Linux is for everyone
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My go to answer to 'why I use Linux' is a simple 'I don't agree to microsoft's terms and conditions'.
If a user actually reads those T&Cs, and agrees to it, all power to them (well, all power to microsoft, but they agreed to that).
+1. You think if something goes wrong for doing what is advertised, then you are using it wrong.
Oh, it's just a list of pro Linux items but in reverse psychology... Kay.
I'm already a Linux user, I was kinda curious about a listing of actual reasons Linux might not be for someone.
This is just masturbation.
As a long time linux user, antagonizing people who are unsure if the switch is right for them is very clearly a poor interpersonal choice that will not result in the change we wanna see in the world, or more people adopting linux
Fuckin seriously, we can do better than this circle jerk. As someone who cares deeply about software being kinder to people it pains me enormously how much of a dump stat interpersonal skills are for so much of the Foss community
If the authors wanna pat themselves for linux they can do it without creating a unempathetic, condescending, preachy culture that alienates people.
Just call the article "things we love about having switched to linux" so it finds the right audience and its fine, but this shit sucks and its exactly the kind of crap that has made so many of my friends resistant to hearing what I think is good and special about Foss software. They hear me out anyway, but I'd love for it to not be a fucking uphill battle because Foss people routinely emulate the same preachy, condescending, unempathetic interpersonal apprach that everyone bemoans about the worst vegan spaces online
Well said
I'm really glad it seems like my thoughts have been appreciated, I was kinda mentally preparing myself for people to be unhappy with me
I find this kind of stuff frustrating enough I needed to edit my first version of the comment cause it was angrier, but I want people to actually hear me out and think about the culture we cultivate in the foss space. It really matters.
There are so many issues people care about (eg. Software freedom) specifically because we want a world that is kinder to people, and then we act on that value or interest in a way that isn't kind to people. A little empathy goes a looong way
Thank you for the kind words, I hope you have a lovely day :)
Your points are valid, and if I saw this on a site like pcmag, medium or whatever, i would totally be on the same page. Still, how many "on the fence" people are likely to be here, on Lemmy, subscribed to a linux forum?
I chose to take it as snarky humor for the "in crowd". Benefit: keeps my blood pressure manageable.
My thoughts were more about the article itself than it being posted here. Being an article it could really easily be something that comes up when someone is trying to figure out whether they can make the switch and are doing their research on pros and cons
I think personally I also just really don't enjoy snarky in-group humor, it feels like it often just fosters resentment for those outside of the ingroup. So I do kinda have a bias in general
Im not subscribed to this forum, it appeared on the front page. Dude was right when he said linux users are the vegans of the tech world. I play video games with my friends almost every night, linux would complicate how I stay in touch with the people in my circle.
Point taken. I assure you at least some of us are not going to shame others for choosing something other than Linux. We know it's not simple to switch and get a comfortable environment.
We're just willing to do the work for various reasons that feel important to us, and will gladly evangelize it gently.
Back on the 90s (I know, I know) the joke was that of your VCR was still blinking 12:00 Linux was probably not for you.
I enjoy the snark, but also agree it's condescending. Folks, take it as cynical humor, and don't be so harsh.
Anyway I commented to say that #10 is creeping into at least some distributions.
My Ubuntu sends security updates that frequently impact system libraries and thus demands (politely) a reboot.
Gnome software does it all the time, but a regular "check for updates" will often install without demanding reboot. I suspect the update won't be in effect until reboot, though.
And here I was, thinking this was a well thought out article with actual, legitimate reasons why someone wouldn't want to use Linux. Instead, it's this smug, autofellating, condescending bullshit. Roland Taylor has some issues.
I mean, #6 is accurate for me. I don't have a humiliation fetish, so I'd rather pay people to tell me what I'm doing wrong instead of braving the barrage of belittlement that comes from asking for crowdsourced support.
And that's completely valid and fair. Different strokes for different folks, as they say. But I do have to stress that I'm not so much criticising the bullet points as I am the general tone of the article. #6 should read like your reply, but instead it feels like the reader should feel bad for not wanting support from humans as opposed to an automated system.
Oh, I understand. I was trying to snarkily imply that the smug, autofellating, condescending attitude you mentioned was unfortunately endemic, to the point where it's starting to feel like some people are secretly jorking it while telling newbs they suck. I think it's a huge reason why people feel like FOSS isn't for them.
You expected better from itsFoss? It has always been this way and it will always be
This article likely came from a very sad and self-righteous place
I just wish there was an OS that was bloated to heck and back, and tried to shoehorn AI into weird places.
Oh shit! That's what we were missing all along! That's what has, all this time, been keeping adoption down and preventing the year of the linux desktop! A condescending prick talking down to people! We should have figured this out a long time ago! Thanks OP for setting us straight! Now our numbers are sure to skyrocket!
This is exactly the kind of shit that keeps people from switching to Linux y'all know that right?
Most of these are not about the Linux kernel, but about distro / personal choice. Android tracks you and doesn't make you use the command-line a lot. Fedora / Ubuntu (and others?) like to reboot for every little update.
10: But honestly, with an immutable distro you are not that far off 😀
I've been running Fedora for a few weeks and if I update it every time there's updates available, I'd be rebooting nearly daily, because it insists on rebooting for "system packages", where debian and even Arch based distros did not require restarts for most things.. I'm not even using an immutable version of Fedora
- You start making weird passive aggressive lists to shame people into your preferred.....whatever...
"Well if you don't buy this car you are a moron who can't see how much better this car is. So keep driving that piece of shit car you dumbass. So, have I sold you on this car?"
If you have a job or are student you'll know that using Linux usually results in a direct increase in corporate tech support battles.
Sorry but AI is coming to Linux too so fear the 13^th^ 🤣
#3 is what does it for me. There are few things more enraging than something I own refusing to do what I'm instructing it to do.
Cool and all but stop the rebooting hate
- I just installed some random drivers, I guess without rebooting. Windows is intransparent af, but I think this was the case.
- Reboots are very important and should be done with updates. Atomic systems make sense!
You’re happy when your computer tells you “no”
This also an affliction of the GNOMEs.
Here's a few more.
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You want to use multiple monitors without messing around.
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You don't want to run an emulator for your games.
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You like being able to share software with people.
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You need corporate software for work or your own business.
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You're looking for a computer that 'just works'.
Most of these points are fair, but.. wine is not an emulator!
The monitor thing is very dependent on distro, I didn't really have any issues at all with Linux mint or nobara
As others have said wine/proton is not an emulator and some games run even better on Linux, that being said a lot of AAA games have DRM that prevent you from running them on Linux, that would be your real argument there
Don't like being able to share software? A ton of software on Linux is FOSS and available on windows, not all of it of course, but you could say the same about Mac
Depending on the corporation and software, you can use Linux, but yes, most places are windows shops, so that is difficult
But yeah,a computer that just "works" I concede most distros will not get you there. Nobara is definitely a bit unstable but I can deal with it because I was in IT for 6 years. Although immutable distros are close, but they definitely still take some knowhow to use, and have their limitations
Edit: misread part of the comment
A ton of software on Linux is FOSS and available on windows, not all of it of course, but you could say the same about Mac
Wine question 2.0: Does WSL count as Windows?
A computer that "just works" nowadays is an android phone, windows has so much broken due to them replacing devs with AI that you can't justify that as a reason nowadays.
I don't understand the first two.
The first one is because at least on Mint, on the machine I have, multiple monitors just don't work, and I've been told it's not just me, it's X11. The second is the need for Wine or Bottles (or whatever Valve has done).
Wine literally stands for "WINE Is Not an Emulator".
That said, Proton is pretty transparent, you can just install any game off Steam right now and it'll work 9 times out of 10 without you noticing that you're using wine. I often can't tell if I'm using proton or not and get surprised when I go into the game files for one reason or another expecting proton and am surprised to find a native Linux build. There has even been at least one time I've switched from a native Linux build to Proton because it ran better, and it was just one toggle.
Why the resistance to wine? Did you have an issue while using it, or is it the principle of using a compatibility layer?
16: I've had more headaches getting multiple monitors to work in Windows than I ever have in Linux. Try connecting 2 monitors of wildly different resolutions in Windows and witness the abject failure of windows to handle that elegantly. Your mouse can slip off into a "void" where no monitor exists, and yet your content can just disappear to, dragging the mouse between monitors slips the cursor way off and to the right, screenshots are a mess, etc. etc.
17: I only play games in Linux and I never use emulators... unless it's for things like SNES.
18: I don't know what you're getting at with this one. Software is way more shareable in Linux. You just say "it's in your package manager" or "install this Flatpak". Windows and Mac on the other hand have half-assed app stores and a culture of "just go to ${URL} and click "download, ok, ok, ok" which inevitably leads to stuff breaking and no discernible way to determine what failed 'cause your machine is full of rando installations.
19: This is fair, though most high-profile stuff like CrowdStrike works for Linux now.
20: I cannot begin to tell you how much Windows and Mac don't work. Like, at all. Just today I spent an hour on a call with another developer stuck in Windows trying to get a JDBC driver to work. The constant ambiguous error messages, useless documentation directing you to "just go to ${RANDOM_SITE} and install some-cryptically-named-executable.msi that craps out with error messages about missing runtimes... the whole operating system is hot garbage and that's before you factor in the missing keyboard shortcuts, flaky monitor support, creeping AI, and ads shooting into your eyeballs. The only way Windows "Just Works™" is if you redefine "works" entirely.
For #18, here's how my sneakernet software sharing goes: Windows: I copy the installer exe, or a zipped version of the software as installed to a flash drive. The person can then run the software from the drive, or copy it to their own PC. No Internet required, no outside connection called for.
Linux: after determining that they have the right distro type for the software, I have to walk them through either getting it from a GUI repository client, apt, pacman, flatpak, snap, or whatever other cockamamie thing it's on. They have to install it from the central authority - which is not sharing the software. It's suggesting that someone else connect to the Internet and download a thing.
If it requires the Internet to for a typical user to share software on media, your operating system is hostile to freedom.
If you want to share software like that, just use AppImage. It's perfect for sneakernet software sharing: no internet access required, and it requires less technical knowledge from end users than telling them to use a package manager. Just copy the file and run it.
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