relying on Raspberry Pies, scripts and external tools to provide such features will likely lead to them being abandoned

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    Is there a Python wrapper for writing PieFed bots? Or does Pythörhead work of-the-box for PieFed?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    I don't think piefed has the same API has lemmy, so no. It's been something I wanted to onboard (the piefed API) ,but I haven't fouind the time.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    I do see there is code to throw an error when it detects an instance is not Lemmy, so it definitely doesn't work out-of-the-box. But the APIs for each are supposedly similar to each other, so it fortunately should not take any major rewrite to support both in the same wrapper.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (8 children)

    Do you have a link to the API doc? Nevemind, found it: https://freamon.github.io/piefed-api/

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Like Blaze mentioned, the api is a bit of a work in progress and we are revamping the swagger. The version of the api spec you have there (freamon's) is manually created and can have some inaccuracies because of that. We are in the process of making the piefed api self-documenting so that inputs/outputs are validated against the schema, but there are a lot of endpoints still to go in that effort.

    Some of those revamped endpoints are going to be coming in the 1.2 release. For the self-documented endpoints that have been done so far, you can check the swagger on crust (the dev instance running right off the main branch).

    To keep up with this effort as I am working through it, I have been making posts to !piefed_api@piefed.social.


    On a personal note, I would kill for a pythorhead-but-for-piefed to exist. I pretty extensively use pythorhead in my lemmy communities now, so I am hopeful that we can get the api in a stable enough state to enable tools like this to exist in the near future.

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  • [–] [S] 1 point 1 year ago* (3 children)
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I'll just remove the 'freamon' one when the auto-generated one is up to date.

    The manually-generated one had 5 missing routes, which I've since added.

    The auto-generated one at crust has about 48 missing routes. It's the right approach, and I'll help out with it when I can, but - for now at least - it makes no sense to redirect people to it (either automatically or via a comment).


    Some thoughts for @wjs018@piefed.social

    /site/instance_chooser probably doesn't need to be a route. It's just the data format returned by /site/instance_chooser_search. As a route, it's returning the instance info for the site you're querying, so if you want to keep it as a route, it should probably be called /site/instance_info or something.

    In the query for /site/instance_chooser_search, nsfw and newbie are both booleans. With the rest of the API, these are sent as 'true' or 'false', but they are 'yes' and 'no' for this route. The newbie query should probably be newbie_friendly In the response, monthsmonitored should probably be months_monitored

    There's no way to exclude communities for the response to /topic/list and /feed/list: If you don't put 'include_communities' in the query, it's defaults to True, but if you put 'include_communities=false' in the query it ends up being True also (because the word 'include_communities' is in the data).

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    TIL that rimu added instance chooser endpoints. I'll take a look at those before 1.2 gets shipped. Same with the topic and feed endpoints. The easiest time to make changes to them is now before they get more widely used.

    I have about 10 more endpoints (working through /user right now) I have finished transitioning in a dev branch right now, so we are making progress.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    One important thing about Lemmyverse is that you can search for communities your instance isn't "aware of" yet. Seeing the "Add remote community" button, I guess this is something that's not possible with Piefed's community search?

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago*

    The other day I made a feature which automatically adds every community posted to newcommunities@lemmy.world. And another feature that automatically posts to that comm whenever a local community is created.

    That's works on a ongoing basis. There are other features for bulk-adding communities as a one off job.

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  • [–] [S] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    This post only says that the Lemmyverse data "is used to suggest search results to people when adding a remote community." Is this data also included in the communities page?

    Another thought about the linked post: Removing inactive communities from the Lemmyverse data is certainly a good thing for stuff like "technology", "memes", "news" etc., but if you're looking for a community about a very niche topic you might even be interested in an inactive community without active alternatives to perhaps "revive" it with your posts.

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  • [+] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)
  • 61 comments in c/fediverse@lemmy.world view that post
    [–] 11 points 1 year ago (22 children)

    Out of interest, what is search like on Piefed? Lemmy’s is all but useless. Even filtering by "last week" will show me two year-old posts and comments, regularly that don’t actually include the word I’m looking for.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    Lemmy's search is a lot better if you don't use the 'All' type, like just search comments and posts. With 'All', it is basically useless. Like sorting by controversial on a user's profile.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    Here's a search I did just now. Despite trying to restrict it to the last month ("Top Month"), none of the results on the first page are within the last month.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Ah, right comments don't actually top with time ranges in 0.19: https://join-lemmy.org/docs/users/03-votes-and-ranking.html#sorting-comments, my bad. The fact lemmy-ui still shows all of them is very confusing, I'll admit.

    This is different in 1.0, the logic was changed for both posts and comments so these will work in future.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (6 children)

    https://join-lemmy.org/docs/users/03-votes-and-ranking.html#sorting-comments

    That's a page that really shouldn't be relevant, and it concerns me if it is, because the search page should not be working on the same ordering logic that comment pages or the front page use.

    Anyway, I mainly only use the "top month" option as a proxy for what I really want, which is "filter by posts/comments in the last month", usually because I'm searching for something I saw recently, and I have a rough idea of when it was posted.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Eh, I don't think it's that surprising. Getting a list of comments on a post vs getting them from a search term are very similar operations, so it doesn't make too much sense for these to have different queries in the backend. One thing you could do, but no client to my knowledge does, is add a search bar to a post that searches through the comments only within that thread.

    Everything in the backend uses the same sorting as the posts do on that page except comments, which is frustrating. Comments do need a different sort enum as there are some options that don't apply to comments (scaled, new comments, etc.), but yeah the fact the top options don't work for comment search when they should is opaque and not user friendly.

    I can't wait for 1.0 to actually come out because I feel like a broken record, but this is fixed there.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    Eh, I don’t think it’s that surprising. Getting a list of comments on a post vs getting them from a search term are very similar operations, so it doesn’t make too much sense for these to have different queries in the backend

    Sure, but one would have thought that the ordering in a search is fundamentally different from the ordering in other places. Because you want something that contains the words you've searched for near each other to appear ahead of a post that has those words scattered at random because it's a 500 word essay. You want exact word matches prioritised ahead of entirely unrelated words that include the same characters. Like "enum" should turn up your comment, but rank a comment that contains the text "renumbers" much more lowly. A particularly smart search page might keep "enumerate" high while rejecting "renumbers", though.

    Of course, it's true that at least in the current latest release, Lemmy fails at all of this. I hope 1.0 is at least fixing some of it?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

    This doesn't have anything to do with sort ordering though, which is based on time and votes. Text search is just a filter on top of sorting.

    You want exact word matches prioritised ahead of entirely unrelated words that include the same characters. Like “enum” should turn up your comment, but rank a comment that contains the text “renumbers” much more lowly. A particularly smart search page might keep “enumerate” high while rejecting “renumbers”, though.

    Of course, it’s true that at least in the current latest release, Lemmy fails at all of this. I hope 1.0 is at least fixing some of it?

    How Lemmy does text search is via pg_trgm which works by breaking down both the content text and search text into trigram* and if the content contains enough of the search trigrams, it's considered to match the search term.

    * A trigram is just a 3 character 'words', for example the trigram of 'enum' is {" e"," en",enu,num,"um "}.

    What you're describing is closer to a tsvector, so you could open up an issues on Lemmy's GitHub to move from trigram to tsvector. One advantage trigrams have though is that they're language agnostic while tsvectoss need both a dictionary and to know the language (thankfully, Lemmy already has this info via the language setting, though the way it's stored will need to be changed to accommodate this). But tsvectors does provide much more intuitive language matching, like what you outlined.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    This doesn’t have anything to do with sort ordering though, which is based on time and votes. Text search is just a filter on top of sorting.

    That doesn't feel like how search should work. It should be ranking results that fit the search query better higher than ones that fit it less. Regardless of how the search is done, that should remain true. So if you're using trigram matching, instead of a binary "does the comment contain 80% of the trigrams in the search query", it should be "if it contains 100% of the trigrams from the search query, rank it higher than something with 90% match, which is higher than 80%." Or maybe not that precisely, but something so that more relevant results appear above less relevant ones.

    Without doing something like that, it's just...not very useful. Which is the observed behaviour of search on Lemmy right now which started this whole conversation.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    That doesn’t feel like how search should work. It should be ranking results that fit the search query better higher than ones that fit it less.

    But the existing filters already prescribe an order outside of how closely the search term matches, you brought up top month and I don't see how you'd want that to work other than a binary filter sorted by votes.

    What you're describing would be a new sort order, analogous to Reddit's 'Relevance' sort. It's certainly doable with postgres' builtin distancing operators, though it be slower.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    you brought up top month and I don’t see how you’d want that to work

    The truth is I don't want "top month". What I really want is "best result, filtered by this month". But unfortunately that doesn't exist, and in the absence of that, I use "top month".

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  • [–] [S] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Curious, I've found Lemmy search to be okay. I don't search a lot on Piefed, so I can't compare.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    Searching by "posts" on Lemmy is actually superior to searching on PieFed, though searching by "all" or "comments" on Lemmy is absolutely borken (haha misspelled unintentionally but Imma just leave it there as it fits so well!?:-P). Reputedly Lemmy's search is about to add the ability to filter on post "titles" separately from the rest of the text, which sounds very nice.

    So it's hit or miss what works or not on Lemmy. PieFed's search is the singular feature that is currently very behind compared to Lemmy, but like everything else I expect PieFed to rapidly overtake Lemmy one day soon-ish. Therefore I use a PieFed account as my daily main, but when I want to search for something I still switch back to Lemmy (you don't even need an account for that though).

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I figured that you would be! :-)

    Although to be clear, searching for content is not something that I do daily or even weekly, so personally I consider it much lower in prioritization than other feature requests, e.g. a comment reply has a Preview option but a top-level comment to a post does not (that button does not appear), notifications is still a bit wonky, particularly not interacting well with the newer feature that loads comments (when there is a larger number of them?) only after loading the post, and then by doing so fails to traverse to where the notification link was aiming to take me to, etc.

    Though I suppose others may consider it higher priority, especially newer people evaluating PieFed, and probably working on the search back-end may be a lot more fun!? :-P

    It is always nice to see new things coming to PieFed. This is the only software giving me any hope for social media right now:-).

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Searching by “posts” on Lemmy is actually superior to searching on PieFed, though searching by “all” or “comments” on Lemmy is absolutely borken

    Ah, that makes sense. I'll try to pay attention to which I'm doing, because my most recent search used only comments, but was absolutely useless.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Yeah anything that involves comments doesn't work so well - either them specifically or the combination of them and posts. And tbf it does retrieve the results of the query, it is only the sort options that fail miserably.

    I've used Lemmy now for >2 years and the excuse that "it's still in development" has very much worn thin when no changes at all have been made to this or so many other issues with it.

    At least the search function is still better than Reddit's! (Obligatory and reflexive fuck spex:-P)

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    At least the search function is still better than Reddit’s

    I actually don't agree. This is one area where Reddit's centralised nature is a benefit, because it makes it super easy for Google to index and return results. On-site search isn't great on Reddit, but at least Googling for stuff from Reddit works really well.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    Yes I meant the on-site one developed by Reddit, but agreed that the centralized nature lends itself towards searching by Google.

    Although the other way opens up a huge can of worms since every large, general-purpose instance will - due to the nature of how the ActivityPub protocol works - have basically all of the content of the entire Threadiverse. Or as near to that as it works for a first approximation anyway, e.g. someone deciding to index all content appearing on "Lemmy.World" would get all the memes, movie discussions, etc., missing chiefly things like piracy and anarchy and other things that LW has decided to ban. It won't be "correct" in the sense of attribution to the OP, but once someone found their way to the content housed on LW they are but a click away from getting to its original source anyway. So from that standpoint, Google indexing I would naively have thought would not be all that difficult? Except for the increasingly niche content that isn't federated with the largest instances, which is perhaps desirable anyway to not expose mainstream normies to content calling for e.g. actual murder in response to world events (such as occurs routinely on e.g. Hexbear).

    A safer, sanitized version of the Threadiverse that is searchable by anyone works to all of our advantage, I would believe?

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    It's now live on https://quokk.au as well!

    This is a great feature to have, as I was reliant on newcommunities and communitypromo to find new comms.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    Is this different to Lemmy's communities tab sorted by 'Top Week', which sorts by weekly active users?

    IMO, the main advantage of Lemmyverse is the better text search and presentation.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    No it's not. It's just a way to sort by active weekly users, but you can mix and match by filtering with feeds which you can't do on Lemmy.

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  • [–] [S] 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Lemmy's view does not allow to search and keep the data about active users, you immediately get into this view that doesn't show active users

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Indeed. You can also search a term and then sort by active users, or filter it by a feed. But I think there needs to be some UI cleanup on the feed drop down box as that is going to be really, really long as people on different instances make new feeds

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    What would a Feed/multicomms' actively weekly users even be? An aggregate of all the comms weekly users, or just the highest one? Or does Piefed go through all the comms and collect the unique actors (God, that would be an expensive operation)?

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  • [–] [S] 6 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    The text search on Piefed is similar to Lemmyverse. Example for 'movies'

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] [S] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    You still don't see the number of weekly active users.

    On Piefed, it's the 'Active people' column, where you can see the numbers without having to go to each community. Lemmy (and Photon in this case) only show subscribers, which isn't an accurate metric as most of them are ghost accounts.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    The active user counts are returned, suppose we just need a client that actually displays it.

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  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago

    That could indeed be the case, but that's probably a low priority item for most of the client devs.

    I had been asking Rimu to add this feature for a while as Lemmyverse doesn't show Piefed communities on the community search, and as a lot of people use Lemmyverse to search for communities, Piefed communities are basically invisible.

    This solves it, if other clients want to implement it too, that would be nice of course

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  • dean winchesters favourite fediverse software

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    It's crazy how fast development moves when you don't spend all day celebrating censoring your instance.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (13 children)

    Is there a theme or css for piefed that makes it look more like old reddit? I love the old reddit frontend for lemmy but sadly it seems to abandoned.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (7 children)

    Not that I know of, and while I hate to shill for Lemmy rather than PieFed, there is just such an interface on the instance you are already on: https://old.lemmy.zip/ . That does sound like a great idea for someone to make though...

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (6 children)

    Yes I am aware, that's what I am using right now. But that'S lemmy and I was wondering if I can "transform" piefed in a way that comes closer to that.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (5 children)

    I don't think so, here is the list of them (accessible for someone without a PieFed account, although for someone with an account it is under Settings -> Theme, change the dropdown then click Save settings, currently no way that I know of to test one out before saving): https://codeberg.org/rimu/pyfedi/src/branch/main/app/templates/themes

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Cheers, yes I already tried all the themes they mostly change the colors and fonts tho. A little padding at best. Maybe someone created a custom CSS for it, which you can apply right under the themes section. But I haven't found anything yet.

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago*

    If it works for users, too, I'm sure to always be in at least the top 10 if not number 1.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Oh great, now I can check if my Taylor Swifties Markov Chains are more popular in Meta’s piefeed instance over Microsoft’s 🙄 /s

    Folks, please don't not fall for Popularity Biases. Just because one instance has more robots talking to each other, doesn't mean you should join the community.

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  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    In the case of 'movies' used in the OP at the end, Piefed.social has much less users than Lemmy.world, so that does not really fit what you are saying.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] [S] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    !movies@lemmy.world is almost only composed of a single poster sharing articles from the Guardian.

    !movies@piefed.social has a diverse mod team, with dedicated threads for movies, weekly discussion threads, and people sharing their own reviews.

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  • 9 comments in c/fedigrow@lemmy.zip view that post
    [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Piefed now has a built-in alternative to Lemmyverse

    One of the main advantages of Lemmyverse is its accumulated knowledge of communities on remote instances which are not yet federated with one's own instance. Does the Piefed version offer this, and if so, how?

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Does active people equal to MAUs? Or does it use quarterly active users?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago*

    Kbin used to try to do this. Not so sure about Mbin, maybe it does. Glad to see a Fediverse option trying to implement something other ones implemented.

    Although I am curious how many people take the approach of clicking a random active user online—I know I come to these thread-based forums to discuss common interests, and would never use the feature myself because 1) no guarantee the active user has common interests 2) I would feel like a weird stalker. Curious about the mindset of those who do—and not trying to accuse them of being stalkers just because I personally would feel like one taking that approach.

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