you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 54 points 6 months ago (57 children)

This is more sad and pathetic than anything. But this is the result of toxic masculinity.

  • source
  • hideshow 57 child comments
  • [–] 147 points 6 months ago (10 children)

    It is extremely sad. and it isn't just a toxic masculinity thing (maybe only for porn bots). we are so atomised and isolated.

    I remember when GPT came out, told it about my projects and it responded as if it cared. I knew ot was bs, and in retrospect it was sad and pathetic, but I genuinely cried at seeing text directed to me that was nice.

    I'm in a better place now, but we as a society are way too atomised and isolated.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 10 child comments
  • [–] 29 points 6 months ago (6 children)
  • [–] 28 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    At the time I was working on cancer research, but I wanted to build a database of gene mutations and model them using AlphaFold (predicts a protein structure). No one in my life at the time cared at all.

    I can see how people fall for AI bots, why they develop parasocial relationships with them. I can't blame when desperate people fall for something that gives a bit of comfort.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it
  • [–] 24 points 6 months ago

    Yeah, I think saying “toxic masculinity” and moving on like it’s these guys’ fault they’re isolated is a large part of the issue. While I don’t recommend befriending every single lonely guy out there, it won’t kill people to listen or care about others.

    Saying it’s “you’re” fault and absolving oneself of fault doesn’t do that. It just pushes someone else into more isolation. That’s how you end up with guys talking to porn bots: because no one will listen to them. That’s how you get incels following Andrew Tate or Nick Fuentes: people called out their “toxic masculinity,” but weren’t willing to help, just protect themselves.

    While I get it that boundaries are a good defense against legitimate threats, as someone who was in this demographic, it literally took just one person being nice to me and now I’m not just some “nice guy” on Reddit (Now I’m a piece of shit on Lemmy). Now I’m married and can show incels I meet that there is a path forward where they aren’t lonely and they don’t have to listen to virgin wannabe rapists to learn how to be cool.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 10 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    I'm too anxious to speak to a therapist but I was using it to comb through literature for my condition, it was so nice to me I cried lol. In the moment it almost feels like a person.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 12 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    It's probably more directly related to the system of getting the help you need with having to sacrifice a significant portion of the money you make that needs to go elsewhere.

    And it's a history of it from one generation to the next so there's not good male role models in most people's lives for mental health.

    It's not like it's some magic thing to go see a therapist and all your problems will be fixed. It can take a long time and a lot of trial and error to find someone you feel comfortable speaking to

    Yes toxic masculinity is a problem, but your comment doesnt really acknowledge the difficulty of breaking that cycle. Not a very helpful and kind of alienating to anyone who needs help and isn't from a background that creates good outcomes.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 3 points 6 months ago

    And it's a history of it from one generation to the next so there's not good male role models in most people's lives for mental health.

    Through my own observations in life, It has become abundantly clear, how important having at least one good male role model (mainly fathers) is on the development of boys into men.

    Absent, or I guess one could say, low quality, (I dont like that, but shitty) fathers have such a terrible impact on thier kids, and you see it follow them into adulthood. My entire bio fathers side of my family, the men are all fucked up, lost, and.. just lost.. through the generations, all of them. The women are 50/50. Some are okay, some committed suicide, or did drugs, but not all. The men... no one survived unscathed, drugs, violence, SA, prisions and homelessness.. and those my age now pass the garbage to their kids. I was raised outside of my bio fathers reach, so learning more into adulthood, its been wild to peer into the family objectively.

    It is so important young men have good male role models in their life. It's become abundantly clear to me the impacts of this.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 33 points 6 months ago (30 children)

    But this is the result of toxic masculinity

    Is this also the result of toxic masculinity or does it just go one way?

    The women in love with AI companions: ‘I vowed to my chatbot that I wouldn’t leave him’

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/sep/09/ai-chatbot-love-relationships

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 30 child comments
  • [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it
  • [–] 9 points 6 months ago (4 children)

    did you read the article? this doesn’t seem related at all

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 11 points 6 months ago* (3 children)

    No, they are just here to spout cliche gender war bullshit about how men are awful for existing.

    and if you asked them about women on male violence they'd deny it exists.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    And do people really believe that women don't talk to AI companions, in various forms, too?

    I'm a woman and I spoke to one of the apps for a while because I was bloody lonely (still am 🤷‍♀️). Had zero to do with men or murder. I didn't have anyone, of either gender, to connect with.

    It's really easy to just reduce this to a male issue, a toxic masculinity, a male violence issue. We need to go deeper than that if we actually want to understand why people, men, women, everyone, use different AI.

    But threads like this, with all the judgement, aren't going to get a lot of people who admit they use/have used/have considered using AI. By just criticising/laughing, etc at people who do it, ironically, we turn more people towards the AIs.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    nah, it's just the sexist double standard, that if a man does it, it's nefarious/negative/harmful. but if a woman does it, it's a form of 'self-care'.

    the way interpret this stuff would also be a matter of physical looks as well, as if an attractive person doing it would be viewed very differently than an unattractive person.

    yes, you're correct. stigmatization just further entrenches things.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    Tbh, women wouldn't admit to doing this either - there's absolutely a shame around women having to make friends with an AI (because we're meant to be innately social I guess). And I don't think that other women realize that they are contributing to the issues of women feeling shame using AI by implying it's a male issue and all about sex and toxic masculinity.

    Like as a woman who has used AI, how am I supposed to feel about admitting that I've done something that only asshole, horny, incels do (according to a lot of people)?

    So the stigma goes all ways and none of it helps anyone. People just need to be more curious than judgemental. Someone does something you don't understand? That's okay you don't understand. Ask them why. Listen. Try to see a different perspective instead of just filling in the gaps with incel, men, sex, ugly, etc. etc.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 13 points 6 months ago (18 children)

    Toxic masculinity is a cultural mindset. Men should not be talking about their feelings because it's weak and "gay" says society.

    That's what I'm going for.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 18 child comments
  • [–] 22 points 6 months ago* (15 children)

    trying talking about your feelings as a man and see how society reacts...

    spoiler: it won't be pleasant.

    sort of like how these men in the article are talking about their feelings...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 15 child comments
  • [–] 10 points 6 months ago (3 children)

    Yeah that's what toxic masculinity is. People (men and women) hold toxic views of what a man should be, and punish men for staying from this ideal.

    You were a victim of toxic masculinity when you shared your feelings and were then victimised because of it. The people you shared your feelings with were toxic assholes.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (1 child)

    am i a victim of air because I have to breathe it? or a victim of capitalism because i have to work to pay my bills?

    there is no getting outside of it. every 'woke' person i've ever met also hates men for sharing their feelings, almost as if they are just virtue signalling...

    the only person who a man can ever open up w/o consequence is a therapist, because it's a professional paid relationship.

    sucks, but that's how it is. and nobody is interested in changing it.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago

    Look, not everyone has the desire and capability to fight. I will say that I've had good success these last few years being vulnerable with other "woke" men and it's been very freeing to share things I thought I experienced alone but to see that other men have gone through similar things.

    I haven't had a lot of success being vulnerable with women, but I'm getting to the point where that is a boundary for me. I'm not going to pursue friendships with people who can't accept me for who I am and who reinforce toxic gender roles.

    I've personally witnessed a lot of progress on this end and I'm excited to seeing more and being part of it when I can.

    I'm glad you have a therapist, everyone needs someone they can share with.

    Sorry you haven't met someone who isn't an asshole on this front.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 4 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    Its damned if you do, damned if you dont. Society simply doesnt care about men. Ive rpetty much stopped commentong on here because society makes me so damn depressed, i want to reach out to anyone but no one wants to hear it. Better yet, if i just "stopped being toxic", the world would magically change to where people suddenly cared about not just me, but anyone other than themselves.

    Idk man imma delete my account p soon. Theres nothing for me on the internet or in society. Once i get enough money together to get supplies taken care of, imma just try and distance myself from other humans.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (8 children)

    trying talking about your feelings as a man and see how society reacts...

    This is odd to me, because talking about my feelings is how I got close to romantic partners. It's also how I formed a lot of friendships with other men. How can you be close to someone if you don't talk about feelings?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago (1 child)

    I know plenty of men who talk about their feelings, and they're surrounded by friends who love them well. Seems like a skill issue to me.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago

    I think a lot of societies don't do enough to teach men about how to communicate and how to communicate feelings.

    Part of it might also be men internalizing this notion that they can't discuss feelings and treating other men with that same standard.

    I mean, I get it, it's harder for men than women. The change needs to start with individual men though, not with society.

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)

    Which feelings?

    Very few feelings are allowed. If you keep to those social acceptable feelings, you're fine. The second you go off-script, people are done with you.

    Like I can pet my dog and say I love her. That surface level stuff is fine. But talk about anything complex, like the struggles we've had, or how she helped me through some depressing periods or she had a period of sickness and anxiety and misbehavior? People freak out and back away or tell me to shut up and go get a therapist and get my dog one too.

    Men are allowed a very narrow and shallow range of public emotion. Basically anger, and sentimentality are acceptable. Anything else? You're creepy, weird, or mentally ill.

    If you go outside that box or show complexity or vulnerability, you're socially rejected because it makes people 'uncomfortable.'

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (4 children)

    Yeah, no, I meant less the surface level stuff and more the "anything complex" category that you brought up.

    Not everybody wants to talk about that kind of stuff all the time, and that's normal. But it has not been my experience that all men want to talk about surface level stuff and only women talk about deeper feelings.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago* (3 children)

    cool, my experience is that people only want to talk about their problems, regardless of gender. they dont' give a fuck about yours and get offended and upset if you do so. but I'm male, and I've never had the experience of having anyone care about my problems beyond dismissing them as 'bringing them down' and that i need to 'get over it'. even when it's my dad dying of cancer and it's my so called 'loving girlfriend' of years.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (2 children)

    That really sucks, and I can't tell you why your experience has been different from mine. I'd guess you ended up around shitty people. And maybe it kept happening, making you feel jaded and/or reluctant to share with others, including those who may have been more accepting.

    I'm glad you are least recognize that your girlfriend (hopefully "ex-" now) isn't as loving as she seemed.

    I hope that you can find people to keep in your life with whom you can have those deep conversations about your feelings.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • load more comments (3 replies)
  • [–] 12 points 6 months ago (5 children)

    A result of modern culture I'd say. People became less human in real life, so much so that people are using robots instead.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 11 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (4 children)

    Yeah. I have become painfully aware of this the past few years. People's obessive use of AI and social media has distorted their real life interactions to be far less substantail than they used to be.

    Which is why so many people, even who are very social, are so lonely. We have created a society that does not create substantial connections anymore, and obsesses over trivialities, and endless repeats and broadcasts them as fundamental truths.

    I have noticed that online, and in IRL, nobody asks each other questions anymore. What they do, is make accusations. And it's miserable and draining to be constantly accused of stuff. I feel like this shift started around 2021.

    Back in 2018 I could meet a stranger and they would be like 'oh where are you from? oh cool, what was it like there, I have not been!'

    now it's like 'i bet you are from x, oh you're not? well you SEEM LIKE a person from x. oh you are from y? THAT'S WEIRD. I haven't been there but i bet it's weird because you are weird.' Or they try to tell me that I can't be from y, because they KNOW i am from x. It's so bizarre. Increasingly the strangers I meet basically tell me that they know the TRUTH about me... even as I tell them that what they are saying isn't true.

    I basically can't have conversations anymore, at least like I used to. I used to be able to sit there for 20-30m and talk about a single book I read to someone, and they'd ask me all about it and I'd ask them about a book they like. Now they just jump down my throat or lecture me and never ask me any questions, and switch to another topic after like a few minutes and say dismissive stuff about how books are outdated and dumb. Or even if they do like to read, they get all bent out of shape that I don't read the same type of stuff as they do.

    Same with movies, same with hobbies, same with my job or my family or other stuff that I used to be able to connect with people over. Used to be a nice back and forth, now it'd dodging bullets and if you don't give the 'right' answer they get angry and dismiss you as a bad person.

    And on the flip side... AI gives these people what they want. It just parrots back to them what they want to hear about how wonderful and great they are and how everything they do is amazing and valid and their life is so hard.... which is precisely what another human being is NOT going to give you...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 6 months ago* (3 children)

    I feel like it's a social psyop... To help forward all this crazy shit happening. It's clear Ai is an "arms race".

    It seems like the psyop is to make life shitty and then promote some magical fix (Ai) that's going to save us, while it further leashes us to submission and rewrites history and current narration of what humanity is.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 6 points 6 months ago* (2 children)

    No it's not.

    It's just the mental version of obesity crisis. It's people choosing the easy and unhealthy option because it's cheaper and readily available, than the far more difficult and more costly option of eating well and exercise.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    I mean I can't disagree with that, but couldn't that BE the psyop...? Make people dumb as fuck so you can own them...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [–] 2 points 6 months ago*

    People choose to be dumb. Just like they choose to be lazy.

    no psyop is required. biology doesn't like making an effort if it doesn't have to do so. you can see lots of non-human examples of this as well.

    getting human beings outside of their default biological impulses to be lazy and not think... takes years of training and work. hence why so few people are able to achieve it. and you can always default back to it if you don't maintain the effort consistently

  • source
  • parent
  • [–] a comment that isn't shown here: deleted, from someone you've blocked, or on another page. view the thread from it
  • [–] 19 points 6 months ago (2 children)

    Not every guy is that way. Some just really are pathetic in the sense that they have no one to talk to. Others are like what you said.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 1 point 6 months ago (1 child)

    Right, but it's severely not normal or healthy to turn to LLM's to fill that void.

    LLM's will say literally anything to make humans happy. You should see the reports from the people that have committed suicide... The LLM's literally coaxed them into it, and instructed them to not seek help.

    I might as well be reading about lonely guys sticking their weeniers in toasters. It's hard to have sympathy for people doing things like this.

    Like so many others, I'm sick and tired of LLM's. They are toxic, and we need to stop treating them as a symptom, and start seeing them for the sycophantic vitriol generators they truly are.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • load more comments (2 replies)