I was just perusing the modlog when I noticed something interesting. Apparently posting news about Gaza/Palestine is not allowed on !worldnews@sh.itjust.works. I decided to check the side bar and didn't see anything. The only pinned post also does not indicate that this is not allowed

edit: the mod in question is @Eyekaytee@aussie.zone . sorry for not originally tagging. i hadn't realized it was a rule that this must be done. i thought it seemed inappropriate since i was trying to initiate a conversation about a community's rules and culture rather than start drama about an individual

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[–] 15 points 1 year ago (86 children)

I don't think Russia has a good economic model, nor would I want to live there. I do think it's forced strategically into trade with socialist countries, which is why it has a good relationship with countries like Cuba, and is working against western imperialism, which is the largest obstacle in the way of socialism worldwide. Additionally, support for socialism is rising over time:

So no, I don't somehow think Russia is socialist still, but at the moment socialist countries benefit massively from Russian trade and from temporary alliance against the west.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (35 children)

    Are you still doing the thing where you equate two entirely different and incompatible things like doing Mad Libs is acceptable logic? Like, someone could say "solar energy is a good thing" and your rhetorical response would be "what if I replaced solar energy with 'racism?' Then wouldn't you be saying racism is good?"

    My point is that Russia has a rising socialist sympathy among the populace, which is true. We can point to their reasons being that capitalism has, by and large, been devastating for Russians, while socialism worked well. Colonialism, on the other hand, has been disastrous for its underdevelopment of Africa, and many of these liberated countries are under neocolonialism or imperialism to this day.

    You really need to check your rhetoric, you were called out for this faulty "Mad Libs" logic already.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago* (16 children)

    what does it even matter, this has nothing to do with anything, cowbee supports socialism?

    what exactly is your argument, that its bad that they're supporting socialism because some people support colonialism?

    cowbees argument is essentially they are bad but they help socialists and they may become socialist again, how is it relevant in any way that africa supports colonialism?

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago* (13 children)

    But he didn't do that so...?

    quote the part where he said we should do socialism because of a nostalgia poll?

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    No, he cited that poll because he supports socialism and russia is in favor of socialism. He did not say socialism is good because of the poll.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (9 children)

    That is not what he said at all, he was explaining why he supports russia, you completely misunderstood his point, reread the conversation.

    a simplified version of his claim:

    "i support socialism, russia is strategically beneficial for socialism because they trade with socialists and may one day be socialist, as evidenced by [the poll in question], socialism being on the rise in russia is part of the reason i support them over western powers."

    see how at no point in that claim did he say that socialism is good because it has popular support?

    you didn't understand the assertion and guessed what he was saying and then treated him poorly based on that misinterpretation, you should apologize.

    honestly why would anyone argue that socialism is good because a country likes it??

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (7 children)

    That is both very obviously what he was saying and also makes all of his responses to you make sense, also it is very easily inferred, you just went with a very bad faith interpretation for no apparent reason.

    you should apologize.

    @Cowbee@lemmy.ml can you confirm

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    he did not try to point out that i misunderstood it

    https://lemmy.frozeninferno.xyz/post/57983013/21014971

    what do you think this post is?

    And no, I’m not apologising to anyone. I made an error and i admit to that. That’s about as much as you’ll get from me.

    this doesn't change the fact that you should.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    "Citing the fact that Russia has increasing support for socialism as proof of Russians having increased support for socialism is perfectly valid."

    can you rephrase this sentence in your own words?

    then

    can you explain why he would say this?

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago

    Yes, that is my point, you're correct. Though, I do think when combined with other points on the positives of socialism that its perception increasing in post-socialist countries is useful, though not by itself.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (16 children)

    No, these are entirely different things. You're essentially saying that it is useless to take public opinion polling on whether they prefer socialism or capitalism because some people would say they prefer colonialism over neocolonialism or imperialism. Citing the fact that Russia has increasing support for socialism as proof of Russians having increased support for socialism is perfectly valid.

    Taking your logic at face value, if someone said "I like chocolate," your equivalent counter would be asserting that that's the same as saying "I like fascism." It doesn't logically follow, the point is about Russians supporting socialism, which is increasingly true.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (14 children)

    I'm not arguing for colonialism, I'm arguing for socialism, and the stat I gave was in the context of other points. Secondly, you gave no source on Nigerians wishing to return to colonialism, you made that up for your Mad Libs argument. You're caught up in trying to point out hypocricy and false rhetoric that doesn't exist.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    So you made it up, just to argue rhetorically using a hypothetical you lied about? No, Nigerians do not want a return to colonialism, you lied about them wanting it back increasingly over time to paint me as a hypocrite.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    I'm sure you can find at least one Nigerian that wishes to return to colonialism, but no such polls exist indicating there is rising support for colonialism in Nigeria. You made that up to prove a point. You lied.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    Mate i AM a Nigerian who has spoken to many such Nigerians. It's a very common sentiment. Again, go speak to some Nigerians

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    i know a bunch of nigerians who disagree with you and say it isn't common.

    now that we've cancelled eachother out in order to continue this you'll need to find a poll.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    I’m sure you can find at least one Nigerian that wishes to return to colonialism, but no such polls exist indicating there is rising support for colonialism in Nigeria. You made that up to prove a point. You lied.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    It is hard to defend that you made up a point to attack a completely valid one, correct.

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  • [–] -4 points 1 year ago (48 children)

    Oh, Cowbee, you and your statistics! How disingenuous you are.

    For starters, that sample size is minuscule at only 1000.

    And unsurprisingly, more countries think the dissolution was a bad thing than a good thing. Of course, Russia thinks the USSR was good, they were the oppressors. Life under the Soviet Union was grossly oppressive for the peasants, and especially if your country was the victim of Russian imperialism. You couldn't speak ill of the leaders, you had zero representation, and you faced the risk of your livelihood being ripped from you at any point. Your indigenous culture was even suppressed because it was considered anti-Soviet behaviour. There you go defending imperialism again, Cowbee.

    And mind you, this is a survey before Russia's invasion of Ukraine!

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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago (47 children)

    You're right, that data is from before the Russo-Ukrainian war. It's even higher now.

    Further, the USSR wasn't imperialist. It had a publicly owned economy, and didn't base its economy on international extraction. The peasantry saw dramatic material improvements, it was the kulaks, bourgeois farmers, that were oppressed. For the peasantry, they saw a doubling of life expectancy, massive development, free and high quality education and healthcare, a tripling of literacy rates, and more. National identities were preserved and strengthened, while trying to develop an internationalist "soviet" identity compatible with all.

    Overall, the majority regret the dissolution of the USSR.

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  • [–] -5 points 1 year ago* (46 children)

    What are these sources, my man? You gonna link to RT News next? Am I gonna need an antivirus to check these out?

    And again, no shit, Russia would want more soviet union, they were oppressors and imperialists. And the majority of countries do not regret the dissolution. And hey, glad you mentioned the DPRK. You must hate North Korean soldiers fighting for Russia against Ukraine, yeah?

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (45 children)

    Do you think the communists are in power in Russia? No, absolutely not, so why would they be lying about verifiable information on the strengthening of opposition movements to the current nationalists? Further, information on trade increasing with countries like Cuba, etc is backed up by non-Russian sources.

    The USSR was not oppressive nor imperialist. You keep claiming this, but it's wrong, the USSR did not run on international plunder, nor did it export capital, nor was it under the control of a financial oligarchy. Further, the vast majority of people, non-Russian included, regret the fall of the USSR.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago

    I gave you sources, your only counter is that they are Russian so they can't be trusted, despite verifiable evidence being within them. It's all easily found on google, here's an article from Reuters talking about Russian-Cuban trade increasing.

    As for posting the same source on countries like Estonia opposing socialism, that doesn't override that the majority of people support socialism. Countries like Estonia that celebrate Nazi collaboration of course have a reason to oppose socialism.

    As for avoiding the question, no, I'm not. Russia and the DPRK have a mutual defense agreement, why wouldn't the DPRK send its support? Trade with Russia helped the DPRK reach 3.7% GDP growth in 2024 as estimated by the ROK, it's an immensely useful relationship for them.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (39 children)

    It's much simpler, I'm a communist, and I try to do what I can to create more comrades. Many people have thanked me for helping change their minds, so I know it isn't worthless.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago* (30 children)

    I never once said that communism is something magical that fixes all problems, nor have I placed religious significance on it. This giant wall of text is just you going on and on in flowery language without actually explaining how I fit the strawman you've made of me.

    Communism, the ideology, is just the general organization towards collectivizing production and distribution. The process isn't magical, it isn't religious, but it has useful benefits and consistent practical knowledge developed by past communists and socialists to aid in reaching this end. That's what communism is. There's no magic utopia, and I have never said as such, nor have you explained how I misunderstand communism.

    It's nice that you top off your comment with an ableist attack by calling me "simple-minded."

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (28 children)

    You didn't lay out anything, though, you waxxed poetic about a strawman. You're even doing it now, just because communism isn't magical doesn't mean I don't think it's important and necessary. You're outright stating in this doublespeak that if something isn't religious or magical, that it isn't worth anything at all, then you call what I do "doublethink."

    Secondly, I have a busy life outside of Lemmy. I like to spend my online time talking about theory and geopolitics, but I don't even moderate any comms except Hexbear's c/theory which I only use to pin and unpin reading threads. You're speaking like a Marvel villian right now without stating anything of substance.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago* (26 children)

    You didn't back up that claim with anything other than vibes, though. Further, politics isn't a tug-of-war, if people firmly disagree with communism, a communist explaining the communist viewpoint with (generally) a level-head isn't pushing them away, it's the communism, full-stop. The fact that the absolute number of comrades has risen due to my interactions means it's a net positive.

    Secondly, I can define communism, it's a stateless, classless, moneyless society where production and distribution is collectivized and based on satisfying the needs of everyone.

    Edit: to respond to your edit:

    Communists have learned good party structure, how to democratize the economy, and the usefulness of implementing controlled market forces in underdeveloped countries as a means to rapidly increase the productive forces. China, for example, is massively improving quality of life year over year, and was one of the poorest countries on the planet only a century ago.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (24 children)

    Gotcha, you just wanted a place to practice your poetry and go on a polemic against me devoid of substance.

    As for killing the sparrows during widespread weather disaster, it's widely recognized as a critical failure. Is your point that communism is bad if communists ever make a mistake? Life expectancy still managed to double under Mao, that's how horribly underdeveloped China was, and a famine under those circumstances of underdevelopment was something common prior to the communists. It was the work of the communists that stopped famine for good in China.

    Not doxxing the users who have thanked me directly in DMs or publicly. You know that it's nonzero, if that's not "good enough" for you then that's your decision.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Having not read much theory, I have found your comments about communism and geopolitics helpful and insightful, thanks.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 year ago (18 children)

    It was initially caused by adverse weather conditions in a semi-feudal level of development. Killing the sparrows made it worse, but the communists did the best they could with what they knew, and more importantly, were responsible for developing beyond that semi-feudal level and instead creating cooperative farms that were far more productive. None of this is cope, the famine would have happened under the Kuomintang had the nationalists won the civil war.

    Secondly, nobody is siding with you here. Imagine this neutral party all you want, they don't exist at the moment.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (16 children)

    The famine started before killing the sparrows, that's why they killed the sparrows. You do realize that, right? And you do realize that communism isn't "kill the sparrows," correct? You have no logical process here, it's pure reaction.

    If your goal is practicing rhetoric, then you've failed, though failure is a good teacher.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    You mean the transphobic american nationalist is someone you hold as having well-thought out views?

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    In what way was it hilarious? imaqtpie made the argument that "communism is when you kill the sparrows," when no modern communist thinks that was a good move. They're arguing against ghosts, while you defend zionists and transphobes.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Nice, dehumanizing me, what a great thing to do.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (5 children)
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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    See, you do it again even when it's been pointed out.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    No, I outright stated that the famine was worse because of killing the sparrows. It was also alleviated by cooperative farming, and famine in general was alleviated by development.

    I really think you need to reread this convo, because you keep saying I'm saying things I never did.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (5 children)
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  • [–] 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

    Once all of production is collectivized, the basis of class ceases to exist, and thus the basis of the state erodes.

    Communism isn't utopian, and greed isn't a matter of biology, but expressed to greater or lesser degrees depending on the mode of production.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago

    The basis of the state is class society. Once class is abolished through collectivized production, the oppressive elements of society that form the state, ie police, millitaries, etc erode. Administration will continue to exist, as will collective decision making organs, etc, but this is not what Marxists recognize as the state.

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