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[–] 45 points 1 year ago (62 children)

You know that you can strategically vote liberal and do direct action, right?

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (59 children)

    You know that you can strategically vote liberal

    There would have to be a strategy in voting against your own interests. It's actively voting for bad things so worse things maybe don't happen? That's your strategy?

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (58 children)

    Correct. At present, the outcomes at the ballot box are "bad" and "worse". Of the two, "bad" is preferable. "Good" will require non-electoral direct action.

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  • [+] 7 points 1 year ago (27 children)
  • [–] -5 points 1 year ago (26 children)

    How many decades of turning up your nose at the lesser evil do you people need before you realize that just makes things worse faster?

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  • [+] 7 points 1 year ago (6 children)
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  • [+] 2 points 1 year ago (4 children)
  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Then why aren't you doing that? And again, who is "y'all"?

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  • [+] 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    To tell me why you aren't doing the productive things you're whining about no one else doing?

    Do you think I'm a DNC strategist? Do you think I'm anyone other than an exasperated leftist trying to get foolish leftists to stop shooting themselves in the foot so much (literally impossible I don't know why I bother)?

    Maybe I'm deliberately ignoring the context clues because the associated conclusion is completely asinine, and I'm giving you a chance to correct course.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    If it gets blue MAGA libs to actually start doing something productive instead of whining that they can't ignore politics anymore, then I'm on team acclerationism.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago

    This wont work, the libs realize you dragged them into the mud (because you guys keep saying that's your intent) and view you as an enemy that is working to bring about their suffering. That's exactly why its so common for people to complain about "protest non-voters" in the first place. They already use their middle class resources to simply flee or batten down the hatches & hide, and leave the poor and minorities behind to suffer. Some small portion of them seem to even (in desperation) side with or play nice with fascists to survive.

    Non-libs who are also non-accelerationists are mostly just going to grow cynical and bitter. They aren't going to throw their lives away for a violent revolution they did not sign up for.

    Accelerationism is aggressively stupid and it will always fail. You wont get enough people willing to work with you to start a revolution when its obvious you dragged people into hell with you. You can't create the conditions artificially. You just have a bunch of scared and angry people bickering and when they can afford it, fleeing.

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  • [+] -6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    So just to clarify, you're perfectly fine sacrificing the millions of vulnerable people who will suffer and die under accelerationism, in exchange for the gamble that maybe your ideology might get more popular. And you have the gall to call libs "blue MAGA"?

    This isn't a game, people have already died because of this. Maybe crawl out of your bubble long enough to think about the outcomes of your gambits.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Considering libs, much like MAGA, want everyone who they think is on their side to fall in line and vote/support their chosen genocidal fascist and attack anyone who criticizes them by viewing them as the enemy (whether it be calling them an undercover agent from the other side or working with some foreign nation to make them lose), I don't see a difference. We saw it last year with everyone that criticized Harris and we're already seeing it again with anyone that criticizes Newsom. Hell I've even seen some of them doing it with criticism towards Jeffries.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (13 children)

    Lmao.

    "We're the good guys because we're making things worse more slowly" is one hell of a self report.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (12 children)

    Slowing the decline is one aspect of treatment, and the best outcome presently available via electoral action. More significant progress requires alternative methods. Mitigating damage via the electoral vector is more valuable to the efficacy of those alternative methods than whatever it is you're trying to do by not mitigating damage.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (10 children)

    so many words just to cope that you got owned

    What are you, 12? Why would I be "owned" by a fundamental misunderstanding of electoral mechanisms?

    Name another "aspect of treatment"

    • Promoting progressive candidates in primaries

    • Writing your representatives directly

    • Becoming active in local politics

    • Protesting

    • Arming yourself

    • Building community and mutual aid with your neighbors

    • Unionizing your workplace

    • Collaborating with leftist groups to coordinate action

    And that's off the top of my head. None of those actions are lessened in any way by voting for whatever the Dems put out in the general election, to keep MAGA out. Any other electoral action perpetuates the acceleration of fascism. We've got concentration camps and military in the streets, continuing to pretend that "both sides" are identical is just patently unserious if not deliberately in bad faith.

    Your turn. Answer the question: What alternative action is available at the ballot box that yields a better outcome? I think you keep dodging the question because you know you don't have an answer. You're either a shill, or a kid hypnotized by counterproductive idealism.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (8 children)

    Why am I not surprised that someone who believes it's impossible to do two different things is incapable of reading past the first element of a list. Honestly, you're being deliberately stupid at this point. Maybe seek mentorship from someone who had the brainpower to walk and chew gum at the same time.

    Again, not liberal, just not stupid. Work on your reading comprehension and critical thinking skills, then your opinion might hold non-zero value.

    And you still haven't answered the question. Are you too dumb to come up with an answer, or are you a shill?

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (6 children)

    And again, still unable to answer the question. You're now tagged as "Fascist's Little Helper". I don't have time for fascists or their useful idiots

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    I asked you a question, you ignored it and asked me a question.

    I answered that question and asked you the first question again, you ignored it.

    I asked you a third time, you deflected.

    You're in debt here, and you still can't answer the question.

    I don't have time for fascists or their useful idiots.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 year ago (29 children)

    Look where that got us. It's a bad strategy and needs to be retired.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (27 children)

    It being a bad strategy and also the best available strategy are not mutually exclusive. No presently actionable strategy has a better outcome.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (26 children)

    So there's no strategy that has a better outcome than Trump's second term? You sure about that?

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (25 children)

    What? Trump's second term is largely the result of not strategically voting for lesser evil.

    What alternative, actionable strategy would have led to a different outcome? Actionable means "Everyone votes for the same third party" doesn't count. So go on, what was the alternative strategy that had any chance whatsoever of succeeding?

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (24 children)

    I think you're missing the point. The strategy out of the DNC going on two decades has been "our horrible candidate is less horrible than their candidate," and it took a worldwide pandemic and thousands of deaths for it to work once.

    They need to stop and find someone who isn't horrible if they ever want to win again. That or just let the world burn and hope it's only the neolibs that survive. I wouldn't bet on that myself.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (19 children)

    "I'm not a fascist, I just loudly promote actions that benefit them".

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (17 children)

    I didn't call communists fascists, I called you either a fascist or s fascist's useful idiot, because you support fascists.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (15 children)

    there is no evidence they support fascists

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago* (14 children)

    Their positions directly help fascists. Whether they know it or not, they are supporting fascists.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (13 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (12 children)

    "Nuh uh", truly the height of persuasive debate. Self-delusion isn't fighting fascism. Voting stupidly doesn't fight fascism, it supports it. If you promote that nonsense, then best case scenario you're a fascist's useful idiot.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    a claim made without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (10 children)

    And the evidence has been made clear. If you still can't see it, you're just as complicit.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    saying it doesn't make it so.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (8 children)

    Neither does denying it. "Both sides"ing Democrats in general elections helps MAGA, that is a simple fact. It would sure be nice to have an alternative electoral system where it makes sense, but we don't, and it doesn't. Ignoring reality for idealism turns people into useful idiots.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (7 children)

    Both sides"ing Democrats in general elections helps MAGA, that is a simple fact.

    wrong

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (6 children)

    Nope, I'm right, this is a fact, not an opinion.

    The electrical opinions of someone who doesn't know what a circuit breaker is are worthless. Likewise, the electoral opinions of someone who doesn't understand Duverger's Law are worthless.

    Educate yourself before making a fool of yourself.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

    duvergers "law" is more of a tautology. it doesn't describe any actual natural phenomenon like gravity does

    duverger's law is a tautology because, from a critical rationalist perspective, a tautological statement cannot be empirically tested or falsified. it's true by definition. duverger's law states that a plurality-rule election system tends to favor a two-party system. however, if this law is framed in such a way that any outcome can be rationalized within its parameters, then it becomes unfalsifiable.

    for example, if a country with a plurality-rule system has more than two parties, one might argue that the system still "tends to" favor two parties, and the current state is an exception or transition phase. this kind of reasoning makes the law immune to counterexamples, and thus, it operates more as a tautological statement than an empirical hypothesis.

    the critical rationalist critique of marginalist economics, which relies on ceteris paribus (all else being equal) conditions, suggests any similarly structured law should be viewed with skepticism. for duverger's law to be more than a tautology, it would need to be stated in a way that allows for clear empirical testing and potential falsification, without the possibility of explaining away any contradictory evidence. this would make it a substantive theory that can contribute to our understanding of political systems rather than a mere tautology.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    You tortured a lot of smart sounding words to say nothing of value. As I said, worthless.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (3 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago (2 children)

    Still you. That's not what a "tautology" is, and even if it was, your argument still makes no sense.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    you haven't read any critical rationalists, and it shows.

    edit: I accidentally a couple letters, but look at this fucking bad faith and proud ignorance

    edit: it's understandable I guess that when your worldview is threatened, you slink off pretending you were right all along.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    So in other words, you're just trying to assuage your own guilt for being powerless in the face having to actually do something to change things.

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