▲ 63 ▼ Forking frenzy ensues after Euro-Office launch sparks OnlyOffice backlash (www.theregister.com) submitted 7 months ago by Ek-Hou-Van-Braai@piefed.social to c/foss@beehaw.org 30 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[+] ugo@feddit.it 8 points 7 months ago (7 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago (6 children) I find code on codeberg all the time. You won't find codeberg unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly. Search in Google, DDG, Kagi, or whatever search engine you like for some generic variant of "where to find source code/ foss tools/ etc", and show me the combo that returns you Codeberg. Unlike Github, which is a well-known place to find code Codeberg is not, and most people have not heard of it, and won't find it organically. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (6 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children) unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly Skill issue indeed. Reading comprehension, specifically. Let me spell it out: You won't find Codeberg in searches unless you know it exists already, or already know of a specific tool that is hosted there. Euro-Office creators probably want people to discover their tool as much as possible. Hosting the tool on a platform that doesn't come up in searches due to its relative obscurity is therefore a bad idea. Euro-Office creators chose not to do that. the vapid useless SEO-optimized articles that you find "This year will be the year of the Linux desktop Codeberg!" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago On top: Codeberg is like sourceforge: Relativeky unknown. So some of the less technically inclined may know GitHub but would interpret Codeberg as a rip off unless IONOS literally links to it on their website (which they probably wont and instead just provide the download link or literally host the git infra on their own) permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) [–] Kissaki@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago (2 children) You're not showing that they were wrong. You're showing what they already said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 3 points 7 months ago (2 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies)
[–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago (6 children) I find code on codeberg all the time. You won't find codeberg unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly. Search in Google, DDG, Kagi, or whatever search engine you like for some generic variant of "where to find source code/ foss tools/ etc", and show me the combo that returns you Codeberg. Unlike Github, which is a well-known place to find code Codeberg is not, and most people have not heard of it, and won't find it organically. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (6 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children) unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly Skill issue indeed. Reading comprehension, specifically. Let me spell it out: You won't find Codeberg in searches unless you know it exists already, or already know of a specific tool that is hosted there. Euro-Office creators probably want people to discover their tool as much as possible. Hosting the tool on a platform that doesn't come up in searches due to its relative obscurity is therefore a bad idea. Euro-Office creators chose not to do that. the vapid useless SEO-optimized articles that you find "This year will be the year of the Linux desktop Codeberg!" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago On top: Codeberg is like sourceforge: Relativeky unknown. So some of the less technically inclined may know GitHub but would interpret Codeberg as a rip off unless IONOS literally links to it on their website (which they probably wont and instead just provide the download link or literally host the git infra on their own) permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) [–] Kissaki@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago (2 children) You're not showing that they were wrong. You're showing what they already said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 3 points 7 months ago (2 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies)
[+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (6 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 6 child comments replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children) unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly Skill issue indeed. Reading comprehension, specifically. Let me spell it out: You won't find Codeberg in searches unless you know it exists already, or already know of a specific tool that is hosted there. Euro-Office creators probably want people to discover their tool as much as possible. Hosting the tool on a platform that doesn't come up in searches due to its relative obscurity is therefore a bad idea. Euro-Office creators chose not to do that. the vapid useless SEO-optimized articles that you find "This year will be the year of the Linux desktop Codeberg!" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago On top: Codeberg is like sourceforge: Relativeky unknown. So some of the less technically inclined may know GitHub but would interpret Codeberg as a rip off unless IONOS literally links to it on their website (which they probably wont and instead just provide the download link or literally host the git infra on their own) permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) [–] Kissaki@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago (2 children) You're not showing that they were wrong. You're showing what they already said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 3 points 7 months ago (2 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies)
[–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children) unless you search for it or a repo that lives on it explicitly Skill issue indeed. Reading comprehension, specifically. Let me spell it out: You won't find Codeberg in searches unless you know it exists already, or already know of a specific tool that is hosted there. Euro-Office creators probably want people to discover their tool as much as possible. Hosting the tool on a platform that doesn't come up in searches due to its relative obscurity is therefore a bad idea. Euro-Office creators chose not to do that. the vapid useless SEO-optimized articles that you find "This year will be the year of the Linux desktop Codeberg!" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago On top: Codeberg is like sourceforge: Relativeky unknown. So some of the less technically inclined may know GitHub but would interpret Codeberg as a rip off unless IONOS literally links to it on their website (which they probably wont and instead just provide the download link or literally host the git infra on their own) permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies)
[+] ugo@feddit.it 2 points 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] t3rmit3@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) foot... Searching for it euro office... searching for it Whether you like the SEO-driving search engine providers or not, they are still the way that most people find things on the internet, and they prioritize Github results. When you're not searching for "it", but just searching them by describing things like it, (of which there are many, mostly on Github), it serves your interest to 'O' for the 'SEs' by putting it somewhere that will get prioritized higher. If the goal is digital sovereignty for europe Sovereignty is exercised and evidenced by a state's ability to enforce the laws they have created. Microsoft operates within Europe. As long as Europe can enforce their laws upon Microsoft (as they can and do now), that relationship is still an exercise of European sovereignty. Back to my first comment in the thread, "sovereignty != isolation". Cutting yourself off from external groups does not make you "more sovereign" or something. If Europe cannot enforce their laws upon foreign business entities operating in their jurisdictions, and thus choose to prioritize Europe-headquartered businesses, that would be evidence of far weaker sovereign control of their jurisdiction. Now, if it's just a matter of prioritizing supporting European businesses, (call it, say, "Europe First", or maybe "Make Europe Gr..." oh wait) that's fine for them to do, and supporting any smaller business or organization over a large one is almost always preferable, but that isn't and shouldn't be about the perception of sovereignty or about nationalism, it should be about fighting back against corporate power by not rewarding these de facto monopolies and political meddlers and manipulators with your business. But once again, that's not within the scope (or ability) of a simple Office-alike application. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago On top: Codeberg is like sourceforge: Relativeky unknown. So some of the less technically inclined may know GitHub but would interpret Codeberg as a rip off unless IONOS literally links to it on their website (which they probably wont and instead just provide the download link or literally host the git infra on their own) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Kissaki@beehaw.org 1 point 7 months ago (2 children) You're not showing that they were wrong. You're showing what they already said. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 3 points 7 months ago (2 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies) load more comments (-1 replies)
[+] ugo@feddit.it 3 points 7 months ago (2 children) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies)
[–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 7 months ago (1 child) Is the code mirrored on GitHub? If yes, you are right. It's a skill issue of web searching If no, you are wrong. It's sort of like searching for a reddit community for lemmy by searching "AskLemmy lemmy.world". (The goal is to highlight that AskReddit was essentially forked to AskLemmy and made it's own thing that is only on Lemmy) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent load more comments (-1 replies)
[+] ugo@feddit.it 1 point 7 months ago (1 child) [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 7 months ago Yeah but what they said is meaningless. Searching for source code is how you would search for tool’s source code. Not “where to find source code” I can't find any mention of that in this comment. And asking to read the whole wall of text in minute detail is bit much to ask... Anyway: I have said it that I agree on being mirrored. But hosting it only on Codeberg does take away a bit from being easy to discover. permalink fedilink source parent