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[+] 136 points 4 months ago (13 children)
  • [–] 16 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    But pay property taxes (and sometimes HOA fees) forever

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago

    Eh, I bought a $142K house and my property taxes plus homeowner's insurance come to $4800 a year, which is $400 a month. What's insane is the condominiums in my district -- over $200K for a 2BR 1BA and you pay the larger property taxes and insurance and you pay condo fees of $800 to $900 a month, and cross your fingers that you don't get hit with any special assessments. You're basically paying $1600 a month to rent your own home.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I did exactly this. I only had to save up for ... 35 years.

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  • [–] 30 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    Moving has always been a huge financial set back for me. It's why some degree of rent control is important as renters are in many ways trapped. It's also super depressing to move to lower rent housing. As you age there's a societal and self imposed expectation of financial progress, paying a bunch to move to lower rent housing is a double tap.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    That lower rent housing could still feel like financial progress. If it meets your needs still, you now have more money to spend on things that aren't housing. I've seen some older couples sell their larger homes and move into small apartments or houses. It cuts back on their costs, maintainance demands, and frees up money for other things like better wine, gifts for the kids, or vacations.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I think they meant they are spending the same rent but getting a lower quality place, in multiple ways. So there isn't more money, just a distinct lower quality of life at the same money.

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  • [–] -2 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    "Paying a bunch to move to lower rent housing" implies the rent is lower, if its about quality they would have specified paying the same rent to get a worse place.

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  • [–] 47 points 4 months ago (6 children)

    Then there's the Application Fee Scam. They charge you a non-refundable $50 per person, sometimes more, just to apply. In my case, that's $150, which goes to the Property Manager. So the property manager is motivated to take as many applications, and turn them down, as possible. They can easily make far more in application fees than whatever fee they collect from actually renting out the place.

    After spending hundreds, only to get turned down within minutes ("Here's $150...oh, it's a No?), I learned to only deal with the person who OWNS the property, no property managers, real estate companies, etc.

    Reasons for being turned down? Usually none given. Once it was because of my "criminal record" - a speeding ticket two years before. Goodbye $150.

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  • [–] 34 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    You might drive the apartment too fast

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  • [–] 14 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Christ, I remember when they were just happy if you gave them money. Now hearing about the song and dance you have to go to to just be considered...

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago

    Then you get approved, to pay 50% of your income to live in a place that wouldn't pass any kind of inspection, so the ceiling leaks and ruins most of your possessions, this happened in 2 different locations.

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  • [–] 43 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    It's important to stay on good terms with friends and family so they will help you when shit like this arises. So you can move back in with mom and dad, or couch surf for a while.

    Sadly, for too many people, there is no help, and they end up homeless.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago

    So many people are on the edge themselves, and taking on one more mouth to feed, use water and electricity, less privacy, less convenience, etc. might push them over the edge, too.

    Times are tough out here.

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  • [–] 18 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Poverty is a resource access problem.

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  • [–] 25 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (25 children)

    https://xcancel.com/jeremyct

    https://x.com/jeremyct

    It's a blue checkmark bot.


    EDIT (because I couldn't help myself):

    It's a faaaake.

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  • [–] 13 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    I’m so tired boss. I hate how fake and artificial the world has become…

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (4 children)

    Then perhaps we should, you know, consider sources?


    I'm sorry, this is not personal, but Lemmy/Piefed complains about slop constantly. It's why we're here!

    Yet they proceed to upvote it onto the front page, every day. Nothing happens when I point it out. Mods don't do anything, the same posters and communities just keep doing it.

    Its frustrating because I love the idea of Lemmy/Piefed, but this is poison for the same reason its poison on Twitter.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    I believe this is an internet in general problem. It’s being filled up with too much shit.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (1 child)

    I don't think we can do anything about it until we solve human verification. Not only is human verification a really hard problem to solve (and also while respecting user privacy), there is a for-profit motive to fill the internet with crap (advertisement industry & state propaganda)

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Also double-dipping on my comment but that's why I make a blocklist of all the politics and doomer sublemmys (or whatever they're called). But there's always new ones popping up it's not a sustainable solution.

    Btw, I don't have a problem with politics but it is impossible to have a nuanced discussion on politics on social media so no point reading the 24/7 doomer headlines and then scrolling through partisan idiots bickering in the comments.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago (13 children)

    Because the message isn't offensive, and people (probably) didn't know it was bot content because they aren't in the habit of checking the background of posts.

    Rhetorical questions only really work when, in reconsidering the question, the absurdity or indefensibility of the situation being questioned comes to light.

    Just because it's a bot doesn't make the validity of the message any less. It just means OP should clip out the account's name.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago* (12 children)

    Just because it’s a bot doesn’t make the validity of the message any less. It just means OP should clip out the account’s name.

    But it's fake.

    It's a story, fabricated soley to farm retweets. It is fiction.

    If you label it as "made up story?" Sure. That's fine. It's the truth. But then its not getting to the front page because it doesn't have the appearance of authenticity.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (5 children)

    A parable is fake too. The point here isn't commiserating with a real person's real financial problem. It resonates with the truth of financial strain people feel in their own lives.

    Do you think there isn't a person alive somewhere in the US that has been priced out of their apartment? Do you think the fees (not the amount it costs) tacked on to applying for a new rental apartment are fake?

    As someone who was priced out of regular rentals: I can assure you, they are not.

    Edit: and I'm not claiming we should all just repost bot farm content. I'm saying it's not surprising a populist message echoing people's struggles is being upvoted. And acting incredulous about that fact doesn't change anything.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago* (4 children)

    You're dodging the issue I have. I'm not arguing with the "resonation of truth." No one here is arguing with the message.

    It's presented as real.

    That's the problem. This is upvoted for its apparent authenticity, and it. Is. Not. Real. It's a story.

    ...Look, tell me this. Lets say you're OP. You found this post yourself, you posted it, but later you found out it's a content farm account. Which would you do:

    • A: Edit it. Label it as such in the title.

    • B: Keep it as is.

    • C: Something else. Delete it?

    And yes, you could post a comment, but the vast majority of viewers wouldn't see that. You could crop out the poster, but that's giving no indication the post isn't authentic.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    I'm not dodging the issue. You even copied a quote of me facing the "issue."

    Just because it's a bot doesn't make the validity of the message any less. It just means OP should clip out the account's name.[emphasis added onto original text]

    It's presented as a tweet. Whether or not you trust any tweet is a personal decision. You yourself, unless you have a habit of checking the background of every tweet picture posted, decided not to trust this one.

    You keep saying it's upvoted for its authenticity and I keep saying that's not the case. If this was framed as a hypothetical, it would get much the same reception because they aren't saying "wow, it's sad this destitute man is having trouble renting a new home. We should make things better for real people like Jeremy. "

    They're probably thinking, "fuck yeah, I feel that. Shit's expensive out here for everybody."

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

    You keep saying it’s upvoted for its authenticity and I keep saying that’s not the case. If this was framed as a hypothetical, it would get much the same reception because they aren’t saying "wow, it’s sad this destitute man is having trouble renting a new home. We should make things better for real people like Jeremy. "

    I dispute this.

    Post a similar Tweet, like this, but label it as "hypothetical" right in the title. Not as a comment or mention, but smack where people see it before they read the Tweet.

    It might get some upvotes, but I'm positive it wouldn't make it to #1 on the front page.

    It’s presented as a tweet. Whether or not you trust any tweet is a personal decision.

    I think this is disingenuous too.

    ...Do you really think, when most people are reading this post, their initial thought is. "Huh, a tweet. I dunno if this Jeremy guy is real, let me consider that... Eh, I like the sentiment anyway. Upvote."

    That's nonsense.

    No one even checked and posted about it until now, apparently.

    It's not a choice. Most never knew to choose! The Tweet is worded as if a real person describing their situation, so that's what the initial assumption will be.

    Just because it’s a bot doesn’t make the validity of the message any less. It just means OP should clip out the account’s name.[emphasis added onto original text]

    And this does nothing.

    It removes attribution. But it does nothing to suggest the Tweet isn't authentic.


    ...And you didn't answer my question, I don't think.

    To be clear, if you were OP of this post, what would you do now? Just remove the author, that's it?

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    ...Do you really think, when most people are reading this post, their initial thought is. "Huh, a tweet. I dunno if this Jeremy guy is real, let me consider that... Eh, I like the sentiment anyway. Upvote."

    I didn't even read the account's name until your comment (I also didn't upvote because I don't upvote a post unless it's small and/or I really like it).

    I try to not extend my experience as "normative" to other people but I don't believe people are giving names much credence unless they're famous.

    To be clear, if you were OP of this post, what would you do now? Just remove the author, that's it?

    Idk if you can hotswap the content of a post. If I learned after posting, I'd probably just delete the post because I don't feel strongly enough to put the work into editing and reposting. I wouldn't have even posted this in the first place because I don't think this is novel enough to be posting. That's almost besides the pount but you asked for personal opinions.

    If I knew beforehand (and was possessed of a desire to share this), yeah, I'd just cut out the account name.

    I agree the tweet form factor drives engagement for some reason, but if the username were "fake-anti-capitalist-tweets" with a blue thumbs up icon, I'm certain it would have moved in much the same ways.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago*

    I agree the tweet form factor drives engagement for some reason, but if the username were “fake-anti-capitalist-tweets” with a blue thumbs up icon, I’m certain it would have moved in much the same ways.

    If it was actually impossible to miss, I disagree.

    Idk if you can hotswap the content of a post. If I learned after posting, I’d probably just delete the post because I don’t feel strongly enough to put the work into editing and reposting. I wouldn’t have even posted this in the first place because I don’t think this is novel enough to be posting. That’s almost besides the pount but you asked for personal opinions.

    Well this is admirable, but:

    If I knew beforehand (and was possessed of a desire to share this), yeah, I’d just cut out the account name.

    I think this is where you and I have a fundamental difference of viewpoints, that's not going to be resolved.

    To me, this would be the same as filing the author off an article I knew was fake, and reposting it with no context. It's disingenous. I'd interpet it as presenting something to the internet as authentic, and hiding that its not. And if it needed the "hypothetical" label, I just wouldn't post it at all, because what's the point of that? Just post the thought directly.

    The source comes before the message, for me.

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  • [–] 0 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    You won't believe this but literally every parable and nearly every single thing written in history is made up. There was no Sodom and Gomorrah, there was no Ark, there was no giant horse to invade Troy, Cleopatra wasn't hot, Alexander wasn't that Great, Paul probably didn't exist, etc.

    But the reason humans tell stories is to illustrate something. This may have been a bot just reposting sentiment, but it still got that sentiment from somewhere. In fact this "story" as you call it has been going around the internet longer than you've been alive based on your comments in this thread. It's a common problem. And one ignored by pretty much everyone in power and their fans.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago* (4 children)

    That's the most defeatist argument I've heard. "The stories of history are fake, most of the internet is fake, so we're justified in presenting a made-up story as real, like we've been doing all along."

    I'm sorry. I'm not supporting an obvious engagement farm just because it "illustrates something" worthwhile. That's the fundamental reason why the internet is in such a horrendous state right.


    To be clear, I have no problem with stories, or even "embellished history," if they're labeled as such. I mean, I know history is a interpreted construct with embellishment, that was middle school history class.

    But this is presented as an example of a real human being's experience. It's why people are upvoting it.

    And that's a straight-up lie.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    No, people are upvoting it because they can relate with it, and it is factual, regardless of it if happened to a real human.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago* (2 children)

    There's a word for made up stories misleadingly presented as an authentic human account, and its not "factual."

    I'm not saying it hasn't happened to a real human either. I agree with the seniment of the story.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    The 'sentiment,' aka the circumstances being lamented, are 100% factual.

    The story might not be.

    If I write about how I tried and failed to move faster than the speed of light by lighting my farts on fire, the story is fake, but it's factual. I would not ever be able to move faster than the speed of light by lighting my farts on fire. Everyone can understand that, as long as they have a reference of the amount of energy generated by flaming farts and a reference for what the speed of light is and the amount of energy that it requires to get there.

    Renting in the united states requires at minimum 3x the monthly rent to be paid upfront, usually 4x the monthly rent, along with a non-refundable application fee which often is just lost and denied. If I write a story about how a anthropomorphic bunny is having a hard time renting due to not being able to raise enough money on only fans to handle these ridiculous requirements, the story is still factual and makes a point about the real circumstances in this world regardless of the fact anthropomorphic bunnies have not been proven to exist yet.

    So yes, it would get upvoted despite taking liberties with the exact details and thus being a fictionalized version of reality that uses facts from reality to make a point.

    I suppose the real problem I have with your critique is that it's pointless to attack an AI version of a meme because of the content of the meme which has been reposted in a million ways by humans before you found your way onto the internet, instead of attacking the fact it's just an AI powered repost of a true meme.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago*

    So yes, it would get upvoted despite taking liberties with the exact details and thus being a fictionalized version of reality that uses facts from reality to make a point.

    I call nonsense.

    If you replaced "Me" and "I" and "Jeremy" in this post with "anthropomorphic bunny," making it clear the text is not from a real person, there's no way it would be on the front page of Lemmy. It wouldn't have even made it wherever OP saw it.

    I suppose the real problem I have with your critique is that it’s pointless to attack an AI version of a meme because of the content of the meme which has been reposted in a million ways by humans before you found your way onto the internet, instead of attacking the fact it’s just an AI powered repost of a true meme.

    I find this implausible too.

    If it was a meme with a message you didn't like, would you have issue with an "AI powered repost of a true meme?" You can't tell me you wouldn't. Just because you like the message, that its sentiment is true somewhere doesn't make presenting a fabrication as a real anecdote ethical.

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  • [–] [S] -1 points 4 months ago (4 children)

    Does the source impact the message? This is the reality of a large part of the working class, so regardless where it comes from the truth is still the same

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago* (3 children)

    Then label it so. Indicate its a made-up source, as a tag in the title.

    I have no problem with a message. But do you really think people would upvote this if they knew it was a "message" from ChatGPT or something, just to make this account a buck? Isn't that a bit ironic, in this community?

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  • [–] [S] 2 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    You think screen shots make money?

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  • [–] 0 points 4 months ago* (1 child)

    Of course not. The Tweeter has already made their cash, and you’re dodging the point.

    Its too late now (as the post has already made its rounds), but its about exposing Lemmy to a fake post.

    It was a pretty simple choice. Do you value information hygiene and truthful presentation, or the message itself, more? Does the veracity of the source it comes from matter? Would you mislead Lemmy viewers if it’s for the right message?

    And it seems you answered that with your choice.

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  • [–] 12 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    In Spain you get a paid vacation day for moving. You just show your lease contract and you get the first day of the lease off.

    But you usually have to pay first month up front and put in a security deposit. It used to also be that you had to pay a fee to the agency. The law now says that the landlord pays that fee but sometimes they will still say it o you. You can either pay or keep looking.

    So worst case you need 3x the rent to move. Best case you just put in the security deposit which you get back at the end of the contract.

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  • [+] 3 points 4 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    You just need residency. Which basically means you just need a job. But keep in mind that the right is on the rise here, like everywhere else, so most likely in a couple of years a lot of progress made here will also be rolled back. I think EU is still great place to be long term, just don't focus on current situation too much when choosing where to go. Things will change.

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  • [–] 12 points 4 months ago

    Yeah, and it's not the excuse that landlords need to keep up with costs, either, since most landlords are huge corporations, and costs don't increase that fast. Land values plateaued years ago, so taxes aren't ballooning or anything like that anymore. I was lucky enough to have help with a down payment, so I now own, but that's rare, especially in my city where house/land costs are way higher than their value due to the limited supply, which is mostly due to all the properties that are forever unoccupied as investment property or are mostly unlivable, and building material costs have made it too expensive to repair.

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  • [–] 85 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (11 children)

    This account is 100% rage bait. Look up the account. It's all posts like this, same formatting, tone, similar themes.

    It's all bullshit, he contradicts himself constantly.

    There's also a community note that the account is based in Africa.

    Edit to address replies:

    First of all, first months rent and security deposit shouldn't factor in. You get your security deposit back from your current place if you haven't trashed it, and you're already paying rent, so the new apartments rent isn't an additional cost. In fact, if you're moving somewhere cheaper, you'll save money that first month.

    Yes, you might have to pay those way before you move in, and there might be a delay getting the old deposit back, so you need more money up front to cover it. But if you don't have two months' rent in savings, credit, investments, etc? You are absolutely living beyond your means. I know I'll get shit on for this, but that's really not a lot to save.

    Application fees include credit checks everywhere I've ever lived. Here they are capped at like $25 I think? It sucks but it's not the end of the world. Never had to pay a deposit on utilities and my credit is shit.

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  • [–] 26 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, it's bullshit. A real American would have said "First month's rent. Last month's rent. Security deposit."

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago

    Everywhere I've lived, "last months rent" = security deposit. Never heard of anyone paying both.

    If that's true, though, it still just means you don't have to save extra for a new lease if the last month at your old place is already paid for.

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  • [–] 15 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

    It doesn't mean that the scenario he described isn't authentic. I've experienced it myself several times in my life.

    He may have framed his story as an actual thing that happened to him, but that isn't important. What's important is that he laid out the parameters for a discussion on the problems with switching rental properties, and a substantive discussion followed. The discussion is the point, not how the premise was presented.

    There are lots of awful things that happen in America. Bringing them up for discussion is not automatically rage bait just because it makes you angry. Rage Bait is when you give it a misleading, anger-inducing headline, just to get someone to click on it, and then see advertising. That's Rage BAIT. What is this BAITING us into? A discussion about the economics of moving?

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    I had a neighbor in my old apartment complex who was looking to buy a house the same time I was. I was lucky enough to get approved for a mortgage at a good rate for a good amount, where as he was not approved for a loan which would have cost him $900 a month in loan payments. He didn't have a choice and continued to rent at $1300 a month. Just in case you didn't catch that, he pays $1300 a month in rent, but the bank wouldn't approve him for a loan for $900/month. How is that fair in any way?

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Leaving aside the issue of credit rating and focusing just on the cost of home ownership, a house costs a lot more than just the mortgage payment. I bought my house for $142K and it had previously been renting for $1300 a month. My property taxes plus homeowner's insurance alone come to $400 a month, so if I had a $900 per month mortgage I'd be at $1300 a month minimum, before considering the cost of maintenance and repairs and upgrades and whatnot.

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  • [–] 9 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Sidebar, I'm a big fan of a minimal life aka having as little stuff as possible. My truck can hold all my stuff for a one trip move. If I didn't have that then there's the $20 daily van rentals which are honestly going to be like $60 all said and done. If I couldn't afford a deposit and first months rent on an apartment then I could rent a room. I've also been tempted to get a cheap trailer for an RV park. Finally there's the option of taking on a roommate. In college we had two people to each room and a guy with a makeshift wall renting the living room. Is it glamorous? Hell no. Could things be better? Hell yeah. Is it better than living out of my truck or on the street? Most definitely.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Same, until I buy a house there's no reason to litter my life with bullshit that just needs to get moved between apartment to apartment. And yea, I've been considering the van life / RV life too. Depending on where you're at financially, the cost of van loan may be far less than what you were ever paying in rent. Of course: I am incredibly blessed and privileged enough to have a completely remote job.

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  • [–] 8 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Good news, you're legally allowed to keep all the copper in the walls as a leaving present.

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  • [+] 6 points 4 months ago* (1 child)
  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago*

    and that key?

    That key is money. So most people will never have the key to escape, but they'll never stop getting charged to look for it.

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago

    I paid over 4,000 on my last move. It was brutal.

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  • [–] 6 points 4 months ago

    This has an AI-like pattern that says:

    "You aren't a virgin, you are just sex-proof"

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago* (2 children)

    I used to suggest committing a crime and getting to jail (if government cannot manage the country economy, at least they could support you with food and shelter).

    Then someone told me there is a waiting list for prisons in USA...

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  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago
    [–] 4 points 4 months ago (9 children)
  • [–] 4 points 4 months ago (7 children)

    I've never heard of "utility deposits" in my life...

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  • [–] 12 points 4 months ago* (4 children)

    They're real.

    Paid to the utility company itself to get services turned on for the first time in your name (and typically not paid again when you move, as long as you transfer your service to the new address), its usually returned to you via a credit to your bill after 3-12 months of service depending on the utility company.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (3 children)

    Wow, well, I can tell you I've never heard of this as a US native who has lived across multiple states, at least. I thought it should say "security deposit."

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago* (2 children)

    Wanna give that post a second go so we can figure out what you're on about.

    Security and Utility deposits are both a thing in America.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, I missed sec. dep. the first time. I still have never heard of utility deposits, though it also seems according to someone else here that they're only for people with bad credit, so I guess that's why.

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  • [–] -2 points 4 months ago

    This post heavily inflates the numbers to maximize the drama.

    First month's rent: That's not an added moving expense. You pay rent every month regardless of where you live.

    Moving truck: If money is tight, you rent a cheap van and move yourself with friends like everyone else.

    Yes, having the cash upfront for a new deposit while waiting for the old one to return is a real liquidity trap. But framing $4,000 as the absolute baseline to escape a rent increase is pure ragebait. It makes the poster sound like someone who has never actually had to do a budget, DIY move.

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