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[+] 233 points 11 months ago (39 children)
  • [+] 35 points 11 months ago (26 children)
  • [–] 29 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Nope it's just apt update & upgrade. Iirc apt tells you when the kernel was updated and needs a reboot as well.

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    full-upgrade probably a better pick

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (1 child)

    Is it? Afaik that also removes incompatible packages so if you've installed some custom stuff that might not be the best option.

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  • [–] 20 points 11 months ago (11 children)

    I think you can do apt upgrade --update now.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago* (5 children)

    WHAT. Does this do both sudo apt update and sudo apt upgrade?

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (1 child)

    Your note is very interesting about the difference between the commands and how autoremove will automatically remove stuff before or after the upgrade is performed. Should it always be done after, or are there instances when running it before is more beneficial? Is there any need to do both like this:

    # sudoΒ aptΒ --updateΒ --autoremove upgradeΒ -yΒ &&Β sudoΒ aptΒ autoremoveΒ -y
    
    
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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago

    I can't really imagine a benefit to --autoremove except for keeping old packages a bit longer before removing them.

    Eg, if you run apt --update --autoremove upgrade -y once a day you'll keep your prior-to-currently-running-version kernel packages a day longer than if you ran autoremove immediately after each upgrade.

    To make things more confusing: the new-ish apt full-upgrade command seems to remove most of what apt autoremove wants to... but not quite everything. 🀷

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (3 children)
  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    Incredible that it's not written everywhere, I always wanted to use something like this without the " update && upgrade" which looks like is not working oftentimes

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Is it really not written? I saw apt upgrade --update and knew the standard shortcut would be -u, but that didn't work so I tried -U, bingo bongo off I went.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    It am quite sure in the manual, but if you just look on the interwebz tutorials every command line just writes the full shebang. So you don't look up the manual and get flabbergasted when you see this post. btw: if you are able to guess "what the standard shortcut would be", you are a wizard Harry πŸ₯³

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  • [–] 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (5 children)
  • [–] 8 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    Also worth checking out restic. It's more command line oriented and is generally stateless

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (1 child)

    Oh, never heard about it. A quick research showed me that restic is a very viable solution. Thanks for mentioning it, I added it to my comment.

    While researching, I also came across a fancy WebUI, which is mostly what non-CLI users want: backrest

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

    I am using restic and backrest on my yunohost server and I really like it! It is really set up and forget for me. Only the uploads to backblaze b2 are still triggered manually. Also did a full recovery from the backblaze repo (downloaded locally) without problems.

    Also just now heard about Zerobyte it is a backup solution based on restic and looks very good!

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 child)

    I'm not the person you asked the question of. I'm a fellow novice homelaber.

    I use Kopia to backup my data folders and Docker container data. Works really well. The project for this weekend is to set offsite backups to be uploaded to iDrive.

    When I update I use this:

    sudo apt update && \ sudo apt upgrade -y && \ sudo apt full-upgrade -y && \ flatpak update -y 2>/dev/null; \ sudo apt autoremove -y && \ sudo apt autoclean && \ sudo journalctl --vacuum-time=7d

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  • [–] 8 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah, people that brag about uptimes are just bragging about the fragility of their infrastructure. If designed correctly you should be able to patch and reboot infrastructure while application availability stays up.

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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago

    With an uptime of greater than 5 years I'm going to be concerned about the system potentially not coming back up after a reboot/power outage, especially for physical hardware

    At a bank I worked at, we had an old IBM Power server which was at that point purely used for historical data. It had multiple years of uptime and was of course a good 10+ years old. When we went to take it offline, we actually just disabled the nic on the switch so we could reduce the number of powercycles it would see in fear that it would not power on anymore. Theoretically the data on it is purely historical, backed up and not needed, but there was enough question marks on each of those fronts we just played it safe

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  • [–] 4 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    I haven't had a kernel update on Debian that triggered the "you should restart" message in quite some time. I was under the understanding that most newer systems now use splicing at the kernel level to not require periodic reboots.

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    [–] 57 points 11 months ago (10 children)

    This is why we have UPS ;-)

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  • [–] 9 points 11 months ago (9 children)

    Seriously, one black out and suddenly you see the need for a UPS. Now my desktop is on a USB, my work laptop and monitors are on a UPS, my homelab is on a UPS, even my modem and router are on a UPS. I just wish I could get a backup generator, but that's not happening anytime soon.

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  • [–] 7 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    My experience with using an UPS is that they have caised an outage every few years, which is more often than we get power outages where I live, so I didn't replace the batteries last time the UPS took down my server, and are just running straight from the wall. It might be better with a more expensive UPS, but it's not worth it for me.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    A hale storm earlier this year and the power outage it caused created some bizarre issue with my home server I have yet to diagnose. All of my containers and VMs corrupted in some way, so I had to restore from backup, but my file server container has some sort of permissions issue on top of that.

    Honestly the brownout before the outage is almost definitely what did it, but the cost of a UPS that also protects against brownouts is well outside of my usual hobby budget so it's hard to justify on ewaste hardware that I got a pallet of for less than what the UPS would cost used

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago*

    Yeah I read up on them before I bought, APC seemed like the best. I test them at least once a year and so far I've only had to replace one battery. Depending on the application I paid between $80 and $180 for each, but the higher upfront cost seems to have paid off for me at least. I am a sample size of 1, your results may vary.

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  • [–] 5 points 11 months ago* (1 child)

    I got tired of my network puking every time the power went out for 5 seconds.

    Edit- My NAS really dislikes having the power cut off.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago

    Yep, the black outs have stopped now but for a while it was a daily occurrence. My NAS took a beating and so did my desktop. I spent a ton on ups's to make sure that stuff was protected and bonus, I wouldn't loose connection while on phone calls with government officials while at work.... they get pissy when you suddenly drop off.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    I sometimes have power outage in winter (snow storm, ice, etc) and working from home I need a UPS ; modem cable, router, PC, monitors, are on it, it can stand ~5h

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago (2 children)

    I've had good luck with APC. Just be ready to pay a bit more upfront. But so far in the last 6 or 7 years, I've only had to replace one battery.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    I bought a used APC Back-UPS Pro BR1500G for $100 on market place, it was a good deal, I replaced the 2 battery inside and added 4 outside (it is supported), I'm ready!

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  • [–] 33 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    My father was an HPUX admin that had a server with an uptime of >12 years

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago

    I was introduced to homelab by trying to figure out how my uncles setup. It ran for 4 years after he died, 11 years uptime. The estate probate prevented anyone from touching the equipment for the legal fights, and I get a kick out of thinking of how smug he would have been about it.

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  • [–] 26 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Heard of tuptime? I've been using it for a while now, I think I like it.

    System startups: 151 since 18:00:05 10/11/15 System shutdowns: 137 ok + 13 bad System life: 9yr 223d 1h 27m 47s

    Longest uptime: 106d 5h 34m 28s from 14:17:10 26/03/22 Average uptime: 23d 4h 32m 0s System uptime: 99.81% = 9yr 216d 12h 31m 51s

    Longest downtime: 4d 23h 30m 48s from 10:36:53 14/09/23 Average downtime: 1h 2m 46s System downtime: 0.19% = 6d 12h 55m 56s

    Current uptime: 25d 0h 34m 25s since 20:25:37 15/11/25

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    Are we not doing kernel upgrades?

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  • [–] 3 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Yeah that’s about the only time I have to do reboots at work which are 99% linux. Well the production ones anyway.

    Or the other reason is my lab having power issues due to malfunctioning UPSes, faulty NEMA L6-30 plugs, janky 240v circuit breakers or… I’m beginning to think my lab is electrically cursed.

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  • [–] 1 point 10 months ago*

    While technically the truth, it can be a hassle to make sure you restart all relevant services after updating a given library.

    I just like being able to restart underlying system to take care of any possible straggler without thinking, and the services broadly be provided by multiple systems so the "experience" is starting up through a rolling reboot

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  • [–] 17 points 11 months ago (4 children)

    Or if you have a UPS and backup generator or a house battery (do these need a UPS as well still?) it will tell you how long since you setup the system.

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  • [–] 7 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    I would suspect you would still want a UPS. I don't think house "power" setups have the switch over speed even if they're automatic. Most home generator setups are manual not sure about battery setups.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago

    My home generator is automatic but you still need an ups because the transfer switch and power on process for the generator isn’t instant. Takes like 10-30 seconds depending on how cold it is and how recently I serviced the generator.

    You also ideally need a higher quality ups that can handle the shitty power coming from a generator, although the overall ups doesn’t need to be as β€œhefty” as a result. My ups is the kind that has extra filtering and stabilization of incoming power. My old ups was a cheaper cyberpower and it died after a few months of generator usage (we lose power here roughly every 4-6 weeks, thus the auto generator). The cheaper cyberpower would be fine in the majority of home circumstances tbh otherwise.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    Battery should be automatic, but yeah not certain how quick the switchover is. At least you could go for the smallest capacity UPS there is as long as it can manage the wattage you are going with.

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  • [–] 1 point 11 months ago

    Pretty sure batteries can be set up for ups. One of the companies I worked for had part of the power for the building as ups. They used orange outlets to mark them. They constantly had to keep telling people not to overload it.

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  • [–] 15 points 11 months ago (2 children)
  • [–] 15 points 11 months ago (3 children)

    I got obsessed with uptime in the early 2000s, but for my desktop Slackware box. It ran a bunch of servers and services and crap but only for me, not heavy loads of public users. Anyway, I reached 6 years of uptime without a UPS and was aiming for 7 when a power outage got me.

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  • [–] 18 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    Skill issue. Next time you can open up the computers power supply while it’s running, splice in a second power cable, and attach a UPS without powering down or getting electrocuted.

    For legal reasons, /s

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  • [–] 13 points 11 months ago

    β€œUptime” β€” aka the anxiety meter for every sysadmin.

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  • [–] 22 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    So, you never update the kernel?

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  • [–] 10 points 11 months ago* (11 children)

    What if I have a really good UPS with like a whole day's worth of juice?

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  • [–] 10 points 11 months ago (7 children)

    That's either an impressive UPS or an impressively low power server. Either way, congrats!

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago* (4 children)

    Anker have up to 3.8kWh stations, goals. This or Anker's equivalent of the Tesla Powerwall, wall-mounted energy storage.

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  • [–] 2 points 11 months ago (2 children)

    That's pretty impressive. I have a "big battery" that still isn't that big, but I don't consider it part of my wacky constellation of UPS devices. It's more of an "oh shit, no power, make sure the food doesn't go bad" and keep the refrigerator going for a day kind of thing.

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  • [–] 17 points 11 months ago (1 child)

    Pretty sure everybody is missing the joke. The joke is that Debian packages are so stable and stale that you likely will need a reboot before an update.

    Also, it's a joke....please patch your boxes, k?

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