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[–] 45 points 4 months ago (5 children)

Please note that Elon Musk doesn’t hoard money in the same way that Scrooge McDuck does

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  • [–] 18 points 4 months ago
    [–] 28 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 child)

    And schools should have economics and personal finances as part of the curriculum.

    Nobody is hoarding money. Scrooge McDuck is a bad caricature of a rich person - that's not how any of it works.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    And schools should have economics and personal finances as part of the curriculum.

    the problem with this "common sense" approach is that it emphasizes and reinforces personal responsibility in a system that's rigged to take advantage of every human foible.

    I call this the "late-fee" fallacy. As in the idea that video store late fees are intended to encourage responsible behavior, not a revenue stream that the business relies on. Overdraft fees are another great example.

    Financial responsibility would ruin the economy.

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  • [–] 11 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    It already does, it's called inflation.

    Also are you talking about physical money, or bank accounts, or what...?

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  • [–] 27 points 4 months ago (6 children)

    It does. It’s called inflation.

    Modern millionaires don’t hoard cash, just like ancient millionaires didn’t hoard apples or wheat. Sure, millionaires always had something perishable, but most of the wealth was/is tied in things like land, buildings, companies, ships, cattle, slaves, stocks, bonds, loans etc.

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  • [–] [S] 2 points 4 months ago (5 children)

    Inflation has little impact on the wealthy. I should have said wealth or assets

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    It makes them invest their money which puts it to good use. That makes credit cheaper for everyone else.

    Inequality is an issue, but that's what taxes are for. You don't solve inequality by breaking the economy.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (3 children)

    Yeah that’s a good clarification. If land and old paintings had had an expiration date…

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    I mean the Mexican government makes it so that land can only be owned for 100 years.

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    That would disproportionately affect the poor since the money owned by the wealthy is overwhelmingly tied up in other assets, index funds etc

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  • [–] 7 points 4 months ago

    Its called inflation. And billionaires dont hoard money, they hoard assets. Most of the time inflation just makes them richer, as salaries drain out year over year and their stock prices keep going up.

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  • [–] 5 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    This has actually been tried. It's called [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demurrage_currency](demurrage currency). Basically, every note decreases in value every week: in 1930s Austria, this was accomplished by requiring people to get regular stamps to keep their money good, but every stamp reduced the value of the note.

    This encourages people to spend money instead of hoarding it, but the obvious downside is that it makes saving functionally impossible.

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  • [+] 10 points 4 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    How so? I support the idea of a wealth tax, but I would have expected the billionaires to be getting way above a 1% return on their assets.

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  • [+] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)
  • It may bring down the overall numbers, but given the rate of passive growth would still be several times the wealth tax, I see no reason they would disappear or new ones would stop appearing.

    Norway as an example has had their wealth tax for over a century. They still have one of the highest rates of billionaires per capita worldwide.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 child)

    Yes, only already rich should have an ability to use capital. Peons should be stripped of even theoretical possibility to get any capital-tier sum. Only gas and bread money.

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago

    Pro hoarders never hoard money

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago

    You mean gift cards?

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  • [–] 2 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    As people said you don't want to completely stop savings but it would make sense for social benefits. Take snap. You could limit people to not keeping in excess of one months benefits in savings (the reason you might allow a month is so that they can do something special on a holiday or birhtday or such). So 2x times their benefit would be the maximum allowed holding. Now lets say you limit snap to things grown and processed in the US. Now it acts as an economic stimulus as well as a social safety net and you prevent the hoarding thing. You could convert all argricutural type aid to it and it would likely be better for the industry. Now note you stopped hoarding of the currency but that does not stop hoarding. Some folks if they see they have not used the full benefit will buy some treats like ice cream cake or something. Others however will buy canned goods or rice and beans and hoard that. Granted those folke like hoarded anyway. Similarly if money in general had an expiration date then rich people would buy more single family homes and warehoused and precious metals and such.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Whoa whoa whoa, you think people are saving their food stamps and not spending all of them every month? I'd love to actually see the data on that because I would be incredibly surprised. Because food stamps do not cover the monthly cost of food.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)
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    What is this, a CBDC ad?

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago (1 child)

    Do you mean cash, money, or wealth?

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Absolutely not

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  • [–] 0 points 4 months ago

    Better solution: world wide wealth caps. WWWC, if you will

    Just your normal tax brackets but with one extra one that says that nobody can be worth more than, say, 10 million dollars. Anything over that goes straight not taxes until you're below again.

    For companies, make it a billion dollars

    This way, nobody can become extraordinary rich and or powerful

    Nobody can pressure others or influence large groups with money because nobody can

    Companies will require a huge amount of small shareholders so no one single shareholder can influence a single company

    Governments will get a huge influx of money which they can use for a huge social network with free healthcare, free education, UBI (Universal Basic Income) and so on.

    With that, no more poverty. Everyone can have a standard minimum living where they have a nice little home, all the food and healthcare and education they'd need, and if someone wants a little more, they can work a little more, but nobody can get over 10 mil.

    It would eradicate poverty, and much of -or most- crime, as money is the incentive of much of the crime in the world

    Governments can make world wide investment foundations that can fund independent press agencies with the single requirements that they always try to be as unbiased and honest as possible

    Companies can't have a networth over a billion dollars, so instead of 1-3 giant companies, we'll have thousands, of not millions of smaller ones.

    Companies will no longer have incentives to cheat and or fuck over customers or the environment because why would you of you reached the limit and you can't earn more anyway? Focus can go to quality and safety again

    I see a huge amount of pro's here with ... Well, I don't even see cons

    I know this requires that we implement this world wide, but that would be the only complication. The rules themselves are simple and basic. I know, there are a lot of details that willl emerge that need to be handled but anything is better than the oligarch shit we have now and this to me sounds like a Utopian society, really, or as close as we can get to them

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  • [–] 0 points 4 months ago (2 children)

    Hoarding is not illegal, maybe it should be, certainly at scale but currently it is not so measures to stop it are not lawful at this time.

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  • [–] 3 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Lol. The way you make something illegal is by passing laws. It's not unlawful to pass laws

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  • [–] 1 point 4 months ago

    Hoarding is not the correct way to think of billionaires amassing grotesque wealth, hoarding is the old couple putting cash under the bed. For the old couple it is their money and their business. What billionaires do is a significant societal drain on resources and should be dealt with accordingly, akin to war crimes.

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  • [–] -2 points 4 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, I feel like we want constant deflation instead of inflation.

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