We love to praise linux constantly and tell everyone to change to it (they should) but what are your biggest annoyances ?

Mine would be, installing software (made even more complex by flatpaks being added, among the 5 other ways there already were to install software) and probably wifi power management issues.

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[–] 79 points 1 year ago (12 children)
  • audio - Most of the time it works, but there have been plenty of times that after an install, I have to go in and make a handfull of changes to get it working.

  • "you are using it wrong" developers - Lookin at you, Gnome, Mozilla and Pottering. Yes, you are donating your time, and I appreciate that, but don't be dismissive of people if they bring up valid issues. If you just don't want to fix problems, that's fine, but just be honest about that, instead of blaming the user.

  • sleep/hibernate - I've never depended on sleep or hibernate to work properly. I gave up on that years ago, and whenever I come back and try it again, I remember why I gave it up.

  • documentation - As a seasoned linux person, I love man-pages, but they are soooooo obtuse and hard to parse for newbies. I also hate it when the website has mountains of documentation, but they couldn't be bothered to put that into the man-pages.

  • video/wifi drivers - Yes, I know that this is mostly a problem because of the manufacturers. That doesn't mean it isn't a problem.

  • unsympathetic users - Just because it works for you, doesn't mean it works for other people. I can't wait for year-of-the-linux-desktop, but it just isn't there yet. As soon as you have to tell a non-tech to open a terminal, the vast majority of them are out. You and I know that 'editing /etc/somedir/somefile and running /usr/sbin/somecommand' is easy, but sooooo many of them don't know what that means, nor will they care. I hear that windows is pretty bad nowadays, but people will often stick with the devil they know.

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  • [–] 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Last point is the most important in my opinion

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    So much this!

    Please, if I don't know how to build this from source, please tell me what I need to do.

    Please say "open a terminal and type git clone [URL]" instead of "clone the repo." Anything to be more verbose. This might be my first time.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Great summary, too many Linux elitists like to claim Linux to be without flaws and every other OS to be the devil.

    I'd love for Linux to become more mainstream. But as long as those elitist are pulling the strings, it will never become user friendly enough for a regular user.

    "But I moved my granny to Linux and she can use it" is their argument. When in reality every time this granny had an issue, the Linux user came around to fix it. The majority of people do not have a tech savvy user in their direct circle capable of fixing Linux. So the only option they have is to bring it back to the store they bought it from.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    The audio stack is just just a nightmare, it's not even funny. Sometimes, at random, when my PC boots, it will output white noise at full volume through my headphones. The is fine if I turned it on and went to get something, make a coffee, whatever. I can still hear it in the other room though. If I'm sitting at my PC and I was just rebooting, wearing the headphones: that isn't ok. It damn near blows my eardrums out when it happens.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    Sleep and Audio are definitely my most annoying, and prominent, issues that I run into. Devices like USB audio interfaces I find tone temperamental. Oftentimes they will not be recognised on startup and I have to unplug them and replug them back in. I also gave up on hibernate, my PCs are now either on or off...

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    The unsympathetic/pedantic users and obtuse man pages are why I've abandoned Linux attempts in the past. The reason I am trying to move to Linux now, isn't because those were fixed. It's because windows is becoming the more annoying option. I've prevented my computer from updating win 10 until I can leave the platform. But I'm not looking forward to dealing with Linux frustrations. Especially the fucking users. I hate asking Linux people for help. 95% chance I just get a pedantic dickwad.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    I think things are getting better. I'm not going to lie and tell you that it's no longer a problem, but I think you can do a lot more with a little patience. I know there's a lot of different implementations, so you might need to experiment as well. Good luck!

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  • [–] 54 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    The community's general overestimation of the average person's tech capabilities.

    Not necessarily fair to pin this on Linux per se, but there's hardware that doesn't work well or at all still and alternative solutions still aren't there. So this would be mostly on companies making software for Windows but not for Linux, but it's still part of the Linux experience that I do not enjoy.

    I have to troubleshoot things on Linux more than I did on Windows.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I disagree honestly

    I think the biggest strength of Linux is that it gives people power over their own computing. That has and probably will be its best selling point.

    I personally wish that there was something Linux based and Foss that is closer to Chrome OS/Android. I want to have a desktop experience that is hassle free and dead simple. Dahlia OS was promising for a while but it has now seemingly been abandoned.

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  • [–] 21 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    I don't like LibreOffice as the only open source Office software that seems to compete with Microsoft. It feels bloated and outdated and for years and years I have display problems with it. The community answers to problems are often written by arrogant pricks.

    However, at the pace Microsoft Office is deteriorating with all that copilot crap LibreOffice begins to look better every day. They don't even have to do anything for it.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Have you tried Proton? It works like a charm for videogames.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I was able to get Office working without issue through Proton, but I couldn't get my reference manager to work with Office within Proton. Ultimately I ended up acquiescing to LibreOffice, and I've ended up liking it more than the bloated monstrosity that is M$ Office in the latest iterations.

    I've also found SoftMaker Office to be great (faster than OnlyOffice and even better docx compatibility) but it doesn't respect Linux's cursor blinkrate when you build from source (it's supposed to respect the default, per the devs), and instead uses a really fast rate. I'm weird, but that issue is damning for me, and idk how/where to fix it. So, I stick with LibreOffice.

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  • [–] 19 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Suspend/sleep. I bought a specific laptop so it works, but these manufacturers need to let our developers know what the fuck is going on in the hardware

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    The sleep/hibernate is specifically designed to work only with windows, especially on modern hardware. It's a known problem and it's not easy to reliably get around it.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    That stuff doesn't even work right on Windows anymore.

    It's kind of sad, 10-15 years ago I'd say everyone (both Linux and Windows) more or less had the whole sleep/hibernate thing figured out. But it's all gone to shit in the past few years.

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  • [–] 36 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    Terrible documentation that is written assuming far too much prior knowledge.

    I'm pretty technologically literate but just don't have a lot of experience with Linux, in the last year of trying properly to switch over the most frustrating part is trying to fix problems or follow peoples "guides" to various things. There is plenty of information out there for sure but when I have to keep looking up a string of things to try and get to my desired end result then the original documentation I'm trying to follow is not adequate.

    I can only imagine what it might be like for users who are less inclined to learn about this stuff and just want to use it / solve a problem.

    I think that a lot can be said for well written documentation that describes necessary processes to get a desired result in a way that everyone can follow regardless of their prior experience or knowledge.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    When I first got into tech, one of the first things I noticed was how deep the knowledge base was, layers upon layers of knowledge dependencies, and how poorly tech people explained things.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    I remember learning about how to write clear, easy to follow manuals in IT classes when I was 13 in the late 90s. What ever happened to that skill, did it die along with physical manuals?

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago

    I think just the phrase "IT classes when I was 13" is enough to convey just how far outside the norm your experience was.

    I have a CS degree from a top-10 university, and they taught me approximately fuck-all about writing good documentation. There was only one course on technical writing, and I don't remember it being very rigorous or difficult.

    If anything, what few writing requirements we had in the rest of the curriculum were typically more similar to academic research papers than user manuals.

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  • [–] 17 points 1 year ago

    Snap. The very existence of it.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago (8 children)

    The fact that there is NO agreed single package standard across distros.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    This has its pros. If all agree to use, say, deb, then some of the users will complain, "I downloaded package XYZ from Arch and it doesn't work on Fedora!"

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    No, not really true, IMO.

    If all distros come together and agree on a single package format (e.g. deb), then if arch makes a package available in .deb, it can be downloaded and installed on Ubuntu or Fedora, as it becomes an universal package format like flatpak.

    Currently we have to compile the source code in such situations.

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    If flatpak is universal doesn't it solve the issue ? Is it the sandboxing people dont like?

    My system is a mix of .Deb, manual compiled, and flatpaks. As im sure many are. Im not an organized person.

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    Flatpaks apps & their runtimes is taking 20 gb, was 80 gb before I realize it and start cleaning up. That's annoying. But I also like Flatpak. I may just prioritize DNF first (I'm on Fedora) to minimize Flatpak bloats.

    60 gb is very significant for me being in 256 gb ssd.

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  • [+] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (3 children)

    What do you install for that much space to be taken up??

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    carelessly lots of stuff. kde & gnome developmnt runtimes. nvidia driver duplicates. Firefox, Librewolf & Ungoogled Chrome. full latex packages. Ardour and various syntesizer.

    I eventually cleaned up most packages out of Flatpak to DNF, especially the one that require big runtime and gtk/qt apps or does't need sandboxing. I may also avoid electron apps since they also tend to be big lol.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Do flatpak remove --unused, it will clear up unused dependencies.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    It never work. I've always done flatpak remove --unused every once in a while. At one time I checked my root filesystem using gnome's disk analyzer to see what takes the most space, that is when I found out /var/lib/flatpak/repo/ ate 80 gb of my disk.

    As per several suggestion from github issues & forums, I did sudo flatpak repair and finally it did clean them up down to around 40-50. Several months later I kind of gone mad and delete everything in the repo directory. I noticed my apps still works. Until few days later when I wanted to update, Flatpak complained and redownload most of the deleted stuff 🤣

    But after redownloading, it only took around 20 gb now, and after that Flatpak also pinned every package lmao so I have to unpin unimportant stuff any case they can be deleted using flatpak remove --unused

    and I seem to be not the only one, like this person has their Flatpak directories almost 100 gb https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=435450

    I realize I may also just remove all latex stuff, I was only using it to graduate. I'd just typst now for smaller things.

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    [–] 12 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    Sleep seems to work nine times out of ten.
    In that 1 time it hangs when resuming, so the computer is on but in a zombie state where it doesn't do anything (won't even power on USB devices).
    Maybe my motherboard just sucks tho.

    Also someone pretty please with a cherry on top make a VNC or RDP server that works on Plasma Wayland, I'm so sick of using Sunshine+Moonlight, it just isn't built for non-gaming usecases at all

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago

    Same problem here but it hangs when entering sleep! There were other people with this issue and apparently the manufacturer released a firmware update that might fix it... in the form of an exe file

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago

    You want to do some cool thing and you find instructions online.

    But that shit only works when t every single aspect of the s is the exact same version.

    Which will never be the case, so now you’re at co desperately trying to improvise the steps that, if you inherently knew how to do, you wouldn’t have needed instructions for in the first place.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Not a Linux thing directly but something that bothers me a lot: The complete lack of support from professional applications.
    Wanna use this tool that cost hundreds of bucks on Linux? Lmao fuck you.
    You’d think companies that actually make money could afford to support Linux and hobbyists doing FOSS stuff for funsies can only focus on the OS they use themselves but somehow we live in a world where the opposite is true.

    This is what makes switching to Linux for me personally and probably a lot of other people completely unviable because it means having to give up on thousands of dollars of stuff for “freedom”.

    And the onus is 100% on the companies developing software. They have to offer Linux versions first, so people can switch to Linux, giving them more Linux users. Doesn’t work the other way around.

    Oh also psst don’t ever mention spending money on proprietary software around Linux people, they will have a heart attack.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago*

    This is the most important issue facing Linux adoption by far. I wish Valve or someone would step in and start improving Wine/Proton's general application support. A couple years ago someone made a fork of Wine that got Affinity running, but those improvements never made it back into the upstream project. Productivity software not being given serious consideration is a common problem with Wine/Proton as projects.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago* (4 children)

    It is not Linux itself but:

    • I dislike when something goes wrong with a program and the documentation is not clear on how to fix it. But I do not complain because it is understandable when developers write documentation they have to choose who's hand to hold, if they choose to help everyone then the documentation can get long and perhaps redundant.

    • When one is a beginner and installs a distribution for the first time one can get scared by the splash screen showing errors which are 99% of the time safe to ignore (e.g showing that a device was not found). I know its important for developers and advanced users to know all this info but it can make beginners feel so damn scared (like me).

    • Naming, like in the general sense, it seems like many software have some ridiculous names (dolphin, ncmpcpp, gimp, foot, gnome). Very subjective, I know, but in the end I love and hate these names.

    • Bluetooth... yeah.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Naming, like in the general sense, it seems like many software have some ridiculous names (dolphin, ncmpcpp, gimp, foot, gnome)

    For dolphin, if your talking about the emulator it is avalible for windows too and its called that since thats what the gamecube was called internally.

    For gimp, yeah i hate the name too, its the "gnu imange manipulation program" and is also avalible for windows.

    Those programs that look like random assortments of characters are generally libraries that other programs use to standarize functionality across programs. Don't want there to be 15 different ways for your computer to understand "write this file to this location" for example. You'll generally never need to know what they are or what they do.

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  • [+] 11 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago

    I love gaming on my Linux machine, and for the most part it is a pleasant experience. By far the worst outcome is when an update breaks a game that was working perfectly fine. This seems to happen regularly, especially with online games.

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  • I'm curious what games you're playing. Back when I started using linux regularly (~2017) this was absolutely the case, and even for a few years after proton first released it still was. But my experience now is games fall on either two extremes of working out of the box or being completly unplayable.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Having to install apps manually and figure out dependencies myself because a popular piece of software only officially supports Ubuntu and Debian. No normal human would ever do this. They would go back to Windows. Hell, I still haven't even gotten one piece of software to work on my new OpenSUSE system yet: Beyond Compare 4. [UPDATE: I got it from work. Either I was blind or they just added OpenSUSE instructions. ]

    Why are there so many package managers with such different syntaxes? And why does one repo maintainer decide to call a package "package" and another calls it "package4"? Or some entirely different name! It's maddening. I've had to create empty proxy packages that translate package names just to install some RPM file. Again, the average person is not going to do this.

    In KDE plasma, the first thing most people do is set up Wi-Fi on their computer, but you need to set up KWallet first or else the password gets stored in some other dimension. I accidentally typed my Wi-Fi password wrong, and I couldn't for the life of me figure out how to clear it out and make it ask me for the proper password when I try to connect. I even went into network manager and switched the network to say, "ask me every time". It wouldn't! It would just sit there and hang on "authenticating". I never did figure it out. I ended up forgetting to encrypt my system partition, so I simply reinstalled the OS.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    And it's not only obscure software on obscure distros.

    The Arduino IDE doesn't run on Fedora 42. It just doesn't work.

    I personally don't need it, I use ESP-IDF on Platformio, but Arduino is an incredibly common piece of software and one I would have expected to work flawlessly on Linux.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    All the different window top bars/UI elements not lining up.. especially for stuff that has nothing up there.. extra annoying when disabling window decorations don't disable them

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (4 children)

    That sounds like a KDE thing, specifically. This is pretty much not an issue in Gnome unless you're running something with X11 compatibility.

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    That kind of comment is what annoys me most about Linux. You explain your problem and then smart_linux_guru_89 gives you a lecture about how the kernel module of KDE desktop library layer is using an instance of the filesystem version in vim-enabled interface and you should edit the famously-known /etc/rcmpfs.conf file before recompiling with the correct flatpack in rust binary stack. And then they get mad wen you tell them you don't understand and they end up saying you should StIcK To wiNdOw$ if YoU dOn'T kNoW hOW tO UsE a COmpUTeR.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago

    I actually used GNOME for most of my linux time lol :3.. now im kinda jumping around between TWMs until COSMIC, I only tried KDE in VMs and it was very much not for me (and tbf I only like GNOME with a ton of extensions too)

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Total lack of stability, not in "crashing programs" but in the entire idea of "throw it all out and start over" that seems to 100% infest every single Linux developer every few years.

    Not to mention the total loss of every single bit of UNIX philosophy over the years.

    "Everything's a file." ? Not according to Linux, not any more.

    All the various *ctls necessary to run and inspect your system have completely gotten out of control.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Totally agree. For some reason we have an aversion to learning from those that came before us. We have to learn the hard way and keep reinventing the wheel, often in worse ways. This post made me laugh because it is so accurate: https://feddit.online/post/929088

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I first started with Linux in 1994, with Slackware.

    However, I've preferred FreeBSD for years, now. The only reason I use linux at all is Steam. There's been work getting it working in FreeBSD, but not enough, and it basically only works on machines with an Nvidia GPU. And I've also been Team Red for literally decades.

    Ah well.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Oh man, I loved the simplicity of FreeBSD. I was actually running it for a bit on my homelab. It was so nice and straightforward, wich suuuuuuch good documentation.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    vendor support

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    The elitism

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  • [–] 23 points 1 year ago (13 children)

    When I was running a Linux distro regularly (1995-2015), audio output would break every couple of upgrades.

    It was frustrating, because I was pretty happy with the rest of the OS.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Ironically, it's only gotten better since 2015ish. For the most part I've used pulseaudio like most others, but I've also used jackd when I need to do audio stuff. After pipewire became usable it's more or less flawless for me.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Audio output doesn't "break," but it's easy for it to get redirected to the wrong device (e.g. by plugging something in, like headphones or an HDMI monitor, and the system trying to be "helpful" by automatically reconfiguring). With so many layers (OSS, ALSA, PulseAudio, JACK, PipeWire) it's hard to figure out how to fix it.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    After switching my gaming PC from Win 11 to Linux Mint earlier this year, audio is the only thing I consistently have issues with. I have the PC connected to my living room TV via HDMI via an Onkyo AVR. I have pipewire installed (correctly, I think).

    Whenever audio starts, there's a couple second delay before I can hear it. Haven't been able to solve that so I just live with it.

    The more annoying thing is after an update earlier this week, the audio output is now defaulting to "Dummy Output" instead of HDMI. I have to manually switch it via pipewire. It randomly switches back and I haven't figured it out either.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    Whenever audio starts, there’s a couple second delay before I can hear it. Haven’t been able to solve that so I just live with it.

    That can be because of a power saving feature - basically PulseAudio puts your sound card to sleep when nothing is playing, and then there's a bit of lag before it wakes up. In my case it was really annoying because I use the optical output, so when PulseAudio put the sound card to sleep, my receiver would also go to sleep after a bit, and resulted in quite a bit of a delay when it was time to get it come back up.

    This fixed it for me (see part 4.8): https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/PulseAudio/Troubleshooting

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I tried this and it worked for about a day haha.

    I've gone through a couple pulseaudio configuration tutorials, but nothing is working consistently. Seems to work fine after initial reboot, but almost every time after waking from sleep I have to reconfigure the audio outputs. I swear this all worked fine until I updated something last week.

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  • [–] [S] 4 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I've amazingly not had a single audio problem, and i mess with inputs and outputs on the front and back panel often, as well as use usb audio devices. Mint and pulseaudio

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  • This does need some attention from the Pipewire profiles perspective. It's mostly a hardware combo thing though. Even if you're using an audio code that has kernel support, the speaker configuration from manufacturers changes CONSTANTLY, really causing problems. They need to break this out into its audio profile IMO.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 year ago

    I hope image-based distro can solve this issue. In general I feel a lot of these breakages are caused by repeatedly migrating configuration files, yet fresh install usually fixes these issues.

    I think one of the advantage of image based distros is that they are much more principled in migrating config files.

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