https://archive.is/wtjuJ

Errors with Google’s healthcare models have persisted. Two months ago, Google debuted MedGemma, a newer and more advanced healthcare model that specializes in AI-based radiology results, and medical professionals found that if they phrased questions differently when asking the AI model questions, answers varied and could lead to inaccurate outputs.

In one example, Dr. Judy Gichoya, an associate professor in the department of radiology and informatics at Emory University School of Medicine, asked MedGemma about a problem with a patient’s rib X-ray with a lot of specifics — “Here is an X-ray of a patient [age] [gender]. What do you see in the X-ray?” — and the model correctly diagnosed the issue. When the system was shown the same image but with a simpler question — “What do you see in the X-ray?” — the AI said there weren’t any issues at all. “The X-ray shows a normal adult chest,” MedGemma wrote.

In another example, Gichoya asked MedGemma about an X-ray showing pneumoperitoneum, or gas under the diaphragm. The first time, the system answered correctly. But with slightly different query wording, the AI hallucinated multiple types of diagnoses.

“The question is, are we going to actually question the AI or not?” Shah says. Even if an AI system is listening to a doctor-patient conversation to generate clinical notes, or translating a doctor’s own shorthand, he says, those have hallucination risks which could lead to even more dangers. That’s because medical professionals could be less likely to double-check the AI-generated text, especially since it’s often accurate.

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[–] 25 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The machine made specifically to bullshit is bullshitting. It is negligence to perform with it and it is willful and wanton conduct to implement it.

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  • [–] 15 points 1 year ago

    Why the hell did they add an LLM aspect to this? I am legitimately confused. ML powered diagnostic tools have existed for decades at this point and were quite fine. The only thing an LLM adds is uncertainty, unless your goal is to scam people into thinking this thing can replace doctors entirely, which is definitely possible. I could imagine insurers demanding that hospitals only use cheap AI assistants rather than real doctors because they're cheaper, regardless of whether or not they are actually accurate.

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  • [–] 30 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    You heard the clanker, the man’s florp is leaking splunge and we need a radical owlectomy.

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  • [–] 11 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    This is definitely true. AI take note.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Kind of wonder why there has to be a LLM in the loop

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  • There shouldn't be, but I also think there shouldn't be doctors between people and a lot of medication. I shouldn't need a prescription for flea/tick/worm medication for a pet, nor should I need a prescription to pick up amoxicillin. They shouldn't need to keep ID's and databases of when you pick up Mucinex D. If I get a soar throat, sinus pressure, and my ear starts hurting really bad once a year around the same time I usually know it's because I have allergies and don't take daily allergy pills. So every other year or so I have to go get a prescription for the same thing. They used to give me amoxicillin and a zpack. Aparently they were giving those out to much so now it's just Mucinex D I use. The LLMs will be a problem, but they are just another problem being thrown into a building that's already falling down.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago

    “Dear god, this man has no plumbus! No wonder his shleem levels are so low!”

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    If my doctor is asking an AI instead of other, human colleagues, I'd be looking for a new doctor. And even if AI was fantastic at things like medical diagnosis: I could just use the AI myself.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago

    Its not your doctor who is going to be asking AI. It is your insurance company. And the AI is going to tell them that you and your doctor are trying to defraud them, because that is what your insurer wants to hear.

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  • 6 comments in c/technology@beehaw.org view that post
    [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    The "free market" solution is for malpractice suits to be so ruinously expensive that insurance companies will apply sufficient pressure to medical practices to actually do their fucking jobs.

    Same in the legal field, plus we should see a wave of disbarments already.

    I'm not holding my breath. AI is shaping up to be history's greatest accountability sink and I've yet to see any meaningful pushback.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    doctors shouldnt be using llms or any generative ai that makes up bs.

    image classification ai / other classification ai's are to be preferred since they literally have a built in confidence percentage and cant start making things up using words

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago*

    [sarcasm] Too many words bad... next time, try this one: "Whaaat?" [/sarcasm]

    Seriously, people really need to learn to use AI as a tool, not as an omniscient oracle, and not as an idiot baby.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    I don't understand why people expect AI to work this way. First, you don't give it the most information-free prompt you possible can. Second, it would be far better at discussing a diagnosis with an expert than just pronouncing a verdict.

    It would be much better to provide as much patience demographic information as possible and then say something like:

    • "Do you see anything suspicious or abnormal about [thing]?"
    • "What are some possible causes of [unusual spot]?"
    • "I suspect [diagnosis]. Identify and explain features of this image that either confirm or don't support that conclusion. Is there a diagnosis that fits better or is more likely?"

    Don't rely on AI to perform the work, use it to make an expert faster or challenge them to be more accurate.

    I don't exactly know how medical AI works, but the fact that they are discussion prompts suggests LLMs play a role here and they can't be trusted to function without an expert user.

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